The next new episode of Aftermath is on 10 October. This week and next A&E is airing reruns of earlier episodes. There is plenty of material in those shows — I recommend watching them again even if you have watched them before as many people find more revealing information in each episode that was missed in the first viewing.
Relevant to Aftermath, and especially to scientology’s response to every show a couple of observations/thoughts.
Do Scientologists Really Care?
It is a curious, and rather disturbing, fact that run of the mill scientologists on social media never (and this is without exception) express ANY concern for the abuses reported on the show.
They loudly and often proclaim themselves to be humanitarians, but 1 for 1 not one public scientologist or any official has said anything like:
“We are deeply concerned about what you are saying. We don’t know if it is true or not, but we will look into it.”
When Catholics were saying they had been molested, did the Catholic churches respond with hate sites about their accusers? Smear videos? No. Perhaps the church hierarchy was not always responsive, but MANY Catholics were outraged and they rightfully noted there is nothing in the Bible that says molesting children is ok. They did not try to proclaim it was “all lies” and the church was victim of bigotry and hate.
Scientology can’t say the same thing. Their policy (“doctrine”) calls for them to attack the victim and make the victim responsible for abuses and crimes committed against them. And to never accept any criticism of scientology as it ONLY stems from the “criminal acts” of the lowlifes who claim anything uncomplimentary about scientology.
Even a halfway decent restaurant or hotel that gets a bad Yelp review will reach out to express their concern and offer to make things right.
Has it been lost on the general public, elected officials, law enforcement and journalists to wonder: “Why do they all react exactly the same way? Is there nobody that ever has a concern that anyone of this might be true? If they are all in such thought lockstep, isn’t this cause for alarm?”
One would hope more would ask these questions.
Everyone is a Bum
Scientology has a pattern of how they attack their victims who speak up about abuses:
a. Everyone is a nobody that has NO information
b. Everyone is a liar, thief, sex pervert, wife beater, failure etc etc
The “everyone is nobody” is provably false — they claim I held no position of authority and was “dismissed” for incompetence. Despite the fact that I walked out the door in London when I had been sent there as the international spokesman for scientology to deal with the BBC. At the time I was a member of the Board of Directors of Church of Scientology International and had been since its creation in 1983. It’s the same story for everyone. And let’s not forget, even a nobody has their own personal experiences, something that cannot be erased by name-calling.
But more interesting is the second line of attack.
If every person who leaves scientology is some sort of scumbag, what does this say about the efficacy of scientology? Many of these people held very senior positions in scientology. How did all these liars, thieves and bums make it to the top of scientology when it claims to have the ONLY technology to not only detect criminals, but to eradicate their aberrations?
Isn’t this failure to detect and “handle” so many people, in fact EVERYONE who leaves scientology the greatest admission of failure of the “tech”?
We should not forget that L. Ron Hubbard said, in one of the last things he wrote:
Thus, at the end of a Confessional, when it has been fully completed, the Scientology auditor who has administered the Confessional must inform the person that he is forgiven for the sins he has just confessed, and that he is cleared of these sins and free of them.
The statement that is used is:
“By the power invested in me, any overts and withholds you have fully and truthfully told me are forgiven by Scientologists.”
Talk about hypocrisy. The truth is scientology never forgives. Rather they take what people give up in their “confessionals” and use it against them. It’s sick.
And for new readers here, I recommend this earlier essay on the subject of the policy of scientology: Dealing with Critics of Scientology: The L. Ron Hubbard Playbook
Interested P – here is one of the many reasons this ‘boring crap’ is so important: the death of Lisa McPherson.
How much longer are you going to rant on with this boring Remini crap?
Having watched her TV debut and chat about OT III it is quite obvious she had TOTALLY misunderstood the materials and it was the COS TOTAL Out-Tech putting her on this level in the first place.
Everyday scene now I hear, no LRH tech left in the place.
So DM really is to blame for her current rantings as he destroyed the Tech in the first place.
Silly little man
Your logic is a little flawed. DM didn’t “destroy the LRH tech of OT III. It is handwritten by LRH…
HOw long am I going to rant with this boring stuff of child molestation, destruction of families, abuse of people, fraud etc etc? Until it stops.
Very good you went to look over your shoulder and went for a ski-vacation.
Thank God for Mike and Leah continuing to talk about this.
You seem to have mis-duplicated something
I never stated that DM had altered the handwritten materials of OTIII.
Please read the post again.
But you are never wrong of course.
No I.P. Mike didn’t. You attribute DM’s actions to wrecking the tech & thus OT III not being de;livered properly. It is YOU who “mis-duplicated” what you yourself wrote. OR, you are too illiterate to adequately express your thoughts in writing.
Do you know when Leah did 3? Do you have evidence that by that time DM had changed the bridge up to the point? Also, EXACTLY and PRECISELY what didn’t Leah understand about OT 3?
Cough up or go take a Dirt Nap Scamology troll.
Look Pa! An scamology troll named Interested Party
I notice the same insane line I.P., “When a person leaves it was because they didn’t understand the wonderful, flawless tek”. Well, FAR more people have LEFT the church than stayed in. By a factor of about 10. So logic dictates that the “tek” must be total crap.
Another piece of evidence is Hubbard trying to commit suicide to dislodge imaginary space cooties.
So many responses, so little time. I can personally say that my response was similar to Leah’s when I saw the OTIII materials I saw them in 1980 and they were the same ones Leah saw handwritten by LRH. I was gone by the early 1980’s because by OTV I could no longer reconcile what was going on in my head with the real world.
But…my father once said “never argue with an insane man, they won’t understand”
So nevermind.
Just thinking of Leah Remini today, one of the hardest working women in Hollywood. I respect her bravery in bringing the Aftermath series into being, it takes a lot of strength to stand up to an organization that always retaliates, and risk losing personal friends and business connections, just think of the repercussions, but she did it! And won an Emmy for it. I appreciate her motivation for making the show – wanting to bring light to the harmful practices and to support other members and ex’s. I am also in awe of her hard work on 2 seasons of the Aftermath show followed immediately with no break with working on her ‘Kevin Can Wait’ show, filming back-to-back, especially since she has a young daughter at home, that’s why to me she is the hardest working woman in the industry. Sending love to Leah, adding my best wishes and kudos to the crowd of Leah-lovers and supporters 🙂 Must give praise to Mike Rinder as well, for the show, and for this site, Leah and Mike are today’s dynamic duo. Best wishes for continued success, looking forward to new episodes of Aftermath in 2 weeks.
Well said! And Bravo Leah for all that you do and Mike for coming forward and sharing the honest truth and for both of you for making it safe for all victims to share stories! It takes courage to come forward and I applaud all of you who do! Don’t let the bullies win and take over your life! Your stories are coming out now and we hear you! Most people who have left this cult are now coming forward especially with this platform for educating us all. To those who try to hide behind religions we know who you are and stop giving religions a bad name and stealing from people’s hard earned $’s or using them as slaves, the mind games are over! Shame on you.
After scientology, mormones and jehovah’s witnesses!?
“Anthony Levandowski, the Uber engineer at the heart of a bombshell lawsuit filed by Waymo, has started a new religion.”
http://www.businessinsider.com/anthony-levandowski-religion-worships-ai-god-report-2017-9?international=true&r=US&IR=T
Are auditors trained in hearing confessions of abuse? What does their training tell them to do? I thought the church said they report abuse to the authorities?
Elizabeth, if the confessional is NOT a security check but “auditing” they are trained similarly to a priest. The information cannot be divulged. Hence the term “confessional”.
I have been watching this series since the first episode. I have to say I commend you and Leah for doing this and not being afraid to put yourselves out there and expose this ridiculous fake religion. Frankly I don’t understand why anyone with half a brain would ever fall for this crazy shit. This organization needs to be stopped and veryone in it needs to be reprogrammed. This is like Jim Jones without the cool aid. Don’t the followers ever ask themselves “how is the planet changing and getting better because of our participation and contribution to all of this”. Miscavage should be put behind bars. I can’t stand to even look at him he looks like what I believe the anti christ will look like.
Thank you Mike for your post, and as always, I have had several jaw dropping moments. I am going to read the ‘Dealing with the Critics’ work right now. As for the trolls – seriously???? The more garbage you post, the harder I (and others) will shut you OUT. Does that not register at all??
Hi Mike, are you getting a lot of people still reaching out with their stories of abuse with season 2 ? Is the show having an impact on scientologists that are starting to question the church practices?
I can’t believe that the LAPD is supporting this organization after all that has been exposed, It’s absolutely rediculous. What more do they need to cut off all ties and start investigations into the many abuses that have been brought forward.
The Catholic church is nothing like Scientology. Catholics don’t harass people that want to leave…do NOT encourage anyone to have an abortion. ..criticize people who leave. Etc
The Catholic Church had the perception and intelligence to evolve from being the suppressive organization it once was into a helpful, caring organization. It kept the good and threw out the cruel and vindictive policies it once applied. The Catholic Church was smart .The Cult of Scientology would do well to follow its example.
Hello. I am wondering if you’ll ever discuss on the show the son of LRH that he had declared? I cannot remember his name. It’s been too long since I was in Scientology to remember these details – but I remember how his son Arthur was so revered and policy being published that no one is to mess with Arthur. Certain words ring out about swinging Arthur upside down – don’t do it! But then there was an older son that he had declared and no one was to engage him. How does that promote family?
I won’t share my story – but as I watch each episode and I look and hope for people that I knew and loved that they got out!! I pray everyday that my dear sweet friend Geraldine got out and found the life she truly wanted. She just wanted to be loved. So the Church and the Sea Org gave her that false love. I can only hope that those at the CLO that I loved got out and those that remain are burning in an on earth hell.
I do not remember anything about them forcing women to have abortions but I do remember policy that Sea Org members were not to procreate. If you wanted to have a baby, you could be reassigned to a local Org. But it honestly woudn’t surprise me that the abortion thing was true. But I also remember that marriage ran rampant just because that was the only way one was allowed to have sex. People didn’t even love each other. They go married and once their libido was satiated they’d get a divorce.
Anyway, thank you Leah and Mike for doing what you’re doing. I hope that this brings awareness to those who are curious will walk away and for those who are in it’s grips will stop being a lemming and get out. Have they become tolerant to gays because of John Travolta? It’s said he is. Not that it’s anyone’s business if he is or isn’t except his wife. Or have they become tolerant for Laura Pepron because of her role in Orange is the New Black? I was sad to see she’s a Scientologist. But Leah said in last season, Scientology accepts gays because they can audit it out of them.
I’m running on and on. Thank you and keep doing what you’re doing.
Mike check The Saltlake Tribune news online. They have had two articles this week about the Labor Department and the FLDS church using child labor. This might be an avenue for you guys to use.
This one D D? http://www.sltrib.com/news/polygamy/2017/09/26/company-with-ties-to-polygamous-church-is-again-accused-of-using-child-labor-this-time-under-a-different-name/
It is company, not a church.
Hi,
I have a question and i did’nt know where to put it.
When a scientologist die , where they put him? only in a scientologist cimetery?
Because if they’re buried next to a SP dead person, i’m not sure they will accept that lol
Generally scientologists choose to be cremated (like Hubbard) so they don’t have a body to “hang onto” and can more easily move onto finding a new body.
And let me guess…the ashes are only given to people who still remain loyal to Scientology. Having learned what Hubbard and Miscavige believe, that would not surprise me at all.
By the look of recent photos of Miscavige, I’d imagine he snorts a line of each cremated member in good standing.
Gads, that guy looks like death warmed over these days.
OMG 🙂
Now that’s certainly something I WON’T write on my bathroom mirror. Geezers, & I thought I had a warped take on things.
It would be my guess, and it is just a guess, that a scientologist wouldn’t even care about the ashes. That is my perception of how they view and handle a death.
I don’t doubt that. That’s the Scientology way.
I never thought about what they believe happens inbetween the “old body” and the “new body”. Does that mean that the thetan/spirit could possibly hang around near the body or have difficulty moving on? So do they believe in ghosts?
So very true Mike, I’m really glad you brought up these points.
People have to start waking up and seeing the insanity inside this church, it is like North Korea where you cannot say anything wrong about your leader or you WILL BE annihilated and hidden away/locked up for life. This is what really goes on in there. But all to the benefit of Miscavige so he can remain as the sole and only Dictator/Leader. That is the ONLY reason he locks people up, otherwise we out here will hear the truth from them and the FBI and government officials will hear the truth from them, that Miscavige is an insane wife beater, a pervert, a professional liar and all the other names he casts out upon hundreds of others. It’s not the hundreds that are lying, it is the one and only Miscavige.
It’s a hefty dose of cognitive dissonance borne out of a little thing called Escalation of Commitment (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escalation_of_commitment). Admitting they are wrong, doesn’t make them senior to the governments of earth, or anyone. Admitting their crimes jeopardizes their IRS status and their status in other countries. Admitting wrongnesses also invalidates current management AND much of the tech. Despite the escalation of commitment factor you have perfect traps built into the very scriptures of Scientology which is truly where the subject is damaging, abusive, etc. It’s a perfect combo of “you pulled it in” … “Ron says the SPs will attack us” and such things as “this is our brief breath …” “man’s only hope” … “greatest good for the greatest number,” etc. All of these things turn on some real blinders. Not to exclude the fact that IF they even look at websites they end up under justice actions which is costly and threatens their whole way of life (family connections, friend connections, business or work connections, their job, maybe where they live …).
The lifers usually only wake up and get out when they are met with gross personal injustice that strikes at themselves and occasionally at family – though we have seen enough family’s torn apart by HCO and OSA.
And you’re right, any other corporation or business or “religion” (in this case cult), would definitely see a change at the top when under such scrutiny for this amount of time. CEO’s resign or get a golden parachute all the time and the company lives on. Miscavige is such an ego freak that he’d rather let the whole thing burn if he’s gonna go down.
If Scientology wants to be a mainstream religion, which it is decidedly a cult at this point, then it’d have to oust Miscavige and cut out every fanatic cold war era paranoid policy letter that exists and not just the publicly viewable ones but the OSA network policies as well.
As for the “philosophy” … who cares? There is other weird crap out there. As long as it isn’t destroying lives people should be free to do what they want with religion or philosophy.
The philosophy of Scientology is what’s rotten to the core…and as such, there is no fixing it. L. Ron Hubbard was a con artist with one goal: rob as many people as possible before he died. He played on the fears and insecurities we all have, especially the desperation for eternal security. He twisted what others had said or written before him, and created his own cult for the sole purpose of being personally wealthy at everyone else’s expense. If his life should be teaching anyone anything, its the importance of 1 Timothy 6:10 – “For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil.”
Yes! REALITY CHECK: “The philosophy of Scientology is what’s rotten to the core…and as such, there is no fixing it. L. Ron Hubbard was a con artist with one goal: rob as many people as possible before he died.”
re: the YouTube segment on LRH,sr. and Jr. Jamie DeWolf summed it up – “members are interrogated and hypnotized…and paying for it. The rest is to confuse you.”
First of all thank you for this fantastic program you and Leah put out there every week.
I was raised Catholic and truthfully there is not much difference once you stop the religion. I am a fallen away Catholic since 1987 having attended parochial schools for 12 years and raised my two sons in them as well. I did question many things we were taught and the nuns and priests we had were not kindly as you’d think they were. I could tell you stories but there isn’t enough room here. I took much much “flack” shall we say for stopping attending the church. I’m still disliked in some circles after 30 years.
We just saw some thing on another show about Hubbard that before he started the church he lived with a Parsons who was into black magic. Hubbard continued with the practices that they had at Parsons residence. Have you heard anything of this friend
of Hubbard’s and what occult things they were up to?
Again, thank you for your bravery and having your program on. I completely understand the treatment you received.
Mary,
Just google Hubbard and Crowley.
Everyone should google Hubbard & Crowley.
You should watch this video by Jamie DeWolf, L. Ron Hubbard’s great-grandson. He did a presentation in 2014, exposing the occultic roots of Scientology.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRUYESI3v3c
Brilliant talk. Thank you for the link.
That was interesting!
Thanks so very much for this compelling piece, Joshua. LRH’s great grandson, Jamie DeWolf, talks about the madness of Scientology and his Gr – grandfather.
You are correct Mike but remember through auditing they are stripped of a conscious this enables them to ignore what is right in front of them – mind control at its best – it takes a long time 2 unlearn – keep hope alive
Mike, you have endured unspeakable pain having your children refusing to stay in comm with you and I want to say I feel you.
I stop going to the Church of $cientology and went to Santa Barbara where David mayo was.
it was amazing to see how many ex co$ where there. I’ve been free ever since. I was never in trouble with the church I never held any official position except a short stint with the RTC. after I left the church I built the family which is still intact today.
I did smell a rat after the FBI’s raid. I was never a true believer, I liked the tech once I realized the total of power going around the tech I bailed.
I have the utmost respect to you and staff members who we’re so dedicated for years only and endured severe personal hardship for wanting to live free life.
cheers!
Hate-filled wog-cursers within the ranks Scientology spew their vile language on Youtube day and night. However, many of them have a genuine life-changing epiphany a few weeks, months, or maybe years down the line.
All it takes is for them to leave Scientology. For some, that means Scientology leaves them.
Once clear of Scientology, ha ha, clear, get it? yeahhh… Anyway, once clear of the cult-organization-corporation-religion that formerly held them in its firm grip they are soon able to return to the ranks of real humans.
Ex-scientologists usually revert to the kindly, intelligent, humane and genuinely ethical beings they always wanted to be, but could not be as long as LRH was running their interior life.
“You meet the nicest people out of Scientology.”
“You meet the nicest people out of Scientology.” ROTFLMAO! Now that’s some funny shit! Well done, Ammo!
DITTO!
“We should not forget that L. Ron Hubbard said, in one of the last things he wrote:
Thus, at the end of a Confessional, when it has been fully completed, the Scientology auditor who has administered the Confessional must inform the person that he is forgiven for the sins he has just confessed, and that he is cleared of these sins and free of them.”
Unfortunately, in reality there’s not much forgiveness, compassion or anything of the like in $cn, I’m afraid.
But let me ask those whose memory for cult practices are better than mine, was Elron differentiating the kind of Confessional auditing he’s referring to there from sec checking, where you’re pointedly informed at the start of the session, “I’m not auditing you”?
Was there ever a time when those two very different orientations to the practice of getting folks to divulge their “sins” were clearly delineated by Elron, or has it always been cult practice to obscure the crucial differences between confessional auditing and sec checking security practices?
Yes to being informed” I’m not auditing you”. I have never ever heard the words :
“By the power invested in me, any overts and withholds you have fully and truthfully told me are forgiven by Scientologists.” Never. Or anything close to that. Was that done after 1982?
No, I was out of the cult well before the Mission Holders Massacre, so it was in the late 70’s that I heard the phrase.
I never heard it in all of the time I was associated with that stellar group.
Madge, you hear those words on completion of Grade 2 confessionals.
Mike, the same thing happened to me on the fan page Leah Remini and the after math. My comment got deleted too. I’m feeling like I’m being suppressed and I don’t like it!
You can join the new FB group created by Aaron Smith Levin now — “Supporters of Leah Remini: Scientology and the Aftermath” https://www.facebook.com/groups/1401290063318947/
thankyou Mike – going to join right now
Well the real issue here Daryn is in finding out what you did to pull it in! 🙂
Yo Dave,
Didn’t El Con state somewhere that You have to have committed an overt to become the effect of suppression? Tell us good buddy and don’t forget to “take a knee” before you watch the next Aftermath show.
Leah and Mike are going to give You a two week reprieve to allow You to get Your scotch consumption under control Dick ……. I mean Dave.
🙂 for each paragraph.
I think it is interesting to note Hubbard very plainly stated way back in 1951 (some Science of Survival lecture if memory serves) that he had NO IDEA how to run a 3rd Dynamic (group or corporation etc). I just remember the stunned acceptance I felt when he said that but I wrote it off as the “power of the bank” and group aberration was firmly evident everywhere else anyway so I was led to believe. Dianetics and Scientology was at that time based solely on improving the self determinism of individuals, or so he said.
Holy crap Batman… did I ever dig myself into a hole, threw the shovel away and then screamed, “why am I here!” But by flowing Dorothy down the rabbit hole quickly realised it’s all my fault this stuff isn’t working on me as I envisioned. I must strive to find my MU, find that incident or locate the correct ownership, get onto the next Bridge step and then all will be well… the path in narrow in Scientology but it can be walked – Yeah, right!
Scientology CANNOT be wrong, inefficient or faulty – ever, for any reason. If it is considered something is wrong the auditor WILL squirrel and make up his own stuff. The KSW series in action, which Hubbard devised to cover his own self admitted inability to run a group, but devilishly devised policy to hold one together by intimidation and military discipline. The fault in anyone always lies with them, never with the tech, for it is standard and works 100% of the time.
The whole house of cards comes crashing down with the slightest doubt on the tech, Hubbard knew that and went out of his way with his policy to enforce compliance to a single source. Isn’t it the art of magicians to misdirect your attention? The individual is nothing in Scientology, Hubbard and the group are everything, and don’t you forget it!
Self-determinism = nothing else works but Scientology. Not a healthy mindset is it?
I’m sure glad I jumped ship, aren’t you? There’s no such thing as friendship or compassion in Scientology technology. A Scientologist doesn’t want to be your friend, they insist on making LRH your saviour.
Dammit Mike, you’re going to have to start putting up cautionary warning signs at the beginning of posts like this one for the unsuspecting still-in folks who might innocently stumble across them.
“Caution! The informational material that follows could cause head-exploding levels of cognitive dissonance for still-in $cientologists who’re encountering them for the first time!”
Have we reached a tipping point of media saturation here in the U.S., where from this point forward the “I didn’t know” defense is no longer going to cut it any longer?
If we’re not there yet, then we will be soon, for sure!
” for the unsuspecting still-in folks who might innocently stumble across them.”
Harpoona, A still-in who might innocently stumble …………………….. That’s a fricken oxymoron! Not as bad as a happy $cientologist of course but the cherch is nothing but one big fat bundle of oxymora. 🙂
I think one of the most interesting and alarming aspects of a cult member is the thought stopping. The inability to think and act for themselves. It doesn’t seem to matter that the person is generally a good or smart person.
If a person did not sign a clergy penitent waiver and a church breeches that, would that person not have legal recourse ? Believe it falls under common law – and varies state by state.
Nope Figh. The US doesn’t use common law. That ended when the States adopted the Constitution and joined the Union. Your church would have to sign something saying that the confessional would be kept secret.. Otherwise you can call the S.O.L. hotline.
I disagree. Tort law and contract law is based on common law throughout the United States. Common law came to the States from England and has been enforced by the courts for centuries. Contracts fall under common law. You can Google this for more information. That is all I have to say about it.
Yes, our WRITTEN tort laws were BASED on old unwritten (common) law. We don’t USE (unwritten) Common Law in court. I’m afraid you are weak on your knowledge of the legal system in the US. Much of our law originally comes from Roman times but we don’t USE Roman laws in court.
I have 40 civil cases under my belt.
We can agree to disagree but please don’t attack with an label of ‘weak’ knowledge. It is not respectful nor necessary.
CGarrison, I call them as I see them. Your knowledge of the US legal system IS weak. Fix the situation if you don’t like it pointed out.
Courts in the US use statute and U.S. court precedence setting rulings. It does NOT use Common law:
noun: common law the part of English law that is derived from custom and judicial precedent rather than statutes.
I don’t care.
You do not understand my last post. Saying that a person is weak in some area of life is a criticism, no matter what subject we are talking about. You call them like you see them – to everyone…in that manner ? Noticed a few blogs ago that you adamantly told someone else that they had ZERO knowledge, ZERO ( your caps, not mine ). I find that critical and aggressive. This is a blog about people sharing feelings, experiences and knowledge in the aftermath of Scientology. Cults are designed to criticize and belittle participants. Who wants to be taken to the woodshed after they work their way out of that nightmare ? By the way, I would rather stick needles in my eyes than work in the field of law.
I agree CG, 100%.
The only reason that there ever was a body of common law to refer to over many years is because it was written down, in English court opinions dating back as far the 13th and 14th centuries. My learned colleague Fightin’ Irish is correct.
“Even a halfway decent restaurant or hotel that gets a bad Yelp review will reach out to express their concern and offer to make things right.”
Exactly.
Scientology is not decent.
It is not even HALF decent. It is INDECENT.
Its members are either too victimized or too cowardly (or both) to, at the LEAST, ask publicly for an internal investigation. Or maybe they truly are evil people.
I suppose, once again, it is up to each member to look into the mirror and decide if they really want to be a part of such a cruel and malicious organization.
Hi Mike, I’m a huge fan of your show and this blog – there is just so much information about this organization that is absolutely fascinating. Thank-you for getting this information out these to those of us never-ins. I’m just amazed that a ‘religious’ organization can spread hate and lies about former members like Scientology does and nobody inside seems to blink. I get they are following LRH’s procedures, but there has to be some pretty severe cognitive discognizance among some of the members in this group.
I was wondering if you had ever told the story of how you escaped the Sea Org? I’ve heard bits and pieces about the harassment you and your wife endured, but never any details about what prompted you to leave and how you went about doing it.
My mind cannot wrap around the fact that these “Celebrities” will not acknowledge the abuse, as far as am concerned if they turn a blind eye to the situation you are just as guilty. What will it take?
I know – I just cannot imagine being aware that people inside my religious organization were being treated badly and not speaking up and trying to fix the situation. Maybe some of the more minor celebrities are insulated from reality (if they don’t read mainstream media, and don’t have sea org slave labor at their beck and call) or others may be afraid that they cherch will release damning information they have from their auditing, but the silence from people like Travolta and Cruise – who are big enough stars that it would be difficult for some past transgression to significantly damage their lives/careers – says a lot about their characters.
You’re right, Kate. When it all comes down to it, Scientology celebs and whales are just people too, people afraid of having the things they’ve done and said revealed, afraid of being embarrassed, humiliated, feared, hated, ruined, etc. etc if what they gave up in confidence to the cult were revealed to the general public.
That’s why celebs like Paul Haggis and Leah Remini are heroes,
That’s why Mike Rinder is a hero,
Tha’st why ANYONE, posting on this blog and elsewhere, who was once in Scientology, who has chosen personal integrity, in the face of overwhelming cult opposition and disapproval, in the face of tremendous loss, is a HERO.
For these people, there will never be enough applause.
Mike’s story is on Ortega’s blog and you can hear it on Youtube. It came down to this and I hope I portray it accurately. Mike was let out out of the Hole, looking emaciated and nearly ghostly, because John Sweeny was back in Miscavige’s face making a BBC documentary on the cult. Since Mike had “handled” Sweeny before, Miscavige let him out and told him that if Sweeny didn’t pull the plug, Rinder would wind up in the Gulag Archipelago of Scientology aka some remote section of Australia. Rinder, speaking with and texting with the evil tyrant Miscagive regularly while Mike was forced to , lie constantly at Miscavige’s orders to Sweeny who was filming everything….Mike now knew he had lost his family forever and therefore there was nothing keeping him in. He knew David Miscavige would keep him in some kind of prison forever , just like Shelly is currently being held.. Mike decided to blow since Miscavige had foot bulleted himself again by punishing those most loyal to him. Hear it told by Mike himself if you can find it
Thanks I will see if I can find the videos on YouTube. I read the Tony Ortega article, but the videos weren’t visible to me. It sounds like Miscaviage put Mike in a no-win situation had he stayed in. I’m glad Mike got out and is helping people share their stories.
I have a question I haven’t really seen answered here thus far, maybe it can’t be answered, but here goes:
What would happen if a major celeb like T.C. or J.T. decided to Quit the organization? How would they handle that departure, of someone who stands or stood side by side to the COB? I wonder if that or those highest honored celebs would be smeared & what they would “spill” having been close to him?
If they spoke out they would be treated the same way as Leah and Paul Haggis. It’s in the DNA of the organization.
In essence I thought that might be the case, however what someone like T.C. or J.T. would surely cause great damage to DM & COS & it would be like lighting a stick of dynamite…..AND vice versa. The info during auditing would certainly ruin a career.
I am sure the organization would have a lot of crap to spill on the noted celeb….but the celeb would also have enough documentation to sink a battleship….or vessel….like the Freewinds. & as a close personal friend of DM’s, it would be more than newsworthy.
Sink the Freewinds? You’d be doing Miscavige a favor. The money has got to be flowing the wrong direction through that tub.
They would Dead Agent all of the traitors.
And you have to look no further than Mike Rinder to see how a person who applies integrity to his life is treated by the self proclaimed cherch.
Dear Mike,
Quite the provoking question: “Do Scientologists really care?” Here is my take.
1) Those Scientologists using public social media are either fully indoctrinated , OR extremely careful to follow the party doctrine. OSA is watching.
2) Abuses abound in the real world and across all groups, SO….. what is the big deal in picking on Scientology? Scientology is perfect, it’s just that the members are flawed in delivering that perfection.
3) Cults excel in Black-vs-White thinking. And as you know, once you come in the door they consider you are on board 100%. Nowadays it looks like LITERALLY 100%. They would rather see you dead than anything less than 100%. You have been ‘committed’ whether you knowingly agreed to it or not. That 100% is for your assets, labor, life, progeny, influence, and anything else the cult may decide they want— and unconditionally.
4) There is no law, social norm, moral code, or ‘acceptable behavior’ recognized or given recognition unless it aligns with cult doctrine. ANY behavior is acceptable as long as it adheres to cult doctrine.
5) Step out of line on cult doctrine and there is no limit to their actions to reprogram, correct , or silence you. Absolutes may be unattainable in the physical universe, but they are working on Scientology being the ONLY reality, communication mode, affinity with ML, and understanding as per cult doctrine..Anything is acceptable if it furthers the cult goals, the product justifies any sins committed in getting to that end.
There are those among us who wish for a controlled and predictable environment in which to feel safe and comfortable. What we may view as slavery, they see as security.
And, then there are those dramatizing the Implant wherein they spent a billion years polishing brick #5,473,118,009, and were happy to ‘have’ it: The identity, the job, and the brick!
Jim – “And, then there are those dramatizing the Implant wherein they spent a billion years polishing brick #5,473,118,009, and were happy to ‘have’ it.”
Geez, that’s a scary thought.
I agree that the stability of a group can have immense appeal.
When given a sec check on OT VII and beyond all confessionals are considered not auditing with “I am not auditing you.” given at the start of session. One is never given the Proclamation of Forgiveness and is always sent to Ethics afterward to bend over and take it with some “ethics condition.”
Your other Point about Scientologists reactions to anybody on the Leah show, or anybody that wrote a book or spoke out in anyway is the same pat formula/answer. They are wrong and the church is right; if they had a grievance they should’ve handled it with the proper authorities inside the church of Scientology. Any of the “proper authorities” for the last 10 years (or longer) have never been on the side of the parishioner. It almost always became about what did that person do to pull whatever grievance he had in or some such bullshit.
Mary, I had the same thoughts too. But there are sec checks on Grade 2, for example, that are not HCO-ordered and should still be protected by the priest/penitent agreement. Still, I am absolutely 100% positive that even those confidential sessions are examined closely for anything that can be grabbed to degrade the person if they have left. Or if something came up in the protected session that the cherch considers very not OK that poor guy is going to get sent to ethics anyway. Even other protected types of processes, like ruds, can reveal something that isn’t OK and I bet that guy is going to ethics. These people really do suck with their ego trips and self-proclaimed holiness.
Mary,
The only time I was asked to get a sec-check was around 1976 at AOLA. The SO dude said ‘this will not be an auditing action .’ I replied; ‘Fine, let’s do it here in the PC waiting room.’ (I was on OT3 waiting for new C/S)’ Long comm lag and he turned and walked away.
Mary, it’s been like that in Scamology since the beginning. Nothing new. “Any of the “proper authorities” for the last 10 years (or longer) have never been on the side of the parishioner. It almost always became about what did that person do to pull whatever grievance he had in or some such bullshit.”
That ‘forgiveness’ statement from the auditor is just so fake.
In fact it was one of the things that helped open my eyes that the tech, in the 1980’s, had reached a “let’s pretend it works” stage.
The statement is contrary to basic Scientology where the thetan is held to be totally responsible.
By accepting forgiveness from someone else, the being is put at effect and it makes the auditor the cause point.
(not commenting on the validity of the tech – just pointing out an obvious contradiction)
What a pompous bunch of assholes to think they have the rank to forgive anyone for anything. The next think you know they will be crying in their beer about how mean everyone is to them!
Yo Dave,
It’s Tuesday before Thursday at too big boy! How are those preps coming along for your International Assholes Society event? Are Tom, John and Krusty going to be there to boost Your morale good buddy?
… “let’s pretend it works” stage.
I like that, it has a certain ring of realism about it you simply can’t avoid.
Knock knock
Who’s there?
A Scientologist.
A WHAT?
A Scientologist.
Oh a contradiction – go away!
Knock knock!
Who’s there?
I’m a Scientologists!
(Some pulls a lever and a trapdoor opens and the Scientologists falls in)
Now that’s what I call being in the Hole!
Lol!!
🙂
Scientology doesn’t let “nobody’s” speak on stage for international events. I think you spoke at every one I saw during my few years in the cult. Amazing at the depraved lengths they go to thinking they are doing a great job preserving their ‘integrity’ as a religion.
While it is said that “absolutes are unattainable,” I would say that this is absolutely true, Mike. And as we also know, “The truth shall set you free.” Thanks for helping to set people free, Mike.
And lest we forget, Dave is an absolute asshole ……. where the sun NEVER shines!
Great, great post, Mike. Everything I read here and the other sites peels more of the onion layers away, relieving my lack of understanding as to why scinos act the way they do even when interacting with fellow scinos. I can probably count on the fingers of one hand (or even less than five times) when difficult situations/communications went well because the other person failed to show any compassion or true caring for the other person and in doing the “right” thing. I never understood… until now.
Thank you, and Leah, for all your do. The empire is crumbling! One brick at a time but faster now than ever before.
Let’s face it – Scientology was never initially designed to be a religion – that was done out of spite by LRH getting rebuffed. The psychiatric profession was not impressed by how unscientific his claims were. So was the court. He originally designed it as a way to take a self-help protocol and make money from it. After he did not receive the public accolades he thought he deserved he created the present organization out of revenge (and to keep making money). He initially passed himself off as a psychologist and was nailed for practicing medicine without a license because he could not prove medical efficacy of the “treatment”.
Turning a “foundation” that charged for psychological help into a religion in order continue to practice and profit, is the reaction of an angry, narcissistic layman to a less-than-impressed reaction of a academic and scientific world. He thought he would be given and deserved much more.
The “religious” parts of it were grafted on, probably to make it conform to preconceived notions and so that he could claim or maintain tax exempt status. Very clever. You can practice “psychology” without a license when you claim it’s a philosophy.
He took his former military experience (after exaggerating it to make himself the hero he wasn’t) as a model for Sea Org. It also looked like he was playing out a fantasy of creating his own private pretend navy where he was the admiral and didn’t have to answer to anyone. But it also allowed him to circumvent certain legalities and restrictions. And of course it gave the whole thing an organizational blueprint. Again, more cleverness, if it lacked in originality.
It seems obvious he was also influenced by the paranoia of a Cold War culture – of the threat of nuclear war and constant fear of communism and stories of espionage and counterespionage – to use the paranoid structures of intelligence agencies to come up with a lot of the rules and regulations, secrecy and strategy for dealing with “enemies” – the way he now saw the general public who had not gotten to their knees and praised him for creating his method and his tech as if he were the new Messiah. Or maybe he was just making sure that he would not keep getting in legal trouble.
Many cults and religions maintain control by making “outsiders” evil – it adds to the feeling of exclusivity for members, but it also keeps them from being unduly influenced. Most of them don’t use aggressive, preemptive attacks that organized crime or large corrupt organizations do to silence their critics. Again, borrowing successful military and business tactics to insure survival and avoid the truth leaking out.
It’s why CoS doesn’t seem like a real religion to most outsiders but a philosophical Fight Club. The tech seems like one of a number of typical “self-help” fads that were common during the period. Many proponents of similar methods have been overly admired for their work initially because they attracted enthusiasm. But the interest waned over time when they underdelivered on promises. We kind of take people like that with a grain of salt these days – it usually comes out that their methods aren’t perfect, or the people are making inflated claims. We’ve learned to be skeptical. The secrecy, indoctrination and coercion of CoS today seems to us like some kind of Manchurian Candidate story. More like a secret society than an actual religion (whose acolytes are generally very open and honest about wanting to spread their doctrine). And it’s run like a totalitarian dictatorship which takes the concept of faith and perverts it to demanding unquestioning loyalty to doctrine with the threat of intimidation and extortion. Like some banana republic.
CoS is like a patchwork quilt of strategies that have worked for very disparate types of organizations – many of which are at odds with each other in the outside world and don’t make sense. It comes off as a shortcut – promising to some a sense of material success through reducing spiritual health to a technologically dependent formula. (not that other religions haven’t adopted a Prosperity Gospel themselves).
The goal of “clearing the planet” seems to be hastily added on as a way to justify itself as charitable, an afterthought to the more obvious goal of creating success for the organization itself. Because, regardless of what its doctrine may claim, a lot more of its actions are dedicated to sublimating the importance of the individual in relation to that of the organization. And its arrogant disrespect for, and aggressive attacks on, outsiders (by not seeing them as potential members but only as adversaries) does not jive, and in fact clashes hideously with the concept of spreading its “salvation”.
I think overall it is this dichotomy of self-contradicting dogmas fosters that is its greatest obstacle to being taken seriously by many, and is also what has allowed the abuses that will ultimately bring it down to have happened. It is a jack of all trades and master of none. A Church of Cognitive Dissonance, not one of scientific anything.
Cecybeans,
Well stated IMO.
Bravo…so very well said!
Ooh La La … that was out of the park.
Fabulous summation, Cecy.
I thought that if I were ever to appear on the show I would introduce myself stating my name and that the fact I was appearing on the show was automatic proof was that I was nobody who knew nothing, and minimally a liar, pervert and failure out to line my pockets with all those huge sums of money that were now gonna come my way….LOL. That is what the Church is saying – appearance on the show is automatic proof of all that and more. And they are doing a back handed condemnation of the ineffectiveness of Scientology by their condemnation of so many former senior executives, long term sea org members, and public Scientologists of long standing who made significant progress on their Bridge. It is the Bridge to nobody-hood, know-nothingness, dishonesty, perversion, criminality, failure etc. by their own admission
It is the Bridge to nobody-hood, know-nothingness, dishonesty, perversion, criminality, failure etc. by their own admission
Perfect summation.
Mike….I am not exactly sure why A&E would call for a “respite” at the point in the series. Last weeks episode was very powerful. The network should not be stopping right in the middle of it’s hard hitting journalism for a break.
It’s like the top of the ninth game seven of the World Series and you hit a grand slam…. you should never stop such powerful momentum.
So…..in light of that…I am not sure if there are things going on behind the scenes that we don’t know about. Hopefully, nothing.
I applaud everything that you are doing. Keep Going my friend!!!!!
….should say…..at THIS point in the series……
Sorry for the typo. ??
Nothing going on behind the scenes other than exhaustion. Tony O has it right in his blog post today.
Thanks….I see that. Hadn’t gone there yet before I wrote you..
??
By the power invested in me, any overts and withholds you have fully and truthfully told me are forgiven by Scientologists.”
SHOOT ME NOW!!!!
Can’t do that, Jacquelin. We need your posts.
This is what is referred to as “tribal blindness” where you can see the bad things that the enemy tribe does, but never the bad things that your own tribe does.
It’s part of being a Scientologist, an Anti-Scientologist, a Chicago Bears fan, and a member of the Republican Party.
This tribal blindness is what you got stuck in as a cult member, and what you can get yourself re-stuck in when you get out. It is the foundation of all sociopathic attitudes and behaviors that human beings engage in.
Getting out of Scientology does not make you immune to tribal blindness.
Alanzo
Nor you Alanzo.
I see you did not mention Democrats Alanzo. Are we to infer, with your reasoning, which I agree with, that you have an inability to be self critical of Democrats?
He didn’t mention Packer fans either
I also take issue with your assumption of moral equivalence between Scientologists and anti Scientologists.
One group abuses people and one wants the abuse to stop.
There is no moral equivalence between these two.
The violence of the French resistance and the Nazis were not equal.
One worked to enslave and one worked to free.
One tribe for good and one for evil.
Making anti Scientologists morally equal to the demonic doctrines of Scientology hate and destruction of critics is a morally confused view, in my opinion.
The reason I included Chicago Bears fans was to ensure that no one thought I was drawing any kind of moral equivalence, or that I was making any kind of political endorsement.
I was just talking about tribal blindness: the ability to see the bad things about the enemy tribe but never the bad things about your own.
Mike described it very well in Scientologists.
But Scientologists aren’t the only human beings who suffer from it.
Alanzo
“But Scientologists aren’t the only human beings who suffer from it.”
Absolutely! It’s the human condition. We have intellectual tribalism now. In the past our tribal differences were resolved by the sword or battle axe.
Now we slander, deceive and demonize those who are in the enemy camp.
But there is no moral equivalence between critics and those that seek destruction of critics. It doesn’t even come close.
Marty’s black ops-psycho manipulating-dead agenting writings and videos has stated on a number of occasions that critics are worse than being being on the end of an OSA operation.
Marty’s moral compass is either out of commission or the money was real good.
Those who oppose Scientology abuse have nothing in common with Scientology OSA street thugs. That’s just twisted sicko.
If that’s so, then why not lead the charge by telling us your own sad tale of how you managed to miss seeing what sMarty was up to, long after most of us here had figured it out? Now that would be of real current relevance and potential value to others, don’t you think?
Instead speaking from on high, in some sort of professorial voice of authority, about generalities and abstractions, why not just get real here and tell us about your own sad mistakes in falling into tribalistic ways of thought and belief, instead of giving us yet another unasked for lecture?
Just tell us YOUR story and let us draw our own conclusions from it, please.
Alanzo’s “story” is that he’s a troll. Now, he has some points to make, I’ll grant him that. I don’t entirely disagree with him on everything. Having said that, he could make his points without harrowing the feelings of those with whom he disagrees, But, then, if he communicated his arguments in a considerate, civilized way, he wouldn’t be a troll 🙂
Even trolls have their own stories. I’d much prefer to hear his than a lecture by D.Scn. Blonzo. Plus, he actually does have a relevant story to tell about his break with sMarty.
“Even trolls have their own stories”. I hear you, and yes, his would be interesting.
Who is “D.Scn Blonzo”?
I have a soft spot for Alanzo. He was the first person to come to my aid when I decided to do a full frontal assault on Hubbard’s deception and psycho manipulation and back up my criticism with Hubbard text references.
This was on Marty’s blog. Before even Marty criticized Hubbard. No one was criticizing Hubbard back then. Only Miscavige. I kept being hit with trained x Scientologists Scientology mindset of attack critics. Some x Scientologists are out physically but not spiritually and mentally. They still disdain critics.
Back then Ron was the sacred cow. Only Miscavige and “Corporate Scientology” were the enemy.
I kept it up, almost got booted off Marty’s, and Alanzo was one of the first to see clearly that it was doctrines of Hubbard being followed. He backed me up when I was getting bombed by believers.
Alanzo, thank you for being that guy back then. And thank you for aiming at and having the philosophy of balance. It’s a good trait.
But……
sometimes sides must be taken. The good supported, and the bad dealt with appropriately.
I am not a fan of moral relativism. I am more a fan of respectful dialog and attempting to be a person of intelligent discrimination, the type Marty is failing at miserably!
So thanks Alanzo for aiming for balance. But those who take a side are not necessarily off balance. They may be seeing things quite clearly. Maybe not.
Yes, Brian! “sometimes sides must be taken. The good supported, and the bad dealt with appropriately.”
Because our silence gives consent.
Alanzo, did you ever reach out to Cathy Tweed?
” Getting out of Scientology does not make you immune to tribal blindness.”
But it does show what values you stand for. Where do you stand Allen? Perhaps just out in the middle of the stream creating turbulence where none need be? Don’t muddy the water.
That’s why things like the M16 exist. It handles all kinds of blindness. Are you immune to blindness Alanzo?
Seems like you’re very much like that bloke Hubbard, he spoke like you do, in vast generalities he referred to as standard tech.
Umm, no.
Any “bad” actions or words by “anti-$cientologists” is absolutely NOTHING compared to what the cult of $cientology does every minute of every day.
I’m sure Marty agrees with this shit, but realistic people don’t. Spare us, please.
Beautifully written. Poignant. Please know that you’re supported by more people than you’ll ever know, in your efforts to help former, and current cult members. Much Love and thanks!
I second that, J Love… So many incredible comments today…as always. Mike, your blog has class, dignity and truth.
THANK YOU SO MUCH!
I would like to point out there’s no other place I know of that I can find such incredible intellect mixed with wit and humor… Quite an accomplishment considering the level of pain and betrayal we share.
This forum has gotten me through more than I can ever say.
Much love and gratitude to you and your team.
Tried to write the below on Marty´s blog: (it apparently got refused…wonder why;-)
Stefan | September 26, 2017 at 8:35 am | Reply
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
Come to think of Granting of Beingness…
Compare Marty, CofS, The Oracle etc to Haggis, Rinder etc..
Not difficult to see the difference I think!
https://markrathbun.blog/2017/09/24/paul-haggis-and-backpage-tony-ortega/#comment-356226
‘Talk about hypocrisy’. Wow, and thanks for that revelation about forgiveness, Mike.
So spot on! Sick is right!
Mike i am so impressed with how you’ve re established you integrity by the way you’re living your life and helping others. It trumps any tech in any religion .you deserve mega props.
Mike, you and Leah need to do an episode on the NARCONON scam…..I would be happy to share my experiences with you.
I think that would be a great idea!
Excellent point, Mike. All the high-ranking defections truly indicate that the LRH tech is worthless. Great job. We will miss the show tonight. I think I’ve seen all episodes at least twice each. 🙂 I recommend repeat viewings.
There is no constructive self criticism in Scientology.
Why?
Because L Ron Hubbard was psychologically terrorized by being found out, discovered and seen as a fraud. Dispassionate self inquiry was absent from Ron’s ability.
Ron was all about,” agree with me or experience retribution and punishment”.
As a Malignant Narcissist, Ron created doctrines to make it a High Crime, a punishable offense, to be self correcting.
To be self correcting, we have to have access to all information, positive and negative, about ourselves and our condition.
And because independent and reasoned scrutiny is a suppressive act by evil people, Scientology can never resolve the issues that have created this bad PR in the first place.
Scientology is NOT the study of knowledge. It’s a study that causes mental distortions which polarizes humanity into two categories: elite Scientologists and stupid wogs.
Scientology cannot be responsible for it’s present PR condition because being responsible, being self correcting, is an ethics offense.
So glad this is all coming out now. We must save our children from joining this madness.
How does one go about defending the indefensible???
You get a team of lawyers that will tie you up in knots in court for decades.
The definition of Indefensible: :
in·de·fen·si·ble
ˌindəˈfensəb(ə)l/
adjective
adjective: indefensible
1.
not justifiable by argument.
“the policy of apartheid was morally indefensible”
synonyms:
inexcusable, unjustifiable, unjustified, unpardonable, unforgivable; More
uncalled for, unprovoked, gratuitous, unreasonable, unnecessary;
insupportable, unacceptable, unwarranted, unwarrantable;
flawed, wrong, untenable, unsustainable
“Smith admitted that her remarks about Collins were indefensible”
2.
not able to be protected against attack.
“the towns were tactically indefensible”
synonyms:
inexcusable, unjustifiable, unjustified, unpardonable, unforgivable; More
Mike,
I volunteered for a few hours at the State Veterans Home for the annual “Stand Down” this past Friday. I am fortunate to have a home and wonderful supporting family. It was cool to see and give a little support to homeless and “normal” vets alike.
I was surprised to see a “VM” in a bright yellow shirt show up. I hadn’t heard of them until recently. She didn’t really do much but pass through the area and “look busy”. Thanks for letting me know what to expect from VMs. She lived down to my expectations.
“…lived down to my expectations”. Good one! I’m stealing that.
100% all true, Mike.
Was watching Jason Beghe’s interview after he left yesterday (I’ve seen Going Clear umpteen times) and there was a clip of you doing an interview when you were still the head of OSA, my gosh Mike…what a different person you are today! You seem relaxed and happy, that’s a wonderful thing. What you and Leah are doing cannot be measured, keep it up!!!!
“It is a curious, and rather disturbing, fact that run of the mill scientologists on social media never (and this is without exception) express ANY concern for the abuses reported on the show.” Exactly!
When I first started to read on line about the abuses, I said to my sibling if even 10% of this is true it is reprehensible, unacceptable and I’m out. I was shocked and continued with my research. Let me tell you it was hard to confront, all my training and indoctrination was (the little devil on my shoulder) screaming don’t look at this, it can’t be true, these are the SP’s spreading lies. But I continued peeling that onion and the rest is history. I have no respect for those still in, especially the old-timers, that won’t look and find out for themselves. They have become the enablers.
ENABLER:
1. Tacit Enabler – Supports another’s bad habits by staying silent.
2. Overt Enabler – Supports another’s bad habits by providing assistance such as money, transportation, approval, etc…
A person who supports another person’s bad or dangerous habits.
Enablers tend to fear calling others on their destructive habits because these “others” tend to be friends, family or others close to the enabler.
Thus, rather than risk losing the love, respect, friendship or contact with the person, the enabler chooses instead to play it safe and watch the other slowly destroy themselves or others through their own actions.
– Urban Dictionary
The Scientologists don’t care to look and see the abuses going on because they are brainwashed puppets. I love your show and am thankful that you and the rest of the crew are so brave to expose all the ugly goings on by them.
I swear Mike, No auditor just starting out or as the most advanced has Ever said or read those lines by Ron to me,ever. The cult Lies, steals away bodies, minds and souls and the outcome is you are thrown under the bus and repeatedly run over for Eternity.
Mike, There are no words to tell you how much I respect, admire and support you, Leah & all who have bravely spoken up and out on Aftermath 1 & 2. A Huge Breach in The Cults Levees! ????
That forgiveness R Factor is said at end of Joburg confessional on Grade II. At least it used to be. DM might have taken that out and omitted LRH date there too.
No Cindy, here is how it works (as El Con set it up). If you are getting an HCO Sec Check it starts, “I am NOT auditing you.” At the end you get no “forgiveness patter”. (everything you said can and will be used against you by HCO)
If it is a confessional it starts, “This is the session”. and you get the forgiveness patter at the end of the session.
Important and relevant question Mike. I think they care primarily for themselves, but it’s important to distinguish why. When we step back and regard the real dangers a public *Scientologist (*paying full retail-prices-for-paying-as -you-go spiritual exorcism) faces, for example saying the wrong thing and having your spouse “write you up” in a Knowledge Report (which gets sent to the “ethics officer” for further scrutiny) it’s plain to see that this is very dangerous time to be making displays of curiosity. Using Hubbards Tone Scale to gauge Scientologists they can be seen to be occupying the low low state of *hiding*. They have to hide their true feelings and misgivings. They have to hide the look on their faces when another re-release is announced that will “fix” the prior “out-tech”. They have to hide their own feelings and perceptions from themselves. When I see this going on I have empathy for them, not anger. These people are in-between a rock and hard place. It’s easy for us, we just post our viewpoints and questions and press “send” and we are not required to proof up our connections with friends and family before doing so. Ex-Scientologists have a freedom that Scientologists are DYING to have, and that is the freedom to be honest. They have had their courage and independence surgically removed by the cults indoctrination and by the enforcement division found in every single Scientology office. When a Scientologist speaks these days, it’s all code for “don’t look over here, nothing to see”. Thanks to you and everyone else who speaks openly, using their own name, standing up as an example. Suppressive Declares mean nothing if everyone just decided to unsubscribe to the madness. I hope they take their lives back. I really do. There are good people trapped in the prison of belief. They don’t need to wait until body death to leave the church. They can simply make a pact with their spouses that their marriage and kids and their lives are more important than defending the indefensible. They should know they are all welcome here. The church doesn’t care what happened to them. We do. A true friend will listen to your concerns and not judge you or condemn you for being honest. I honestly care about these people. I do not think we should vilify them.
Doug – one comment, it is not possible for everyone to appear on this blog using their own name, and it’s usually to avoid retribution from ‘the group’.
IMO it’s safer over here to make comments than on Facebook. I love Aaron’s new Facebook page, BTW.
I thank you and Leah for your work. I have been fortunate enough to have never been exposed to their hypocracy.
Me, too! I was interested when I started hearing about it because it was all so mysterious, but somehow all these famous people were part of it. Thankfully, because I’m a Christian, I was never interested enough to get sucked in.
But, I agree, you and Leah and doing God’s work, here, whether you know it or not.
Very well said Jacquelin Davis, I am also a Christian and have never been interested in joining scientology. God’s work indeed. Praying for all the brave souls who choose life and leave this Occult themed group. Thank you Mike and Leah
ahn?
Forgiveness is a virtue, and those can’t exist in an organization founded on (or at least inspired by) the occult. I’d recommend the following presentation by Jamie DeWolf, great-grandson of L. Ron Hubbard.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRUYESI3v3c
As for Scientologists being on social media, I thought one episode said Miscavige frowned on that for members…since browsing the Internet unfiltered could expose them to negative sayings (i.e., the truth) about Hubbard and himself. Another classic double-standard, from a temperamental loon who doesn’t even follow his own rules…or those of the man he claims to revere.
Absolution for a Catholic !
God the Father of mercies, through the death and resurrection of your son, you have reconciled the world to yourself and sent the Holy Spirit among us for the forgiveness of sins. Through the ministry of the church, may God grant you pardon and peace. And I absolve you of your sins, in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. Amen.
LRH copied from Catholic Church.
As a true believer in Catholicism, the church believes
a priests stands in for
JESUS AT THE MOMENT OF ABSOLUTION!
Priest are all flawed and human too. We all are just trying to figure life out.
Scientology is just evil thinking.
No disrespect but Jesus doesn’t need a “stand in” and I don’t pray to saints, I pray directly to God. When I married my first husband I had to take six weeks of “religion” lessons from the Church to be able to get married in the Catholic church. Let’s just say that I’m sure the priest was happy when the six weeks were over and he never did answer most of my questions other than to say they were “trained” (not the exact word but similar) to advise people. Sadly we got divorced and then the church refused to grant him an annulment but the second time he asked they granted him one so in the eyes of the “church” we were never married. Well I’m here to tell you that in the eyes of God we were no matter what the “church” said.
I read an article yesterday about Irish Priests who are pushing the church to hold Priests that fathered children financially responsible to support them & their mothers…..interesting point
Oh yes, as far as an annulment….in the eyes of the Catholic Church the marriage is not recognized….yet the children born of that marriage ARE recognized……
@ Jaye Aither – It has long been the view of many in various Christian churches, that marriages are finalized in the eyes of God by sex…especially between one man and one woman. There’s also some who say that if sex occurs outside of marriage, God still deems those two people as married. However, the latter makes no sense to me…because God can’t bless a union which goes against His commands. God forgives those who repent, to be sure…but it doesn’t validate their previous rebellion. I hear people talk every so often (including ministers), about God throwing our sins as far as the east is from the west. The basic message is that we’re free from condemnation when we turn away from sin and back toward God…but our Creator doesn’t have amnesia. He knows everything we’ve ever done, but He’s sworn to never punish us for things His blood has covered. A supernatural being who’s all-knowing can’t forget, but He can love to the point He extends grace in spite of our failures.
Amen, there is only one way to the Father and that is through the Son, non of us are perfect but we are supposed to STRIVE to be like Jesus……good deeds don’t get us to eternal life with God, this was a gift given freely. Thank you for letting me be heard, I am a non-denominational Christian.
Kay, just because one bit of magical thinking is older than the other does not make it right. So much evil has been done in the name of Jesus, just as it has in the name of LRH. Both religions suck you in with promises of a better life, neglecting to tell you of the inherent punishments at the core of the belief system. Sorry. I’m sure you are a good person, but if you are a Catholic, you have simply been taken in by a different fantasy, as in all other religions.
Kay, Scientology is far worse than you think.
and I’m sure once forgiven, or at any time, do priests announce publicly the sins of those who confess.
Mike, thank you for this excellent article. You have articulated this point so well that you could use this as the framework for a special episode that should unpack this whole phenomenon in Scientology. You already have clips from many episodes that you could use–such as Paul Haggis arriving to his home with a yard full of celebrity friends who are outraged not at the abuses, but at him “going outside the church to handle it.” “Don’t write the letter that way Paul.” And the things that happened to Leah, the f’d up comments from Kirsti Alley; how upset Leah still by the fact that, as she said in episode 5, “I’m hurt because they know I’m telling the truth” and they don’t care. This has been an underlying message in every show in some way. And while we have been focusing on the horrific things people have experienced in Scientology, this underlying common theme has been seen and touched on, but has not been a theme of its own. The tolerance of crimes and aberrant behavior is a characteristic of Scientology as you point out in your contrast to the Catholic Church. This deserves to be turned inside out.
It ties in with the question, why would justice officials continue to turn a blind eye, and why would “religions” be allowed to be vigilantes above the law of the land.
This is very likely one reason of many, that Hubbard and Miscavige fought so hard to get Scientology’s tax-exempt status restored. Its tougher for politicians to stand against a government-recognized church, without facing some kind of blowback…either from the organization itself or those who support it.
Karen, just finished your latest book. It is a great one, I recommend it to all.
As far as Scientologists and their responses, truly they don’t know. They can’t read your book, they can’t watch Leah’s shows, they think the articles are all lies because that is what they were told.
Certainly they know about abuses and insanity in their local areas, but Dave Miscavige presents such a prettied up picture at his events that they take it as a local problem. Sure, they are penniless and destitute at the local org, but they just saw video after video of other orgs that are apparently doing great.
They sound clueless on social media because they are. None are so blind as those who will not see. But every time they blindly defend their position a little crack gets made in the façade. A little bit of truth seeps in, even when they are screeching the loudest.
It is far easier to see what is going on in Scientology from the outside. Those who read this blog and other sources, who have read a few books or have seen the Aftermath show know far more than the average Scientologist. The clams are cradled in a bubble and don’t like the clean air outside. It burns a bit at first. But you can’t spend your whole life in a tiny bubble, walled in by beliefs and sheltered by platitudes. It’s not good for you.
What a great comment, Bruce. It is so true what you say. The church members truly don’t know because it is all hidden from them and they are told what to believe and are told that all the whistleblowing is all lies.
I believe that the LRH policy should be applied whereby a person who knows or should have known about an outness is a accessory and receives the same penalty as the actual offender. Scientologists are supposed to be smarter and more aware than WOGs. So good; they know about these crimes and if they are noy stopping them then they are criminals themselves. I don’t buy the idea that they don’t know or are too brainwashed to act like human beings. They sure are competent when it comes to finding ways to fuck over ex-members and their families. Give them some credit. They are supporting Miscaviage with tons of money. They basicaly are paying him to commit these crimes. They should be judged accordingly.
Perfect!
This is a great article.
I would love to see an episode which laid out all of this with evidence.
I’ve seen some of the lists available online, giving the names of all the first clears declared/dead, the Old Saint Hill Staff or early SO crews, the list of all the highly trained/audited ex-SO, OTs who are out, declared, or dead.
I don’t know how to get those who are IN to look, but if we name enough names and show the faces and tell, even briefly, their background and achievements and how they’re all out and declared, it might just shake a few people into opening their eyes.
Even while IN I looked online here and there, clicked on a link, read some things. (paid dearly in sec checks and Truth Rundown later)
If we could show the HUNDREDS (thousands?) that are out and quit or were found bad and declared, and then shove in their faces all the LRH references about SCN and how it works and fixes people…..
maybe
we could save at least one.
……..
Thanks Mike. A valuable and good comforting read this morning.
Thank you Mike for all that you’re doing. It is very moving that you have taken your past and turned it into something that is helping humanity. You rock 🙂
You mention the word confession and forgiveness of sins. In Western culture anything said in confession is as protected by law as if you were in private conversation with your lawyer or doctor. So if Scientology really is a religion and has confession can not a case be made against their claim of being a religion when the evidence is undeniable that they break the most basic tenant of any religion by making public things they learn about their members in confession?
I beleive they sign away their rights before they even start going up the bridge.
Ding, ding, ding……………alarm bells going off for any authority responsible for declaring this a religion.
Ann, in the USA there is no one who declares something a religion.
Perhaps declare is the wrong word, but the IRS certainly endorsed that status…
Totally irrelevant 50sparks. That ISN’T what gives them a tax exempt status.
But bang away at the 16″ inch armor plate that is the status of religion (which you will NEVER pierce) and distract people from the vulnerability of why they have non-profit status and how best to take it out.
smh
Pretty much so.
Never could figure that one out Mike, Years ago it was a couple of sentences, Now a 20 page book ,All rights taken away , and no guarantee of reaching the desired end , abilities gained,
This would be a huge stumbling block for new Raw meat.
Also they’re Plagiarizing my Motto for life.
“Do other’s before they do you” , I’m Pissed !!
Granitt.
Especially bearing in mind that the Auditor’s Code reads in part:
“I promise not to divulge the secrets of my preclears “.
This means that whatever happens in session is supposed to stay in session. I am still wondering why Scientologists don’t bring this up when they hear about it because it is a violation of policy.
Except when the auditor proclaims during a ‘confessional’ “I am not auditing you.” ?????
My question as a never-in.
Correct OhioBuckeye. Auditors code doesn’t apply when not being audited.
Ann Marie, it is a strange arrangement. On the one hand, they sell what they call counseling for a “fixed donation”. So you would think they would be subject to the privacy laws (HIPAA and others) that apply to counselors. But on the other hand they are quick to hide behind the First Amendment and call all their activities “religious practices” if anyone objects.
Which is it, Scientology, religious practices with no basis other than faith, or super-effective scientific techniques that don’t require faith? Stand up and give it to us straight, you can’t be both.
But of course they will never give up their First Amendment cloaking, cynically contrived to fool the FDA back in the 50s and used in thousands of court cases ever since. In other countries this hasn’t worked so well and they ended up actually having to comply with local laws. But in the US, there seems to be some reluctance to prosecute because of the “religious” angle, possibly coming from folks whose other questionable “religious” activities might also come into question. I am looking at you, Joel Osteen.
We can only hope that by educating as many as possible about what is really going on behind those curtained windows in Scientology establishments around the world we can get through to those who actually have the power and responsibility to do something about it.
The cost is not only the damaged lives and blighted hopes of the deluded followers, the leaders also effectively use tax dollars to support their extravagant lifestyles. Via the tax exemption. And then they have the gall to cry about religious prosecution when they get caught red-handed.
As Mike says in his blog title, “Something Can be Done About It”, more is happening every day. The disinfecting sunlight of truth is shining in on the rats as they scurry around in their holes. Are you surprised when they react violently? Nothing is more vicious than a cornered rat. But when they cannot hide, the truth reveals them for what they are.
Bruce, I helped write HIPPA. No mater what is or isn’t charged, it wouldn’t apply. Has to be a medical professional.
Also, as a religion there is nothing along that line to prosecute.
Ann Marie – I think the legal term is penitent – clergy confidentially and it varies state by state. If, as Mike says, a person waives that right, they are without legal recourse. Scientology is a spider and people, who join under the idea of improving themselves, are the flies. Nasty, exploitive and tragic.
That is not true Ann Marie. It IS true that the gov cannot demand to see a confession BUT, there is nothing about a church divulging such on their own.
And boy do they divulge!
No shite OSD. They even divulge what you didn’t do or say! LOL