I had done an some earlier posts about the Purification Rundown, including one with an article from National Geographic “Purification Rundown Debunked” and a later one that generated a lot of comments entitled The Danger of Niacin.
A commenter responded to the first article with some interesting observations and I invited him to expand on the information he provided. I had forgotten all about it and a few days ago up popped Dr. David Schnare and provided this write-up. I am always interested in MORE information about subjects, and I think this is a valuable addition to the general knowledge on the subject. Dr. Schnare participated in some studies on the Purif and he is the first person I am aware of who has spoken about this who is not acting on behalf of scientology.
Does the Purification Rundown Work?
By David W. Schnare, Esq. MSPH, Ph.D.
1/15/2021
About 3 years ago Mike Rinder posted an article suggesting the Purif was debunked. I stumbled over it about a year thereafter. It wasn’t until couple of weeks ago that I noticed Mike had responded to my comment, suggesting a more comprehensive write up. (I don’t follow Mike closely and rarely his blog. My bad.) As well, others posed some interesting questions. So, here is that write up. To ease reading, I’ll pose a question, answer it, and then move on.
Who are you anyway?
First of all, I’m an ex-Scientologist. I was never on staff and simply drifted away in the early 1990’s. I was the first director of research for the Foundation for Advancement in Science and Education, an organization I only learned later was a front for the then Guardian’s Office. I have a few academic degrees: BA Chemistry, Master of Science in Public Health, Ph.D. in Environmental Management and JD cum laude. Now retired, I spent my entire career with the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency as a health and policy scientist and then later as an enforcement attorney. I’ve attested to OT3 (for what that is worth). Steve Heard, then of the GO, asked me to help form FASE so as to allow scientific study of the tech. He never mentioned that it was part of a program to get Hubbard a Nobel Prize, something I only learned later. I joined him and conducted and managed several well-designed studies to examine the efficacy of the Purif. We published these in the peer-reviewed scientific media. I parted ways from FASE when it became clear they were not really interested in doing the kind of science I wanted to do, and weren’t really interested in having me on their board any longer.
Did Hubbard write the Purif?
No. A nurse worked it up. You can find her initials on the Bulletins next to LRH’s. Hubbard did review her work, as he did ours as well. She actually did a fairly good job of understanding the biology behind it all.
Does it work?
Let’s take that in pieces.
Does it work on BT’s?
There is no way to objectively and reliably measure the presence, absence or effect of BT’s, so any suggestion that it “handles” them is speculation (regarding both BTs and the effect of the Purif on presumed BTs). Nuff said.
Do drugs store in the body and can they be removed?
Yep, and yep. We found THC metabolites in both belly fat and “sweat” (actually sebaceous oil/wax). Levels in body stores were reduced immediately after doing the Purif by about 25% to 35%.
Is sweat the major means of clearing these foreign chemicals out of the body?
Nope. Very little mass of foreign chemicals come out in the sweat. They do come out that way, but clearly the concentrations we found in the sweat were too small to account for the reductions in body burden we found as estimated by belly fat concentrations. We had planned to do a more thorough study that would look at concentrations in sweat, urine and stool, to be done at Wayne State University, but their Institutional Review Board didn’t approve the study (we never found out why). The stool (poop) is the most likely major exit point for fat-loving chemicals. The function of bile is to break down fats into fatty acids and in the process gives color to the stool (makes it darker), and helps trap fat-loving chemicals for excretion. Because we saw significant reductions in body burdens of fat-stored foreign chemicals, we know they had to go somewhere. The only reasonable inference from our work is that it comes out in the stool.
Does the Purif really reduce body burdens of foreign chemicals?
Yep. Here is a link to our most often cited paper. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/20046351_Reduction_of_the_human_body_burdens_of_hexachlorobenzene_and_polychlorinated_biphenyls#fullTextFileContent. We also published in Ambio, a journal of the Royal Swedish Academy of Science, available here: http://detoxacademy.org/pdfs/ambio.pdf .
The Ambio paper demonstrated two things. There were significant reductions immediately after doing the Purif and still greater reductions four months after that for most of the chemicals we examined.
The question remains as to whether this is significant with regard to actual health or risk from these chemicals. Well, I’m still sort of sitting on the fence on this. Clearly, reducing the body burden of chemicals known to cause cancer has to be a good thing. Very low levels of foreign chemicals in the body may, however, actually improve health. It’s called hormesis and this is mainstream science. Ed Calabrese has a useful discussion on this topic. Basically, “the dose makes the poison”. A large amount of a poison will damage the body and cause disease or death. A tiny amount simply triggers the immune system and the body responds with better performance. Ed’s paper (2017) is available here: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41514-017-0013-z. Keep in mind, this is NOT homeopathic medicine and I’m not endorsing that either. Just letting you know, tiny amounts of chemicals in your body are not necessarily a problem. Nevertheless, Dave Root and I published a piece on the potential health implications of low levels of foreign chemicals in the human body. Take that for what you want. It is here: http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download;jsessionid=320FBA49C9567556374C0CD302294355?doi=10.1.1.497.4725&rep=rep1&type=pdf
What’s with niacin?
Niacin is a vasodilatator. It has two useful effects. It increases high-density lipoprotein cholesterol (HDL-C), the good cholesterol. Exactly how this would improve excretion of foreign chemicals has not been studied, at least as far as I can tell. (My work on this is very dated and I have not followed the literature on this for the past 20 years.) As a vasodilatator, niacin pushes blood up to the surface of the body. This is a useful thing as that is where the fat is, thus niacin helps blood flows that allow fats to move into and out of the blood stream, promoting the replacement of fats that have been in “deep” storage for years with fats that are being introduced into the body during the purify. I will say, there must be some kind of “memory” of past skin events. We saw and recorded too many events (mostly in women) of flushing patterns associated with swim apparel, including multiple different flushing patterns, apparently associated with different apparel as previously worn by the same patient. I can’t explain that, but I did observe it.
Is the purif any more effective than plain old increased water consumption?
Probably, but I’ve never done a study examining that. I don’t see, however, how increased water consumption would potentiate release of foreign chemicals from deep fat stores. Doesn’t make sense to me.
Did anybody bury studies that failed to show efficacy?
Well, I didn’t. I have no idea if anyone else did or did not. FASE did not while I was there. As a matter of practice, “negative” studies never get published. They should, but that is not how academics works today, sadly.
So, what is/was FASE up to?
I don’t know what they are doing these days. As I departed FASE the focus was on education rather than science. Recently I’ve tried to touch base with Jack Dirmann and Steve Heard, the two staffers who set FASE up. Jack has failed to respond to my emails to him. I can’t find Steve’s contact information. Probably a disconnection thing that prevents Jack from responding. How Steve has found a way to never appear on the internet other than as a producer of a movie once upon a time says a lot about Steve. He was a top notch GO operative. I send best wishes to both. They helped me do some good science.
Which type of vegetable in the purif? And the quantity?
Some people were trying to get Blubbard a Nobel prize? I never knew that and I never could have even imagined that. No Sir! Not in a million billion years.
I think I could have accepted the concept if it was not called the “Nobel Prize” and if it was called the (are you ready for this?) … the Dumbell Prize, instead”.
OK. OK. I realize that is not the best joke I ever told. In fact, it is pretty far away from the best. But if the concept of “pulling in something” has any validity, then you can be certain that he pulled that one in by himself.
But, please believe me, I just could not resist. I had no resistance to going there. I could not help myself. He was just such a Miserable! Such a rotten SOB!
Good on you David. It’s refreshing to read your piece. In the swimming fecal matter cauldron that is Scientology’s PR of itself it’s so good to see an objective piece based on science, be it dated or not. And just as refreshing you stated quite clearly on a number of points, “haven’t done a study on that… so I can’t comment.” A Scientologist would never admit something like that and immediately twist it into Hubbard is source. Cheers and hope you enjoy your retirement and freedom to think for yourself.
Damn. That jolted some memories. In 1971/2, I was running OT2 when I was told to turn in my materials to start a Drug Rundown. I exploded in the AOLA HGC and was routed to the MAA, Margret George. I told her that a) I was on OT2 and in the non-interference area, b) i was having wins and not bogging, and c) I was not a recreational drug user. She showed me the Blue on White Directive from Ron stating EVERYONE STARTS A DRD AND NOW!
I stormed out and at the door to the AO yelled “Ron has gone Psychotic!”
I was working at a university in the radiation safety department and in 1973 made up the ‘guk’ mixture. At the 3rd increase the excess minerals and phosphates started making me nauseous and I quit it. At the time we were keen in finding ways to eliminate radioactive elements that had been ingested so I , and the entire health Physics, Industrial Hygiene, and Environmental medical community, was ahead of the purif in studying how to excrete toxins.
When the purif came out I questioned the science/validity of it and only a few scienos bothered to ask me about what sort of scientific tests could be done to prove it. I said several $100k and 200-250 volunteers. 50 to just be monitored for six weeks, 50 to do 5 hours of exercise daily. 50 to do 5 hours of sauna daily. 50 to do the vitamin regime daily. And 50 to do the full sauna and vitamins daily. All would submit blood, urine, and poop specimens every other day. After 6 weeks the results would show what worked and what didn’t help at all.
“””Ron said..””” was all I ever got from them, as expected. Well i did the purif as ordered and got the expected flush and nothing else.
Your proposed study design is very similar to our Wayne State proposal. I wish we could have gone beyond clinical studies, but it didn’t happen.
Thanks,
You do analytical chemistry for years and move into rad safety and the techniques never get forgotten. Also a critical mind is incompatible with cult dogma.
“I will say, there must be some kind of “memory” of past skin events. We saw and recorded too many events (mostly in women) of flushing patterns associated with swim apparel, including multiple different flushing patterns,”
Nope. I long ago consulted a couple dermatologists on this. When one gets a bad sunburn the number of capillaries in that area can multiply greatly. Later when something like niacin is taken and dilates those, it will show on the skin of the past burn area as being red. There is no skin memory. Also this guy didn’t address the “radiation storage” quackery of the Purif materials. Cells cannot store UV or any other type of EM radiation for later release. Also to really remove most stored toxins one would have to burn ALL the old fat and replace it ALL with new fat (to avoid weight loss per the purif directions). Which cannot happen in all but the thinnest males (females have too high % body fat to pull off) during a typical purif time frame. Critical points completely ignored in this article.
I didn’t address the radiation issue because we never got that far. I agree with you that radiation tends not to store easily in the body. It will store in the bone, as will metals, and heat treatment does reduce those loading as has been known for centuries. As for removing “all” stored toxins, we never suggest that was either likely or possible. I am aware of a case in Viet Nam where a woman exposed to agent orange did reduce her burdens to unmeasurable levels. She did it by having and breast feeding 13 children. She lost her body burdens and her kids got most of that. Not exactly a happy outcome, but a demonstration that under some circumstances it is possible to get to unmeasurable levels. As for the causes of the patterned flushes, I repeat, I can’t explain it and don’t even try. I only report what we observed.
“As a vasodilatator, niacin pushes blood up to the surface of the body.”
I didn’t do the purif but I’ve tried a couple of vitamin regimens in the past and experienced the very distinct niacin flush on previously sunburned areas of my body. I guess over time all the skin cells would be replaced but some parts like scars remain. Perhaps a below the surface layer of sun damaged skin cells persist and niacin pushing blood to the surface causes some type of healing or curative effect indicated by the flush. This would be in contrast to the idea that niacin “runs out radiation” which might have been suggested or implied on the purif.
No, the “flush” is there because after your sunburn the body greatly increased the capillaries in that area to heal the skin. Later when the niacin caused those to dilate it caused the skin to look red in the area of the old burn.
Wild – That sounds correct. I think some people say that after continued niacin use they no longer experience the bright red flushing which might indicate organic cellular change or repair has occurred. Just a guess.
Richard, The human body develops resistance to many types of chemicals. Which is why people have to take more and more drugs to get high over time. Probably that type of mechanism. I wouldn’t want to test it with the toxic level of niacin the purif uses though.
I do remember a person I knew who had done the purif years before and then tried 100 mg of niacin after years of taking none and they lit up nicely. The body’s resistance having flagged after years of no use.
Wild,
I took 1 gram of niacin with each of my three meals a day to satisfy my MD who wanted to lower my cholesterol. I had a flush after each dose for the first week. After about 4 weeks I got a liver reaction: Hot inside and bumps and chills on skin. That stopped that.
I have a weight room and sauna, and will occasionally take 100 mg niacin along with 3-4 grams of C to help clear nasal congestion. Still tingles.
I used to live next door to Steve and Kathie Heard. When we first moved to Clearwater about 7 yrs ago, Steve was in a wheelchair, and suffering badly from lewy body dementia. It was a sad situation. We had no idea about Scientology at the time. Kathie would take him in his wheel chair to shop. At times we offered to get things for them. She seemed grateful. I never saw her get any help from anyone else. We had stairs to get into our units, and she would basically carry him up the stairs to get him in the house.
We were snowbirds at the time, and left for the season. When we returned the next winter, Steve had just passed. We heard from another neighbor, that Kathie had described his memorial held in LA, and how many dignitaries were in attendance. That’s it. We expressed our personal condolences, Kathie was grateful, but did not speak of him again.
I started researching, and discovered how important Steve was within the Scientologists ranks.
I realized they must have relocated to Clearwater when Steve got sick. I can only imagine how much money he spent for auditing, to discover how he “pulled this in”. How sad. Kathie is still very much in, Steve passed about 5 yrs ago.
Both Steve and Kathie were definitely GO operatives.
We recently moved to the beach, but I had many conversations with Kathie prior to, since she was our HOA rep for the complex. She is quite smart, yet seems so sad. She often looked tired and somewhat disheveled. I felt sorry for her.
Thank you for that information. One more of my once upon a time friends that has died.
You’re welcome.
I’ve done the purif as prerequisite for OT 4, never had drugs. It did absolutely nothing other than some niacine reaction.
Does anyone know who the nurse was?
If she’s still around or her friends, it would be great to get that side of the story.
There was no nurse that I am aware of. The initials on HCOBs are typically those of the typist/proofreader. The two people I know who participated in putting the Purif together are Drs. Megan Shields and Gene Denk. Both have passed away. Also, the medical liaison officer from the Apollo, Jim Dincalci worked with Hubbard when he was hiding out in Queens in 1973 on Hubbard’s interest in vitamins. That was the genus of the Pep bulletin and other things on diet that would become part of the Purif a few years later….
Thanks Mike!
I wonder why David said it was a nurse?
I remember Nancy Tidman, “nt”, the typist on many of the issues.
I have no idea. Perhaps he will respond. I didnt vouch for the accuracy of his statement, I simply put it out there to add to whatever knowledge there may be on the subject.
Mike, it was a long time ago and I don’t remember her name, but Steve Heard was able to put me in touch with her and we had a brief, but useful discussion. I worked with both Gene and Megan. Neither was involved in developing the program. Jack Dirmann was a subject of the early form of the program, but not a developer. David Mayo and I discussed its development, and made clear Hubbard reviewed the development, but made no substantive contribution.
I don’t think there’s anything beneficial from doing the Purif. I did 4 of them + the sweat pgm. The body sweats to cool down. Really all the Purif does is make the body too hot, and it’s frantically trying to cool down. I’m not saying that the body doesn’t hold on to drugs and poisons it its fat tissues. To what extent I don’t know. And if you really want to get at the poisons locked up in the fat, you’re just going to have to lose it. Go on a diet or fast. And I think with niacin, people see in the flush what they want to see. Kind of like the stellar constellations. All I’ve ever seen is random blotches in the flush. And I’ve seen a lot of purifers. There may be some benefit to niacin, as well as abuse. And taking all those high dose vitamins are certainly abuse. Plus the idea of drinking straight liquid oil so that it replaces the bad fat is just complete nonsense. Drinking straight oil like that is really bad for you, and it doesn’t replace the “bad fat”. It just adds to it. There’s no benefit to the Purif at all. Take a pass.
WADR, the ambio paper describes an open label, non randomised, uncontrolled study of just 7 people.
I could find no peer review.
Please advise.
The Ambio study involved before and after controls with careful attention to the sensitivity of measurement. We were able to measure within a two percent change of concentration in body burdens. The size of the changes were sufficiently large as to document a real change. As well, Ambio is a peer reviewed journal. Later studies replicated the outcomes and they had non-treated controls. But, its ok if you don’t believe the outcomes. Just go ahead and make an effort to replicate the outcomes and see how you do. That’s how science works.
No David, science works by PEER REVIEWED experiments. A “peer reviewed journal” is NOT a peer reviewed study. Either the study has been peer reviewed, or there is no peer reviewed study. SCIENCE!
We had peer reviewers as well. I used PhD toxicologists at EPA for that. As well, peer reviews by journal peer reviewers were very detailed and helped improve both our papers and follow on work. I’m with you. Science benefits from involvement by independent, qualified fellow scholars.
“The Hubbard programme was administered to 14 firemen who were suffering from significant memory impairments after exposure to high levels of polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs) in a transformer fire. (6) The firemen’s scores on several memory tests reportedly improved after the intervention but the sample size was small and no control group was included.
“By applying a similar detox regime, the Foundation for Advancements in Science and Education of the Church of Scientology found statistically significant improvements in blood pressure, cholesterol levels and psychological test scores amongst 103 volunteers compared to a control group of 19 individuals who did not receive treatment. (7) The study was limited by lack of randomisation and blinding, and the duration of the intervention period varied widely from 11 to 89 days. The control group did not receive a placebo treatment and the participants were simply re-tested after maintaining their usual lifestyle for 3 weeks. Rather dubiously, the average increase in IQ in the experimental group was reported to be 6.7 points, despite the average intervention length being only 31 days.
“The Hubbard Purification Rundown used in the New York rescue workers’ detox project (involving vitamin/mineral supplementation, polyunsaturated oils, sauna and exercise) has been reported to reduce adipose tissue concentrations of PCBs and hexachlorobenzene (HCB) in electrical workers. After 3 weeks of treatment, the body burdens of HCB and PCBs decreased by 30% and 16% in the workers respectively. (65) Rea et al. (66) trialed the programme in 210 volunteers who reported suffering from ‘chemical sensitivity’, although a control group was not included. The study claims to have tested blood levels of several chemical categories (pentachlorophenols, PCBs, volatile aliphatic and aromatic chlorinated and nonchlorinated hydrocarbons and organochlorine pesticides) before and after treatment, although the specific compounds are not named and no information is provided on how they were quantified. Instead, it is simply stated that blood toxic chemical levels decreased by 63%.
“The paucity of data and poor methodologies presented in these studies cast uncertainty over the validity of the results. Moreover, concerns regarding the safety of this detox programme have arisen subsequent to reports stating that it can lead to severe hyponatraemia. (67)”
Klein, A. V., & Kiat, H. (2015). Detox diets for toxin elimination and weight management: A critical review of the evidence. Journal of Human Nutrition and Dietetics, 28(6), 675-686. doi.org/10.1111/jhn.12286
I stand by my previous comment. It has nothing to do with what I believe. A healthy scepticism is my default. I assume it’s yours as well.
The CoS’ current go-to paper is also limited. Lennox et al. (2018) evaluated 109 individuals for quality of life/SF-36 scores (amongst others) pre and post Purif. Despite reported improvements, the authors concluded that “….without a comparison group, it is impossible to know how much change might have occurred over the same length of time from continued sobriety, strong expectations or placebo effect. Intensive daily contact, exercise and improved nutrition may account for improvements regardless of actual elimination of residual drug metabolites…”
Lennox, R. D., & Cecchini-Sternquist, M. (2018). Safety and tolerability of sauna detoxification for the protracted withdrawal symptoms of substance abuse. Journal of International Medical Research, 46(11), 4480–4499. doi.org/10.1177/0300060518779314.
Clearly more (and far better) studies are needed.
I agree that well done replication studies should be done.
One apparently reputable researcher claims that the purif is beneficial. That would seem to validate one small part of Hubbard’s ‘tech’, except for one thing: the purif did not come from Hubbard, it came from some nurse somewhere.
Way to go Hubbs, another incidence of stolen valor, I guess.
Looking back, it was inevitable that the purif would make me feel better. Coming from a background of not exercising, eating fast food, working very long hours, not sleeping enough, smoking and drinking,
Of course the purif would make me feel better. You have to take vitamins, exercise, eat salads, get sleep, quit drinking, etc. It was the hook to continue scn attributing how I felt to scn tek. Boy was I duped.
However, there is no evidence that what hubbard and after scn claim to be miraculous in the purif is true.
The human body by its nature can restore or heal itself. Or at least partially expel harmful substances. Surely an inadequate or sedentary lifestyle does not help. But eating certain foods or extracts that contain specific vitamins, minerals and fats helps a lot. I think people feel good because doing purif they start moving more and eating better and the body feels better. But it stops there.
Personally, for several years I have discovered the functionality of the olive leaf extract. It is incredibly therapeutic as has been amply demonstrated by decades of laboratory studies and research. This product act on a wide range of situations and with perhaps only one contraindication. The key substance is called oleuropein. It has an adaptive activity and therefore varies according to the person.
After crossing the NewAge and trying everything from superfoods to aquatic mushrooms from the Carpathian caves I can say it really works. But google it and check for yourself (I think I’ve gone a bit off topic).
You did, but I for one don’t mind a bit. I am always interested in natural healing/health aids, and thank you for this lead! (I suppose Mike can always delete this if it proves too much of a digression)
Welcome Cindy. Of course give it a look, perhaps the only contraindication seems to be low blood pressure, as oleuropein tends to regulate it.
Ok, so the purif does work in a sense. However, the purif is not unique to Scientology. Many self-help leaders run sweat lodges and many health advocates talk about saunas. The unique combination of niacin and the sauna is unique to Scientology, but the idea of sweating out toxins is a common theme in self-help and new age groups.
Now to be fair to the case that I’ve heard about that had a negative effect. There was apparently a case in the Buffalo org where a kid went psychotically insane and it was blamed on the high doses of vitamins causing chemical imbalances in his brain. That is what was suggested by staff, and he ended up committing a murder. It was his mother, who was a Scientologist (Mike probably knows about this more than I do). I am not a doctor, so I can’t properly judge the case if the kid who did this was fine before the purif and the vitamin doses messed up his brain due to the chemical mixture combined with a possible mineral or vitamin deficient diet. It’s not safe in a general regard for children or teenagers, and I would stand by that statement based on my personal experience.
Dr. David Schnare, Thank you for your contribution to the thought and understanding here.
I personally never had much of a drug history. I enjoyed the Purif a lot, as I did any action I did in C of S. I had zero difficulties. Mostly, a renewed sense of clarity and calm emerged. Physically, the biggest thing that “turned on” and “ran out” was fragrance from shampoo. That is about it.
I can accept the stable, good feeling might have been strictly placebo effect. Though for me, I don’t think so. As I say, I enjoyed it—enjoyed the exercise, never had any difficulty with the calcium-magnesium or other supplements, the exercise portion. I really felt so much better in all social situations after. I don’t know what that was about, but for all the time since, I look at the Purif as being the action I did which appeared to have permanently aided that part of life for me.
I do not discount, though, the bad reports I have read, such as for a person who has a heavy drug history. Frequently, (from what I saw while still in), they are tossed in with the rest doing the Purif at the org. The training for a Purif In-Charge is in no way on par with a medical person. I think, instead, as many in this blog community can affirm, an org (always desperate for staff) will appoint nearly ANYone into these functions. Most commonly what I saw, it was a person without knowledge of biology or nutrition, except for what they studied in the Purif In-Charge pack.
Also, curious: it seems any org has that ONE doctor, nearby, who is the org’s “purif doctor” to whom they send everyone for the doctor to sign off, “Okay to do the Purif.” (Talk about a “quickie” action.) Including down at Flag. I do not observe any real depth of examination into: Is this person physically qualified to be on this non-medically supervised daily set of biology-based actions and procedures?
I find it interesting (and this is the second place I’ve read this) that it was not factually Hubbard who came up with, but a medical person. Many of us remember, C of S written issues used to designate at the bottom “C of S, founded by L. Ron Hubbard.” At some point this transformed to “Source: L. Ron Hubbard.” Two quite different things. Nowadays, what is said: “You need to get on-Source” or similar. The 7-page Keeping Scientology Working issue at the beginning of each major course drills that in hard, including through clay demonstrations and trips to the Word Clearer.
Mike’s blog is filled with ongoing useful education.
Thanks again!
One fellow told me he had to do the purif 6 hours a day for 66 days! ALL sauna! He got so bored he brought in a dvd player and was watching old Sat. Night Live episodes. When his handler found out she was angry. She eventually relented that he could watch DVDs in the sauna but ONLY LRH DVDS!
I’m of course not sure, but for both Jack Dirmann and Steve Heard there are recent additions to completions at
https://www.truthaboutscientology.com/
Jack’s most recent one is from 2019.
In general, when you can’t find many links for a person who was in, that’s a good sign they’re still in or deceased.
I did the purif. soon after it came out.
I was very skeptical that doing this could restimulate past exposure to radiation.
Once I got into it I noticed that the Niacin flushes not only felt like sun burn but also formed patterns.
Most typically, I could see a swim suit pattern (where the flush appeared over my entire body except where a swim suit would have covered) and a tee-shirt pattern (where the flush covered my face and neck but then cut off in a straight line and covered the bottom part of my arms, cutting off just above the elbows.)
This was very convincing and I still do not have another explanation for what I saw.
Absolutely everyone was put onto the purif., regardless of their drug history.
Also on the purif with me was a guy who had once been a drug dealer. He claimed that he could feel the LSD restimulating and could even tell what batch it was.
Personally, my drugs history was very light and I did not experience anything like this.
Did experience something that felt like an alcohol hangover just one time.
I didn’t have any adverse reactions but no great gains from this actiion either. Hated the cal mag. The experience as a whole was interesting but not particularly helpful.
Its not suprising that you felt a alcohol type hangover on the purif, after all hangovers have many similar side effects to extensive sauna use. Dehydration, tiredness (which you would definetely get after hours in the sauna), possible headaches (from the dehydration), foggy brain, lethargy all from the tiredness are all very similar side effects to excessive alcohol use.
No mention of the effects of high doses of niacin and vitamins on top of spending 5 hours a day in a sauna.
I would have liked to see comments on high doses of niacin also. I believe I ended up on about 4-5000 mg on my final days in the sauna but I was in my mid 20s and without other body issues. fwiw… high niacin seems NG
https://www.mayoclinic.org/drugs-supplements-niacin/art-20364984
In around 2012 when I was still in Scn, a woman I knew was told she had to re-do her Purif. She had already done one Purif and now the CS was making her re-do it. That second time brought on allergic reactions in her which was horrible eczema. It was so itchy that she got infected from scratching it. It covered large areas of her body. So she went off the Purif to heal it and it got a little better but not much. The CS told her that what turned it on will turn it off and so she went back on the Purif and the eczema got worse It was so bad It was obvious to me that it was an allergic reaction to some vitamin on the Purif or of just sitting for five hours a day in steam heat or something to do with the Purif. I felt she was probably overrun on the Purif. But she was such a Kool Aid drinker that she never questioned any of it.
Heat on the skin, and its associated effects, can be a trigger for many with eczema.
I personally had bathing suit patterns show up while on my second purif and saw other people have the same thing happen.
I continue to enjoy exercise and saunas, but I have zero belief in anything hubbard.
An accurate full study that produced truth would be of benefit to many.
Very interesting. Though even if certain drugs were reduced by 35%, that would hardly rise to the level of the stated end phenomena of the rundown (which would be someone completely free of all drug residues as I recall it) and of course this EP is not determined by any blood test or other objective test, but a subjective feeling (as well as the niacin not “turning on” a reaction at the highest dose).
Then there is the issue of any possible dangerous side effects from the rundown itself. I did the purif twice with minimal results. I was CSing it at my org when it first came out. Most people seemed to have good subjective wins at the end, generally feeling more alive or clear headed, not sure how much of that was temporary placebo effect.