This, according to Ron, is not a threat or a curse…
Sure seems like it to me.
This is one of the huge traps of scientology. Hubbard constantly dangled the “research” and “next levels” as the reason to give your money and your life over to the cause. In this regard it is much like the doomsday cults (including the Jehovah’s Witnesses) who preach the soon to come Armageddon/end of the world that will consume everyone except the truly dedicated believers and committed practitioners of their particular brand of belief.
And of course Hubbard (and scientology) claim theirs is NOT a belief system but “practical knowledge based on science and research” and then they publish this sort of thing. They’re still waiting for these OT levels…
The “Doomsday” talk is sort of what happened on my cycle. The Captain Freewinds told my wife that I was going to die and that nobody (including Scn) could do anything fo me and then worked ( and nearly succeeded in ensuring my demise. He failed in the end; but not by much. My wife was afraid to go to the store as she thought I might be dead when she got back. As an aside, today is my birthday, 17 yrs after I was supposed to die. The cults stupidity towards its supporters alone will cause its demise.
The Captain Freewinds told a an engineer in his office “Straass would lay down his life for this ship”. This was true,, I never expected to leave the ship alive, even before I became ill. Now I am, I hope an SP worthy of the title even though I have never received my Cert.
Happy Birthday to you, Bill Strauss!
HAPPY BIRTHDAY, Bill Straass
It’s GOOD to survive such things, as traumatic as the process can be.
Personally, I’ve celebrated my 39th anniversary of being rejected by the cult as inadequate. Today, I’m FREE — and enjoying a well-earned retirement with no thought to statistics or production, other than the last trip to the Bathroom I did. It’s good to get rid of the toxins that way, and can be SUCH a relief.
Happy Birthday!
Keep going strong Bill & happy birthday !
Happy Birthday, Bill!
Wow! I am always gobsmacked and thetanically thumped by the Imbibers of the Kool-Aid who show up here from time to time and deign to interpret/explain Uncle Ronnie’s profound fuckery, er, wisdom, to this rag-tag assemblage of ” jokers and degraders” and clueless meat-sacks who comment…on a forum hosted by a full-blown, bearded,
Aussie Ess Pee, with a beard, no less…😎😂
For fuck’s sake, it’s 2019, and there’s a ton of accessible, documented evidence that dianetics and scientology, along with its e-meter and toxic, Orwellian-named “purification rundown “, are rubbish, are complete,toxic, intentional scams. Similarly, there is a huge trove of documented evidence of Uncle Ronnie’s criminality, racism, sexism,drug abuse,and stolen valor…among other ” colorful accomplishments ” of his.
Sigh…And the e-meter fiddling and fake-memory creation and niacin-poisoning continues…
Ok, so this has nothing to do with today’s post, and this is probably not true, but I wanted to get it from the horse’s mouth…so to speak. I just ran across a vid where Taryn Rinder is thanking a head honcho at a&e for doing the right thing and firing you, Mike. Your thoughts?
Please provide link for this video. That is of great interest to me. Of course it’s untrue, but the statement may be helpful for other things.
It’s on her instagram page. I’m not instagram-savvy, I just typed her name in and stumbled on this. It’s with her other videos. Hope this helps.
Thanks
Ron was such a pessimist, or paranoid scitso, that cowering in fear locked into his BlueBird parked in a corner of a property ‘way out, back and beyond, where no one could find him, was as close to the real world as he could confront. He couldn’t DO anything at the last but “regert” his many missteps. No family, no friends, no more fawning crowds hanging on his every utterance. HOW far below zero on his ‘tone scale’ WAS “hiding”? By his own measure, he was dead long by then.
This quote is the essence of cult evil:
The only way and..
Eternal damnation.
They all do it. This doctrine needs to be crushed and purged from religious and political ideologies.
I’m it’s name normal human beings become demons for the greatest good.
Brian,
The ones who fell for Ron’s lie paid a large price. Those of us who questioned him from the start paid a smaller price.
KFrancis – ‘’Uncorrupted Scientology = Delusional Nonsense ‘’
It is a doomsday cult. (titanium plates in the mountain bunkers)
Ron starts a Purification issue with this sentence
“I want Scientologists to survive World War 3”
Hubbard used the looming threat of World War to get people to sign up for services now now now
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
That quote is a perfect example of ‘Ron the Hypnotist’ at work.
Get their attention, have them focus on your words, throw in an element of truth, an element of fear, get their trust and agreement and then lay in the command – “You must do Scientology or else”.
And then LRH ends his statement telling you that this is a friendly advice, thus coating the lie with ‘love, affinity, care’ words that makes you believe it is true.
The magic of words can be in itself a trap.
I remember 1982 when Hubbard wrote the posted quotation. Scientology was very close to a collapse. When I was at Flag one weekend, I got no service. Auditing was very slow and sec-checking was just starting. Solo NOTs was so new Hubbard could get away with saying that he was researching into the OT levels. After the original Freewinds OT VIII and failures on solo NOTS, it became very clear that Hubbard was lying. Even today there are truncated versions of OT VIII and no signs of anything valid on the OT levels.
Miscavige pulled OT VIII and had people on OT VII for more than ten years. Still no OT’s. I think they finally gave up and just now ask for donations. The truth of Scientology is that it was a failed Satanic “religion”. It is a perverted cult. Scientology can buy downtown Clearwater and develop it along what ever lines they want. They are not going to get public acceptance. Best strategy is to put them into a “fish tank” environment. Buses driving around downtown Clearwater showing the fish to the tourist public.
Lancaster, Pennsylvania has a thriving tourist industry with many thousands of people visiting to watch the Amish ride in horse and buggy and see how they live and work without electricity and internal combustion engines. A guided bus tour of downtown Clearwater has profit potential.
When Hub says “research,” what he really means is “ludicrous fiction he pulled out of his rear end.” The Freezone is no different. They make up their crap as they go along, and insist that it’s based on research. In either case, it’s convoluted sci-fi that’s mostly incomprehensible. Not so much religion as it is zany improv theater.
I’m pretty much in agreement with what Ron is saying here.
Look at the behavior of the D’s vs the R’s in Washington as well as war and civil unrest in Syria, Iran, North Korea and Hong Kong -we’ve got big problems. Add into the equation the thirst that some of these players have for nuclear weapons and look out is all I can say.
I don’t think Ron is saying commit yourself and wealth to the the 3rd and 4th dynamics. I think he’s saying getting yourself up and through the The OT Levels is a 3rd and 4th dynamic contribution and the best chance we have. By getting through them you’re removing just that much crazy from the collective amount of crazy on this planet.
I can tell you I didn’t go through the OT Levels with the idea, “ Its all about me me me and what great glories can I accumulate to my precious self “. Instead you wake up to just how many beings have been insnared in purposely constructed traps and are in pain to this day. You are auditing for you and them.
Yes, you do accrue a lot of freedom and happiness to yourself but you’re doing a lot of freeing of others on these OT Levels as well. The beings are there, real and with personalities just like you and I.
You definitely are positively affecting others and dissolving the horror show that was constructed to crush us a long, long time ago. The structure is still there and running.
To my earlier point, just look around the planet and you see the destructive hidden influence of this manifesting socially nearly everywhere.
I personally do think we’ve had it if Scientology doesn’t make it and I don’t mean Dave’ s church, I mean real uncorrupted Scientology.
If we only had bows and arrows available to us I’d say we have some time. It’s the presence of so many nuclear weapons that paints a pretty frightening scenario.
whole lotta ray going on in your head KFrancis. Seek real help before you do anything else insane
I agree with you that Dave’s bullshit (aka. Golden age of tech/knowledge)
is bringing down Scientology but the primary issue on this blog is that even Ron’s tech wasn’t even free, at times not even cheap. Also the area of abuses that have happened to those who availed themselves of this tech. I feel that, while many on this blog would agree with your general assessment they would state that there are far more effective means to improve the world other than by Scientology.
Even if the world is going to hell in a handbasket, investing your life and money in his teachings is absurd. He made Scientology up off the top of his head. There is no ‘research’. What little might be of any value in Scientology can also be found in any bookstore’s self-help bargain bin.
There’s no ‘clearing’ of anything. Your body does not have thousands of evil spirits attached to it. None of what he said about the universe could possibly be true. Ron’s b-movie cosmology is a joke.
It’s time to let it go. It’s a scam and you’ve been deceived. Don’t waste the rest of your life.
KFrancis bequeathed us with:
“I personally do think we’ve had it if Scientology doesn’t make it and I don’t mean Dave’ s church, I mean real uncorrupted Scientology.”
So speaks a true believer, still a scientologist despite all the evidence against ANY of it being true, or being able to help anyone long-term.
As IF scientology wasn’t corrupted at its source — never intended to do anything but create Ron a cadre of loyal slaves.
And the tooth fairy will put quarters under my pillow. It’s true it’s true!
Now Brian, dragging the Tooth Fairy into it is crossing a red line.
Say LRH was a crook if you must, but I have personally known the tooth fairy since before teeth existed. (Joke, and not very good one).
You are absolutely right to be concerned about the proliferation of nuclear weapons and the threat that they pose to the future of the planet but any person who thinks for a moment that the Cult of $cientology can lessen that threat or make a single positive contribution to mankind is one heavily deluded individual.
You’re an indie, and we’re not really buying the subject. We’ve rejected both the organization and the subject.
It may upset you to hear that I consider myself to be a body, ephemeral and mortal. I no longer buy the spirit theory.
You are absolutely right to express concern that the proliferation of nuclear weapons threatens the the future of the planet but any person who thinks for a moment that the Cult of $cientology can lessen that threat or make a single positive contribution to mankind is one heavily deluded individual.
I’m working hard to see where you are comming from.
I was a scientologist 40 years. I really thought well of Ron and backed up his research by being his ginny on the Sweatout, Int r/d and thousands of hours of counseling by the most highly trained and compassionate lrh trained auditors.
In the long shot …. 15 years after my last counseling…
Thank you for your thoughts.
I’m different from you now (took need of change).
My life is mine. I’m my best friend. You go on with your life, I’ll go on with mine.
#1 lie: there is no reactive bank
#2 lie: lrh is NOT my best friend, I am 😘
What does it mean, please: “by being his ginny on the Sweatout [and] Int r/d?”
Snake, I think Cece means guinea pig …
WHEEEE…
The crazy go-round goes around and around.
I’m sorry, but it’s really difficult to understand how someone who has left the cult of $cientology still believes in Hubbard’s craziness.
Everyone has the right to believe what they want. But Hubbard was a conman. A compulsive liar. An abuser. A narcissist asshole. A bigamist. A chauvinistic pig. Basically… a disgusting human being. Given all that, how can you put any stock in the “tech” or still believe anything he said/wrote/etc…?
I’m not trying to be disrespectful. Just trying to understand.
It sometimes takes a while to untangle youself from the matrix when you’ve been in for a while.
It’s a process
Katherine, it is possible to believe in the philosophy upon which a religion is based, and reject the morals and ethics and practices of the organization itself.
Examples as follows:
* Millions of people are members of the Church of England, founded by Henry VIII because he wanted to dump his wife Catherine of Aragon because she was by that time middle-aged and had been unable to give him a legal son and heir. He was besotted with Ann Boleyn and sure that she could give him sons so he wanted his affair with her legitimatized. Long story short, the Pope at that time refused to annul his marriage to Catherine so he dumped the Church of Rome and made himself the head of his own church and mandated that the Anglican Church would henceforth be the official Church of England. Then he married Ann Boleyn and she of course did not give him a son and he had her beheaded on a trumped up accusation of adultery with a lot of men including her own brother, so he could marry his 3rd wife, I forget her name. He went on to marry 3 more wives , another of which he beheaded. He also put many of his former friends and loyal subjects to death. Not a nice guy, one could say. Yet he is the FOUNDER of the Church of England and millions of people over the globe adhere to this faith – it can be assumed NOT because they approve of its Founder.
* I know a number of Roman Catholics who are quite devout and at the same time HORRIFIED at the former activities of the the Church of Rome, i.e., the bloody Crusades, the Inquisition, the persecution of the Moors in Spain, the viciousness and selfishness of some of the former Popes (like the Borgias)…they most do NOT approve of ANY of this behavior that is part of the bloody history of the RC Church and at the same time find great strength and comfort in their Roman Catholic faith, its principles, ceremonies and rituals, etc.
Those are just off the top of my head.
I would just add that if not Scientology then some other influence is going to have to intervene on Earths behalf. Some outside influence we didn’t see coming. We are simply acting too suicidal from one end of the planet to the other to be viable at the rate we’re going.
I’m not counting on us to be able to show restraint with super nuclear weapons because historical we haven’t been able to. Historically whenever a new weapon arrives eventually somebody gets around to using it.
The fixation on war and slaughter here is breathtaking and just goes on and on over centuries. Something is driving this. It is being driven in on this planet. The unbelievably long history of it is the evidence.
I take what Ron said here as friendly advise and fair warning if we aren’t able to change our course and save ourselves from ourselves.
Save yourself, saving the world is delusional.
“Save yourself, saving the world is delusional.”
Excellent slogan!
Or perhaps it is better to call this some other word instead of “slogan”. Maybe “advice” or “motto”?
But this is a most excellent counter to a cult that tries to tell people they will save the world. When I hear that, I figure the real thing being saved is money – in the glorious leader’s bank account.
“I would just add that if not Scientology then some other influence is going to have to intervene on Earths behalf.”
I’m sorry KFrancis but you are as crazy as Hubtard was. NEVER in recorded history has there been less warfare on earth than today. This measured as % of people on earth dying as a result of warfare.
So, what EMPIRICAL data the CONTRADICTS the above fact do you base your blathering on?
KFrancis, if what you say about OTs is true then why do they tend to die so early?
“Cause over mest”? Why do so many of them get cancer? If someone can’t be cause over one’s first dynamic how can one be cause over the 3rd or 4th dynamic or beyond? Possibly being unhealthy with wasting illnesses and dying prematurely are not “considerations” for them? Or being obese, or broke? These are not “considerations”? If, by going OT, they have removed abberration from the 3rd and 4th Dynamics why didn’t they remove it from themselves? Btw, I read your success story a few days ago and appreciate what you’ve shared as your wins. I’m interested in your replies to these questions if you are so inclined.
I don’t know really. Some may have died as a result of too long on OT 7- roughing the case up. Excalibur is the answer to getting it done, that’s what I did. I steered around solo Nots as delivered by the church. Excalibur was AWESOME !
Some just plain don’t care of themselves just like anyone else I guess.
Some may be caring a genetic line that is not ideal right from birth.
It’s not enough to be OT 8 there are still traps and case above that. The rabbit hole apparently runs deeper than first thought.
Cause over MEST is misunderstood I think. I can’t move anything with a thought or fix anything by waving my hand at it. I’m just not there. I am able to be cause over the MEST that exists on my case and in the mind and handle in session. What you’re taking about is a much higher harmonic I think.
There are OT Levels that do address the body on CBR’s Bridge. What is referred to as “ the body .Org. “ has its own set of handlings.
Maybe there wouldn’t be so many problems if we did these levels in our 20’s instead of middle age or older…🤷🏼♂️ That’s all I’ve got.
LMAO! What a f’ing psycho. The rabbit dug right through your skull KFrancis
Wow! An F’ing psycho! 😧
Couldn’t you have tapped the brakes a little and just stopped at
psycho? 😅
no, when a person has been exposed to the truth about scammology and hubtard as long as you have is still spouting its garbage a 4×4 upside the head tends to works better since there is nothing inside to damage….
Thanks for your candid replies, Kfrancis.
“Some plain don’t care of themselves as anyone else, I guess.”
So someone not taking care of themselves physically, for whatever reasons, would be an ETHICS matter, not a case matter. In other words, OT8s can eat, drink and smoke themselves sick just like anyone else can.
Basically, what I understand you to be saying, Kfrancis, is that, barring illnesses to which some bodies are genetically pre-disposed, many body illnesses occur due to neglect; of lack of basic attention and care.
This is something I’ve observed.
But then, if one spends hundreds of thousands of dollars to go spiritually free and STILL can’t exert basic will power over one’s own body, what the hell good is it?
If, as Scientology unequivocally states, the body is the vehicle we’re using to get around, and what we’re putting out there to communicate with and be communicated to, why wouldn’t an OT8 have already had this cognition?
Who wants to be spiritually free and physically sick and in pain?
What IS the point of having a body if one can’t enjoy life with it?
And what good is being OT8 if one’s will power stays on the level of a hypoglycemic 5 year old who can’t stop himself from eating an entire box of Mallomars in one sitting?
Plenty of people who’ve never heard of Scientology have their ethics in with regard to their physical health. I also know a number of fervent Koolaid drinkers who practice good discipline as regards nutrition.
I also know plenty of non-Scientologists with no self discipline and/or common sense and boy oh boy did I know quite a few seriously sick OTs. A good friend of mine, UTR, recently told me that an OT8 in her org just had a triple bipass! His OT levels didn’t seem to help him, his 45 years in Scientology didn’t seem to matter much when it came to clogging up his own arteries.
Seems to me that whether someone’s OT8 or not, common sense is common sense and self discipline is self discipline.
Forget the OT Levels, one either has the former and applies the latter to to one’s bodily health or one does not.
No such thing. Poor solo-auditing, questionable C/Sing is the outpoint if it roughs you up. You run it until there’s nothing left to run. All very simple.
One other thing. Many of these were essentially under suppression you forced Sec. Checking , expensive trips to Flag, invalidation by telling them they weren’t Clear etc…
They killed them by killing the dream of getting to an honest OT state.
Well, I agree to a degree. Certainly the suppression and invalidation they experienced contributed to their stress which in turn contributed to their ill health.
But it didn’t “kill” them. No, they KILLED themselves – for whatever reasons – with poor nutrition and neglect of their own bodies.
Don’t forget smoking too. While just about every thinking and semi aware person I know has quit smoking, not these koolaid drinkers! Many of them are still self polluting with nicotine, which, by the way, is NOT a “drug”, but a POISON which happens to have narcotic properties. That’s right, poison. That IS its scientific classification. Look it up if you don’t believe me.
I got through the Nots band after age 60 without any real illness or body difficulty. I’m currently on L-10 and in great health. Others I know who did Excalibur all reported great results and got through without delays and troubles.
I think the key to a smooth run through the NOTs band is to get it done away from the church.
@Kfrancis again:
Totally agreed on the wisdom of not getting ANY auditing from Co$! Xenu forbid! Seriously, I’m not being funny.
As to your physical health, etc, very well done!
I suspect though, that in your life you mostly haven’t abused your 1st dynamic, that instead you’ve taken basic care of your body by not smoking and/or quitting if you once did, and throughout your life having mostly applied sound nutrition and moderate exercise, etc. Maintaining good health would also include your ability to recognize when or if you were in in a toxic emotional or mental environment or relationship, because any of that can make a person physically sick also! A key cognition on the OT Levels, I would think – if not way sooner!
All of the above are assumptions on my part with regard to you, Kfrancis; feel free to correct me if I’m wrong on any of them.
Your posts show you are fixated on BODIES. (Protecting Bodies)
look everyone, foolproof has created a new sockpuppet
Look son, another retard.
I’m glad you are enjoying auditing KFrancis. I’m glad you are learning.
Excalibur is not only squirrel, it’s totally nuts.
Yes, true, it’s part of the overall picture.
General comment to no one in particular. FULL RESOLUTION OF “CASE” is ALWAYS on the NEXT LEVEL.
Translation: “You will die in eternal torment unless you give us all of your money and all of your time”. I hope he’s wrong.
John I’m sorry but that’s a poor translation. Ron was about getting you into the course room or in front of an auditor. I think he would be beside himself with the draining of public of money for beautiful buildings, Super Power Cathedrals and leather bound books.
It’s just typical of this planet for almost anything useful in any field to eventually be abused and used to strip people of their wealth. Opioids for example probably do have a useful place in medicine but just look what has happened- obscene misuse and exploitation.
No, he wouldn’t, he would have had a pool full of cash that he could do a Scrooge McDuck in every day. Tubb O’Lard was always about the MONEY and nothing much else (apart from creating headache inducing, eye straining, and mind deadening bottom rung pulp style bullshit).
Hope you wake up in time to live out your life without living in a lie built by a criminal. Not because I know you, but only because your money spent perpetuates this scam. I’m looking out for the other people this will damage.
No it doesn’t. KFrancis is an Indie.
KFRANCIS Hubtard was about amassing as much wealth as possible. Not about auditing or training. If you knew how he set up management you’d know that but you don’t so remain clueless
There is an opioid epidemic but how about these now opioid addicted people applying the solution they approved for others back in the 80’s, other people and groups who were addicted to other substances? It was such a simple solution, too! “Just Say No!”. Remember Mrs. Reagan coming out with that one? And so heartily approved of by those not addicted. Yes, just say no! Who would have thought that that was ALL the addicted ones had to do, this WAS the solution for such situations, just do it, just say no! Nancy fixed that problem a long time ago, didn’t she? Why isn’t it being applied now?
If the opioids we have today had been around while Lub O’tard was alive he would been bombed to the eyeballs daily and thoroughly addicted to them.
Not much of a stretch to say that! He admittedly had no problem with amphetamines!
aqua, you have a HUGE misunderstanding. the just say no campaign wasn’t for addicts. It was for kids when approached to try drugs.
He was such an idiot (Hubtard) that he was wholly incapable of maintaining internal consistency in the mythology he created.
Hubtard datum: You are an immortal all powerful spirit who cannot be harmed..
Hubtard datum: You as an immortal all powerful spirit who cannot be harmed have “had it” if you don’t pay money and do what I say.
I am SO glad that I really do have a high IQ so was able to see his lies early on.
The way I interpreted it was this: we are immortal spiritual beings, so we can’t be killed. However, we are aberrated, and are stuck in a body cycle and are unaware of this. So if we don’t get out of the trap with Scientology, we won’t escape the cycle, and that’s our entrapment. He’s saying we’re gods, but unaware of it. These two ideas can work together.
This idea is basically Satanic. If you carefully read classical definitions of Satan, you will see it clearly. Hubbard omitted love and friendship, but used the deceptive powers of Satan – mythical or otherwise – to fool people.
George, there’s no such entity as Satan.
Not true. Satan in classical definitions was defined as a deranged mind.
Oh, I see. Ok, I haven’t read those definitions but that makes sense. ” Satan” = “A deranged mind.”. So in classical definitions its just a catch-all word for mental illness
In my own defense, George, I was referring to, and denying the existence of the mythical Satan, that creature depicted throughout the ages in art and elsewhere as having horns and a tail – you know, Rosemary’s Baby Satan, the Exorcist Satan, endless examples in ancient art of an actual BEING or creature, etc.
You are correct in the sense that the Western Satan depicted in art does not exist as a “being”. The Middle Ages wanted to control people so they invented this beast to scare them.
Milton’s Paradise Lost is actually an Occult poem based on classical definitions. While he does not outright come out and say deranged mind, one reaches that conclusion after multiple reads. The key to classical definitions is the idea of pride and this is what leads to Satan’s decline. But the point is that anyone can have pride and this, in a classical sense, is the start of the deranged mind. Milton describes beings with OT powers who have earned their power by being pure. The Greeks and Romans had the same idea, but most of their gods had incomplete OT powers because they were flawed in some sense.
In classical Buddhism, Mara is sort of the equivalent of Satan but is defined differently. Mara is not a permanent being like Satan, but represents the deranged mind which could posses anyone. The most deranged mind of the day is Mara and it changes constantly.
Show me a link to these supposed “Classical Definitions”.
Satan is a Hebrew term meaning “accuser” or “adversary”.
http://www.dartmouth.edu/~milton/reading_room/pl/book_1/text.shtml
You can also check Mark Twain. He wrote a book on Satan. First chapter
depicts Hubbard.
Check authors in the Middle Ages.
Formost idiot, those quotes are from classical works that may or may not be online..
YOU being too stupid/lazy/incompetent/uneducated doesn’t mean another has to do your work.
Invented definition. The Wynski retard just as dumb.
Then you haen’t read much of Hubtard Imaberrated.. He stated he overcame this without scamology and told people to not ask how he did it so that contradicts what you just wrote
That comment made me come across as a bit of an indie, I’m afraid. I spent two thirds of my life in the cult. I thoroughly reject both organization and subject.
Let’s see if I can get this thought out:
1. Hubbard says we’re spirits, and by definition, we can’t be destroyed.
2. The urgency in clearing the planet is that there is a technology, in physical form (books, e-meters, etc.) that needs to be applied to a spirit in a body, and it could be destroyed before the spirit is freed. If that happened, the spirit could not become de-aberrated.
Of course he was doing all this for money. The logic above is what got me stuck working in the cult.
I hope that’s clearer.
Paraphrase of LRH:
“We will not speculate at this time as to how I rose above the bank.”
Well, I agree!
No speculating about such a momentous feat should EVER be done!
Instead, TELL us, Ron! TELL us how you did it!
Bingo Aqua!
I attended the NY org hoping to find something to make me feel better about life. When I saw the push for my money, I bailed out and it wasn’t easy! High pressure. I feel that I narrowly escaped before I got in too deep.
How long or short is ‘early’?
Only 5 years totally (mostly) out, I do feel ‘early’.
So much to learn… so much to know.
Thx everyone for keeping us in the loop. 😘😘😘
Hardly friendly advice from Hubbard.
It contradicts his 8-80 or 8-8008 book passage which says that the thetan is indestructible.
In that 1950s passage he says why the thetan even worries about the long range future is misplaced worry.
Hubbard just is so no tworth reading in full, but if anyone does read him in full, they inevitably trip over his continual swings back and forth contradicting.
Mike, I think someone has to do a paper in depth about Hubbard’s in detail final state of mind.
Because at the end, he told Sarge, and I think Ray Mithoff too, that Hubbard planned to go do the “OT Running Program” in effect, circle a distant star for rehab as an OT.
He told Sarge he wasn’t coming back.
I think really there is a bit more digging into the understanding of the final group of in the know people who had chance to talk to Sarge and Annie and Pat, and really piece together what Hubbard really thought about coming back or not.
I gather Hubbard really wasn’t planning to come back.
Hubbard’s final state of mind and statements of intent, ought to be put into a nicely researched piece of credible work, interviewing widely all the people who heard the real details of Hubbard’s final state of mind, and what Hubbard told Ray Mithoff, in detail.
Hubbard was Scientology, and thus his final thoughts and intent, would be crucial to get his final thoughts back into the minds of the movement members, since they are not in the know at all about his final state of mind and intent.
Thanks for the comment, Chuck. I am in the process of renouncing my faith and membership in Mormonism due to things I’m finding out about its history that don’t add up and were kept hidden by the church authorities. In my opinion, Mormonism was the 19th century Scientology and Joseph Smith was a precursor to L. Ron Hubbard.
Yea. Once it became about what I could do for, contribute to, donate to, do ethics conditions for, subject my mind to abusive sec checks for the church of scientology – oops – I mean “the third and fourth dynamics,” I was outta there and you who are still in it should do the same before you end up losing those things (like your own mind and good senses) and loved ones most precious to you.
Oh Mary, you sure are the voice of reason and, sadly, experience. What is it going to take for those still in to have their moment of clarity? I have to think that there are many who realize it, but are afraid to make the break. What a wicked trap they are in.
Peggy,
You didn’t ask me this, you asked Mary, but I’ll share with you my answer.
What will it take for them?
It will take what it took for us.
We left.
So can they.
What did it take for us?
Anything we saw, they see.
Anything we heard, they hear.
Anything we realized, they can realize.
Anything we decided, they can decide.
We left.
They can too.
I appreciate your answer Aquamarine. What you said does answer a lot of what I wonder about. It just seemed that those in had to, at the very least, had to see the contradiction in what they are told and what they see with their own eyes. The contradiction in what they were told the goals were, and see that these goals were not happening despite all the hundreds of hours they work, all the money they have invested, all the sacrifices, are just not happening.
As for those on the outside, it has to be that they just don’t want to look too closely.
Thank you. 🙂
You’re welcome. I believe this STRONGLY. There’s no way that they don’t see what we saw. The contradictions. The disparity between what they are told and what IS. They see it, just as we saw it. Possibly more because there’s more evidence out there now. They see PLENTY. We underestimate them by assuming they don’t see ANY thing that we saw. But just like there was with each of us, with each of the Still Ins, there is a tipping point. How MUCH do they have to see before deciding to leave? I know what it took for ME. What it took for me might not be what it took for you. You might have experienced your Tipping Point MUCH faster than I did. So just as each of us who left reached our individual Tipping Point and said, “So long, I’m outta here”, so it is with each individual who is Still In. How much can they block out? How much can they explain away or justify? How much can they studiously ignore and still live with themselves? When is enough, enough? It depends. But, just as we were, THEY are each capable of deciding to leave. There’s NO difference between THEM and US when it comes to the ABILITY to make this decision! Now whether they’re READY or WILLING is a different story, but that was how it was for us, too, back in the day.