The next Terra Cognita essay. See earlier Terra Cognita: BT’s in the Belfry, Two New Conditions!, The Condition of Liabilitiness, Condition of Doubtfulness The Mind, The Way To Happiness: Really? A Story, Auditing: a PC’s Quest for the Holy Grail, The Knowledge Report, Integrity, The Almighty Stat, The Reg, The Horrors of Wordclearing, Why Scientologists Don’t FSM, Respect, The Survival Rundown – The Latest Scam, Communication in Scientology… Or Not, Am I Still A Thetan?, To Be Or Not To Be, An Evaluation of Scientology, Fear: That Which Drives Scientology and Justification and Rationalization.
Cause over Life – Really?
Speaking of BT’s, according to the latest version of the Scientology Grade Chart, “Cause over Life” is the ability gained on OT 7. Is it just me, or could there be a more generic, non-specific ability than this? And am I to assume, that until finishing this level, I will never be “cause over life?”
“Cause over life” is the most dumbed-down ability-gained on the Bridge. None is more vanilla than this one. Every EP—end phenomenon—and “ability gained” on every lower level is harder to achieve than “cause over life.” Being in present time while bull-baited on the Comm Course is harder. Being able to communicate with anyone on any subject is next to impossible for the average OT. Being able to confront one’s bank is more difficult. Working one’s way up the conditions from Confusion is more grueling, for sure. Writing an Admin Scale is harder by leaps and bounds—applying one is the Mt. Everest of Scientology administrative technology.
From newborns, to grandparents, to homeless people living on the street, everyone is cause over life. Without that ability, we couldn’t exist.
OT Levels
Apparently, by getting rid of all the BT’s attached to our bodies, we become self-determined again, and thus, “cause over life.” As if we’d never been self-determined or at-cause in our lives before this level. Does reaching OT 7 without being cause over life even make sense?
Interestingly, “Rehabilitation of intention,” used to be the ability gained on OT 7 until someone changed the Grade Chart back in the sixties or seventies. I assume that end-phenomenon was a person who could make anything happen with sheer intention. Since nobody ever achieved this—and it looked as if nobody ever would—the Chart had to be revamped. True to form, the current “ability gained” hasn’t worked either as evidenced by a failing church. Rest assured, if Scientology is still around in ten or twenty years, the “ability gained” will once again have to be revised.
So, according to Scientology doctrine, people aren’t “cause over life” until they’ve finished OT 7? Until that time, we only pretend be at-cause. We’re just going through the motions, being manipulated by other forces. Everything we ever accomplished before completing OT 7 wasn’t our doing but was due to something else. Really?
What Life?
Admittedly, cause over life sounds awesome. Presumably, a person with such ability could change, not only his own life, but LIFE—all life, across the Dynamics. He could make crops grow out of parched earth, ensure world peace, turn water into wine, and of course, make shit-loads of money and move up to Supreme Giver status. That is, if LRH and OT 7 did what they promised.
When he—or DM, or whoever—wrote the new EP for OT 7, they didn’t specify what life. Or whose life. Or how much life. They didn’t write “more life;” they just wrote “life.” Which leaves the “ability gained” wide open to interpretation—and rationalization.
While the optimist hopes to gain tremendous new powers, the less confident might only wish for life to go a bit more smoothly for once. A moderate raise at work would be good. So would a newer car. If one were really lucky, he might even make that ashtray rise up off the chair without having to touch the damn thing.
If one actually gained non-rationalized, non-watered down “cause over life,” he’d be able to jump over tall buildings, stop speeding locomotives, and yes, once again, make that damn ashtray raise up off that damn chair! Can someone—anyone!—please make that ashtray rise! I mean, really, should anything be easier for an OT than making a small hunk of glass float in the air for a few seconds? Seriously! (YouTube link anyone?)
One Sweet Carrot
Since nobody achieves “cause over life” until they’ve completed OT 7, all the “abilities gained” at the lower levels of the bridge must not be valid.
How can one “recognize the source of problems and make them vanish” (Grade 1 EP) if he isn’t at-cause? How can one erase an engram? Or clear a word? Make blockbuster movies? Or donate massive amounts of money to the IAS?
“Cause over life,” if not the ultimate carrot, is one hell of an incentive, though. The EP is so big, so OT! What could be better than “cause over life?” Imagine never again having to circle the block for a parking spot!
Last Words
We’re all cause over life. We always have been. We always will be. Anyone telling you otherwise is lying and has a hidden agenda.
There will always be those who drive flashier cars and who are able to throw a ball farther than you. Some people cause bigger effects than others. Big deal. Doesn’t matter. We’re all cause over life. We always have been. We always will be.
Still not Declared,
Terra Cognita
In this sense I see “Cause” as not being “Effect” to life on a subjective level, the result of not having a NOTs case, or such case condition. It’s a frame of mind, the external pressures are pretty much gone. BT/CLs no longer exerting thought-influence, impulses, etc., ie. no “Other-Determinism” going on in the background unbeknownst to you – no other subjective sources of causation other than yourself.
One does not have to be fully complete on Solo NOTs to experience “Cause over Life”, nor is that the EP of Solo NOTs.
Mike, have you seen this article by The Richard Dawkins Foundation for Reason and Science? It made my day.
https://richarddawkins.net/2015/03/its-not-easy-being-scientology/?gclid=CjwKEAjw7ZHABRCTr_DV4_ejvgQSJACr-YcwyM4uslC0Y3YNOyMFzpSD1zMGCOkBoGn7u5XS6Bx5KRoC_0nw_wcB
I discussed the whole idioty of BTs and super-powers and so forth in my french book “La secte – secte armée pour la guerre – chroniques d’une “religion” commerciale à Irresponsabilité Illimitée”. Has been sold, says my publisher Alban from France then, at 6500 copies.
The cult never attacked anything of my book before courts when it was published in 1998. Probably Mike remembers the damages against the cult, moreover since I was helping the french govt PM’s services to get rid of cults.
The book can now be read for free in my main website – opened in march 1997. The URL is http://www.antisectes.net/la-secte-pdf-2007.pdf
I am cause over life. I know who I am now and I’m not really interested in finding out who I was.
Cause over life untill you meet a hungry lion meating you. Then life is cause over you 🙂
New OT5 and OT7: Ask the BT: What are you? Who are you? BT: I am myself. Free.
OT8: EP: You are not your BTs memories. And now interested in knowing who you really are.
OT9: Same as OT5, but this time ask not BTs but yourself, the what and who you are.
EP: I was a fool to pay. I am me. Bankrupt. There are no Free win, only Freewind and Sea Orgres.
OT10: Find out that you are not really you. And now interested in what you really are.
OT11: EP: I am nothing. Life that is not being. Nothing new, you have always been nothing 🙂
OT15: Total Freedom. From scn and auditing, as OT15 is the last level.
The biggest win on any grade or level is not the level itself but completing it.
OT16: We will invent some more levels to blow your money out of your pocket.
Why limit solo processing to BTs? There are OTs, God, gods, the Devil, and devils (the Heaven, and the Hell OT games). And why run one OT/BT at a time when you can run them all at the same time. Unlimited space. Mutual as-isness. Cause over life is a group action. Not a one persons action. As that gives counter forces. BTs being dead and unconscious. You get what you consider is there.
And for heavens sake don’t use the KRC Triangle. The last thing you want is Knowingness, Responsibility, and Control. You only want as-isness, true love and forgiveness. No Control, only free flow. But not so free that it kills you. E = mc2.
Auditors Code (you and all BTs): Don’t hate the The Devil, or he won’t as-is anything.
Tank you, Devil, for participating in the game. That may blow 1 million Evil Purposes per second. Where CoS used one hour to blow a few Evil Purposes.
Having gods to as-is can be a bit more difficult. Holy as they are. We only cast a few sinners into Hell, they deserved it.
Mental Image Pictures (Die an etics) is nothing compared to OT-force and OT-energy.
But mental image pictures are a lot safer to run, than OTs forces. Many OT7s lost their physical body just running BTs. Total Freedom from physical body. Yes why OT15 if OT7 can do it.
The problem with being an expert in mutual as-isness is, your space gets crowded whith OTs too eager to get freed. This is not case but eagerness. You need an automatic e-meter. No time to ajust the TA all the time when you get 750 divisions of TA per hour. Not for long. OT-force scares BTs, so they say stop. Also they hate OTs at cause over MEST. An OT at total cause over your MEST and life. No thanks. OT is a trap. We need to get higher.
Warning: Solo processing OTs instead of BTs can give chronic somatics that last for years, if the OTs target your body. Actually there are no BTs, only OTs who have invested their OTness in OT wars. Large groups. Pains from OTs can be switched on and off by thought alone. Right thought, no pain, wrong thought, sharp pain. Total cause over the pain center in your brain? Or are spirits real? Maybe your wife or husband is just a spiritless robot. You too 🙂
Matter, Energy, Space, and Time, are created illusions. You are nowhere and everywhere. Being everywhere is Telepathy. But many OTs hate to face what they did. Telepathy shut down. Total forgiveness opens it. Unfortunatedly there are trillions and trillions of them. So if you only audit for your own benefit, they will use OT tricks to make you fail and believe that it is all fake Tech. Or they wil make you choose Tech that doesn’t work. So far very successfull. But if your solo processing also helps them then they will be helpfull in as-isness.
I left CoS in 1984. Obnosis, a drill in the Academy, observing the obvious.
Those who stayed 40 years in CoS must have had a MU on Obnosis, it only took me 9 years 🙂
But a day without solo processing is a wasted day. According to LRH. He may be right in that.
Apparently there are some 37 trillion cells in the average human body. Each of these cells is a living entity unto itself and works in unison with other cells to create and make function all of the organs and processes that go into making said human body function and stay alive.
From what I can tell, all one needs to do to be cause over this magnificent contrivance is to feed it pizza once and it will forevermore crave pizza. I, therefore am cause over life since I decide if it will be pizza (yum) or broccoli (yetch).
I think a more realistic EP for OT VIII would be Cause Over Mike.
Great post TC. I will present my comment next Friday.
Thanks for the spark.
RB
Looking forward to it.
Thanks RB. I already have a picture of another of your wickedly wacky conversations in my mind! Can’t wait!
???
The way I understood this on ot7:cause over life is that the space cooties would not bothe rme anymore.But I was never bothered by them in the fist place(if they even existed,lets be kind)Typical Hubbard.He invents a problem that he can be a solution for.For the most cash possible.But I am not blaming Hubbard.As long as there are people around like I was who saw what they believed instead of believed what they saw we will have a hard time getting the last remainingg clams seperated from the Rock.
I was on OT VII and I never took that EP to be as complicated as TC and others are painting it to be. “Cause Over Life” to me meant cause over BT’s and Clusters, which if you think they exist, are life they are living beings if you believe that. I don’t want a big debate on this. My only point is that the EP of ” Cause Over Life could just be the ability to not be affected by or upset by or restimulated by BT’s. And if you wanted, cause to be able to tell them to get lost, or to audit them or whatever you decided to do with them. I don’t think that one would ever be “totally without even one BT left on your body.” Absolutes are unattainable. But you can become cause over life, which is what a BT is: a live, even if in a subdued or not very aware state.
Nobody ever told you about your body becoming translucent?
I was aware of the “invisible body” thing also. I was commenting on what “cause over life” could mean if you think of BT’s as being alive even though not in the fullest sense.
Mike I assume you meant that ironically – it doesn’t mean that the body would be translucent to other’s ocular sight but to the perception of the being.
Well, as they say, translucence is in the eye of the beholder 😉
Now that’s funny, Mike! I love your sense of humor
Of course it wouldn’t be translucent. To anyone. Although a person hypnotized for years might imagine themselves as translucent.
Would be one way of determining how brainwashed a El Con follower was.
HA Ha. Not to a body’s eyes, no, but to a thetan? If there were no masses / bts and ridges etc of course it would be translucent on a theta level. See? Oops. Perceive? ;P
Mimsey
Allegedly YOU are a “thetan”; so keep your theta eyes peeled for any transparent people.. ha, ha, ha!
At least Cindy understands what it means. As for the rest of the nonsensical comments on here on this subject it is descending into a kindergarten of gleeful nincompoops. The article as well – this is scraping the bottom of the barrel now.
Thank you, Foolproof. I agree, we’re scraping the bottom of the barrel now.
The bottom line is: if you are happy and having wins with BTs, fine. I have no problem with it.
But just because you are blowing charge, getting a Floating TA etc, does not guarantee that what the minds understands is true about that transcended feeling is actually true cause.
It’s symbols you are running. You are running concepts that you are creating, and giving it the mental garb of LRH.
The story of OT, BTs etc is non essential to running the seed energy: the prime thought.
You don’t need the “Ridem Cowboy” Ron Cosmology. You can if you want. You are and will have wins.
But at some point the story is non essential. You work with concepts, not someone’s story. The story is for Kindergarden. See spot run, run run run.
What keeps this argument alive is that people are having wins on these Rons form of controlled looking,
It’s the story I conclude is BS. But when people are hating on LRH, they also invalidate that people are getting gains. It’s not all hypnosis. But much of it is. People are happy running this stuff.
But……. Reason will always hound you in the form of the collective attitude toward Sciwntology and LRH.
Out here in Woglndia, Scientology, LRH, DM is seen as a public Pariah.
You will first have to explain to us why your savior wished for suicide. To equate his end as a victory or “cause over life” will always be seen as a product of hypnotism.
You talk about cause over life. I do not think so.
Non the less, people like running this stuff. Just know you do not need the story. Run ideas. That’s all visuals are anyway. They are symbols of ideas!
You don’t need the story!
Cause over Life.
Actually by true statistics OT 7s and OT 8s drop dead of cancer, heart attacks, and so on just as much as any *WOG* as Scientologists call them (non Scientologists).
I recall a guy in the Seattle area who dropped dead while auditing his BTS.
The Cult was frantic to alter the death scene before Law enforcement arrived so that the Emeter and cans were not part of it.
Ann Ruble, DSA and other help changed the room so that an advanced Scientology session was not connected with the death.
The question is, why do they have to hide it all ?
Well Karen, when you’ve got as many withholds as Dave, hiding is your only option.
Why does anyone hide? They hide to deflect attention.
What would that attention reveal?
It would reveal a world of inconsistency, lies and absurdity. It would reveal that L Ron Hubbard taught his student to overcome body consciousness by riveting their attention to the body for year after year. Assigning everyday thoughts and pain to alien creatures.
It hides the extremely disempowering doctrine of the BT which destroys self knowledge and self determination and assigns cause of actual mind stuff to make believe.
There has been plenty of revelations about the body/mind connection in medical and cognitive studies since Ron’s time.
To always visualizing for years and years and years that your body is a hot bed of countless tortured unconscious beings is going to have an affect on the cells and central nervous system. Beyond doubt!
If visualizing health has been scientifically found to affect the body through the body/mind connection, it is reasonable to deduce that visualizing the body as a prison of tortured unconscious beings will have a negative effect.
But the biggest danger is the assault on ones knowledge of thought itself and feeling itself.
To assign ones own thoughts to the thoughts of others is a form of self induced mini schizophrenia.
Is it my thoughts thinking? Or is it my tortured unconscious BT body condo. Is this me thinking? Or is it a cluster? Is this my goal? Or is it the effect of implanted beings causing me suffering? Is it me that wants sex? Or some BT pervert?
That gives new meaning to cluster fuck. Lol, sorry,lol……
This is a dangerous and cruel doctrine.
It drove the Old Man to wish for suicide. People want to end their life when they lose what? Hope!
By assigning his thoughts and feelings to some outside force, LRH hid the true cause of his suffering and ignorance by blaming his imagination. He condemned himself to never seeing with clear accurate eyes. BT theory and practice is the essence of blame and victimhood. The opposite of cause.
Finding the true source of his suffering was completely a hopeless search. Because he was not developed enough spiritually to know that he was creating it. Mocking it up. By denying, or not being able to see that his problems came from him, Ron, he became hopeless.
Only responsible people, people who do not blame external reasons for internal problems, can find the true source of those problems.
It requires self scrutiny and constructive self criticism: taking responsibility.
BT theory and practice deflects the discriminating intelligence, our own very powerful human reasoning skill. BT theory never allows you to say: I have found the source of suffering within me. Because that source is transferred to something outside of ourselves.
All experience is self generated. We are mocking up everything. Our entire experience of life is defined by our mind, our experience with life. And our mind is composed of facsimiles of those experiences. It is the mind that is the cause. Our thoughts. Or more exactly our ignorance of the nature of the mind and its relation to our experience.
Simply put: there is no one but us responsible for our thoughts, feelings and body pressures.
Following his imagination because of blips on the emeter, Ron drove him into a psychotic state.
And no……………… I will not cease reminding you that Ron’s final recorded OT research was wishing suicide To free BTs. Wishing to hunt down and kill the body to free BTs?????????
Does anyone even think to ask the question, that if he was at least OT8, he is still running BTs.
You need constant reminder. Running BTs led Ron to choose killing himself.
People that see no problem with this need our help and patience.
Some people get a very negative effect of running BTs. There should be a study. If anyone does one, I would be happy to tell my story of how Likki, my X wife from the Incredible Stringband lost her mind and became a homless women living on the streets.
And please, those who still believe this stuff, spare me of the condescending arrogance that she was missing some level and you give your condolences.
I came home one day, during heavy episodes of Likki talking to invisible spirits.
I found her curled under the bathroom sink in a fetus position heaving tears and making her eyes beet red. She looked like she was crying for hours and she says to me,”I created the OT 3 incident. She was talking in the first person. She was insane.
Some months later, when we split up in a friendly manner, she started living on the streets.
From Woodstock, The Royal Albert Hall, Lincoln Cener in NYC, to the streets of Los Angeles.
My X wife Likki needed help. OT3 and BT auditing drove her further down the rabbit hole.
A celebrity becomes homeless and a “wise world savior” wishes death by electrocution.
Yeah right…………. “Tell your friends Scientology is not a perfect system. Tell them that it is the most workable”
Wow Brian, I never knew about Likki. That is so sad. I knew her and you from back in the day. If you’d like to reach out, please have Mike give you my email.
Brian, such pain you must have gone through losing Likki.
Your point of losing self determinism because of the viewpoint of the mythology is so right. I appreciate you articulating this so excellently.
Hi Brian. Thanks for all your thoughts. And my spouse and I were also saddened by the story of Likki. Wow.
Thank you guys. For years, way before this open forum, during the time we were afraid of speaking out, when the demonic beast used “willing hounds” ala Bolivar to destroy critics, I kept this stuff to myself.
So many of Likki’s fans wanted to know what happened to her. I stayed out of the Scientology energy because I knew GO/OSA goons were still in operation. I was all too glad to forget about Scientology for good.
I had nothing to do with Scientology after I left. Nothing until I read Clam Bake which lead me to Marty’s, which led me to do research.
The OT 3 materials were responsible for the mental deterioration of Likki. I witnessed it.
I now know, because she did not have the money to do the next level, she was stuck at OT3X.
I now know that she was listening to voices in her head. Desperately wanting to get rid of these voices.
Scientology and the OT materials triggered some deep issues in Likki.
It was tragic to watch someone I cared for, someone who was alive and creative, lose her sanity right before my eyes.
It was pure hell.
I tried to get her help at AO, but they only have her a review and made her sign a waiver that if she killed herself Scientology would not be responsible.
It was at that moment that I got supremely pissed off because I realized Scientology was a business not a benevolent group.
Likki once showed me a letter from a Flag Missionaire. It stated that 60% of the entire UK staff got into Scientology through the Stringband.
So here was this women partially responsible for staffing the UK.
AO dumped her like a pariah.
That was my first feeling of righteous anger towards this dangerous false road.
That you had to hold in your story about the loss of Likki for years is absolutely heart wrenching. I am glad you get to share it now.
One of the phrases that I learned in Scilontology that I won’t give up is “betrayal after trust.” When I read of how through the string band Likki got so many staff on and in her time of need she was thrown to the curb, I see the true meaning of betrayal after trust.
I can only imagine the towering bitterness that welled up inside you when you saw this horrid “handling” and Likki’s subsequent descent into insanity. I have tears in my eyes for her and for you.
I appreciate the time you spend to share your views, whether I’m with you or not. Keep telling your truth.
I second what Clearly said, it’s just heart wrenching. Has there been any progress in investigating what happened to her? It’s so sad to think of her out there somewhere, in need. I’m really hoping this will eventually have a resolution and hope so much that it will turn out to not be really bad. God bless, wherever you are….
Only rumors. She was last seen crossing the Arizona desert in the early 80s.
Someone also said she may be in Sacramento and does not want to be found.
Karen, that story of the guy who died auditing BT’s is astounding. It is stories and finding out things that really happened that helps me heal. Please do keep sharing what you have seen like this, that is the opposite of the sunny little bullshit world that Scilons propagate.
“Cause over Life.”
I think most people have the wrong definition in mind when they think of that statement.
It’s understandable that so many misunderstand this statement of the EP for OT 7 because it is deliberately vague and sort of implies that one will be cause over their lives and all that that means as Terra Cognita explains.
Here’s what I think it means: Since “absolutes are unobtainable”, according to Hubbard, then no one is ever going to be able to completely get rid of all the BTs on their body or around it.
But one could move into a position of no longer bring effect of them. One could become “slight, gentle cause” over all those BTs, all that Life, that’s been tormenting one.
So if one defines “life” as living things and their activity, then the EP “Cause over Life” becomes being the boss over all those pesky BTs that you couldn’t get rid of.
There. Now you can attest.
All the above presupposes the assumption that BTs exist and can be dealt with using the techniques of Hubbard.
“What Life? Admittedly, cause over life sounds awesome. Presumably, a person with such ability could change, not only his own life, but LIFE—all life, across the Dynamics.”
Many people do seem to agree that the definition of “life” being used in “Cause over LIFE” is this one: “sequence of physical and mental experiences that make up the EXISTENCE of an individual.” http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/life
However, that concept of “life” would be more like the EP of full OT: “cause over thought, life, form, matter, energy, space and time” – where “life” is only one aspect of existence.
In other words, with OT VII (which is not full OT but a pre-OT level) the EP “Cause over Life” must be using a different definition of “life.” Based on what the level handles, I would say it’s this definition: “spiritual existence transcending physical death” (also from Merriam Webster online, same link as above).
Actually, a better definition of “life” in this context might be: “living beings.”
This is an interesting subject. But it is based on the seemingly never ending contradictions that Scientology as a subject produces. It goes round and round, and the more modern version always seems more shinier and more cosmetic than the previous one.
I drank pretty deeply the 1950s data Hubbard presented, especially the pre PDC stuff in 1951 and up through what was known as the Professional Course. Trying to interpret how that information back then morphed into what is presented today in Scientology is the stuff headaches are made from. There is so much bs connected and created with this I disown anything Scienological presented after the bs of NOTs was not only introduced but gobbled up like there’s no tomorrow. I’m not saying the earlier stuff will “set you free” but I am saying it’s entirely different than the gobbly gook people get suckered with today.
Hubbard was all about universes back then and insisted there is such a thing as your, “home universe.” The MEST universe is a specialist case and is primarily designed to mask yours and make you believe you are lesser, more unimportant than it, Hubbard also beat the drum pretty loud and clear on what the condition of man was all about and how abberated it is. He even use to say, “what in the hell are you doing in meat body anyway?”
The whole shooting match morphed into an obsession about money and power plus killing off anyone who challenges the church doctrine of getting more and more money. It always makes me chuckle when people say show me someone moving mest with thoughts or cause over life while assigning all their fortitude to the comfort and the existence of a meat body. According to Hubbard that is the basis of the why we ended up so keen to destroy each other and starve most of the population of earth while we look the other way.
I’ve met some old time OT5s & 7s and they were happy with their lot in life and didn’t get suckered into free money for the Cof$ and actively got on with their lives away from the Church. It seemed apparent EPs back in those days were what they were and people weren’t pressured into resigning etc. In other words they were respected. That’s such a far cry from the insanity of what Scientology presents today.
It doesn’t take Hubbard or anyone else to be you and the more you are convinced it takes something like that or a God perhaps, then the more MEST oriented you’ll become, If it becomes the only place you’ll ever accept evidence of spirituality, who is cause over what then?
I get somewhat lost for words with all these blanket opinions that it’s all lies anyway and let’s just enjoy the direction and results of… well, who cares because Scientology in any form is just so bad, it’s eradication alone is the freedom we all need. At a very young age I was qualified to handle and use weapons of deadly force and trained by my Govt to blindly do what I was told. Yet so many tell me I’m wrong and can’t be trusted to ask questions of another, it’s all so wrong you’ll go insane – go figure that one???
All I am convinced of is that Scientology destroyed itself from within.
Nice writing Yawnalot…and great insight: “Scientology destroyed itself from within” I totally agree.
Silly Terra Cognita Tricks are for OTs. ‘Cause over Life’ is a great slogan, but utterly meaningless in semantics. That is why Lron used that slogan (slogan, not End Phenomenon) is its sale. It was all about the sales and not any thing real or measurable.
It was and still is a Piece of Blue Sky. All ‘Cause over Life’ needs is nice jingle to go along with it.
here’s the little jingle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npH1KPr32Gk
$cientology wants cause over your money. That is all they care about.
T.C., I’m frankly embarrassed for you. In today’s article you demonstrate a pretty serious lack of understanding of what you’re talking about.
The end phenomena for OT 7 wasn’t changed in the 60’s or 70’s as you claim. What did happen was that in 1982 the Grade Chart above OT 3 was completely revised. All the original OT levels 4-8 were withdrawn, and New OT 4-8 took their place.
These new OT levels weren’t in any way based on the originals. They were different processes altogether, aimed at different end phenomena. Original OT 7 pre-supposed that the pre-OT had handled all BTs on OT 3, and had then drilled various abilities on Original OT 5-6 in similar fashion to the book “Creation of Human Ability.” By contrast, New OT 5-7 handle additional BTs still remaining after OT 3. Logically, if Original OT 5-7 were re-introduced, they would be positioned after New OT 5-7, but would have new OT level numbers to reflect that.
The End Phenomena for Original OT 7 was “rehabilitation of intention.” Please note that this wording doesn’t say anything about super-human powers. A person injured in an auto accident might spend some time in a “rehab facility” to get back to normal, but that wouldn’t make him a world-class athlete. Original OT 7 strengthened the intention of those who did it, but wasn’t intended to create supermen.
The End Phenomena of New OT 7 is “cause over life.” That wording was left vague because it’s a confidential level dealing with “life” in a very particular way that LRH didn’t want unprepared persons fooling around with. Of course, that confidentiality has been completely blown in recent years, so here’s what “life” means in this context. It’s BTs and other spiritual entities that the pre-OT was formerly the effect of, and the conditions those beings caused. Defined in this way, “cause over life” is a very good thing and is attainable, albeit after a lot of work. But it has nothing to do with super-human powers.
Many Church members and staff have misunderstood all this, and promoted fantastic, unreal results for the OT levels, both Original and New. So I do empathize with you. But I also think that someone assuming a sufficiently authoritative position to write an article for this blog ought to get his facts straight first.
Also, your article is dripping with bypassed charge and exaggeration. It’s great that Mike provides this blog as a channel for us to blow charge by finding out that we’re not alone in the abuse we suffered while in the Church. But in my opinion, truth is also important, and articles and comments about the tech itself should be written with more intellectual rigor.
All the original OT levels 4-8 were withdrawn,
Are you saying there was an “original OT 8”? My recollection is that it went to OT VII with OT VII actually done after OT III and before OT IIIX?
Your recollection is correct Mike. The final (original) OT levels were through OT 7. I had a couple of friends who did them in the 70’s after doing up through III around 1969. Some people did what was called 7 E.P. at AO’s until the late 70’s.
There is NO record anywhere (including from those who worked in RTRC) of any OT 8 PRIOR to the one that eventually got delivered on the ship. Although there are conspiracy theories. But ZERO physical evidence.
I know (from looking at them) that the original OT levels, 4-7 were in filing cabinets in FSO and the AO’s until the 80’s.
Yes. Those original OT 4 – 7 are all over the internet.
Mike, you are right. Original OT 8 was never released. But it had a different and far greater end phenomena than the New OT 8 that eventually was released.
There is NO “original OT 8” that wasn’t released, except in your hypnotized brain.
I said “not released.” That doesn’t imply that it was all written up and ready for release. It doesn’t even imply that LRH had completed researching it. The point is simply that the god-like ability gained stated for Original OT 8 was much greater than the ability gained on New OT 8.
El Con NEVER created a different OT 8. Released or not. You are simply making up lies My Two Cents.
Why do you keep lying about that?
If there was an original OTVIII, Otto Roos would have known about it, being one of the top tech terminals at the time. He has never said anything on the subject.
If there was an original OTVIII, Bill Robertson would have known about it. He was such a Standard Tech fanatic that he would have used it in the Ron’s Org Bridge. But he created Excalibur to be his OTVIII.
Given that, I think we can assume that original OTVIII doesn’t and never has existed.
Wynski, I don’t know, and neither do you, whether or not LRH ever developed or wrote up Original OT 8. What we do know is that it was listed on the late-60’s Grade Chart with an Ability Gained that sounded pretty god-like, and certainly much greater than the “truth revealed” claimed for New OT 8.
There is no lying from me about this. I don’t care whether or not LRH ever completed or even started the R & D for Original OT 8. My point has only been that New OT 8 was not intended to produce the same god-like Ability Gained that was stated for Original OT 8 on the late-60’s Grade Chart.
I have several HCOBs from the original OT VIII which are not part of the New OT VIII. All New OT VIII HCOBs are post 1980 issues.
Always nice to see “Mike el con Wynski” making friends.
Yep, the only people who aren’t are still hypnotized and carry the criminal lines from El Ron in their brains.
That’s a nice generality, got any more?
OT VIII was on the 1970 Grade Chart. See link below:
http://www.lotsofscam.nl/Grade_Chart_1970.png
WRONG My Two Cents. NO WHERE in the New OT 7 materials does LRH state he means BT’s when he says that the EP is Cause over Life.
You just pulled that out of your ass as a LIE. I mis-stated in my fist post on this thread that the insane would attack this thread. I omitted that pathological liars would also chime in.
If you care to post where El Con says that about new OT 7 I will stand corrected. Otherwise, my charge of you intentionally lying stands. Correctly.
Wynski, I simply related my own understanding, without claiming it to be a statement by LRH. Thus I did not lie. On the other hand, your accusation and the hateful terminology you used in making it reek of charge. Why are you so full of hate?
There is a lot of feeling of betrayal My 2 Cents. Waking up to the idea that folks have been conned, that they spent their whole lives in a lie to a man who said one thing and was another, is an intense feeling for some people.
A feeing of a wasted life following a con man.
You may have, through your own intelligence, put the doctrines of Ron and Scientology in a lower position to your own powers of observation, but most people believed Ron.
You are promoting to use the parts that have worked for you, while others have only perceived betrayal, lies and duplicity.
You have a tough road to climb out here.
It’s like promoting a child day care center run by a child abuser.
There is a cognitive dissonance in seeing the good in a subject that has caused so much harm.
If you really knew the comm formula, if you really had your auditors hat on, if you really duplicated the pain people are in from this betrayal, you would be listening and granting beingness instead of refuting people’s thoughts and emotions with how great Ron’s teachings are.
If you wish the benevolent parts of auditing to be accepted, I would suggest duplicating the pain and betrayal that people are experiencing.
It is real. Knowing that someone has used you, someone who you have given trust to, for financial gain and power is not an easy path.
Folks feel betrayed. And you believe they are missing some auditing level to handle BPC.
To use Scientologese: that is a wrong indication.
You want to be understood. Trying understanding others first.
Excellent comment.
I would also add that one of the more troubling parts of the scientology experience is the inculcated idea that you must accept EVERYTHING. Apologists can argue all they want about the few quotes that seem to indicate you can take or leave what you want of scientology. The overwhelming majority of policy and HCOBs and lectures hammer away that you MUST accept and apply everything without alteration and without thinking. You have to follow the carefully taped path or fall into the abyss.
In that regard Mike, I can easily conclude that those that are using Scientology according to their own understanding are actually “squirrels”.
People out here doing Scientology are saying they are doing it according to their own understanding.
That freedom was never afforded anyone in the church. To have your own opinion of Ron’s work was considered a High Crime and a punishable offense.
To have any opinion about Ron, BTs and auditing, that was not a total agreement with Ron was considered being an SP squirrel.
It was considered “reasonable” and “open minded.” The redefining of these terms is insidious as far as free thinking is concerned.
It is completely known to us all, that having any opinion about Scientology that did not agree with KSW, was a suppressive and punishable act.
To say, “this is my understanding of BTs” or “this is what I think Ron meant” was never something you could express in Scientology.
My 2 Cents, you know that. So your brand of Scientology would have had your head chopped of by Ron himself.
Having an opinion about auditing and Ron, that was not in writing was the very definition of evil in the church.
Freedom of thought was not Ron’s goal.
It was regimented membership to secure paying customers.
Freedom of thought was his enemy. Because if you saw behind his well marketed and enforced messiahship, you were crushed by a demented military tribunal: ethics.
That is real Scientology.
Brian, of course my idea of using the good and leaving behind the bad is squirreling per both the Church and LRH. So what? I’ve already been declared, so I have no reason to follow the rules if they make no sense to me.
Is your position that we should be either 100% KSW fanatics or 100% anti-Scientologists, with no other viewpoints and action programs possible?
My viewpoint is that KSW is the thesis, “all Scientology is bad” is the antithesis, and that what I’ve been promoting — throwing out the bad while continuing to use and expand on the good — is the synthesis.
Mike, we’re not in the Church of Scientology any more, so we don’t have to have an all-or-nothing viewpoint on using what Ron created. The truth is that some of it was good, and some of it was bad. If we call it all good, we commit the overt of perpetuating the bad. If we call it all bad, we commit the overt of wasting the good. I’m just promoting a sensible middle path.
Brian, I do understand that people post comments here to get relief from the charge they have accumulated on the abuses and betrayals they have suffered. Over the years I was on the receiving end of a lot of abuse and betrayal myself, some of which is still a factor in my life. So I can easily empathize with others on this.
However, a blog is more than a mutual therapy group. It can also be a venue for the discussion of what to do next after some group therapy has been accomplished and group members have recovered some of their lost free attention. The needs of blog members at all stages of recovery are important.
I think there’s a difference between telling one’s story of abuse and betrayal, and totally condemning the subject involved in all of its parts. I think there’s a difference between emotionally unloading a few times, and continuing to make vicious, punishing, absolutist statements about the subject every day, year after year after year.
When years of unloading to good listeners on one or more blogs hasn’t worked to bring a person relief, it’s not rocket science to suspect that other factors may be at play. For the record, I absolutely do not believe that all upsets are caused by previous undisclosed harmful acts by the upset person himself, and I never did. But when sharing one’s story with empathetic listeners doesn’t bring relief, including the ability to reason again in the area, or grant beingness to any goodness in the subject or in those on the other side of the upset, then I think one has to wonder why.
When blog commenters, after a reasonable grace period for getting some relief through venting about how they were wronged, become permanent “it’s all bad” propagandists, inaccessible through reasoned dialogue, and this goes on for years, then what they are really doing is programming newer relief seekers to get them stuck in “it’s all bad.” This is mind-control brainwashing, and I think it’s unfair to relief seekers, as it robs them of their self-determinism while pretending to help restore it.
Ironically, this is one of the crimes the “it’s all bad” propagandists insist is the strategy of the Church. And it is, but on both sides.
The only hope any of us have for permanent relief is to rise above right and wrong, winners and losers, and just view the truth. If everyone would do that, we could all get along just fine.
Of course, that isn’t going to happen any time soon. But I thought it might be interesting to introduce the possibility through this blog.
One of your best comments 2 cents.
Plus 1. One of the best, and most succinct, by anyone on any forum.
Two cents, you had me until you got to the point where you said that people who continually post negative comments are “programming” people to believe their point of view, and that it’s “mind control brainwashing”.
I think this is ridiculous, that you actually believe that people repeatedly reading someone’s negative opinion of a subject will be ‘programmed’ or ‘brainwashed’ into adopting that exact same view. People are intelligent enough to make up their own minds on a subject, despite seeing other’s opinions on it, whether it be for or against that topic. This is not the only forum that has people expressing their opinions; readers are able to get many different views and arguments on this subject, without being “forced” into the mindset of anyone who posts here.
I also dislike you terming people who feel that the church is basically harmful, as “propagandists”, it kind of seems like you, who are continually pushing your point of view, are being a propagandist. It’s also annoying how you continually declare that people need to hear “the truth”. The truth as defined by you? Who made you the official speaker of the truth? What you believe is true, is not necessarily what anyone else believes is true. You don’t hold a patent on “the truth”. It is merely your viewpoint. You say if everyone could “view the truth” we could all get along; what you mean is, if everyone would accept *your* view of the truth, your mindset, your opinion, then there would be no debate, The problem is, that everyone does not, and is not going to, agree with you and your beliefs and views. So of course, we will continue to have discussion here (unless M.R. decides to start censoring comments a la some other blogs) and people will continue to state *their* truth, their opinions, their beliefs, whether or not you want them to. You are going to have to accept the fact that some people do not believe in the viability or benefits of practicing Scientology.
TJ: “I think this is ridiculous, that you actually believe that people repeatedly reading someone’s negative opinion of a subject will be ‘programmed’ or ‘brainwashed’ into adopting that exact same view.”
Here’s a paragraph from the Wikipedia article on Propaganda (emphasis in caps is mine), which gives an example:
“Propaganda may be administered in insidious ways. For instance, disparaging disinformation about the history of certain groups or foreign countries may be encouraged or tolerated in the educational system. Since few people actually double-check what they learn at school, such disinformation will be REPEATED by journalists as well as parents, THUS REINFORCING THE IDEA THAT THE DISINFORMATION ITEM IS REALLY A ‘WELL-KNOWN FACT’, even though no one repeating the myth is able to point to an authoritative source. The disinformation is then recycled in the media and in the educational system, without the need for direct governmental intervention on the media. Such permeating propaganda may be used for political goals: By giving citizens a false impression of the quality or [of] policies of their country, they may be incited to reject certain proposals or certain remarks or ignore the experience of others.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda
T.J., it’s a well-known mind control technique to subject a person repeatedly to the ideas you want him to adopt. It’s only one part of the whole package, but it does have an effect on a lot of people. That’s why the Church and all totalitarian regimes in politics, business, and religion use it.
It’s not true that readers are able to get a variety of viewpoints by visiting different blogs on Scientology. Except for some secret Facebook groups all the blogs are either 100% for the Church, or overwhelmingly negative regarding the whole subject. If you know of one that is balanced along the lines of my various comments here, please let me know.
I don’t call people propagandists because they feel the Church is harmful. I myself consider the Church to be harmful — not originally but more and more so over the last 35 years. I also believe that the actual subject, divorced from the Church, is mostly helpful, and could be made much more so with continued R&D work by people who actually understand it.
The people I would call propagandists are a few well-known commenters here who use a hateful tone, alter the relative importance of good and bad points, make assertions of all the ways in which LRH and the tech are bad without logically proving what they are asserting, do not respond to any attempts at rational discussion, and have been doing this for years. I say that these people are trying to get readers to agree with their ultra-negative views. That’s their right, but it is propagandizing.
Of course, I want people to agree with my views, too, so you could say that I am also a propagandist. The difference is that I’m not promoting an us-vs-them agenda. I’m not trying to kill anything.
I spent 40 years in the Church — getting auditing, auditing others, and being on staff at missions, orgs, and the Sea Org, plus being a public — then another 10 years outside the Church evaluating all my adventures inside. I concluded that when the tech is applied properly, it usually gets good results, but that most people don’t apply it properly, and the way the Church is run has ensured the perpetuation of that tragic situation, at least within the Church itself.
I know there is both good and bad in Scientology, because I experienced both for myself, and because I understand the subject well enough to be able to evaluate it in theory vs. application. Also, I know Independent Scientologist auditors who on their own have done what I’ve been promoting here — throwing out the bad and using the good — and they are getting good results with their pc’s and in their own solo auditing, with absolutely none of the abuse and betrayal we experienced in the Church.
I want people to be more self-determined, not less. If I were auditing you or anyone, it would be with no pre-conceived notions of what your truth should be, either already or as a result of the auditing I was delivering to you.
But a blog is not an auditing session. It’s also educational. So I do express my viewpoint on what I believe the truth to be, just as everyone else does with theirs.
Marildi, I don’t think anyone is purposely trying to spread covert propaganda against Scientology on this blog. They are just voicing their opinions. There is no hidden agenda to disenfranchise people; the Church has done that on it’s own. Ex-members are already disillusioned, and comments here are not likely to sway anyone from their own viewpoint.
Marildi (again) I also don’t believe that people are not likely to double-check what they are told in school (or elsewhere), I know I myself always look for primary sources to corroborate what I am told, and do not repeat something that I do not personally know to be true, unless I preface it with “I can’t vouch for this as a fact, but I’ve heard this from several reliable sources”. I also tend to provide links to reference materials whether or not anyone asked for it, to back up my assertions, and I dislike the habit of spreading around information without verifying the source. You probably haven’t noticed, but at least 3 times recently on this blog, I’ve corrected people who posted a quote they attributed to Einstein, which was not, in fact, actually said by him. This is how misinformation gets spread, by people not checking into things themselves before repeating them. So it looks like I mostly agree with you here, (about 80%) and partially disagree with you, (about 20%) basically the disagree is in the assertion that people are trying to sway others covertly to their point of view. Thanks for your input.
Two cents: your reply was very thoughtful, well reasoned, and intriguing, and it was the first time I’ve actually agreed with almost everything you said and not been even slightly annoyed by it. I’m sure that comes as a huge relief to you. << this was a joke (a very feeble one) in case it wasn't clear. A lot to think about in your last post. Thank you for your comments as well. – T.J.
TJ, I see some things differently from you, but I have no disagreement with your approach and your attitude. If everyone were so inclined, I think we could have more productive discussions and all of us learn from them. Thanks for all your input.
T.J. if someone wants to take a Provenly harmful subject ( like scientology) and claim that parts of it are GOOD, I have no problem IF they bring empirical evidence of it. Otherwise I will expose them for pushing a KNOWN harmful product.
So far in a couple of decades of confronting scamologists on this, not one has been able to do so. Always falling back on referring to the dangerous practice itself to “explain” why the person confronting them is doing so. Much like how a NAZI would say that a person who attacked NAZISM was not a real member of the Aryan as the reason for the attack.
The problem though is that belief is subjective, not objective. You cannot measure the benefit of belief (or self help or talk therapy or whatever) is not measurable to anyone outside of their experience. That scientology claims that it works 100% of the time or claims specific results is clearly wrong — but that does not mean that nobody achieves anything of value from it. The value is measured in personal, subjective terms. Who are you or anyone else to say someone didnt have “gains” or isnt “happier.” You can criticize scientology for making false claims. But don’t try and hold the individuals who say they have had gains to the same standards you criticize.
Regardless Mike. The burden is on those making positive claims of help for the known damaging cult. It is NOT on those asking to see those purported positive results.
“When blog commenters, after a reasonable grace period for getting some relief through venting about how they were wronged, become permanent “it’s all bad” propagandists, inaccessible through reasoned dialogue, and this goes on for years, then what they are really doing is programming newer relief seekers to get them stuck in “it’s all bad.” This is mind-control brainwashing, and I think it’s unfair to relief seekers, as it robs them of their self-determinism while pretending to help restore it.” Excellent comments, My 2 Cents
But should everyone who comments on this blog be termed a “relief seeker”? This blog has a very mixed bunch of posters: ex-members, people who have not been members at any time, those who still practice, either in the freezone or independently, and those “under the radar” who are, like Terra Cognita “still not declared”… not everyone who comments is a relief seeker, some just want to discuss, to hear people’s stories and thoughts, to put forth their own ideas, opinions, theories, and having an open, free dialogue cannot really be termed “mind control brainwashing” that “robs people of their self-determinism”. I just don’t think anyone who comments here is going to be so easily persuaded to alter their views merely by reading comments by someone who often repeats their opinion.
It would be kind of fun and interesting to gather some information and draw up some statistics on the profile of posters here. ON the other hand, there is an ever-changing group of commenters, so it probably wouldn’t really give an accurate over-all picture of who comments here on a regular basis, maybe just who does on any particular day that the info was gathered. And of course, with so many people who tend to see conspiracies everywhere, it probably wouldn’t be a good idea to ask anyone for any type of info about themselves. So, nevermind. Forgive the musings, I’m in the accounting field, my mind just normally wanders in that direction.
Great points My Two Cents. I completely agree with your views.
Thank you for sharing them.
It’s always about balance. It’s always about happiness. I think that’s why I never resonates with Tony’s blog.
I don’t hate him or think something is wrong with him or his blog.
I just did not find the intelligent discussion as I have on Marty’s and Mike’s.
But………….. I do see the purpose for Tony’s blog. It’s a lightning rod for all the hate and violence that has been perpetrated by Ron’s mental illness.
Tony’s blog is Scientology’s karma. Ron sought destruction of critics through any means: deception and black ops. Destroying people’s lives.
The critics are now alive and well seeking destruction of Scientology.
And I cannot say it makes me feel bad at all.
Ortega has a purpose. A high profile purpose. I support him in his efforts.
Two Cents: Well articulated. Thanks.
You say: “Defined in this way, “cause over life” is a very good thing and is attainable, albeit after a lot of work. But it has nothing to do with super-human powers.”
OK, the discussion is on OT VII but I cannot help but think of VIII. Somewhere I probably have an old (1970s or 1980s) grade chart but I don’t have it handy. But my recollection is that OT VIII had the result of something like total cause over matter, energy, space, time, life, and though, both objective and subjective. If that had nothing to do with super-human powers, I don’t know what would!
(Clearly the end phenomena of the processing side of the grade chart had to be toned down to keep people taking the bait for newly imagined higher levels, since in over 65 years of “trying” and self-proclaimed “successes” there has not been a single Clear or OT — as originally defined — that has been documented.)
FOTF2012, you are right that Original OT 8 had a pretty god-like “ability gained” per the Grade Chart. But it was never released. And when I said “nothing to do with super-human powers,” I was talking about Original OT 4-7.
I’m a “glass half full” guy. I prefer to find the good and build on it. I consider that LRH failed to find a workable path to the theoretical absolutes of Clear (original DMSMH definition) and OT, but that he did produce tools that can help people become significantly less aberrated and more able. I also think his R & D work can be continued by those who actually understand what he did.
Thanks for sharing more on your thoughts on this. While I would agree that there are some useful tools that can help people, I’ve also seen that the “tech” can cause harm. So I guess for me the glass is half full but some of what is in that half-full glass may be Kool-Aid of the worst sort.
The solution is to actually understand the philosophy, tech, and organization, and then eliminate the bad parts while accentuating the good parts and building on them. This is not an easy task, but there are people working on it.
You are correct. From the 1970 edition of Scn 0-8, ” OT Course Section VIII: ABILITY TO BE AT CAUSE KNOWINGLY AND AT WILL OVER THOUGHT, LIFE, FORM MATTER, ENERGY, SPACE AND TIME, SUBJECTIVE AND OBJECTIVE.
Thanks for this Les.
It is interesting to look back historically at the claims made for the states of dianetics and scientology from the earliest claims for Clear.
They are ALWAYS way over the top. And then there is all sorts of two-stepping and explaining as to why they are no longer the claims. And those caught in the euphoria of belief will ignore it and not walk away. In fact, all the way to today, they will explain that these things CAN be achieved, someone just needs to take what Ron said and refine/expand/clarify it and such magnificent states of being will be attained.
That is not to say that nobody gets any gains from applying dianetics and scientology.
But to continue to support the notion that it contains “the answers to all life” is patently untrue.
I like your presentation 2c. I agree there is so much illogical crap inserted in the Bridge it’s unreadable and just as unworkable. The unworkability is why we post here and can be used as evidence I suppose.
A point I observed in 2 people years back was they were somewhat stalled on original OT5. They didn’t have a needle that responded to anything, it just floated all the time. They just went off merrily on their way. I never heard what became of them, they sure dumped the Cof$ apparently as they never showed up back on lines. Declared most likely as they were well trained in the subject and were good auditors.
I still maintain if one has to continually ask what is next up around original OT5 you’ve missed the whole point and have done something else with your time and money. The subject should be yours by then.
Yawn, I don’t understand your last paragraph. Please explain.
To me the top of the so called Bridge is recovery of oneself and your abilities to fool around with universes without them turning around and biting you in the butt. According to Hubbard in the early 50s, home universe was made with basically the same Qs & Logics of Scn as the agreed upon MEST universe was/is but the differences between universes can be wildly variable. Processing and the all important theory of training that one is supposed to put in practice is for themselves to be able to dig your way out of the messes you create for yourself and along with other beings. The axioms follow suit but are a lower order of instruction really, more like a statement of “facts.”
I’m trying not to spruke/endorse the virtues of how the tech developed along certain lines but it did. That’s what makes it a easier to see where it really went off the rails. Hubbard said a few interesting things in his personal evaluation of the data. One being always process towards the Thetan, ie the one in charge. (That’s why I really don’t like NOTs, it’s a very LIMITED process at the very least). There comes a point when you can’t do that anymore because the thetan has seen their home universe in sufficient detail they can start to unravel it themselves – STOP Processing! This is where the Cof$ fucks up badly and goes off into God knows where and drags everyone who’ll listen along with them.
It gets as complex as you want in trying to understand yourself but one point stands out. Many a home universe is not a satisfactory creation (to begin with) to elicit admiration even for the creator of it. Thetans have a tendency to not like a lot of their creations and do weird things like stealing others stuff, getting violent etc. (The Factors).
Anyway, all I’m trying to say is that somewhere along the track of so called Scientology one is supposed to make the tech your own and go from there, create your own way out. Cause doesn’t mean dominate imo but rather the creator of new things. We’ve done enough of fooling around with old energy imo, yet that what most people do and they call it memory, genes and all sorts of names. At that part of the Bridge you shouldn’t need a boss. The Cof$ insists you do.
Thanks, Yawn. I basically agree.
Interesting view.
The top of the bridge is the ability to be at any point on any scale or not knowingly and at will, and to have or not have any identity, gpms, valence, goal, purpose, Rock, creation, problem, out ruds et al.
It’s being and creating all of the dynamics.
It’s not to be at the bottom of the effect scale and have to create total effects on others, with no effect on self.
Beings are immortal and create space and time, So you get an interesting situation – what do you do with all of that space and time you create?
Karen is right – not only did people die on NOTS, I know for a fact people died auditing OT III and they covered that up, I saw that at AOLA in the 1970’s.
But I’d make the point I did years ago, if the SCn stuff doesn’t work for you, don’t do it. Don’t deny others the possible gains they might have in doing some of it, just cause your pissed off about it. Although I cringe for anyone that did anything in the C of S these days.
Frankly the multiple Ad Hominem attacks often made on many of these blogs is shameful, any simple rhetoric class would disabuse you of using them. If you have evidence present it.
I have personally witnessed people exhibiting paranormal abilities after having done something in Scientology, that was not some magicians illusion.
Many paranormal abilities have been well documented along the way, involving no Scientology at all. There is a well documented telepathy experiment that was done as part of a polar exploration for example, that demonstrated results.
It should not be surprising that Scn might increase a person willingness to demonstrate what any of us could do if they were willing.
There’s no free lunch on this. You go as far as what you understand and no farther.
I got hundreds of hours of top notch paid Class VIII auditing from the bottom of the Bridge, every process of every level, through original full OT VII, and then NOTS, L’s , several OT VIII’s , and then the full CBR bridge. I trained interned and audited HDC, HSDC, NED, XDN, the SHSBC, and I’ve done the checksheet for the Class VIII course in the freezone under a Class VIII, I trained on NOTS and Solo NOTS and delivered that in the freezone for several years, training under the person who sup’d the first NOTS course at Flag. I was a fully trained, interned and experienced Qual Word Clearer and Cramming Officer (at ASHO FDN). All lots of damn hard work.
While I was doing this I came to create a very stable 2d situation for over 30 years, my income and jobs in the software business were on a power trend, I was a key part of a startup that went from 0 customers and income to over 3000 customers leasing software at a $4 billion per quarter rate in 8 years. My software work went from programming for one company to being level IV technical support for the top 3000 companies on the planet. I literally talked with dozens of people all over the world, every day, doing very difficult support work. Starting with me not hardly able to talk with anyone much less women, not having much reach or responsibility at all. I went from not being to talk in front of groups to giving technical presentations at user conferences to thousands of people, comfortably. None of these good things would have happened without SCN. I’ve seen similar wins with others where they spent the time, money and effort to make it happen.
BTW I attested to Solo Nots completion in April 1984, in the Freezone, my Senior C/S that verified it was David Mayo. Before there were any C of S Solo NOTS completions. Later the first C of S Solo Nots completion was declared – a nice sweet lady, who later died of Cancer.
I don’t know if Solo Nots would have lead to my death later, as I did CBR’s Excalibur , and many other things. And I’m still alive and kicking 32 years later. In fact I’m in the best health I’ve ever been . I’ve done all of the available LRH bridge and the full CBR bridge, and 14 years of stuff after that.
I have studied all of the available material from the beginning , I’m on my 7th pass. Most people who haven’t studied all of the materials have a very limited view of the subject. Scn really didn’t get significant real traction with other people besides LRH until 1958 with the 20th ACC running out the Rock, and then 1969 with the usage of HSDC, and many many processes on the grades – four flows.
Many people who audited the OT levels didn’t have sufficient training or understanding to do it effectively. There’s a huge difference in Solo auditing between someone who has been auditing hundreds of hours, has done the SHSBC, and gotten hundreds of hours of solid auditing, and someone with minimum training and experience. There is no short cut on getting the best possible results.
I too have had lot’s of negative experiences with the subject, I’ve seen abuses by people in the C of S I couldn’t believe, and I’ve seen people use it to harm and destroy others deliberately, I’ve seen too many people involved only out for themselves, not creating or existing much beyond themselves, and being perfectly willing for others to get screwed.
But I’ve also seen it work well, with people who cared for others, knew what they were doing and got results, and very much worked on creating a better situation for themselves and others.
As Einstein said there are two things that might be infinite – the universe and human stupidity – and he wasn’t sure about the universe. The C of S and Scn is a human endeavor and fraught with all the limits that causes. To err is human, to really screw up you need to misuse SCN.
Wow. What an awesome write-up of your experiences. Thanks for sharing all this data.
Dear Doc,
What is the CBR bridge?
I was fascinated by your training, auditing and viewpoint about studying and being thorough. I feel like I’ve had a peak at the freezone and what one can find there.
Your opinion, story and comment are most appreciated. I speak for me, not Wynski.
CBR stands for “Captain Bill Richardson.” Here’s one link where you can find out about him and his extended bridge: http://www.freezone.org/cbr/e_cbrpg.htm
Bill Robertson
Right. Thanks.
Captain Bill Robertson was in Europe and decided to do his NOTS , he twinned with Ulrich Kramer, and in studying the material he felt that it was missing some basics that he knew from the application of both Tech, and Admin.
Captain Bill had acted at Saint Hill after he had done his SHSBC as a review auditor with LRH as the C/S and handled getting a number of ARC broken people back on lines. Bill at one point was third in line in Scientology after LRH and MSH, and had done a large number of successful missions to fix things for LRH over the years. Including establishing advanced orgs, and correcting advanced orgs.
From Bill’s study of NOTS he put together an improved handling and audited that. That became Excalibur. (Originally called super VII – someone else called it Excalibur and the name stuck). Excalibur ran much deeper than NOTS and the sessions were much tougher – something I know from personal experience.
After Bill had finished Excalibur he looked around found was his attention was on , and put together a procedure and handled that. Level by Level he put together a bridge handling , all completely using LRH tech. I know from my own experience that it is not just Bill’s case as some have suggested who have never done the levels.
My wife, who was a C of S trained Class VIII C/S and OT review auditor and C/S, who did her OT levels on the ship in 1968, and who had audited thousands of hours at AOLA and before as non Sea Org, when doing the first course in the US on delivering Excalibur decided to go to Europe and train and intern with Captain Bill, and did so spending two one year periods in learning how to deliver the levels he had put together. She was my C/S as I did all of the Levels Bill put together. None of it was just ‘his’ case. My wife felt that Captain Bill was the best C/S after LRH she knew of.
I started Excalibur in December 1986, and finished all of the CBR levels by mid 2002. This was after I done all of the available LRH bridge.
There isn’t a single thing on any of the CBR levels that is not LRH basic tech.
If you feel that LRH tech is bad, don’t do any of them. If you feel that you only want C of S approved LRH basic tech don’t do any (CBR levels) of them. If you want something past what the available C of S bridge can do then you might want to consider them. But do them with someone that actually is trained on delivering them.
The LRH and CBR bridges do not handle everything. As available.
But the tech to continue is freely available on the 3rd ACC, the 6th and 7th ACC, the 1st Melbourne ACC, and elsewhere. These were all ACC’s that concerned themselves with handling an exterior thetan , getting them out of being on some inverted level of the Know to mystery scale, and getting them to creating and operating on the other dynamics besides the first. For people who haven’t done it, the OT Doc course is excellent. I did mine between getting the L’s and Excalibur.
There is a very large amount of gain ahead past the available bridges.
Okay, it’s pretty clear that I’m not a big fan of the Bridge or anything on it. And it’s quite clear that Captain Bill was a weapons-grade whackadoodle. I mean, he believed that the CoS had been taken over by the US government, who were acting on behalf of (for lack of a better term) the New World Order, which was controlled by the Marcabs, who were led by Xenu. There really wasn’t enough tinfoil available for Captain Bill’s sailor hat. And then there’s the whole Astar thing and Elron Elray…
(I also love his goldenrod. The Galactic Patrol was a “sick parody of the Sea Org”? Considering that the Sea Org was a sick parody of the US Navy and Heinlein’s Starship Troopers, you immediately take CBR’s side in this fight.)
That being said…
His Bridge is logically constructed from its principles, and he was absolutely clear about what he wanted to achieve with each step. There’s no mystery or “confidentiality” with Excalibur: the pre-OT was in full control over what was being run, and each case was approached individually, no cookie cutters involved. There wasn’t a mammoth money grab involved with him; he made it clear that everything past audited Excalibur was solo auditing, and you only paid for C/Sing. Doing the Bridge in reverse order and trying to understand what gets people stuck on OT 17 through 33 is a wonderful piece of insight that’s designed to expand someone’s understanding. This is really a well-built Bridge that at least leads to some kind of resolution, unlike the CoS Bridge.
The biggest drawback I have toward his approach was that he maintained the universality of OTIII (oh, boy, did he). That immediately causes conflict with the “OTIII was Ron’s case” types. But, yeah, Doc, I think he believed that everything he wrote up was based on Standard Tech, or at least his understanding of it (the fact that he made old OTIV to OTVII optional raises a question about that).
Doc, I was wondering this: You said that you did the whole of the CBR Bridge. We haven’t really heard anything from anyone about their impressions of OT41 to OT48 (hell, I even forget what it’s called, I just remember it’s a four-letter acronym). Was it a positive experience and what did you get from it?
Espiando,
As a US military veteran USMC before I did any Scientology I always had trouble with the para military aspects of the Sea Org myself. As a Heinlein Fan who has read every book Robert Heinlein wrote several times, and who owns all of his books, I’d argue that you may have misread Starship troopers like most people do. Although for people that haven’t actually read it, it’s a common misconception that it is about a military society – it’s about a society that goes to war against the ‘bugs’, but requires some form of Federal Service to acquire citizenship, not only Military. In the same way within the US government there are 7 uniformed services,some are not military at all, and do not fall under the department of defense. .
Army. Department of Defense. …
Navy. Department of Defense. …
Air Force. Department of Defense. …
Marine Corps. Department of Defense. …
Coast Guard. …
Public Health Service Commissioned Corps. …
National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration Commissioned Corps.
I strongly believe that elements of the US government took over Scientology. I have former USMC friends who work for US intelligence. One of my friends I met at the trial of the individual who had written the biography of LRH and left because of the difference between the C of S PR about LRH, and what he found when he examined the actual information. My friend was there to monitor the trial for the CIA. I talked to him on a break – he told me that I better not be involved in the C of S as parts of US intelligence were taking over the C of S, this was after I had resigned and left in 1982. My friend was not sure why exactly why elements of the US government were involved, but he knew they were.
It is probably true that this planet is involved in an proxy war from several alien et groups, but I don’t think anything other than Marcab is only part of that, and I don’t think that Xenu is the top of the chain for all of that. There are lot’s of bad actors, some organized in groups.
I know that not everyone has Inc I on their case. Some don’t have it because they are stuck in much earlier incidents, and aren’t present enough for something like Inc I to even effect them. This is just one Universe out of a great many that exist now, and have existed before.
I think the Ad Hominem attack on Bill , the tinfoil remark is in poor taste and not warranted. I don’t back Bill because he’s my friend, although I’m perfectly happy to drive a stake in the heart of anyone who attacks my friends, and burn their bodies. I am perfectly happy to be the biggest fucking monster anyone has ever seen in defense of my friends, and family. Act in ways beyond the imagination of Steven King, Edgar Allan Poe, and HP Lovecraft. We Marines scare the evil that lives in the shadow of the Valley of Death, for good reason.
Bill acted on what he saw for himself. I support that. Just as I act on what is true for me. That fact that is not true for you, doesn’t have to lead to attacks. So, you have a disagreement. Fine – have it. Just don’t take discussion of it to such pejorative levels. It’s fine to state what Bill actually did, and let people draw their own conclusion.
I agree that people should do the original OT IV, V, and VI, all based on 1952 – 1954 processes, and the goals plot for the Clearing Course (depending on which original OT IV you are talking about). Bill put his bridge together level by level as you said, based on what he found on each level. LRH based his original OT VI, V, and VI on ACC processes for Clears and OT’s that were exterior to the body.
Games basics, Games Series, Games Master Graduate, Source Operation Levels, and VAST (Viable application of Source Training) and VAST Plus all handle quite a bit of theta machinery, abilities and some very specific areas, including the body. All valuable to do. It’s not all the machinery there is. It’s not all the abilities there are. Beings have subjective machinery (things in your own mind and universe) and objective machinery (things shared – co-created in this and other universes), that still exists even after those levels.
I finished with all of that by 2002. Since then I’ve been addressing additional areas.
These involve running out your own valences, something pointed out in the 1st Melbourne ACC, your Rock chains – 1958 20th ACC, your own GPMS – SHSBC and L’s theory , and exercising the exterior thetan as LRH suggested in the 1st – 8th ACC. Dealing with Pan determinism – handling co-created things, and multiple things. Creating the dynamics, and having created them, be everyone involved in them, and get them to change by assuming their viewpoint. Improving speed of particle flow, ability to hold positions in space, ability to obnose and grant beingness. Ability to create energy. Ability to create, uncreate, stop, change and start time. Running out your own auditing. Running out or restoring your ability to fully have incredible incidents. Removing your use of any time track, restoring your ability to know what you did, were, and had at any point in the past or present time.
The point isn’t run out everything, it’s to get to the point where you can completely have it or not, do it or not, and be it or not as you choose. The OT version of 1946 Dianetics. 1946 Dianetics done by LRH did not erase the bank, it made the person so comfortable with it, he was not long affected by it in any way. It required too much judgement, and curiosity for most people to run on others. So LRH went with erasure, in my opinion.
Excellent comment My 2 cents. The Nots ep is one of the most misunderstood in Scientology, but it does exist. In my opinion there is way too much attention put on this level of the Bridge. It is just a part of it, a big part, but just a part nonetheless.
I have experienced the overwhelm that an over restimulated OT3 case can cause, it is not pleasant. Many “insane” people talk about nothing else when they are listened to.
There is a body, being a part of the physical universe, to handle also. The original OT levels started to deal with this and they have not been seen since the early 80’s. This is the next big hurdle, but if the earlier parts of the Bridge worked for you then I believe a little bit of faith is in order.
Of course this is assuming any semblance of standard Scientology will be available in the future, with the hope that all the bpc and injustices in the field can be addressed satisfactorily and that the practice of Scientology will be allowed to continue. A big couple of Ifs there!
Many Church members and staff have misunderstood all this, and promoted fantastic, unreal results for the OT levels, both Original and New.
I wonder why they’d do that. Hubbard, as we all know, significantly played down the results. From DMSMH, all the way to the top. Such a humble man.
Yes, LRH did over-hype his results all the way from 1950 until his last years. Was he just conning us? Or was he legitimately trying to keep our hope alive so the legitimate research and movement he started would have a chance for success in the long run? My personal opinion is that his major motivation was the legitimate and sincere, but not necessarily purely so.
Bingo. 🙂
So much of the Hubbard dogma is based on the spiritualism movement of the Victorian era. Of course moving an ashtray does not demonstrate “cause over life”. That would be “cause over matter energy space time form and life”, the definition of a Sea Org member. “Cause over life” would be making a goat die by staring into its eyes (“Men Who Stare at Goats”).
But I remember being very impressed by the card tricks of the visiting Operating Thetan we saw at the Steven’s Creek mission in the mid 70s. One of the tricks was finding a card in the bushes outside the room, through a glass window, and it had the same face value as the card randomly picked by an audience member! Pretty impressive until you find out that all they do is palm the real deck and have the audience member pick a card from a deck that is all one face value. So all he had to do was leave some cards with the right face value lying around and voila! OT powers demonstrated! Not!
But it always niggled at me that he could have just floated a card in the air. I would have been a lifetime believer if I had seen that and this blog would never have existed. The Defense Department would have been disbanded in the 80s and replaced by the Men Who Stare at Goats Patrol. A returned Hubbard would be reigning at the One World United Nations and Planets center in Alpha Centauri and nobody would even be able to get mixed up between “loose” and “lose”.
All kidding aside, if you study up on Madame Blavatsky, Mesmer and the Victorian hucksters that preyed on innocents in the days of tables that rise in the air, Ouija Boards and spiritualists you find the same kinds of tricks that Hubbard promised his hapless followers. And if it fails you get the same excuses. Someone in the room was an unbeliever. Negative energies. You just didn’t do it right. Never that it just doesn’t work.
If Dianetics had worked it would have been enough that it reduced reaction time or increased intelligence. That alone would have been worth pursuing. Even if it was only a decent way to reduce PTSD by having somebody “relive” their war experiences, that would have been an invaluable resource in the postwar years. An honest amateur experimenter in mental therapy would have been proud of such an achievement. Instead, Hubbard invented vast uncharted territories of unproven and unprovable claims. It is almost as if he knew….
Excellent points about Blavatsky. I just finished reading her books. I think Hubbard was in reality an Occult minded person who just tried to hide it so that he could avoid the negative publicity that the spiritualists had generated. Hubbard probably started reading Occult pamphlets as early as 1926. He would have been well grounded in the substance “ether” which he changed to “theta”. The entire basis of the “invader forces” was changed and adapted from easily available Occult ideas. His relationship with Parsons was, perhaps, deeper than recorded. IMO, Hubbard developed his attitude, self confidence, and image projections from Occult sources. The OT levels were shallow interpretations of existing Occult ideas – exorcism, BT’s.. Hubbard just bloated himself up with food and Occult ideas.
I think Hubbard was in reality afraid of competition. This is why he made the OT levels so meaningless. Most Occult books tell you how to get rid of minor BT’s in like two seconds. Hubbard extended this simple action to 10 years for the average person. Hubbard was a very average Occult team player. His magic was merely psychological implants. Hubbard never really had a simple solution to anything in the area of the mind. He created his own methods which were not related to eastern meditation or even the Occult. His idea of “exteriorization” was tried and abandoned as early as Pythagoras. Legend has it that his grandfather could exteriorize. There were no OT powers from that route so the Occult moved into mysticism which Hubbard rejected. So in the end, Hubbard was just running in circles because he refused to really study anything.
My cognition on the OT levels: Ron is mocking (making) it all up.
George, just saw your thoughtful reply. Ironically the Theosophical Society was in the same building as the San Francisco Org at 414 Mason St. in the mid 70s. They had half a floor, Scientology took up the full floor below. You had to do your ashtray shouting in the basement to avoid disturbing the other tenants. The Better Business Bureau also had an office in that building. Talk about strange bed-fellows!
But to answer your other points, I am sure there is more to learn about the true nature of humanity. Apparently Uri Geller really could bend spoons with his mind. Or maybe that was a trick too. But he had those abilities before he became a Scientologist. “Men Who Stare At Goats” is a book by Ron Johnson. The movie based on it is just puerile nonsense but it is a fact that the US military tried to study para-normal phenomena like remote viewing. Apparently drone viewing works better.
Like past lives, with psychokinetic phenomena and other studies the jury is still out. Some say the whole subject is fraudulent, others have discovered intriguing hints, many have used these phenomena to deceive.
All I am saying about Hubbard is that he was a deceiver. Whether he borrowed from folks that really knew something or not is sort of irrelevant in the long run. He used to say that Eastern techniques to free the mind only dug the user further into the mud. Well, his techniques are no better. Sure, they make you feel better. Usually. (Check out the post by Brian above). But they are not a road-map to higher abilities of any kind. They are a way to make a buck by fleecing the innocents.
Path of BuddhaGeorge M. White,
100% agreed
True and Beautifully commented Terra.Thank you.??
Hey, Ann B! I made my body get out of bed this morning!!! Then, I made my body eat!!! Then I made my body sit on the couch!!!! Then I made my body look at my big screen in preparation for watching my Rams play!!!!
I am SO cause over life!!! Whew! I gotta, what, OT 15? Higher?
I must be nowhere on the OT scale. My body follows me around wherever I go. It walks and talks on its own and make the most god awful smells. Try as I can to be cause of over it and it forgets what it was doing. Sheesh… and I have had zillons of these things for a millennium… ahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!
Completely agree there! Once you make the specific ability to be gained at that level so general and vague it becomes virtually meaningless. It’s like saying that the ability gained is “to be nice”.
And the fact that no one on the inside of $cn has been able to apply the same simple logic that TC has here, or that no one feels safe enough to speak up about it if they have, speaks volumes about the abilities lost as a result of sustained involvement in $cn. If such simple and intuitively obvious questions as, “What does ’cause over life” specifically include?” are disallowed to the point where $cilons learn to be their own internal thought police monitor and not even internally voice them, then there’s just no way to avoid concluding that, contrary to its claims, $cn just makes you stupider and more fearful the farther along in it you get…it’s a bridge alright, but a Bridge to Complete Other-Determinism and Total Financial Ruination.
Friends don’t let friends do $cn, and they sure shouldn’t let their own children anywhere near it, because $cn kills, but first it destroys families and individual lives.
It’s a typo. After Dave was feeling super dominant and banished Shelly, he declared himself to be Cause over Wife.
+1! Nice!
Hahahha
Mephisto, that was funny! 🙂 Laugh of the day. :p
🙂
Loverly logic! (What? Scio ain’t logical??? You betchum, Red Ryder!) Hint to TC, you never will be declared!
Silly Terra C., you are SUCH a DB! The real EP of Oat Tea 7 is $CIENTOLOGY is cause over your life. You need to route back onto the Purif RIGHT NOW so that your ability to dublicate Ron is is rehabbed and you only see Ron, only hear Ron, only speak Ron. Otherwise, the planet and your Eternal Damnation, oops, I mean ETERNITY, is at risk! WAAROOO!
“Cause over life” is certainly not a precisely defined state, so who knows exactly what it is intended to mean as an EP (if anything).
But aside from the grade chart notation, any person is in a relative state of being able to cause things in life. And as part of that, NOT being able to cause things. Can a person realize their goals in life? Can a person get a job? Can a person get to the bus? Can a person get out of bed? I could name 1000 activities in life that one can have relative success or failure in achieving. I think what most people would say is “cause” is being able to be AS successful as possible in any given area. AND I do think that any person can become MORE causative in any area of life.
” “Cause over life” is certainly not a precisely defined state, so who knows exactly what it is intended to mean as an EP (if anything).”
Joe, I think we need to reinstate the old grade chart descriptions of Oh Tee 7 Eee Pee and Full Oh Tee Sevin.
The Eee Pee is only a temporary release where you think you might have a chance of becoming cause over your life.
But then you have a reg cycle with Teddy Braggin or some other See Ogre type and relapse into only being cause over death ( sorry, I mean debt).
When you finally make it to Fool Oh Tee Sevin, you think you are now ready for Oh Tee Ate (which would be incorrect as you are still not cause over life).
If you take the alternate route (which requires no money, very little time and no debt) and is done by extending your middle finger high into the air, reading the internet and doing what ever you damn well please with your life, not only will you make it but hopefully you can get a cert to go along with the state (usually issued on SPecial goldenrod paper.
Then you know you have made it!
Were all pulling for Terra to get the cert soon as we know you have achieved the state!
I have already reached the official state of a “declared sp” so nothing more to shoot for in that regard. (I mean, when you’ve reached the pinnacle … ha ha)
I felt I made case gain and became more knowledgeable and causitive in life from training and processing. Possibly without Scientology I would have just become more causative in life by getting older. Or maybe I would have gone in the other direction and killed myself. But who knows? I joined staff when I was 19 and stuck around for over 35 years. Man, it went fast.
Anyway, now living out retirement in the tropics … so I ain’t complain’
I couldn’t find a Youtube of an ashtray standing up, or even some celeb OT 7’s being Cause Over Life and getting good PR for the Co$, but I did find a 30 second snippet on a game show with some impromptu applause that gives you a sense for how “nuts” ordinary people think Scientology really is…. how much darker can Scientology’s PR get?
Never has a group with so many $ billions to spend been soooo NOT cause over life!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kD6_mA4_XS4&list=UUYvKu5pkFuD8Xjd8InQwkXA
Two comments:
“Cause over life” is one of the many nonsequitors regurgitated by the poor folks stuck in the grip of scientology. To anyone else, it is meaningless arglebargle.
and… the Chrurch of Scientology is the only place where the people smoke outside but the ashtrays are inside. That makes as much sense as anything else.
One of my earliest moments for ‘pause’ while getting onto OT7 was when I’d just arrived at Flag and was in the early days of OT6. Some guy was attesting to OT7 completion and we were all called into the atrium to hear his speech. His BIG WIN that he chose to give above all others was that while on Seven, he’d lost his job (given the sack after endless 6-monthly checks, more likely, though he didn’t put it in those terms) and he FOUND ANOTHER. Wild hysterical applause! I thought, every prick I know has been through that and didn’t pay hundreds of thousands for the ability. It certainly left me with more modest expectations of the level, and when even those weren’t realised, I blew. One of my own BIG WINS was when I came back home to audit solo, some arse presented me with a bill I didn’t feel like paying, I went in session and hey! I never saw that bill again. Others might say I was just a crook!
But others may say you’re the smartest guy in the room….
I am curious to hear from OTVIII people as to if this is the EP. My husband would always tell me that was only the published EP but the real one was secret. I read a lot about OT7 on the internet while he was on the level to try to figure out what he was trying to achieve while wasting so many hours in session.
You’re probably referring to the EP of your body turning invisible. When all the BTs are gone, one’s body is supposed to no longer be visible to oneself through their “thetan eyes.” I know this doesn’t make a whole helluva lot of sense, but I did read that in the issues when I was researching this myself.
Mary the secret E.P. (not to be confused with the double secret E.P.) is something like one would look like this pic of the Space Ghost cartoon image: http://www.chickendynasty.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/space-ghost-1h.jpg
Sitting in a chair and chasing about 450.000 real or imaginaryspace cooties away on OT 7 did not do much for me.Well not true.I did gain something: 20 pounds.My presence now filled the room.
Yep, El Con Tubbolard made “cause over life” the ability gained for New OT VII. Of course it is a COMPLETE lie just like every other single Ability Gained listed on the Grade Chart that is an Objective claim.
The terminally insane will of course argue this as they are … terminally insane.