Right now, CLO New York does not have a staff auditor/minister, either does N.Y. Org or Long Island Org. How friggin bad is it when the Church of Scientology does not even have auditors / minsters for their own people? There are no ministerial services available to the people working in this city for the Church of Scientology! Auditing and training are part of their supposed EXCHANGE for being on staff!!!!!!
Hark! Did I just the “E” word David? My apologies.
A group that abandons family and friends on command and offloads people who have been loyal workers for decades once they get ill, is an extremely sick and perverted group. A great value of this site is to warn and educate people so that they do not get involved with this loathsome “church” in the first place. Those who stay in are truly gone mentally and spiritually.
Thanks for this newest edition of spot on satire, Regraded. Again, I didn’t, couldn’t laugh. The hypocrisy you have highlighted here, the pretense of caring and help when in fact there is no caring, no help, unless money is involved – its sad, tragic. I know someone who was fitness-boarded from the SO at 68 because of health issues. This person’s entire adult life was devoted to Scientology and its aims – about 35 years of service. A true social personality simply kicked to the curb because of inconvenient health issues. Just heartless.
God RB – it is spooky…like you have some super powers to exactly duplicate what really happens in Scientology. The sad thing is – the “group think” convinces us to put up with it for years. Most people leave because they hit a tipping point (that is if they have any rational mind that has not been audited out).
Hi Regraded Being, I can tell you, I really needed your post tonight. A mixture of what you posted and the realization that the Internet is not always kind. Not you RB never you.Thank you always, Ann.
I found myself laughing at the cartoons probably more with relief that such did not happen to me. They’re good fun but as many other commenters say here the truth is also not so funny for these people discarded and treated like dirt. Now, this is just another manifestation of the infestation that has taken over the Church. When I was on staff I don’t think the majority of the staff treated their fellows in this way, far from it. But the place (the Scientology network that is) was finally taken over by people with such cruel mentalities and attitudes. When I say finally taken over there were many instances of this hard-nosed cruel attitude before 1981 but it was not endemic – as it is now, I believe. It was capable of being corrected. I know this personally as I was chairman of many Review Comm Evs that undeclared people that had been falsely and maliciously declared.Now I don’t believe it is capable of being corrected – not without removing the gang that has taken over the show. Shame really because most Scientologists I know are very decent people. But then I don’t know any now still left in. The most apt reference is HCOB 2 August 1969R LX Lists which states “…critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant or contemptuous personalities are always out of valence.” Is it not amazing that the management ethos of the Church seems to be operating exactly in this manner and yet no one inside the Organization questions such, overtly anyway, or leaves it? They even support it by donating funds to it! Those remaining in this monstrosity that now passes for “Scientology” are seemingly all “out of valence” now.
Very astute analysis Foolproof
There used to be islands of sanity created by some caring, sane individuals throughout Scientology, particularly before 1981. These individuals and their islands are gone today. Replaced by Miscavige’s cold chrome steel CULTure. By comparison, Folsom prison is a vacation hotel for these 2nd gen and Russian & Eastern European RPFers that populate Flag today. I drive by Flag every day to and from my work… no smiles. No laughter. Very, very serious people dressed in bellboy uniforms. They are observably miserable sods, that’s for sure.
Yes that phrase “cold chrome steel” indicates just one thing does it not – total and utter psychosis. imagine having a session with a “cold chrome steel” auditor? LRH states “seriousness = mass”. God help us!
Secondly with this ridiculous and vicious cold chrome steel thing, anyone with even a modicum of sanity and training knows that it is based on evil purposes and some sort of whole track dictator valence – in theory the complete opposite of what Scientology should be trying to clear up. Yes we have all heard that some people like to be led by “strong dominant personalities” and all that sort of bunk but we are talking about Scientologists. And thus we see the results of treating decent people like dogs – the Orgs are empty. Was that the purpose? You would have to say “yes”!
“critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant or contemptuous personalities are always out of valence” but it is the only valence one can have and survive…except when the staff put on the fake 1.1 ARC valence to get you to give money so their stats can go up. Soon as the money hits the account – it is back to critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant and contemptuous valence….and then back to fake ARC for more stats.
I like the title of a book and movie – Scientology – The $tat Driven Life
Good People: Pleasure, and there is still hope that the monstrosity can be tamed and behave decently. All they had to was deliver auditing and training – shouldn’t have been that hard! You know I think their crashing misunderstood is on the word “tough” – they seem to think that Scientology should be like the US Marines with drill sergeants barking orders and ordering press-ups and running around screaming pretending they are producing etc. What Hubbard really meant by “tough” was staff being determined that people got good gains from their auditing and knew and applied their materials in training. Not shouting at people or insisting on virtual pain of spiritual death if they “did not donate the expected amount”. If they had done that there would have been no need for all the shouting and screaming. Look at their stats for the last 35 years – long term (very) down-trending and empty Orgs and Academies.
“…critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant or contemptuous personalities are always out of valence.”
That sounds like an attitude or a ser fac. Just like saying all homosexuals are 1.1.. It also sounds critical. Maybe even snide. Maybe even arrogant and contemptuous.
“C for Mark Chambers, the KTL supe at Stevens Creek, who started having bad health problems, ended up in a wheelchair, probably after a double amputation as his circulation was horrible from years of smoking and just bad health habits–perhaps diabetes. He kept on as a staff member, but the ED got him offloaded as the idea of a ‘cripple DB’ in the org on staff was completely out-PR to her. She was pretty brutal about that sort of thing and had made sarcastic comments about fixing the org’s elevator, because only downstats would need it–and that was not worth putting money into. He died after he was kicked off of staff. To make matters worse a few years prior to this, his wife really went off the deep end mentally. Many suicide watches and handlings with the DSA, and last I heard she was still in terrible shape. She also had been a staff member for years.”
From the “They Should Not Have Died” Website
I was friends with Mark back in the 70’s. He was smart but kind of quiet. He lived and breathed $cientology.
The way they cut him loose was so cruel as to be even worse than Regraded Beings example.
Chaplain and ministerial services. Try to get one, even a volunteer minister to come to your hospital or home and give assists. Assists that are ordered by the C/S. Forget it. No one will come and if you are like one victim I’ve seen you will simply be left to die there. Fucking despicable! So, as usual, and as Mike can confirm, the hyperbole the cult spreads across its own website and vomits to the media is a complete lie which is offered purely to position itself as a worthwhile and contributing function in the world. But the truth is completely opposite and sadly the fraud only comes to light when experienced in the daylight of fact and real world events.
At this point, Dear, it’s time to address my participation in Writers of the Future. I still find it fascinating I was escorted off post and out of Author Services shortly after your memorial service in November 2004. Truth be told, that shows how much common sense and compassion was present when LRH’s doctor’s widow, and a dedicated worker for twelve-years was treated that way.
Shortly after I was escorted out of Author Services, I was contacted by an International Association of Scientologists registrar. Yes, he’d lost his brother and he felt the IAS was the best way to make earth a better place. The registrar asked if I’d seen the Tom Cruise commemorative video. When I replied, “Yes,” he asked me, “Don’t you want to be like Tom Cruise?” I said, “No, not really.” The registrar wanted me to take out a home equity loan on our house and donate it to the IAS because “COB has a really big problem.” The registrar also wanted use of the Denk name so he could get others to do the same using your name as an example.
I remember thinking at the time of this conversation, “Boy, it’s a good thing I’m not on post at ASI, as this would flap sky high.” And, therein lays the reason for the tactic. I was off post and out of ASI so I would donate to the IAS to help solve COB’s “really big problem” and thereby regain favor in the eyes of the powers that be. This is crazy shit and I can see you shaking your head in disbelief right about now.
These days we have a term, “thrown under the bus.” It means to sacrifice another person (often a friend or ally), who is usually not deserving of such treatment, out of malice or for personal gain or self-protection. That’s exactly what was done to me. Rest assured, Dear, I got pretty clever from that point on. The trick is not agreeing with the crazy stuff, but simply out-creating it. I learned this from you, so thanks!
As it turns out, within a short time I was told a “mistake had been made” and I should keep working at Author Services on the WOTF Contest. There was a new head of the activity named Ria. For a while I could only be in the office when she was there. Funny stuff was going on, like I was considered a security risk.
Early on after my return, I did have an opportunity to tell Hugh Wilhere I would work for a year and then I’d be moving along. He had been in charge before all this stuff took place. He was a good one to tell. I didn’t talk to Evie, the HAS, much, if at all, as she seemed upset by your passing and didn’t attend your memorial service.
Judy, the part time contest administrator, was around but she was doing medical stuff. It was good she stayed in the loop as she was to be my replacement. She and Ria seemed to get along great. I could and did cut my hours to three days a week. I also worked three days a week with Jim at his electronics business and took Sundays off.
Within the WOTF office, I felt disoriented by all the changes. Judy would come and go depending upon her medical treatments and kids. Ria would work on things like changing the rules of the contests, new copy for public relations purposes, raising the Grand Prize amounts from $4000 to $5000, the addition of new judges, new trophies, etc. It appears the predominant viewpoint was that I was “holding things down” and, with your departure, it was time get rid of me so expansion could occur.
I have since found out that around this same time, December 2004, there were church executives in the lobby of ASI, one floor down. There were daily haranguing meetings by COB and executives were even beaten there. It looks like “expansion” was being sought in far more abusive ways than simply getting rid of the widowed contest administrator.
As we worked along through my final year, I turned over everything by showing the girls how it was done and then not doing it anymore. I no longer worried about staying on top of tasks because Ria was the new head of the activity and Judy had “already done it before,” her words. I slowly and smoothly withdrew, cleaning out files along the way. As my next trip to Florida neared, I started reminding folks that I would be leaving the activity … only to find Hugh Wilhere had never informed anyone of my plan.
There seemed to be some sort of an upset over all this but I had made my plans clear to Hugh and, thus, held firm. The HAS, Evie, spoke to me with Judy in the office; either she was afraid of me or thought Judy was my opinion leader. Both options are very funny to me. Evie said stuff like, “You are WOTF,” and “COB knows where you are.” I shrugged these off as unimportant. She then offered me more money to stay, saying “LRH would pay you.” False, absolutely totally completely false! I was done … and gone.
TWD….if I may ask…..why would regging you while you were on staff at ASI cause a flap?
I am also glad you did not mortgage your house (let’s see Tom Cruise make that kind of commitment) and are out and truly free.
@ Chee Chalker. I (underlined) would have flapped. I would have stated openly on ASI lines: “You allow the IAS to come to me for money when I’ve recently been widowed and am coming off $50,000 in medical bills? You allow the IAS to reg me when I’m intimately tied into the Shaw Health Center/Optimum Wellness businesses? You allow the IAS to treat me as easy prey as I am now a widow and the reg thinks I need to be like Tom Cruise by donating to the IAS? Do you think I would even consider the IAS’ use of Dr Denk’s name under these conditions? How dare you allow the IAS reg to intimate I should take out a home equity loan so the IAS can use Dr Denk’s name to influence others? (etc … etc … etc). This is not how we handle a loss. Get on your ministerial hat!” I could go on but I believe that’s enough of a rant and answers your question.
Thanks TWD…..I see what you meant.
I’ve always.been curious as to why the Tiny Terror seems to go out of his way to alienate dedicated staff. It’s almost as if he can’t help himself. It’s either complete paranoia or he needs to see how far he can test loyalty.
That’s quite the timeline of truth, thanks for sharing and your resolute actions.
“COB has a really big problem” = indeed he has and his friend TC is neck deep with him.
Thank you Wifow Denk for exposing your treatment by the greedy church after the loss of your husband. It was a regging opportunity to them, not an actual person who suffered a loss.
So a widow should be used to solve COB’s “big problem.” How about COB grows up and solves his own problems and leaves widows alone?’!
I’m happy you never wanted to be like Tom Cruise, didn’t take an equity line on your home, and eventually left your post. I hope you have peace in your life that you deserve to have.
Regraded Being, you hit the nail on the head again as usual. Probably the old salt SO guy looks like a caricature to some, and his recommended “handling” (crawl in a hole and die, you useless #$#$#!!!) probably seems an extreme exaggeration. Believe me, it is not. That is the “retirement program” of the Sea Org, work until you drop and then pick up another body and work some more. Rinse and repeat for one billion years.
When I was in PAC routing out in 2004 there was an old salt in the dorm where I was for awhile in Big Blue. The story we heard was that he was in the Navy with Ron. Don’t know if that was true, but certainly he was very ill. Keeping us up late hacking and coughing. Possibly mesothelioma, possibly just from the smoking habit that he kept up to the end.
Apparently he had a daughter, also in the Sea Org.
The story we were told was that on his daughter’s birthday he went to get her a cake, and on the way back with the cake he fell down and died in the streets. No surprise there, with his cough and his inability to get around we were expecting him to drop his body anytime.
No idea if he was getting medical treatment or not, but certainly he was not in a hospital or nursing home. He was right there in the normal Sea Org dorm with the rest of us. Six flights up and a broken elevator.
That is the true inner face of the “Minister of Scientology”, you said it well Regraded Being. I have done the Minister’s Course (It took me two weekends at the San Francisco Org in ’75 or so). The “Minister” part is just the outward facing facade, to give a semblance of religious tradition. To trade on the public’s built-in expectations of what a religion means and what it does.
The “of Scientology” part is the part that counts, where meaningless gestures like human decency, regard for the suffering of another, the milk of human kindness, are considered to be “human emotion and reaction”. In Hubbardese: HE&R. To be avoided and viewed with contempt while the greater cause trumps all. It is common to hear an executive squelch the objections of a sobbing staff member with the words “Cut the HE&R! You’re in the SO!”
The “Minister of Scientology” is supposed to be super-human, above all that, a Nietzschian uber-mensch. In reality, by discarding his humanity he only achieves the sub-humanity of the vicious zealot.
I recently visited an AO. I saw some of my old SO work mates from the Apollo. My, how those old-timers that are still in, have aged so badly. After 30 years of being out of that crap, I have played tennis weekly, golfed, started a normal, “wog” company, drank and ate as much and as often as I wanted to and lived a normal life. No real bosses (except for my wife…)! Other than having to physically be at the AO, I was happy and healthy. My old work mates, weren’t either.
I felt sorry for the strain these old time SO members have taken. And that strain wore badly on them. Constant harassment, poor food, lack of proper exercise, few days off to relax doesn’t equate to a healthy senior citizen.
Bruce and RB are so right. I feel these old guys will not be well cared for and be encouraged to “find another body” once they are not producing to the desired levels of the SO.
For them to leave is nearly impossible. Working for a cult, on the Apollo with a nut-job at the helm doesn’t make a potential employer jump over their desk with an employment contract. And as Bruce said, Social Security will not even be their for them.
The next 10-15 years will see a whole generation of Sea Org members expire. They joined in 1970 to 75 at 20-25 years of age and now they are 65 to 70+ years old. They can’t go anywhere. No social security. So, they will drop dead in the streets or in small hotel rooms with cancer with little/no medical care (I know one doing this now). Miscavige hated this generation of Sea Org (his father was one of them) and he has done everything he can to get rid of them. Now “old age” will clean up the stragglers for him. Good ol’ DLHDM David Let Him Die Miscavige.
I always think that the Regraded Being strips are based on real, actual people and situations. In the past there was a strip where a woman tries to talk to her dad, who runs away, which turned out to be a real story, and the woman involved posted here. Another strip featured a child in the Sea Org, based on Jenna Miscavige Hill. These strips hit to the bone; they are too real to be entirely made-up.
So it is very sad that the first man was told to divorce his spouse of many years, the second man was lied to and money taken for nothing, and last man is now cast away, literally, from the only job he’s ever had, old, ill, and with no pension. I feel that this is a real man who has this problem and wonder if something can be done to help him. It’s a huge problem that Sea Org members slave away for years, yet at retirement age have absolutely no funds built up to live off, and are not entitled to Social Security Retirement pay, since they have never paid into the system. (I may be incorrect in this, if so, please correct me, I’m not very familiar with how that works).
I think The CoS really should be obligated, morally if not legally, to set up a plan for old folks who have given their lives to the church. This strip by Regraded Being was very well done, as always, but this time I didn’t find it funny, only disturbing and sad. But we need to see the truth, so please carry on Regraded Being, thank you for your work. – T.J.
T.J., they now get income reported to the Social Security Administration but it is far too low to qualify for benefits. The Sea Org does not report the value of training, food and housing as compensation, just the stipend. $2600 per year if you are very very lucky and get full “pay” all year. A small amount goes to Workman’s Compensation and you may get some benefits from that if you stay in.
So those who joined as teens and never had another job do not qualify for Social Security or Medicare. They have absolutely no retirement savings unless some inheritance came their way and they somehow kept it a deep dark secret from the IAS vulture registrars.
The Sea Org doesn’t look too good on your resume either, good luck getting a job at 65 after you escape.
The CoS may have a few moral obligations to their slaves but do not hold your breath waiting for them to pony up.
Social Security Admin has a program for those who are disabled or too old to work. It is called Supplemental Security Income, SSI. It currently pays $740/month. Those cut loose are the prime population for this program.
this, along with Aaron Smith Levin’s story about Sandy Lattimore (sp?) stroking out at Flag and being left on a bench for the paramedics to pick up and register as a John Doe (in an interview with Jeffrey Augustine) is so f’d up that I cannot even believe that this is allowed to continue. I am no fan of the government being involved in everyone’s business, but for this “church” to take the very life and health of members (as well as any and all money they have) and then not have an obligation to care for them when they are old and infirm makes me sick to my stomach. their children and families within the organization probably are encouraged to get them to “drop their bodies” or those without having been disconnected from by the member on the absolute faith that they are doing something for their “eternity” by spending their lives in service to a group that cares nothing for them? it is despicable and revolting. to not even give them enough money that they qualify for Medicare?? seriously, wtf?
Oh my…
That makes me feel decidedly sober and menacing today. I never fully realised it got that threatening in the US for SO members and staff alike. I remember fondly some of the nicest people I ever met wore an SO uniform and diligently worked their ass’s off at Flag & LA.
I can only imagine in Australia the social welfare & medicare system will at least give them something, age pension is governed on age here, not like the US system & the medical system works to fair degree and basic hospital stuff is free. I’ve been feeling a little more resentful and hateful of the church lately and I guess this is sort of why.
I think it’s time for a personal regroup and a more considered approach to dealing with the real organisational behaviour behind and running scientology. My first consideration has always been for the rank and file, I detest corrupt management and officers who abuse their responsibilities.
Your work is indeed valuable Mike.
T.J. trust me its very real. Mike makes it a little satirical. Very litttle. These comics are very very close to real. Mike rinder ahould have the ufc slogan. As real as it gets. Im ex sea org. Ive seen every skit he does in real life.
I find most of these strips disturbing and sad. They shine a bright light on what goes on in the C of S. There is very little about any of that that is funny. The strips concentrate the ugliness in a way that makes it hard to dismiss how bad it is.
Captain Obvious says this RB skit came from
the San Francisco Org. If you are the least bit skeptical
try giving one million dollars to the IAS like Leah Remini
and take notes, in fact write a book.
Wait a minute Captain Obvious says thats been done already
and its a bestseller,number one.
One of your classics RB.
It’s getting scary how accurately you are examining the underbelly of scientology as it’s actually practiced within the church. You are exposing the mechanisms within the tail chasing bubble of the complete inapplicability of humanitarian values they say they practice, if that makes sense? Those in the church have developed the unbelievable ability to self administer brainwashing to co-mingle with and be used to justify the behaviour of non stop criminal misconduct, all the while camouflaging themselves as a religion – that’s quite the trick, its a mental virus.
One constant remains however, albeit purposely (lied about and managed by lawyers) hidden & completely non-confrontable by a card carrying scientologist – the solution to their own survival and sanity will always be – follow the money. Its trail leads to all the answers they will ever need for a solution to their current, future and past dilemmas – add a dose of suspicion to life and bingo! That’s the real tech required.
I need a holiday, I’ve been looking at scientology far too much!
“By Longstanding tradition, Scientology MINISTERS also have acted to ease suffering and provide counsel and succor to those in need, whether a member of their congregation or simply someone in the community who may need help.”
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!! Can’t stop laughing! Tears in my eyes! Running out of breath! Whew! Now that’s rich. But there is one thing that’s kind of cool: The provide counsel and succor! I mean, succor is another name for sushi, right?
Oh yeah. Like biting lemons or eating raw onions, your lips ‘succor’ up.
The thought of seeking advice from a scientology minister… what weirdness does that conjure up?
HELP scientology minister style… try wrapping your thinking gear around that for minute… you’re right – rich indeed!
If you saw a little kid crying and noticed a scientology minister walking toward him, what do you know is going to happen?
Oh how the tide has changed!
What do I know is going to happen? The kid will probably kick the cult member in the balls and then start reading him OT III. After which he’ll rip off the clerical collar and toss it in the nearest trash can. Then he’ll tell the cult member that Hubbard died obese, with his teeth rotting out of his mouth and he had psych drugs in his system when he took off for Target 2.
Hey, kids nowadays are pretty smart….
Not to even mention computer savvy. You’re right! Hadn’t thought of that. Kids probably know more about the truth of scientology and Mike Rinder, Tony Ortega, Marty Rathbun et al than any scio. Kids would be particular knowledge on the subject and won’t be afraid to tell it either. Another piece of karma that will indeed grow up for the church.
My age bubble shows sometimes. My need my afternoon nap now…
OSD,
In $cientologeeze it is pronounced ‘Suck’ …. ‘er’.
As in ” It really, really SUCKS to be Miscavige!
Yo Dave,
Tell us good buddy just how it is on this Fry – Day after Thursday at TOO! The weekend is here and I don’t have to spend one single second of it on cult related activities. I will make time to finish Leah’s book however. I suggest You do the same.
Coop, as always, you are right on Target! It does, indeed, suck to be the dwarf boy. His whole world is collapsing around him. You know, I better make a trip up to the Pasadena Model Idle Morgue to see how well they’re getting people in. I’m sure they’re bringing ’em in by the hundreds…..Yea Haw!
Again, RB hits the sad, nasty world of $cientology in the gonads. In the Navy, being sent to the Chaplin was the first step in punishment or psychological counseling. Lron just appropriated that process and bent it to his needs.
On his good days, Hubbard hijacked more positive philosophical concepts and bent them to his needs — to assuage his conscience. Once he bootstrapped himself to ‘Clear’, he went off on an insane BT tangent.
This is the philosophy of Scientology. But because Scientology is rife with cognitive dissonance some Scientologists will say:
This is not Scientology, auditing helped me, that is Scientology.
I once read an article on how to make a junk yard dog.
1) create trust with dog with tons of affinity
2) throw dog into a metal container and bang on the sides to freak out the dog
3) take dog out of container and pet it with drones of love until it’s calmed down
4) slug the dog real hard a few times
5) throw dog back into metal container and repeat banging to freak out dog
6) take dog out and love bomb it until trust is established.
7) keep repeating until you have a dog who will bark, growl and bite anyone except the master.
Scientologists are caught between being helped (pet and love bombed) and being hypnotically victimized by being thrown into metal containers.
Scientology in essence is the projected mental state of L Ron Hubbard in writing.
The us against them quality, that is inherent in Scientology, has its source in L Ron Hubbard’s paranoid persecution complex.
What we see in Scientology is the:
Word cleared and demoed psychological profile of L Ron Hubbard. Scientologist’s are trained to be paranoid because Ron was paranoid.
Scientologist’s see the virtue in violence because Ron was violent. Scientologist’s isolate themselves from society because Ron did.
Scientologist’s think they have all the answers and all other paths are implants because Ron did.
There is not one distorted, uncivil trait that does not have its root cause, SOURCE, from L Ron Hubbard.
These examples of “ministers” are people who are not necessarily bad people. They most likely are good people who were influenced by a dangerous philosophy which informed their behavior.
There is a sadness to that.
How have they been trained to numb their conscience ?
BOLIVAR
How have they been trained to denigrate the family ?
THE GE IS A FAMILY MAN
Why do they hate all critics ?
BECAUSE ALL CRITICS ARE EVIL CRIMINALS
Why do the have condescending arrogance towards other spiritual paths
BECAUSE L RON HUBBARD IS THE ONLY BEING TO FIND THE REAL TRUTH
Scientologist’s are the human, walking, talking demonstration of the mind of L RON HUBBARD.
Money, material wealth and manpower,
these are the things that scn comes after,
the reason for being.
Emotional/mental health and well-being is bartered, wagered and spent in the endeavor to accummultate evermore of those three commodities, and, yes, the person newly-indoctrinated is first reduced to “a thing”, a scientologist, a barganin chip if you will, and it is done by first hijacking and then replacing his …identity.
Impossible to the thinking mind, you may be inclined to say.
But, as master, to do that all you need to do is reduce all sources of information to one, your own. Now the person becomes your definition and not their own. Once in scientology you see, a person is quite forbidden to question scientology. That’s what all the fuss is about, whenever you the church making noise. They just cannot tolerate criticizm. Pointless clamoring and hollow attacks is all they have to throw at you, the “suppressive person” asking questions and voiceing complaints…
The outside is also blocked from looking in, completing the trap. Isolation is the point there, and the scientologist is told, basically, that it is all for their protection, that the whole population is inferior because, specifically, that they are not scientologists! One almost has to go through the whole cold system, hell and back, to understand the reality of this, what scn. really is about, to know the danger of it, to know the utter deception of it.
Almost.
A little education can go a long way. If the focus of that education is geared around critical thinking, the innocent child has a very solid protection. If you are forbidden to ask questions you know you are being manipulated. If you are told there is only one source of knowledge, that a man is “righteous” or has any method of special knowledge, well, I would say any space between you and such a man is the only safety you can afford to keep, and the further you can get away the better.
Outstanding post, mark! Simply outstanding. They must accept the mindset of Hubbard and nothing less. Poor lost souls. And it REALLY sucks being on staff nowadays. They’re lucky to get $10 in a week.
Ye shall know them by their fruits. (Matthew 7:16)
What use to say someone is not a bad person? What difference does it make what kind of person they are if that notion is independent of what they’re doing to people? The only thing that’s really, truly knowable about a person is what they DO. What’s underneath is strictly speculation.
At Gold/Int Hoden was cutting his teeth as an asshole. We’ll find out from Ron Miscavige Sr’s. ( a good guy at Gold/Int) book if Dave ever even had a conscience to be snuffed out by Hubbard. At Int, people like Ron Sr, Dan Koon, Bruce Ploetz and others always gave the feeling that they knew things that they would like to pull you aside and tell you about (not good about Dave, etc.). Just couldn’t go there at the time. In hindsight, it is interesting to see who gained the “ability to walk away”, and those who have not (yet).
I find your comment wholly logical and quite encouraging, three.
The “ability to walk away” is not, cannot be limited to those who already have!
Why, any of the still ins can gain this ability!
After all, who would have dreamed that Mike Rinder and Marty Rathbun would have walked away? From all I’ve read, these two were the on the short list of least likely people to EVER leave the SO.
How about Debbie Cook? Talk about the least likely people!
And there are so many more, who held positions of high responsibility in the SO, execs who were in all likelihood considered Scientology fanatics and martinets by their co-workers and juniors all the years they were in, yet who each, in SOME way, for SOME reason, GAINED the “ability to walk away”
In brief, there IS hope.
The Still Ins are NOT hopeless but perfectly capable of achieving the ability to leave, as many have, as we here all have.
Yeah, there is a spectrum of ability. People like Ron Miscavige, Jr and Steve Hall had the good vibes. Debbie had good vibes. Mike Rinder and Marty, due to the nature of their work (and were often away doing their job) were not likely to get into a conversation with someone that they were not working with directly. Miscavige had them by the short hairs and tightly controlled them. But Mike has always had the voice that was theraputic just to listen to; at staff meetings, on stage or where ever (“the ability to walk away” is Mike’s aptly [jokingly] stated EP of OT X, I’ve called it BT Version 10.0) Marty was FOCUSED but seemed conflicted, having to report to a Demented Midget every day. Clinkers like Mike Sutter and other members of DM’s inner cadre are at the dark end of the spectrum, with tiny if any souls. You could sense it before they walked around the corner. People like Lana and Jim were just on some other wavelength. People like Heber and Ray would have made it out by now (with a little help from their friends) if Dave didn’t have them by the balls with his tiny fists. When Dave succumbs, most of the evil will dissolve.
This is the rotten and funny truth of scientology and its church. Self-serving and vindictive behaviors openly committed under the banner of an ARC triangle symbolizing understanding and all things magnanimous. Very few parishioners are true victims here in my opinion. They see the contradiction, they just choose to ignore it because they want something out of it. They go into collusion with it until they see there’s no winning with it. It is a TOTALLY UNGIVING, NON-RECIPROCATING entity. It feeds on the ones who serve it.
IMO, I think the majority of the parishioners either don’t see the contradiction due to the years in the bubble or are remaining in and UTR due to needing to protect their contacts with their family and I guess that can be skewed to mean “they want something out of it”, . People will endure a lot to stay connected to their family.
Leah was lucky to extract her entire family when she left. The majority of the people who leave, Mike included, are not so lucky, and are forced to “abandon” their family in order to save themselves, then be derided for doing so, even though it is the family members who abandon the person who leaves, not the person who leaves who abandon the family members.
Mike did not want to cut ties with his family, nor did he do so. The cos forced his family to cut ties with him when he chose to walk away from the insanity.
We have an intrinsic knowledge of the difference between right and wrong. When we fail to act in accordance with that knowledge we are complicit with the misguiding influence and are culpable for our actions.
That isn’t to say there shouldn’t be sympathy, for who of us has never done as we ought not to have done? Still, culpability and sympathy are two different things.
Valerie, I respectfully and humbly disagree with YOU on the point that the church forces members to disconnect…hear me out, now, please!
Of COURSE, the cult applies enormous pressure and threats and so forth on its members to disconnect from anyone who could inform or influence them with the truth – no disagreement there, certainly. But when it comes down to brass tacks, the individual undergoing this pressure in the end makes up his or her own mind. He or she caves to it, or refuses to do so.
The same huge pressure, threats, dire warnings, were applied to Mike, to YOU, to MANY people posting on this and other ex-Scn blogs. Why is it that some people can take responsibility and think for themselves – at great cost, at enormous sacrifice, sometimes, and then others simply will not look, will not consider any other viewpoint – you see, there is a DIFFERENCE between people, and that difference boils down to integrity to self. “To thine own self be true”, etc.
These are the people who cannot, will not, lie TO THEMSELVES anymore.
And the people who stay – you think they don’t know?
I say, “Baloney”. The know PLENTY, IMO. Yet they let themselves be bullied, cowed. In fairness, perhaps they need TIME to gather the strength and courage to leave. That’s a distinct possibility, but its still their decision. They are still the ones DECIDING, just like the ones who left, routed out, blew, etc., decided.
Yes, ultimately it is the family and friends who disconnect from the one who leaves, not the person who left to save him or herself from the CoS or even Scientology itself.
This is an interesting point to make. The ones who leave out of necessity, the ones who violate the code by reading and posting abuses on the Internet, etc., are always the ones who are blamed for “wrecking” their families and friendships.
It’s hard to read the mind of someone who is still in (because they act/think so robotically), but essentially, I agree with you that we all know right from wrong.
LRH managed to get people to somehow by-pass this thing we call a conscience. “The greatest good… bla bla” and all that baloney is piled up layer by layer in Scientology until it is solid as a rock. But somewhere, somehow, deep down, our innate understanding of right and wrong can never be fully hypnotized out of us… I believe that is true. And that is the main reason why the Co$ is shrinking. It is the goodness of people awakening, like Leah and many, many others, we cannot stand by and do nothing in the face of this human abuse. In that, I am sure we can all agree.
The sad part of this RB post is that when most people read the Chaplains responses, they probably feel shock or perhaps they assume that this is an embellishment. Unfortunately, for me it isn’t even shocking. Having been brainwashed for the first 30 years of my life and now for another 30 years of observing thru “still in” family, this inhuman attitude the cult has towards families and someone’s life in general seem quite normal.
Some MAA or Chaplain is using this SCN-shit-logic on my son right now and I haven’t heard from him in 5 months or so, he changed his phone number and recently moved so we cant locate him. My wife and I are apparently huge SP’s that have ruined his life. We are just the parents that raised him and no longer of use or value. This explains my handle being used on this site, pissed off….
Oh, I just wish I could feel shock at this article….
Oh wow!
The quicker the bubble bursts the better. I feel for and your wife and wish a speedy end to the madness your son is wrapped up in. May you all be together real soon and decompress as a family unit and get all your lives back.
The Cof$ is just horrible!
Thanks for your concerns Yawnalot. That is what we are working towards. Sadly, we are probably just 1 of thousands of families that this messed up cult has destroyed. And they wonder why they can’t get new public into their orgs. They are self-destructing.
Perhaps it really is only a matter of time for each individual still in, clearlypissedoff. Perhaps its necessary – in order for each person to really GET IT – perhaps it is necessary for each individual, whether SO, staff or public, to experience something very personally, to get the suppression full in the face, as it were, so that the suppression is really real to him or her, so that it is unmistakable as real suppression.
And if this is the case, then it is only a matter of when, not if, each Scientologist Still In, has their AHA moment wherein he or she says, “No. No more. I will not accept this anymore. This can never happen again”, and begins planning the leavetaking, or just blows.
I think that the more pressure the Co$ managment experiences is the worse they will treat the still ins, and the more likely that each still in will experience, directly and personally, the suppression.
I think the suppression has to be very real to the still in, to fuel the will to leave, and the courage to confront the unknown.
What I Yawnalot said. I was forced to disconnect from my mom while on staff in Hawai’i. She attempted suicide the minute she got home to Calif. Our cousin, who she was living with, came home from work early for the very first time and found her. She was able to get to a hospital in time to save her life. The guilt has never left me.
clearlypissedoff, many of us here are have family still in, too. We know your pain as we’ve gone through it ourselves. Our collective love goes out to you, your wife and any other family for friends that are affected by this. And, please, keep posting here! It’s a way for all of us to come together.
Wow, what a sad story about your mother. I’m glad your cousin helped to save her!
I can see there is a lot of supportive people on this site. Mike and Marty have also been helpful to me. Your kind thoughts are greatly appreciated as well as from others here. Thank you!
You are very, very welcome, Clearly! Welcome to our world! It’s a very safe place.
And…thank YOU for your kind words. I was an only child so my mom felt she had NOTHING to live for. Hence the suicide attempt.
Hi OSD, I know if I have to cross over before you, please you and theta clear carry my torch my flame for me. So shattered about your Mom I am very sorry yet my family my up bringing had suicides and beatings too. Y’all that is why I stayed so long under the GO/Intell physical stuff. My late mother beat me for years til at 15 I told her never to touch me again.We are talking 50s 60s here and when your parents are rice and powerful no-one will believe you back then.You are a other anchor for me. Love,Ann.
I know you’ve gone through quite a bit. It’s a wonder you never lost your mind when you were in. Ok, between you and me, whoever crosses first waits for the other…
Hi OSD, Thank you,it is a deal! For some reason as I wait for you or vice versa,no flying monkeys! The monkey room ai East Grinstead SH would really do a number on me! Love to you both! Ann.
I Yawnalotsays
Wow Dude… I truly feel for you and your family. Words fail me to express the ripple effect of the organisational dismay scientology inflicts on people. Thanks for sharing.
I guess the main reason I visit this site so often and try to give silly responses is to lighten the load scientology dumps on family. A day doesn’t go by when my wife and I don’t talk about the ‘good old days’ before our US family got fully immersed in that horror of an existence created by the church. Loneliness and longing for family unity just doesn’t go away.
Peace within life is tough enough but with scientology calling the shots it’s damn near impossible to fathom a better life is possible at all. That group truly needs to be disbanded.
The blindness created within the scientology group is the cruellest blow of all and to realise it’s all based on ‘help’ creates a new classification for humanitarian criminality.
My prayers and postulates are that this destruction of families will soon come to an end and you will see your son again. So many have suffered disconnection for no benefit to self or society. This abomination will not stand the test of time.
So sorry, clearlypissedoff. This is a good example of why people come to hate the CoS, and yes, it is self-destructing.
I hope you and your wife are doing okay.
The CoS wants to be your everything: your Mom, your Dad, brother, sister, spouse, son, daughter, best friend, co-worker, boyfriend, girlfriend, social contact, God, everything. The truth is, it can’t be and it’s inevitable that people wake up to this sooner or later. I hope your son gets wise to this very soon.
I Yawn, I don’t think you come close to me regarding being a ‘sick puppy.’ When I was still doing stand-up, I ALWAYS pushed the envelope as far as I could….then I pushed it more.
Do Scientologists really actually speak in that tone and manner? Or is that a slight exageration? Part of what makes me laugh when reading regraded being is the manner that they speak let alone what they say. I really want to meet some real Scientologists now just to hear how they speak. With all the “millions” of Scilons out there I’m sure to run into one sometime. Right?
Hi Edward. It has been my observation that when around non-scientologists most still-in folk behave quite civily and unless your ear is tuned to some very specific scientology-think patterns you would never know they were in scientology. Amongst themselves it’s a different story. Amongst parishoners, successes in life are generally credited to abilities gained through the application of scientology technology. Failures or lack of success are simply described as the need to better apply scientology. There is no talk about the organization itself except to repeat what you can read on the scientology website.
Sea Org and Staff members are quite harsh with each other and when things aren’t going well you’ll have to look hard to find a meaner group. They are very friendly and loving when parishoners are present but very critical of those who they deem to be ‘not with the program’. In private a chaplain or ethics officer or any other staff person who has decided to ‘help’ you will have absolutely no problem telling you that it is best for your survival that you separate from your spouse or any other family member they consider to be afainst the church. They will use praise and friendship as easily as they use insults and threats to get you to donate money.
When confronted with any negative ideas about the church, their behaivior can be quite bizarre. You can see a few examples on youtube. Start with Tory Christman’s videos and go from there.
Sea Org and Staff members are quite harsh with each other and when things aren’t going well you’ll have to look hard to find a meaner group. They are very friendly and loving when parishoners are present but very critical of those who they deem to be ‘not with the program’.
In my experience RB that is an understatement of some magnitude. I cannot find words without utilizing many expletives to describe what I witnessed frequently.
Scary stuff that its toned down. I’d still like to meet one one day. I’d like to be reg’d one day just to see how good/bad they are at it. Being from a sales background myself and knowing the sales tricks they use, I take great pleasure in leading on sales people especially phone telemarketers and door to door sales people letting them think I’m an easy mark and then just dragging it out. I figure the longer they spend time on me the less time they have trying to sell to some other poor sucker. Hmmmm… I have too much time on my hands.
Has everybody been getting hit with an unusual barrage of scn. commercials on YouTube recently? …
I punched in something totally disrelated, Louis CK, and there is this slick, new, commercial for Scientology offering me ANSWERS.
…
Just about made me sick. Then it happened again, next day, which was yesterday.
But, you know, no matter…
The Going Clear movie, Leah’s book, Tony Ortega’s book, this blog, all the other books and blogs… there is no way in heaven or hell these phony commercials, no matter how slick, are going to reach even ONE PERCENT, (maybe two?) of the grand total of viewers getting the truth from the ANTI-scientology side. Game over.
And the TV seems to be lit up with Leah’s book, making even more of a splash than the movie, or maybe the movie got the ball rolling, huh? This is just wonderful.
I remember a day (not long ago) that I felt the need to keep quiet
(thanks to brainwashing) about my past as a scn-gist.
What a release, letting that go…
What a revelation.
-Mark
Registrars are not about selling they are about crushing your will to resist, if they were trying to sell me something I didn’t believe in I would swiftly walk away – I put the phone down on sales people all the time – trouble is whilst I hated being ‘regged’ I felt they were trying to serve a noble purpose so it then became an exercise in “what could I minimally give in order to get out of the room and get home”. What I didn’t realize till too late is that when you have donated you immediately become a target. A friend of mine never gave more than a few $ simply because he gave them hell every time they tried to regge him, after a while he was pushed way down the list of possible targets. Not me, I got all the “big being” shit and never could work out why! Regges will make you the most amazing promises, one actually said they would help me get an extra job to cover the new monthly outgoings on a loan they were pushing me to take, once they have your money they could not care less, all promises are swiftly forgotten.
After I left had the central org’s phone number blocked on my cell and landline but before this it felt really good finally telling them to get lost when they came after me for donations
You asked in one of your earlier posts: “Do Scientologists really actually speak in that tone and manner?” Absolutely – I saw one Exec Director reduce a staff member to tears then shout at her for “case on post”. I was reduced to tears one time by an evil Sea Org woman who was demanding repeatedly I do something I really didn’t want to do. Stupid me, this all happened years ago yet I still stuck with scn for many years afterward.
You could always take a course at your local org and decide based on personal experience. Beware, love bombing is step one …………. the juicy stuff you are perhaps looking for comes a little later. Good luck!
Doing the balls in a vice trick per above might be more fun and produce faster results. Make sure you kick your twin in the face before you start.
It just so happens that my local org is in Mike Rinders old stomping ground. Adelaide Australia. On a long winded side note, I did try to go in there once not too long ago when i visited Adelaide (i live 400 miles away) and lo and behold it was shut so I googled it and it gave a status of “permanently shut”. I found it odd because looking through the windows all the displays of Dianetics books etc and personality test areas were still set up as if it could be opened tomorrow. So I just figured the scilons had abandoned it and couldnt be stuffed/ didnt want to pay for removing the contents of the shop. It could be pure coincidence and I may be having delusions of grandeur but I happened to mention it on an underground bunker discussion thread and then a couple days later it was no longer “permanently shut” on google. I’ll have to go back to confirm if its still in operation.
Great insight as usual RB from the first to last panel!
If I may say, I thought “Richard” was Andres Rodriguez when I first saw the drawing. Minus the glases. Oops.
Right now, CLO New York does not have a staff auditor/minister, either does N.Y. Org or Long Island Org. How friggin bad is it when the Church of Scientology does not even have auditors / minsters for their own people? There are no ministerial services available to the people working in this city for the Church of Scientology! Auditing and training are part of their supposed EXCHANGE for being on staff!!!!!!
Hark! Did I just the “E” word David? My apologies.
wow! you know about these Orgs in the NY area? Thanks for the tidbit of info. It grants me “happiness!”
Be well and thanks so much for this news!
A group that abandons family and friends on command and offloads people who have been loyal workers for decades once they get ill, is an extremely sick and perverted group. A great value of this site is to warn and educate people so that they do not get involved with this loathsome “church” in the first place. Those who stay in are truly gone mentally and spiritually.
Thanks for this newest edition of spot on satire, Regraded. Again, I didn’t, couldn’t laugh. The hypocrisy you have highlighted here, the pretense of caring and help when in fact there is no caring, no help, unless money is involved – its sad, tragic. I know someone who was fitness-boarded from the SO at 68 because of health issues. This person’s entire adult life was devoted to Scientology and its aims – about 35 years of service. A true social personality simply kicked to the curb because of inconvenient health issues. Just heartless.
God RB – it is spooky…like you have some super powers to exactly duplicate what really happens in Scientology. The sad thing is – the “group think” convinces us to put up with it for years. Most people leave because they hit a tipping point (that is if they have any rational mind that has not been audited out).
Hi Regraded Being, I can tell you, I really needed your post tonight. A mixture of what you posted and the realization that the Internet is not always kind. Not you RB never you.Thank you always, Ann.
I found myself laughing at the cartoons probably more with relief that such did not happen to me. They’re good fun but as many other commenters say here the truth is also not so funny for these people discarded and treated like dirt. Now, this is just another manifestation of the infestation that has taken over the Church. When I was on staff I don’t think the majority of the staff treated their fellows in this way, far from it. But the place (the Scientology network that is) was finally taken over by people with such cruel mentalities and attitudes. When I say finally taken over there were many instances of this hard-nosed cruel attitude before 1981 but it was not endemic – as it is now, I believe. It was capable of being corrected. I know this personally as I was chairman of many Review Comm Evs that undeclared people that had been falsely and maliciously declared.Now I don’t believe it is capable of being corrected – not without removing the gang that has taken over the show. Shame really because most Scientologists I know are very decent people. But then I don’t know any now still left in. The most apt reference is HCOB 2 August 1969R LX Lists which states “…critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant or contemptuous personalities are always out of valence.” Is it not amazing that the management ethos of the Church seems to be operating exactly in this manner and yet no one inside the Organization questions such, overtly anyway, or leaves it? They even support it by donating funds to it! Those remaining in this monstrosity that now passes for “Scientology” are seemingly all “out of valence” now.
Very astute analysis Foolproof
There used to be islands of sanity created by some caring, sane individuals throughout Scientology, particularly before 1981. These individuals and their islands are gone today. Replaced by Miscavige’s cold chrome steel CULTure. By comparison, Folsom prison is a vacation hotel for these 2nd gen and Russian & Eastern European RPFers that populate Flag today. I drive by Flag every day to and from my work… no smiles. No laughter. Very, very serious people dressed in bellboy uniforms. They are observably miserable sods, that’s for sure.
Yes that phrase “cold chrome steel” indicates just one thing does it not – total and utter psychosis. imagine having a session with a “cold chrome steel” auditor? LRH states “seriousness = mass”. God help us!
That quote may be true. He also said that RTC was supposed to be “hard as cold chrome steel.”
Secondly with this ridiculous and vicious cold chrome steel thing, anyone with even a modicum of sanity and training knows that it is based on evil purposes and some sort of whole track dictator valence – in theory the complete opposite of what Scientology should be trying to clear up. Yes we have all heard that some people like to be led by “strong dominant personalities” and all that sort of bunk but we are talking about Scientologists. And thus we see the results of treating decent people like dogs – the Orgs are empty. Was that the purpose? You would have to say “yes”!
“critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant or contemptuous personalities are always out of valence” but it is the only valence one can have and survive…except when the staff put on the fake 1.1 ARC valence to get you to give money so their stats can go up. Soon as the money hits the account – it is back to critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant and contemptuous valence….and then back to fake ARC for more stats.
I like the title of a book and movie – Scientology – The $tat Driven Life
Thank you for your insightful point of view. It helps clarify my experience.
Good People: Pleasure, and there is still hope that the monstrosity can be tamed and behave decently. All they had to was deliver auditing and training – shouldn’t have been that hard! You know I think their crashing misunderstood is on the word “tough” – they seem to think that Scientology should be like the US Marines with drill sergeants barking orders and ordering press-ups and running around screaming pretending they are producing etc. What Hubbard really meant by “tough” was staff being determined that people got good gains from their auditing and knew and applied their materials in training. Not shouting at people or insisting on virtual pain of spiritual death if they “did not donate the expected amount”. If they had done that there would have been no need for all the shouting and screaming. Look at their stats for the last 35 years – long term (very) down-trending and empty Orgs and Academies.
“…critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant or contemptuous personalities are always out of valence.”
That sounds like an attitude or a ser fac. Just like saying all homosexuals are 1.1.. It also sounds critical. Maybe even snide. Maybe even arrogant and contemptuous.
It’s definitely an A=A=A computation.
A=A=A=…Get the fuck OUT of scentology!
Right?
So are you defending critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant or contemptuous personalities?
I think blanket declares are suspect.
I think the whole “commodore” thing, with a private militia was a bit OOV.
“C for Mark Chambers, the KTL supe at Stevens Creek, who started having bad health problems, ended up in a wheelchair, probably after a double amputation as his circulation was horrible from years of smoking and just bad health habits–perhaps diabetes. He kept on as a staff member, but the ED got him offloaded as the idea of a ‘cripple DB’ in the org on staff was completely out-PR to her. She was pretty brutal about that sort of thing and had made sarcastic comments about fixing the org’s elevator, because only downstats would need it–and that was not worth putting money into. He died after he was kicked off of staff. To make matters worse a few years prior to this, his wife really went off the deep end mentally. Many suicide watches and handlings with the DSA, and last I heard she was still in terrible shape. She also had been a staff member for years.”
From the “They Should Not Have Died” Website
I was friends with Mark back in the 70’s. He was smart but kind of quiet. He lived and breathed $cientology.
The way they cut him loose was so cruel as to be even worse than Regraded Beings example.
Chaplain and ministerial services. Try to get one, even a volunteer minister to come to your hospital or home and give assists. Assists that are ordered by the C/S. Forget it. No one will come and if you are like one victim I’ve seen you will simply be left to die there. Fucking despicable! So, as usual, and as Mike can confirm, the hyperbole the cult spreads across its own website and vomits to the media is a complete lie which is offered purely to position itself as a worthwhile and contributing function in the world. But the truth is completely opposite and sadly the fraud only comes to light when experienced in the daylight of fact and real world events.
I was really sad today reading all of these comments, now I’m just pissed, throwing good people away…sick!
The poor offloaded guy is whining. He got about $500 bucks when he was let go. Heck, that was a couple years pay — what a windfall!
I do think there is a typo. Should “counsel and succor” have been written “cancel the sucker”?
Peace out. End of cycle. Catch you on the flip flop. Don’t goof the floof or come a cropper while I’m being reborn.
Sharing a story …
~19~ Escorted off post and out of ASI
At this point, Dear, it’s time to address my participation in Writers of the Future. I still find it fascinating I was escorted off post and out of Author Services shortly after your memorial service in November 2004. Truth be told, that shows how much common sense and compassion was present when LRH’s doctor’s widow, and a dedicated worker for twelve-years was treated that way.
Shortly after I was escorted out of Author Services, I was contacted by an International Association of Scientologists registrar. Yes, he’d lost his brother and he felt the IAS was the best way to make earth a better place. The registrar asked if I’d seen the Tom Cruise commemorative video. When I replied, “Yes,” he asked me, “Don’t you want to be like Tom Cruise?” I said, “No, not really.” The registrar wanted me to take out a home equity loan on our house and donate it to the IAS because “COB has a really big problem.” The registrar also wanted use of the Denk name so he could get others to do the same using your name as an example.
I remember thinking at the time of this conversation, “Boy, it’s a good thing I’m not on post at ASI, as this would flap sky high.” And, therein lays the reason for the tactic. I was off post and out of ASI so I would donate to the IAS to help solve COB’s “really big problem” and thereby regain favor in the eyes of the powers that be. This is crazy shit and I can see you shaking your head in disbelief right about now.
These days we have a term, “thrown under the bus.” It means to sacrifice another person (often a friend or ally), who is usually not deserving of such treatment, out of malice or for personal gain or self-protection. That’s exactly what was done to me. Rest assured, Dear, I got pretty clever from that point on. The trick is not agreeing with the crazy stuff, but simply out-creating it. I learned this from you, so thanks!
As it turns out, within a short time I was told a “mistake had been made” and I should keep working at Author Services on the WOTF Contest. There was a new head of the activity named Ria. For a while I could only be in the office when she was there. Funny stuff was going on, like I was considered a security risk.
Early on after my return, I did have an opportunity to tell Hugh Wilhere I would work for a year and then I’d be moving along. He had been in charge before all this stuff took place. He was a good one to tell. I didn’t talk to Evie, the HAS, much, if at all, as she seemed upset by your passing and didn’t attend your memorial service.
Judy, the part time contest administrator, was around but she was doing medical stuff. It was good she stayed in the loop as she was to be my replacement. She and Ria seemed to get along great. I could and did cut my hours to three days a week. I also worked three days a week with Jim at his electronics business and took Sundays off.
Within the WOTF office, I felt disoriented by all the changes. Judy would come and go depending upon her medical treatments and kids. Ria would work on things like changing the rules of the contests, new copy for public relations purposes, raising the Grand Prize amounts from $4000 to $5000, the addition of new judges, new trophies, etc. It appears the predominant viewpoint was that I was “holding things down” and, with your departure, it was time get rid of me so expansion could occur.
I have since found out that around this same time, December 2004, there were church executives in the lobby of ASI, one floor down. There were daily haranguing meetings by COB and executives were even beaten there. It looks like “expansion” was being sought in far more abusive ways than simply getting rid of the widowed contest administrator.
As we worked along through my final year, I turned over everything by showing the girls how it was done and then not doing it anymore. I no longer worried about staying on top of tasks because Ria was the new head of the activity and Judy had “already done it before,” her words. I slowly and smoothly withdrew, cleaning out files along the way. As my next trip to Florida neared, I started reminding folks that I would be leaving the activity … only to find Hugh Wilhere had never informed anyone of my plan.
There seemed to be some sort of an upset over all this but I had made my plans clear to Hugh and, thus, held firm. The HAS, Evie, spoke to me with Judy in the office; either she was afraid of me or thought Judy was my opinion leader. Both options are very funny to me. Evie said stuff like, “You are WOTF,” and “COB knows where you are.” I shrugged these off as unimportant. She then offered me more money to stay, saying “LRH would pay you.” False, absolutely totally completely false! I was done … and gone.
Thanks for your story and I’m glad you stuck to your plans and left!
TWD….if I may ask…..why would regging you while you were on staff at ASI cause a flap?
I am also glad you did not mortgage your house (let’s see Tom Cruise make that kind of commitment) and are out and truly free.
@ Chee Chalker. I (underlined) would have flapped. I would have stated openly on ASI lines: “You allow the IAS to come to me for money when I’ve recently been widowed and am coming off $50,000 in medical bills? You allow the IAS to reg me when I’m intimately tied into the Shaw Health Center/Optimum Wellness businesses? You allow the IAS to treat me as easy prey as I am now a widow and the reg thinks I need to be like Tom Cruise by donating to the IAS? Do you think I would even consider the IAS’ use of Dr Denk’s name under these conditions? How dare you allow the IAS reg to intimate I should take out a home equity loan so the IAS can use Dr Denk’s name to influence others? (etc … etc … etc). This is not how we handle a loss. Get on your ministerial hat!” I could go on but I believe that’s enough of a rant and answers your question.
Thanks TWD…..I see what you meant.
I’ve always.been curious as to why the Tiny Terror seems to go out of his way to alienate dedicated staff. It’s almost as if he can’t help himself. It’s either complete paranoia or he needs to see how far he can test loyalty.
Hi The WidowDenk, Thank you for your post and for you. Love,Ann.
That’s quite the timeline of truth, thanks for sharing and your resolute actions.
“COB has a really big problem” = indeed he has and his friend TC is neck deep with him.
Thank you Wifow Denk for exposing your treatment by the greedy church after the loss of your husband. It was a regging opportunity to them, not an actual person who suffered a loss.
So a widow should be used to solve COB’s “big problem.” How about COB grows up and solves his own problems and leaves widows alone?’!
I’m happy you never wanted to be like Tom Cruise, didn’t take an equity line on your home, and eventually left your post. I hope you have peace in your life that you deserve to have.
The best religion money can buy?
Okay…
http://www.somethingpositive.net/sp02262003.shtml
Regraded Being, you hit the nail on the head again as usual. Probably the old salt SO guy looks like a caricature to some, and his recommended “handling” (crawl in a hole and die, you useless #$#$#!!!) probably seems an extreme exaggeration. Believe me, it is not. That is the “retirement program” of the Sea Org, work until you drop and then pick up another body and work some more. Rinse and repeat for one billion years.
When I was in PAC routing out in 2004 there was an old salt in the dorm where I was for awhile in Big Blue. The story we heard was that he was in the Navy with Ron. Don’t know if that was true, but certainly he was very ill. Keeping us up late hacking and coughing. Possibly mesothelioma, possibly just from the smoking habit that he kept up to the end.
Apparently he had a daughter, also in the Sea Org.
The story we were told was that on his daughter’s birthday he went to get her a cake, and on the way back with the cake he fell down and died in the streets. No surprise there, with his cough and his inability to get around we were expecting him to drop his body anytime.
No idea if he was getting medical treatment or not, but certainly he was not in a hospital or nursing home. He was right there in the normal Sea Org dorm with the rest of us. Six flights up and a broken elevator.
That is the true inner face of the “Minister of Scientology”, you said it well Regraded Being. I have done the Minister’s Course (It took me two weekends at the San Francisco Org in ’75 or so). The “Minister” part is just the outward facing facade, to give a semblance of religious tradition. To trade on the public’s built-in expectations of what a religion means and what it does.
The “of Scientology” part is the part that counts, where meaningless gestures like human decency, regard for the suffering of another, the milk of human kindness, are considered to be “human emotion and reaction”. In Hubbardese: HE&R. To be avoided and viewed with contempt while the greater cause trumps all. It is common to hear an executive squelch the objections of a sobbing staff member with the words “Cut the HE&R! You’re in the SO!”
The “Minister of Scientology” is supposed to be super-human, above all that, a Nietzschian uber-mensch. In reality, by discarding his humanity he only achieves the sub-humanity of the vicious zealot.
I recently visited an AO. I saw some of my old SO work mates from the Apollo. My, how those old-timers that are still in, have aged so badly. After 30 years of being out of that crap, I have played tennis weekly, golfed, started a normal, “wog” company, drank and ate as much and as often as I wanted to and lived a normal life. No real bosses (except for my wife…)! Other than having to physically be at the AO, I was happy and healthy. My old work mates, weren’t either.
I felt sorry for the strain these old time SO members have taken. And that strain wore badly on them. Constant harassment, poor food, lack of proper exercise, few days off to relax doesn’t equate to a healthy senior citizen.
Bruce and RB are so right. I feel these old guys will not be well cared for and be encouraged to “find another body” once they are not producing to the desired levels of the SO.
For them to leave is nearly impossible. Working for a cult, on the Apollo with a nut-job at the helm doesn’t make a potential employer jump over their desk with an employment contract. And as Bruce said, Social Security will not even be their for them.
Thanks LRH and DM!
The Social Security Administration will currently pay people who are disabled or retired with no income $740/month. Its not much, but it is something.
Hi Bruce Ploetz,An amazing and true post. Thank you.Love,Ann
Has anyone ever reported back to the SO after there twenty one year leave? Anyone ever hear any stories of this happening?
Hi Good People, Surely not Miss Ann. Love,Ann.
Are you kidding? Good People. LOL
Spot on Bruce Ploetz
The next 10-15 years will see a whole generation of Sea Org members expire. They joined in 1970 to 75 at 20-25 years of age and now they are 65 to 70+ years old. They can’t go anywhere. No social security. So, they will drop dead in the streets or in small hotel rooms with cancer with little/no medical care (I know one doing this now). Miscavige hated this generation of Sea Org (his father was one of them) and he has done everything he can to get rid of them. Now “old age” will clean up the stragglers for him. Good ol’ DLHDM David Let Him Die Miscavige.
I always think that the Regraded Being strips are based on real, actual people and situations. In the past there was a strip where a woman tries to talk to her dad, who runs away, which turned out to be a real story, and the woman involved posted here. Another strip featured a child in the Sea Org, based on Jenna Miscavige Hill. These strips hit to the bone; they are too real to be entirely made-up.
So it is very sad that the first man was told to divorce his spouse of many years, the second man was lied to and money taken for nothing, and last man is now cast away, literally, from the only job he’s ever had, old, ill, and with no pension. I feel that this is a real man who has this problem and wonder if something can be done to help him. It’s a huge problem that Sea Org members slave away for years, yet at retirement age have absolutely no funds built up to live off, and are not entitled to Social Security Retirement pay, since they have never paid into the system. (I may be incorrect in this, if so, please correct me, I’m not very familiar with how that works).
I think The CoS really should be obligated, morally if not legally, to set up a plan for old folks who have given their lives to the church. This strip by Regraded Being was very well done, as always, but this time I didn’t find it funny, only disturbing and sad. But we need to see the truth, so please carry on Regraded Being, thank you for your work. – T.J.
T.J., they now get income reported to the Social Security Administration but it is far too low to qualify for benefits. The Sea Org does not report the value of training, food and housing as compensation, just the stipend. $2600 per year if you are very very lucky and get full “pay” all year. A small amount goes to Workman’s Compensation and you may get some benefits from that if you stay in.
So those who joined as teens and never had another job do not qualify for Social Security or Medicare. They have absolutely no retirement savings unless some inheritance came their way and they somehow kept it a deep dark secret from the IAS vulture registrars.
The Sea Org doesn’t look too good on your resume either, good luck getting a job at 65 after you escape.
The CoS may have a few moral obligations to their slaves but do not hold your breath waiting for them to pony up.
How very, very sad…..
How very true, as I wintnessed with those discarded by RCo$
Social Security Admin has a program for those who are disabled or too old to work. It is called Supplemental Security Income, SSI. It currently pays $740/month. Those cut loose are the prime population for this program.
this, along with Aaron Smith Levin’s story about Sandy Lattimore (sp?) stroking out at Flag and being left on a bench for the paramedics to pick up and register as a John Doe (in an interview with Jeffrey Augustine) is so f’d up that I cannot even believe that this is allowed to continue. I am no fan of the government being involved in everyone’s business, but for this “church” to take the very life and health of members (as well as any and all money they have) and then not have an obligation to care for them when they are old and infirm makes me sick to my stomach. their children and families within the organization probably are encouraged to get them to “drop their bodies” or those without having been disconnected from by the member on the absolute faith that they are doing something for their “eternity” by spending their lives in service to a group that cares nothing for them? it is despicable and revolting. to not even give them enough money that they qualify for Medicare?? seriously, wtf?
Oh my…
That makes me feel decidedly sober and menacing today. I never fully realised it got that threatening in the US for SO members and staff alike. I remember fondly some of the nicest people I ever met wore an SO uniform and diligently worked their ass’s off at Flag & LA.
I can only imagine in Australia the social welfare & medicare system will at least give them something, age pension is governed on age here, not like the US system & the medical system works to fair degree and basic hospital stuff is free. I’ve been feeling a little more resentful and hateful of the church lately and I guess this is sort of why.
I think it’s time for a personal regroup and a more considered approach to dealing with the real organisational behaviour behind and running scientology. My first consideration has always been for the rank and file, I detest corrupt management and officers who abuse their responsibilities.
Your work is indeed valuable Mike.
T.J. trust me its very real. Mike makes it a little satirical. Very litttle. These comics are very very close to real. Mike rinder ahould have the ufc slogan. As real as it gets. Im ex sea org. Ive seen every skit he does in real life.
I find most of these strips disturbing and sad. They shine a bright light on what goes on in the C of S. There is very little about any of that that is funny. The strips concentrate the ugliness in a way that makes it hard to dismiss how bad it is.
Was that last guy based on R.D. Sludge, I mean Sledge? It would not be totally on point, but close.
Captain Obvious says this RB skit came from
the San Francisco Org. If you are the least bit skeptical
try giving one million dollars to the IAS like Leah Remini
and take notes, in fact write a book.
Wait a minute Captain Obvious says thats been done already
and its a bestseller,number one.
One of your classics RB.
It’s getting scary how accurately you are examining the underbelly of scientology as it’s actually practiced within the church. You are exposing the mechanisms within the tail chasing bubble of the complete inapplicability of humanitarian values they say they practice, if that makes sense? Those in the church have developed the unbelievable ability to self administer brainwashing to co-mingle with and be used to justify the behaviour of non stop criminal misconduct, all the while camouflaging themselves as a religion – that’s quite the trick, its a mental virus.
One constant remains however, albeit purposely (lied about and managed by lawyers) hidden & completely non-confrontable by a card carrying scientologist – the solution to their own survival and sanity will always be – follow the money. Its trail leads to all the answers they will ever need for a solution to their current, future and past dilemmas – add a dose of suspicion to life and bingo! That’s the real tech required.
I need a holiday, I’ve been looking at scientology far too much!
“By Longstanding tradition, Scientology MINISTERS also have acted to ease suffering and provide counsel and succor to those in need, whether a member of their congregation or simply someone in the community who may need help.”
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!! Can’t stop laughing! Tears in my eyes! Running out of breath! Whew! Now that’s rich. But there is one thing that’s kind of cool: The provide counsel and succor! I mean, succor is another name for sushi, right?
Oh yeah. Like biting lemons or eating raw onions, your lips ‘succor’ up.
The thought of seeking advice from a scientology minister… what weirdness does that conjure up?
HELP scientology minister style… try wrapping your thinking gear around that for minute… you’re right – rich indeed!
If you saw a little kid crying and noticed a scientology minister walking toward him, what do you know is going to happen?
Oh how the tide has changed!
What do I know is going to happen? The kid will probably kick the cult member in the balls and then start reading him OT III. After which he’ll rip off the clerical collar and toss it in the nearest trash can. Then he’ll tell the cult member that Hubbard died obese, with his teeth rotting out of his mouth and he had psych drugs in his system when he took off for Target 2.
Hey, kids nowadays are pretty smart….
Not to even mention computer savvy. You’re right! Hadn’t thought of that. Kids probably know more about the truth of scientology and Mike Rinder, Tony Ortega, Marty Rathbun et al than any scio. Kids would be particular knowledge on the subject and won’t be afraid to tell it either. Another piece of karma that will indeed grow up for the church.
My age bubble shows sometimes. My need my afternoon nap now…
I’m in my mid 60s. You?
OSD,
In $cientologeeze it is pronounced ‘Suck’ …. ‘er’.
As in ” It really, really SUCKS to be Miscavige!
Yo Dave,
Tell us good buddy just how it is on this Fry – Day after Thursday at TOO! The weekend is here and I don’t have to spend one single second of it on cult related activities. I will make time to finish Leah’s book however. I suggest You do the same.
Coop, as always, you are right on Target! It does, indeed, suck to be the dwarf boy. His whole world is collapsing around him. You know, I better make a trip up to the Pasadena Model Idle Morgue to see how well they’re getting people in. I’m sure they’re bringing ’em in by the hundreds…..Yea Haw!
Again, RB hits the sad, nasty world of $cientology in the gonads. In the Navy, being sent to the Chaplin was the first step in punishment or psychological counseling. Lron just appropriated that process and bent it to his needs.
Sky Pilots…
Sorrow comes in many forms.
On his good days, Hubbard hijacked more positive philosophical concepts and bent them to his needs — to assuage his conscience. Once he bootstrapped himself to ‘Clear’, he went off on an insane BT tangent.
This is the philosophy of Scientology. But because Scientology is rife with cognitive dissonance some Scientologists will say:
This is not Scientology, auditing helped me, that is Scientology.
I once read an article on how to make a junk yard dog.
1) create trust with dog with tons of affinity
2) throw dog into a metal container and bang on the sides to freak out the dog
3) take dog out of container and pet it with drones of love until it’s calmed down
4) slug the dog real hard a few times
5) throw dog back into metal container and repeat banging to freak out dog
6) take dog out and love bomb it until trust is established.
7) keep repeating until you have a dog who will bark, growl and bite anyone except the master.
Scientologists are caught between being helped (pet and love bombed) and being hypnotically victimized by being thrown into metal containers.
Scientology in essence is the projected mental state of L Ron Hubbard in writing.
The us against them quality, that is inherent in Scientology, has its source in L Ron Hubbard’s paranoid persecution complex.
What we see in Scientology is the:
Word cleared and demoed psychological profile of L Ron Hubbard. Scientologist’s are trained to be paranoid because Ron was paranoid.
Scientologist’s see the virtue in violence because Ron was violent. Scientologist’s isolate themselves from society because Ron did.
Scientologist’s think they have all the answers and all other paths are implants because Ron did.
There is not one distorted, uncivil trait that does not have its root cause, SOURCE, from L Ron Hubbard.
These examples of “ministers” are people who are not necessarily bad people. They most likely are good people who were influenced by a dangerous philosophy which informed their behavior.
There is a sadness to that.
How have they been trained to numb their conscience ?
BOLIVAR
How have they been trained to denigrate the family ?
THE GE IS A FAMILY MAN
Why do they hate all critics ?
BECAUSE ALL CRITICS ARE EVIL CRIMINALS
Why do the have condescending arrogance towards other spiritual paths
BECAUSE L RON HUBBARD IS THE ONLY BEING TO FIND THE REAL TRUTH
Scientologist’s are the human, walking, talking demonstration of the mind of L RON HUBBARD.
Yep, they too are victims and just don’t know it….yet.
Money, material wealth and manpower,
these are the things that scn comes after,
the reason for being.
Emotional/mental health and well-being is bartered, wagered and spent in the endeavor to accummultate evermore of those three commodities, and, yes, the person newly-indoctrinated is first reduced to “a thing”, a scientologist, a barganin chip if you will, and it is done by first hijacking and then replacing his …identity.
Impossible to the thinking mind, you may be inclined to say.
But, as master, to do that all you need to do is reduce all sources of information to one, your own. Now the person becomes your definition and not their own. Once in scientology you see, a person is quite forbidden to question scientology. That’s what all the fuss is about, whenever you the church making noise. They just cannot tolerate criticizm. Pointless clamoring and hollow attacks is all they have to throw at you, the “suppressive person” asking questions and voiceing complaints…
The outside is also blocked from looking in, completing the trap. Isolation is the point there, and the scientologist is told, basically, that it is all for their protection, that the whole population is inferior because, specifically, that they are not scientologists! One almost has to go through the whole cold system, hell and back, to understand the reality of this, what scn. really is about, to know the danger of it, to know the utter deception of it.
Almost.
A little education can go a long way. If the focus of that education is geared around critical thinking, the innocent child has a very solid protection. If you are forbidden to ask questions you know you are being manipulated. If you are told there is only one source of knowledge, that a man is “righteous” or has any method of special knowledge, well, I would say any space between you and such a man is the only safety you can afford to keep, and the further you can get away the better.
Outstanding post, mark! Simply outstanding. They must accept the mindset of Hubbard and nothing less. Poor lost souls. And it REALLY sucks being on staff nowadays. They’re lucky to get $10 in a week.
Hi Brian, As always your posts resonate to me as a sweet note of eternity.Thany you both my true fiends and brilliant spirits.Love, Ann.
Hi Brian,Spell-kill,my true friends although I can be a fiend at times ! Love, Ann.
Hi Ann, love also to you and yours.
Ye shall know them by their fruits. (Matthew 7:16)
What use to say someone is not a bad person? What difference does it make what kind of person they are if that notion is independent of what they’re doing to people? The only thing that’s really, truly knowable about a person is what they DO. What’s underneath is strictly speculation.
+1. Nice post hgc…
Thank you, hgc10. Spot on and well said.
Thank you hgc10.
Ken Hoden, ASHO Chaplain
He has a new post in life …… ASSHOLE Chaplain.
At Gold/Int Hoden was cutting his teeth as an asshole. We’ll find out from Ron Miscavige Sr’s. ( a good guy at Gold/Int) book if Dave ever even had a conscience to be snuffed out by Hubbard. At Int, people like Ron Sr, Dan Koon, Bruce Ploetz and others always gave the feeling that they knew things that they would like to pull you aside and tell you about (not good about Dave, etc.). Just couldn’t go there at the time. In hindsight, it is interesting to see who gained the “ability to walk away”, and those who have not (yet).
I find your comment wholly logical and quite encouraging, three.
The “ability to walk away” is not, cannot be limited to those who already have!
Why, any of the still ins can gain this ability!
After all, who would have dreamed that Mike Rinder and Marty Rathbun would have walked away? From all I’ve read, these two were the on the short list of least likely people to EVER leave the SO.
How about Debbie Cook? Talk about the least likely people!
And there are so many more, who held positions of high responsibility in the SO, execs who were in all likelihood considered Scientology fanatics and martinets by their co-workers and juniors all the years they were in, yet who each, in SOME way, for SOME reason, GAINED the “ability to walk away”
In brief, there IS hope.
The Still Ins are NOT hopeless but perfectly capable of achieving the ability to leave, as many have, as we here all have.
Aqua,
Yeah, there is a spectrum of ability. People like Ron Miscavige, Jr and Steve Hall had the good vibes. Debbie had good vibes. Mike Rinder and Marty, due to the nature of their work (and were often away doing their job) were not likely to get into a conversation with someone that they were not working with directly. Miscavige had them by the short hairs and tightly controlled them. But Mike has always had the voice that was theraputic just to listen to; at staff meetings, on stage or where ever (“the ability to walk away” is Mike’s aptly [jokingly] stated EP of OT X, I’ve called it BT Version 10.0) Marty was FOCUSED but seemed conflicted, having to report to a Demented Midget every day. Clinkers like Mike Sutter and other members of DM’s inner cadre are at the dark end of the spectrum, with tiny if any souls. You could sense it before they walked around the corner. People like Lana and Jim were just on some other wavelength. People like Heber and Ray would have made it out by now (with a little help from their friends) if Dave didn’t have them by the balls with his tiny fists. When Dave succumbs, most of the evil will dissolve.
Excellent points, I completely agree.
This is the rotten and funny truth of scientology and its church. Self-serving and vindictive behaviors openly committed under the banner of an ARC triangle symbolizing understanding and all things magnanimous. Very few parishioners are true victims here in my opinion. They see the contradiction, they just choose to ignore it because they want something out of it. They go into collusion with it until they see there’s no winning with it. It is a TOTALLY UNGIVING, NON-RECIPROCATING entity. It feeds on the ones who serve it.
Roger, I humbly disagree.
IMO, I think the majority of the parishioners either don’t see the contradiction due to the years in the bubble or are remaining in and UTR due to needing to protect their contacts with their family and I guess that can be skewed to mean “they want something out of it”, . People will endure a lot to stay connected to their family.
Leah was lucky to extract her entire family when she left. The majority of the people who leave, Mike included, are not so lucky, and are forced to “abandon” their family in order to save themselves, then be derided for doing so, even though it is the family members who abandon the person who leaves, not the person who leaves who abandon the family members.
Mike did not want to cut ties with his family, nor did he do so. The cos forced his family to cut ties with him when he chose to walk away from the insanity.
We have an intrinsic knowledge of the difference between right and wrong. When we fail to act in accordance with that knowledge we are complicit with the misguiding influence and are culpable for our actions.
That isn’t to say there shouldn’t be sympathy, for who of us has never done as we ought not to have done? Still, culpability and sympathy are two different things.
Valerie, I respectfully and humbly disagree with YOU on the point that the church forces members to disconnect…hear me out, now, please!
Of COURSE, the cult applies enormous pressure and threats and so forth on its members to disconnect from anyone who could inform or influence them with the truth – no disagreement there, certainly. But when it comes down to brass tacks, the individual undergoing this pressure in the end makes up his or her own mind. He or she caves to it, or refuses to do so.
The same huge pressure, threats, dire warnings, were applied to Mike, to YOU, to MANY people posting on this and other ex-Scn blogs. Why is it that some people can take responsibility and think for themselves – at great cost, at enormous sacrifice, sometimes, and then others simply will not look, will not consider any other viewpoint – you see, there is a DIFFERENCE between people, and that difference boils down to integrity to self. “To thine own self be true”, etc.
These are the people who cannot, will not, lie TO THEMSELVES anymore.
And the people who stay – you think they don’t know?
I say, “Baloney”. The know PLENTY, IMO. Yet they let themselves be bullied, cowed. In fairness, perhaps they need TIME to gather the strength and courage to leave. That’s a distinct possibility, but its still their decision. They are still the ones DECIDING, just like the ones who left, routed out, blew, etc., decided.
Hi Valerie,
Yes, ultimately it is the family and friends who disconnect from the one who leaves, not the person who left to save him or herself from the CoS or even Scientology itself.
This is an interesting point to make. The ones who leave out of necessity, the ones who violate the code by reading and posting abuses on the Internet, etc., are always the ones who are blamed for “wrecking” their families and friendships.
It’s a very unforgiving world in Scientology.
RogerHornaday
It’s hard to read the mind of someone who is still in (because they act/think so robotically), but essentially, I agree with you that we all know right from wrong.
LRH managed to get people to somehow by-pass this thing we call a conscience. “The greatest good… bla bla” and all that baloney is piled up layer by layer in Scientology until it is solid as a rock. But somewhere, somehow, deep down, our innate understanding of right and wrong can never be fully hypnotized out of us… I believe that is true. And that is the main reason why the Co$ is shrinking. It is the goodness of people awakening, like Leah and many, many others, we cannot stand by and do nothing in the face of this human abuse. In that, I am sure we can all agree.
I like the double triangles with the dollar sign though them. Nice touch.
The sad part of this RB post is that when most people read the Chaplains responses, they probably feel shock or perhaps they assume that this is an embellishment. Unfortunately, for me it isn’t even shocking. Having been brainwashed for the first 30 years of my life and now for another 30 years of observing thru “still in” family, this inhuman attitude the cult has towards families and someone’s life in general seem quite normal.
Some MAA or Chaplain is using this SCN-shit-logic on my son right now and I haven’t heard from him in 5 months or so, he changed his phone number and recently moved so we cant locate him. My wife and I are apparently huge SP’s that have ruined his life. We are just the parents that raised him and no longer of use or value. This explains my handle being used on this site, pissed off….
Oh, I just wish I could feel shock at this article….
Oh wow!
The quicker the bubble bursts the better. I feel for and your wife and wish a speedy end to the madness your son is wrapped up in. May you all be together real soon and decompress as a family unit and get all your lives back.
The Cof$ is just horrible!
Thanks for your concerns Yawnalot. That is what we are working towards. Sadly, we are probably just 1 of thousands of families that this messed up cult has destroyed. And they wonder why they can’t get new public into their orgs. They are self-destructing.
Hi clearlypissedoff, I hear you and I so feel for you. Yes even in my day horrible is so apt, and so much more to describe it. I send you love Ann.
Perhaps it really is only a matter of time for each individual still in, clearlypissedoff. Perhaps its necessary – in order for each person to really GET IT – perhaps it is necessary for each individual, whether SO, staff or public, to experience something very personally, to get the suppression full in the face, as it were, so that the suppression is really real to him or her, so that it is unmistakable as real suppression.
And if this is the case, then it is only a matter of when, not if, each Scientologist Still In, has their AHA moment wherein he or she says, “No. No more. I will not accept this anymore. This can never happen again”, and begins planning the leavetaking, or just blows.
I think that the more pressure the Co$ managment experiences is the worse they will treat the still ins, and the more likely that each still in will experience, directly and personally, the suppression.
I think the suppression has to be very real to the still in, to fuel the will to leave, and the courage to confront the unknown.
What I Yawnalot said. I was forced to disconnect from my mom while on staff in Hawai’i. She attempted suicide the minute she got home to Calif. Our cousin, who she was living with, came home from work early for the very first time and found her. She was able to get to a hospital in time to save her life. The guilt has never left me.
clearlypissedoff, many of us here are have family still in, too. We know your pain as we’ve gone through it ourselves. Our collective love goes out to you, your wife and any other family for friends that are affected by this. And, please, keep posting here! It’s a way for all of us to come together.
Peace & Blessings to you and your family…
Wow, what a sad story about your mother. I’m glad your cousin helped to save her!
I can see there is a lot of supportive people on this site. Mike and Marty have also been helpful to me. Your kind thoughts are greatly appreciated as well as from others here. Thank you!
You are very, very welcome, Clearly! Welcome to our world! It’s a very safe place.
And…thank YOU for your kind words. I was an only child so my mom felt she had NOTHING to live for. Hence the suicide attempt.
It’s good to have you here, clearlypissedoff.
Old Surfer Dude,
That must have been a real hurt in your heart. Glad you made it through.
Love and blessings to you my friend
Thank you so very much, Brian. I appreciate it so very much.
Hi OSD, I know if I have to cross over before you, please you and theta clear carry my torch my flame for me. So shattered about your Mom I am very sorry yet my family my up bringing had suicides and beatings too. Y’all that is why I stayed so long under the GO/Intell physical stuff. My late mother beat me for years til at 15 I told her never to touch me again.We are talking 50s 60s here and when your parents are rice and powerful no-one will believe you back then.You are a other anchor for me. Love,Ann.
Hi OSD Spell kill rich and powerful,Ann.
I know you’ve gone through quite a bit. It’s a wonder you never lost your mind when you were in. Ok, between you and me, whoever crosses first waits for the other…
Hi OSD, Thank you,it is a deal! For some reason as I wait for you or vice versa,no flying monkeys! The monkey room ai East Grinstead SH would really do a number on me! Love to you both! Ann.
Wow Dude… I truly feel for you and your family. Words fail me to express the ripple effect of the organisational dismay scientology inflicts on people. Thanks for sharing.
I guess the main reason I visit this site so often and try to give silly responses is to lighten the load scientology dumps on family. A day doesn’t go by when my wife and I don’t talk about the ‘good old days’ before our US family got fully immersed in that horror of an existence created by the church. Loneliness and longing for family unity just doesn’t go away.
Peace within life is tough enough but with scientology calling the shots it’s damn near impossible to fathom a better life is possible at all. That group truly needs to be disbanded.
The blindness created within the scientology group is the cruellest blow of all and to realise it’s all based on ‘help’ creates a new classification for humanitarian criminality.
Thanks, I Yawn. But, the cult’s time is winding down. No one’s afraid of the Big Bad Cult anymore. No more huffing and puffing to blow the door down…
Ouch. Heart. Hurt.
clearlypissedoff
Ditto what Old Surfer Dude said
My prayers and postulates are that this destruction of families will soon come to an end and you will see your son again. So many have suffered disconnection for no benefit to self or society. This abomination will not stand the test of time.
So sorry, clearlypissedoff. This is a good example of why people come to hate the CoS, and yes, it is self-destructing.
I hope you and your wife are doing okay.
The CoS wants to be your everything: your Mom, your Dad, brother, sister, spouse, son, daughter, best friend, co-worker, boyfriend, girlfriend, social contact, God, everything. The truth is, it can’t be and it’s inevitable that people wake up to this sooner or later. I hope your son gets wise to this very soon.
You know what they say: Just as LRH intended.
Yep! Just as LRH intended: Being enslaved and taking on, completely, Hubbard’s viewpoint.
I was thinking along the lines of: Get their balls in a vice, and squeeze until the money shoots out. Then call it “help.”
Now that’s a mental image I can do without!
And I thought I was a sick little puppy… geezers!
I Yawn, I don’t think you come close to me regarding being a ‘sick puppy.’ When I was still doing stand-up, I ALWAYS pushed the envelope as far as I could….then I pushed it more.
Boundaries are for whimps…
Ah, I knew you’d see the light! Boundaries are for wimps and Scientologists…
You mean it’s not “help?’ I ALWAYS gave money when I was in that situation.
I don’t think you gave it, you coughed it up!
Hey, I was keeping that a secret!
Do Scientologists really actually speak in that tone and manner? Or is that a slight exageration? Part of what makes me laugh when reading regraded being is the manner that they speak let alone what they say. I really want to meet some real Scientologists now just to hear how they speak. With all the “millions” of Scilons out there I’m sure to run into one sometime. Right?
You’ll do better to not meet some real Scientologists…
And you’ll know them by their, now famous, 1,000 yard stare.
Hi Edward. It has been my observation that when around non-scientologists most still-in folk behave quite civily and unless your ear is tuned to some very specific scientology-think patterns you would never know they were in scientology. Amongst themselves it’s a different story. Amongst parishoners, successes in life are generally credited to abilities gained through the application of scientology technology. Failures or lack of success are simply described as the need to better apply scientology. There is no talk about the organization itself except to repeat what you can read on the scientology website.
Sea Org and Staff members are quite harsh with each other and when things aren’t going well you’ll have to look hard to find a meaner group. They are very friendly and loving when parishoners are present but very critical of those who they deem to be ‘not with the program’. In private a chaplain or ethics officer or any other staff person who has decided to ‘help’ you will have absolutely no problem telling you that it is best for your survival that you separate from your spouse or any other family member they consider to be afainst the church. They will use praise and friendship as easily as they use insults and threats to get you to donate money.
When confronted with any negative ideas about the church, their behaivior can be quite bizarre. You can see a few examples on youtube. Start with Tory Christman’s videos and go from there.
Sea Org and Staff members are quite harsh with each other and when things aren’t going well you’ll have to look hard to find a meaner group. They are very friendly and loving when parishoners are present but very critical of those who they deem to be ‘not with the program’.
In my experience RB that is an understatement of some magnitude. I cannot find words without utilizing many expletives to describe what I witnessed frequently.
Actually, Edward, Regraded Being actually tones it down. Scientoloigy: It’s far, far worse than you think.
Scary stuff that its toned down. I’d still like to meet one one day. I’d like to be reg’d one day just to see how good/bad they are at it. Being from a sales background myself and knowing the sales tricks they use, I take great pleasure in leading on sales people especially phone telemarketers and door to door sales people letting them think I’m an easy mark and then just dragging it out. I figure the longer they spend time on me the less time they have trying to sell to some other poor sucker. Hmmmm… I have too much time on my hands.
Way…
Has everybody been getting hit with an unusual barrage of scn. commercials on YouTube recently? …
I punched in something totally disrelated, Louis CK, and there is this slick, new, commercial for Scientology offering me ANSWERS.
…
Just about made me sick. Then it happened again, next day, which was yesterday.
But, you know, no matter…
The Going Clear movie, Leah’s book, Tony Ortega’s book, this blog, all the other books and blogs… there is no way in heaven or hell these phony commercials, no matter how slick, are going to reach even ONE PERCENT, (maybe two?) of the grand total of viewers getting the truth from the ANTI-scientology side. Game over.
And the TV seems to be lit up with Leah’s book, making even more of a splash than the movie, or maybe the movie got the ball rolling, huh? This is just wonderful.
I remember a day (not long ago) that I felt the need to keep quiet
(thanks to brainwashing) about my past as a scn-gist.
What a release, letting that go…
What a revelation.
-Mark
Registrars are not about selling they are about crushing your will to resist, if they were trying to sell me something I didn’t believe in I would swiftly walk away – I put the phone down on sales people all the time – trouble is whilst I hated being ‘regged’ I felt they were trying to serve a noble purpose so it then became an exercise in “what could I minimally give in order to get out of the room and get home”. What I didn’t realize till too late is that when you have donated you immediately become a target. A friend of mine never gave more than a few $ simply because he gave them hell every time they tried to regge him, after a while he was pushed way down the list of possible targets. Not me, I got all the “big being” shit and never could work out why! Regges will make you the most amazing promises, one actually said they would help me get an extra job to cover the new monthly outgoings on a loan they were pushing me to take, once they have your money they could not care less, all promises are swiftly forgotten.
After I left had the central org’s phone number blocked on my cell and landline but before this it felt really good finally telling them to get lost when they came after me for donations
You asked in one of your earlier posts: “Do Scientologists really actually speak in that tone and manner?” Absolutely – I saw one Exec Director reduce a staff member to tears then shout at her for “case on post”. I was reduced to tears one time by an evil Sea Org woman who was demanding repeatedly I do something I really didn’t want to do. Stupid me, this all happened years ago yet I still stuck with scn for many years afterward.
You could always take a course at your local org and decide based on personal experience. Beware, love bombing is step one …………. the juicy stuff you are perhaps looking for comes a little later. Good luck!
Doing the balls in a vice trick per above might be more fun and produce faster results. Make sure you kick your twin in the face before you start.
It just so happens that my local org is in Mike Rinders old stomping ground. Adelaide Australia. On a long winded side note, I did try to go in there once not too long ago when i visited Adelaide (i live 400 miles away) and lo and behold it was shut so I googled it and it gave a status of “permanently shut”. I found it odd because looking through the windows all the displays of Dianetics books etc and personality test areas were still set up as if it could be opened tomorrow. So I just figured the scilons had abandoned it and couldnt be stuffed/ didnt want to pay for removing the contents of the shop. It could be pure coincidence and I may be having delusions of grandeur but I happened to mention it on an underground bunker discussion thread and then a couple days later it was no longer “permanently shut” on google. I’ll have to go back to confirm if its still in operation.
This is seriously excellent.
Seriously?
Excellent as always RB!
Bingo. Wow. Just Bingo.
That was priceless! Thanks for a good laugh!