I came across this Sea Org promotional piece from 1999. It was a time when there had not been the extensive exposure of abuses of children in scientology. And thus it reflects the true attitude of scientology — not the carefully worded utterances that are put forth these days (scientology.org is the epitome of scientology propaganda and it is the lead for most public statements now).
Here we witness the unvarnished (well, at least less varnished) side of how scientology views children.
Education outside scientology is not valued. In fact Hubbard derided it often — especially higher education (he dropped out of college and his disdain has not been disguised since).
Children should be put to work at a young age.
Scientologists are proud of their children joining the Sea Org at a young age.
These are some of the people featured on the inside pages.
Krystal is often featured in scientology PR videos, particularly the puff piece about the worker’s paradise that is Golden Era Productions. She and her sister formed about 50% of the African American population at Gold.
He joined the SO when he was 13. His parents were scientologists, just like Crystal’s.
Another “scientology kid” — I assume she is still at Gold “fixing” Hubbard lectures
Astra Croft was another scientology kid. She left the Sea Org after being in the Hole with her husband (after Parselle) Ryan Fear. Neither of them have ever spoken about the abuses they endured. Astra is the daughter of prominent scientologist hair salon owners in the UK.
Another scientology kid. Aaron ended up in the Hole also. No idea where he is now.
Don’t know if Dana was a scientology kid, but I assume so. No normal parent would send their child off to the Sea Org at age 14.
Hi Mike, I am from the UK and find it quite difficult to understand how scientology can break so many laws. In the UK children up to the age of 16 have to go to full time education by law. They are not allowed to work until a certain age for different jobs. Child abuse,Unlawful imprisonment ,Carrying guns or weapons and many things i have watched in your programme are against the law here regardless of whether it is a religious order or not. Are the laws in America slightly different to ours or does the church of scientology just ride rough shod over the law.
I have watched all the programmes and want to compliment you and Leah on exposing all the atrocities that go on under the supposed protection of a religious order. I can’t even imagine what the people who break away go through.
They must be truly amazing human beings. Keep up the good work, I can’t wait for another series.
Telling a child that they know everything, have experienced everything and have been everywhere already – and that their entire future (outside the SO) is a total, utter waste of time – is such a profound moral evil I can barely put it into words. It’s almost unfathomable.
And all based on the literal interpretation of garbled and preconditioned subconscious narratives vomited up during trance-induced dissociative states, as directed by a sociopathic drug user.
I saw a post at Tony’s regarding ESMB. Some kind of crazy conspiracy thinking about how people, prior to Aftermath, shouldn’t be “written out of history”.
WTF is that about? Alonzo’s name was at the top. Ugh… he’s the absolute worst in every way possible. Aside from FP, that is.
I left scientology in 1982 and never read a word about it until I watched “Going Clear” in 2015 which got me interested in taking another look. The first blog I participated on was Alanzo’s. He was helpful to me and gave me valuable feedback as I sorted through my past scientology experience.
Yes KatherineINCali, Alanzo is a pro-pedophile, pro criminal nut case. He visciosly attacked the kids who reported CoS sexual abuse. Along with Marty, Marildi and the like.
It’s way off topic but I’ll briefly summarize. I didn’t suffer any “damage” in scientology. I wrote it off that I had been in a “We know everything about everything” cult and left it at that. Even so I had carried forward several notions and beliefs from scientology that needed to be examined.
Alanzo was an early internet scientology critic and there are over 100 anti scientology topics on his blog. Why he “flipped” is speculation on motivation. He had some type of “epiphany” that being in a cult and getting out “strengthens you” and I’ll leave it at that.
Alonzo IS Foolproof. At least that is my opinion based on what Alonzo posts there and what FP posts here. Both continually bash Mike but say nothing about Marty, both never answer direct questions, both always turn the questions back at the people commenting, both will not reveal their real names yet bash others for hiding their identities, both say they are only trying to “correct misinformation” about Scamology and will argue and name call anyone who disagrees….I could go on and on about the similarities. He just recently got unbanned at ESMB and is having a ball over there causing a shitstorm which is why, correct me if I am wrong, he has been noticeably absent from here.
Top picture is in the Lebanon Hall at the Big Blue. Who does this to their kids?
Bottom left in the “Many are called..” ad is Roberta, long time staff at the Films and Equipment section at CMO Gold. Mixing up chemicals for photographic film developing. Cutting edge.
Krystal I guess is a lifer.
Don’t forget, Mike, the Director of Inspections & Reports (I won’t drop names of people possibly still up there who aren’t already publicly known) and the famous Online Editor are also black. The one that Dave Miscavige ordered Chris Guider to spit on. So was Skeeter, Sarah Lahde’s fellow team member (a nickname, a pretty insensitive one for a black man from the South but he always said he didn’t mind).
Sarah Lahde, doesn’t she look like the last time she slept all night was a few years ago? Well it was! All that equipment is what they use to make Hubbard’s decaying reel-to-reel tapes listenable. But Sarah and her partner Skeeter were busted out of there in the 90s and sent to the PAC RPF to work in the furniture mill.
The blurb calls her an “Assistant Sound Engineer” but she was really the Mix Admin, sort of a secretary who kept track of all the settings and paperwork. Skeeter was the Machine Operator, tuning up recorders and hitting the record button at (usually) the right time.
Dana Reid, also looks like a zombie in the shot and it is quite true. Sleep was optional on the Electrical Team because why would you need sleep when the 12,500 volt circuits will wake you up if you nod? The motto was “Who needs sleep? We’ll sleep when we’re dead!” She got involved in buying up surplus electrical gear to “save money”, ending up with mountains of useless equipment and wasting millions of dollars. Busted off the Int Base a long time ago. I hope her life since then has been better.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/flight-attendant-died-contracting-measles-154909131.html
SO MUCH FOR COS & THEIR ANTI VAX VIEWS
Tony has an excellent piece at his blog today. Another horrific story of child sexual abuse. That’s the one thing, that makes me the most angry.
You guys gotta read it. It’s about a girl named Victoria Locke. She was forced to apologize to her rapist (her own cousin for god’s sake) for “allowing him to rape her” (at age 11) and “putting his marriage at risk”.
I have no words. I cried. I wanted to kick that son of a bitch’s face in, along with anyone in $cientology who covered it up and did absolutely nothing to help this poor child.
Fuck you, $cientology. You claim to help, yet you do everything in your power to ruin people’s lives. You can all go straight to hell… if there is one.
Victoria’s story is one of the most devastating I have ever! But I just keep hearing more and more. Shocking. Bewildering!
Katherine, Victoria’s story IS yet another story that lowers the depths to which scientology can go. Sadly, there will be other people whose
“childhood” stories shock us even worse.[There is no real childhood for scn kids.]
AND, as far as “going to hell”, for many staff, Hell would be a vacation.
I have absolutely no doubt that other horrifying child sexual abuse stories will be told. It’s something that shocks and disgusts me to my core.
Child abuse in any form is what makes me most furious about the cult. The second is disconnection. Will someone please put these sick and soulless sons of bitches out of our misery??
I hope I see the cult’s demise in my lifetime. I’m 43. Here’s hoping…
KatherineINCali, I’m on the sidelines hoping for the same, [scn’s demise within my lifetime] at my current age of 67. My wife insists that I HAVE to live another 100 years so we can live up to our wedding vows, and has taken steps to ensure that I do, like making me take ALL my medications, go to the doctors at appropriate times, and other tortures. I HATE going to those vampires who so gleefully draw multiple vials of my blood for the blood tests (The next health-checklist to-do, IIRC). I’m somewhat heartened that she has to go through the same rituals AND do both of our drug-runs(to the pharmacy).Seems CVS has us on speed dial as they’re calling us about every other day for SOME medication that has come in.You’d think they’d stockpile extra supplies of the popular ones before the summer rush or something
In Aron Mason’s blurb the cult is giving a name check to the “prestigious New Yorker magazine.” It’s refreshing to see that they have finally come around to recognizing the stature of the magazine that published Lawrence Wright’s game-changing piece on Paul Haggis’ life and times in said cult.
To add to the irony: No small amount of scientology’s attacks on NYM were orchestrated by the very same “Freedom” propaganda organ that is taking up all available space behind young Aron.
This is wildly off-topic, but I think it may be of interest to people here. Scientology Clear and Patron Meritorious Joy Villa will be speaking at the Digital Soldiers Conference, which is allegedly associated with QAnon.
Tweet: https://twitter.com/ISNOINews/status/1161330748156047360
ESMB post: http://www.forum.exscn.net/threads/scientology-member-joy-villa-launching-exploratory-committee-into-a-congressional-run.44910/page-11#post-1219676
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Can’t make it – have to watch the paint dry.
I can help you with it.
I can’t make it either. Have to buy paint so I can go watch it dry with Scribe.
I immediatly recognized the first picture, as Tony Ortega has used it several times on his blog, e.g.
https://tonyortega.org/2017/10/27/kid-corps-scientology-wanted-to-turn-little-children-into-little-machines-of-sea-org-efficiency/
IIRC Sunny Pereira is on the picture.
This piece of propaganda is from 1999. Now, twenty years later, are they still able to recruit pre-teens and young teens?
Of COURSE they’re doing exactly the same thing 20 years later — and expecting that THIS time, it’ll work.
They aren’t allowed to think of something different, let alone act on it.
I shudder to think what they do with those pre-teen and younger teens. Old
OSD:
“I shudder to think what they do with those pre-teen and younger teens. Old”
working them like dogs, of course; unloved dogs at that.
Hopefully, they’ll have gotten the idea and stopped the sexual abuse somehow. IIRC, that’s at least out 2D, which was a no-no back in the day, and pretty reliably a fast route to the RPF. EVEN “Consenting Adults” were proscribed from any activity outside of marriage, that failed WOG institution(as demonstrated by Tubby’s inability to abide by the well-established rules)[Boy, did he have some MUss THERE!
It’s really tragic with those kids. I’d love to take everything down to the ground and then spit on it.
“GET ‘EM WHILE THEIR YOUNG”….FROM BIRTH if possible so they can be trained to be fully obedient and subservient to an adult’s whims, including the adult’s sexual proclivity toward children.
Adults have full power and control of a child who has no say in what it happening to them. Taken advantage of sexually at an adult’s whim, passed around like a piece of candy to be used again and again & NO ONE is there to protect or defend the innocent child.
Put them to work, including hard labor so they can “pay for their keep”….do NOT by ANY means educate them properly so that they come to realize what’s REALLY going on & that they DO HAVE RIGHTS……COS certainly doesn’t want them to know that.
Put the FEAR in them that the OUTSIDE world is an EVIL PLACE and that they WILL be harmed, even killed should they decide to try to leave COS. Lack of education and financial resources will keep them LOCKED IN, they’d have NOWHERE to go…..
Oh yes, let’s not FORGET DISCONNECTION….the threat of being cut off from the ONLY people the child really knows….or partially knows….their biological family….WELL, hold on a minute….let me rephrase that…the FAMILY THE KNOW IN THIS LIFETIME….
And so it goes…the child is always the VICTIM
Right, Balletlady: That’s how those in power have traditionally kept their positions: Keep the slaves or partitioners illiterate and unaware that there could be some other arrangement, that THEY could have power to change or fight the injustices. Kids without parents or anyone else to care for them are particularly vulnerable. Even when they’ve been told “these things shouldn’t happen”, they’ll hesitate to go to the appropriate authorities because they “know” they did something wrong to make the bad things happen or don’t want to ‘hurt’ their abusers or other justification. Then Tubby enhanced their guilty feelings by double-curving(his term) things so the victim was always GUILTY of crimes or they wouldn’t be nattering about their “betters” like that. What a sick puppy, who birthed one sick puppy of an organization where all higher-level human values were asserted to be “wrong”, weak, misguided, or whatever.
I can’t believe that I’ve missed something so obvious. While it’s a given that SO staff get virtually no auditing, I’ve never considered why that is. The “why” is as simple as it is obvious. SO staff aren’t “sessionable.” They’re physically and mentally unqualified for Scn processing. Even the most elementary level of auditor can tell you that step one of any session is to “fly ruds” (make sure that all the rudiments are in).
Primary rud: The PC must be fed and well rested. That alone probably disqualifies most SO members. But there’s much more. You cant’ audit a PC who has these “out ruds:” 1: An ARC break; 2: A present-time problem (PTP); 3: A missed withhold.
Simple, obvious, and ironic too. The supposed most elite group of Scios are also the most permanently impossible to audit. I can’t think of another Scn group who would have this level of chronic out ruds. And the double irony is that the only thing that would effectively handle all of this would be to leave the SO. What a facepalm moment.
Add to that this Hubbard gem: Competence is above case gain.
Is that how ant-man gets around his non-auditing status, ’cause he is so very “competent”.
Competence is above case gain? Bwahahahahahahahahahahah. Scientology continues to amaze me.
Chris – they don’t audit Sea Org Slaves because it is all a horrible hoax and scam. They use other methods to Keep Slaves Working….
All of it is manipulation, mind control and fraud.
Scientology does not work period!
To say parts of Scientology work…is like saying Heroin Works cuz I liked the first high.
Whether it works or not is completely beside the point. One need not buy into the tech in order to explain the procedures. Call it whatever you like, but it doesn’t change the fact that Hubbard wrote very specific rules and procedures that would be comparable to several sets of encyclopedias. And that doesn’t even take into account the hundreds of hours of tape lectures. If you’re going to understand scios and deal with them effectively, you have to know their system. What they do is predictable.
I think we’re mostly all agreed here on Scn’s bogus nature. I see no need to belabor that point. Those of you who want to fight back need to know and understand Scientologist at least as well as you know and understand yourselves. Perhaps even more so.
Chris: I know the subject very well.
For every piece of “tech”, there is an equal piece of opposite tech to explain why Scientology never works.
Sea Org slaves were told they would get the “Bridge” but they could never get their stats up…so they were not given anything.
That is how mind control works.
Covert invalidation and nullification are SOP in Scientology.
I think you may want to check out L Ron Hubbard’s Laws of Commotion. Hubbard never intended his Slaves to get auditing. He lied.
HelluvaHoax posts about it on Ex Scientology Message board
He is hilarious.
Again, you miss my point. And I think that it’s a point that needs to be understood. Check out my website for some possible clarification.
http://www.formerscientologistmagazine.com
Merely taking derogatory pot shots at the COS does nothing and is worth nothing.
“Taking derogatory pot shots at COS” does nothing and is nothing”
Truth = Derogatory Pot Shots
Just sayin….
I don’t care to try to decipher someone’s version of Scientology tech…. I am very clear as to how it harmed me and thousands of others.
Uh, okay, I think i’m the one missing something. It sounds like you’re both against Scientology…so what are you arguing about?
Disabused:
“Scientology does not work period!”
Truer words haven’t been spoken for a while.
You got that right, jere!
Chris, good post. When I was doing auditor training, we were given staff to audit our course requirements on. But the trouble was as you said, most of the time our pcs couldn’t get a metab on the meter due to lack of sleep and bad or no food. And when I was a paying pc, several times I had auditors dope off or fall asleep in a session. One did it after an all hands that lasted all night moving into new quarters. So the were awake all night moving mest and then had to audit the next day on no sleep and heavy work. Just when you think it can’t get any worse, in Scn it does.
And I assume you paid for this?
Well, I never did.
But, I can give you a couple of bucks. I don’t mind.
of COURSE the victim(s) paid for it, be it with dollars or their wasted time, or whatever. By definition, everything that happens to a scientologist, particularly staff, is THEIR own fault, not scientology’s or the auditor’s. EVEN that poor girl that Miscavige punched out in session back in St. Hill. Guess he spun it as her trying to leave the session and it was the only way he could stop her, she being much bigger and stronger than him, obviously.
Chris:”What a facepalm moment”.
DOUBLE face palm moment, IMO.
If one can trust the numbers the Clampire has put out:
There are 2064 Sea bOrg if you go by the man hours blurb.
There are 6275 Sea bOrg if you go by the population blurb.
$cienoes can’t even lie in a coherent, consistent manner. The same PR team put that crap together.
All those kids denied a basic education. Why is that tolerated? Because the Clampire pretends to actually educate their young Sea bOrg. Pretend with a capital P.
I do see the potential for many lawsuits in these admissions. And how many others were denied a basic education? I smell a class action in that tort able offense.
Zee Moo:
“If one can trust the numbers the Clampire has put out:”
Rarely is that a safe bet More oftentimes, their numbers are a priori fantasy.
Aron and later his Mom both on the PAC RPF; a twisted version of ‘All In The Family.’
Is there NO one who wasn’t subjected to the “prison detail” RPF? It was so obviously a wrong action after a while in my case that they let me go — FREE at last. It didn’t actually affect me as I was used to harder, more exacting work, and could and did run circles around a few of them who was in charge. The latter was EASY because most/all SO crew were in horrible shape.
Wow. I’m hoping Kat can use this as evidence for some complaint – and things like this ought to be collected somewhere they can readily be found and referenced by others as well.
This dovetails with Tony Ortega’s piece today about child sexual abuse in Scientology. I wonder if a bunch of suits are about to drop when the forthcoming New York law extended the statute of limitations takes effect.
Peacemaker, the change in NY law probably won’t affect many as very little of scn is sited in NY. Thus, it’ll take a change in California or federal law.
Peacemaker,
Unfortunately, I think the statute has probably expired on most of these, but if a pattern of abuse can be shown, as well as a concentrated coverup, there may be some way to get this moving up the chain. That would need someone a lot more versed in law than I am!! I will definitely forward the information to the people I’ve already been in contact with, but they would likely need a complaining witness for this.
Good God. How can you leave school at 12, 13, 14 and no one from the government, school board, etc. questions it?
“Hey, we’re a religion – fuck off!”
Dave
I’d like to get that punk in a small room with no way out. The screaming would lull me to sleep.
Dawn, I believe those days are over and now the cult is forced to wait until a kid is 16 when he or she is allowed to drop out of school. Then, with the parents’ permission, the cult can take the kid into the Sea Org. Parents’ permission is usually a no-brainer as the parents themselves believe that higher education is a waste of money. Conveniently, by dumping their kid in the SO they are relieved of the financial burden of the child and can instead feed that money into the cult’s gaping maw. And added benefit to such parents is that now they can brag about offloading their kid this way, to their fellow cult members. They actually BRAG about their kid dropping out of high school and, effectively, placing himself or herself within that demographic of uneducated, illiterate, unemployable American teens who survive God knows how – welfare, crime, etc. With the best of intentions these Scientology parents put their children on the fast track to nowhere and make losers out of their clueless kids. And brag about it! Seriously, you can’t make this up.
Dawn, scn will simply say they’re being ‘homeschooled’ in scn’s own very special classrooms. It’ll be a lie, but what’s one more lie to a scientologist?
Would love to know the SO’s recruitment numbers today. I’m guessing (not even really guessing…) that they are extremely low, having declined steadily from their peak in the 70s/early 80s. How many parents are giving their children up to Scn today, apart from adult recruitment into the SO, which is probably laughably low as well.
I haven’t ever understood “Many are called, few are chosen” either. Does that refer to how many people are pitched on the SO and how few actually join up? And LOL at the idea the process of recruiting and admission is selective in some way. Who exactly are they rejecting?
Should be changed to “Many are called, few are stupid enough.” Or “Many are culled, few are willing.”
Few are called, many are frozen.
Few are called. Many are in the Hole.
I’m with you, MarcAnon. And we all need to realize that the cult is shrinking by leaps and bounds.
A family asked me if I could go to the OC Org to see if their son is still there. I did, but, no sign of their son.
And, get this, they were hinting around for money!!! I politely said “no”.
The one thing I saw in abundance were frowns.
Were you known to them, or did they just hit some random person up for money who’d never set foot in the org before?
No. I went to the OC Org to see if could find a kid that was still in. Unfortunately, I never found him.
Change that to “Few are called, pretty much anyone is chosen” and you’d have it right. LOL! The Sea Org will accept – grab, actually – just about any living, breathing, ambulatory arrangement of human protoplasm clueless enough to sign the contract and physically healthy enough to do hard work for extended periods of time.
MarcAnon, “few are chosen has always been a joke. I never saw them reject anyone other than the obvious illegal PCs, seen by school counselors or institutionalized being the only “crimes” serious enough to have them reject you.
I believe I heard that a single LSD usage might disqualify someone, though doing the Purif supposedly “handled” such adequately. But, of course, my info is OLD. Others can bring my faulty memories into line, I’m sure. Still, the primary point is that they tried not to reject ANYone who signed that stupid “contract”. IMO, a valid contract gives quid pro quo, but the SO agreement simply signs your lives away for the next Billion years, with the SO promising NOTHING in return(other than verbal promises, which are unenforceable, IRL).
MarcAnon, “few are chosen has always been a joke. I never saw them reject anyone other than the obvious illegal PCs, seen by school counselors or institutionalized being the only “crimes” serious enough to have them reject you.
I’d agree with your assessment of recruitment bottoming out, as I’ve seen evidence that the insanity of SO life has filtered out to the public . Some very few still want to ignore the rumors and reach for that “star high goal”, which is commendable dream, but all too soon, I suspect reality shatters their dreams. I was SHOCKED when I joined to find myself in the EPF; a lowly go-fer despite being a trained auditor and professional cabinetmaker, never mind that I was quite a bit brighter than the average bear.
Many are called, few apply.
I feel the worst for the kids that ended up at Int Base (Aron Mason,Krystal Simmons, etc). Going to the Int Base is the kiss of death. In 1987 I was sent (exiled) from Int to LA. For the rest of my years in the SO, I dreaded above all else being sent back to Int. I had to occasionally go to Int for meetings and every time I dreaded not being allowed to leave – fortunately that never happened. Every time I would leave that base after a meeting or whatever we were doing, I experienced tremendous relief.
I certainly understand that feeling. My recurring nightmare (less frequent than they used to be, but still get them) is that I foolishly return to the Int Base and get stuck there despite my best laid plans. Usually I return to gather evidence or try to save someone and it all goes wrong. The “Worker’s Paradise” is in fact a hell on earth.
Yeah, I have had my share of bad dreams re: SO. In one I had a few years ago, which seemingly went on for hours and hours, I had been promoted to Int to work directly with Miscavige, and literally was spending my whole day with him. Nothing really happened, i.e. I did not get thrown in the whole, but I was petrified the whole time that something would set him off and I would be toast. LOL.
Mike, I’m so sorry you went through those reoccurring nightmares. That must have been Hell. But, that’s Scientology.
Yeah. Unfortunately I still have them.
Are you sessionable? 😂
Oh, that’s just so wrong. But if he is sessionable, put him on the cans and grill him. But, hey, that’s just me.
OSD, don’t “grill him”, just fly ruds its a, earlier its a to a grin and a win.
Isn’t that strange, I think Marc Headley also mentioned having Int Base dreams. I used to wake up from dreams like that in a full blown panic attack, barely able to breathe, but it has gotten easier over the years.
Had a dream once that the Int Base crew had done something that pleased Dave, so he had the RTC members passing out cupcakes and champagne on silver trays. Something like that is even more terrifying because you know it’s going to go wrong. And when it does, you’re probably going to be the scapegoat. Nobody but Dave wins at he Int Base.
YEs Bruce. I havent come across anyone who was there who has NOT had this symptom.
Unfortunately the nightmares people have about Int aren’t as bad than the real life experiences they suffered. As I said earlier I was exiled from Int at a point in time, which was good luck for me. Following that I observed over a period of years numerous ILO level staff/execs, many good friends, be called up to Int for projects, or “promoted” (really the right word probably is “sentenced”) there, never to be heard from again, or maybe seen at a doctor’s office with an escort some years later.
Every great once in a while I have one where I’m all alone in MCI and can’t get out. I can look over and see the Security Chief’s office door and that is all. I wake up in a panic. Weird.
Bruce:”Nobody but Dave wins at he Int Base.”
IMO, no one but the “Munchkin”™ wins ANYwhere in the cult he’s running.
Mike, I’m sure you are aware of this, but still having recurring nightmares, being that you have now been out several years, is a clear indication of PTSD. I work at a VA hospital doing direct patient care- I know PTSD signs.
Yes, thanks. I have been told this by a number of people.
Interestingly, I have yet to come across anyone who was at the Int Base that has not suffered from nightmares relating to being back there.
I would like to suggest that you file a lawsuit about the recurring nightmares.
I know the odds of your winning anything are almost zero. But the more lawsuits that are filed bring the tipping point closer. One of these days, this wealthy and powerful scam will tumble to the wails of pain coming from the people who have experienced the torture and you are one of the best representatives of that group. I know full well that filing a suit would be a pain in the *bleep* but I would still like to encourage you to consult a lawyer and find out the answer to the question of whether it is a total waste of time and money or whether any good whatsoever can come of such an action.
I’d like to hope that some good could come out of taking another punch at these bastards. No one (that I know) is in a better position to win such a suit. The cost of filing is tiny and the work involved is also tiny.
I may well be out of line making this suggestion. I suppose the odds are that you may well have tried this in the past. But if there is any chance at all that taking this action could possibly result in something good, I’d like to see you take another shot at these bastards.
Skyler, you need to study the US civil justice system for at LEAST a few minutes… 😉
Skyler, “And the purpose is not to win, but harass” Give the bastards a taste of their own tactics.
Skyler – I totally agree with you. Mike and others were tortured and David Miscavige was the guy who needs to go to prison for life for his crimes.
I was on org staff, not SO, out for 13 years now after 35 years in, and still about once a month, maybe every six weeks or so, I have what I call my “3D dreams” (nightmares). Always a variation of the same theme: I am back at the org doing something around people I use to know and have to hide from them that I am actually a declared SP, and also realizing that some of them must know that, and there’s a weird “push/pull” of my trying to stay and trying to leave at the same time. Weird.
Yep Joe, very similar for me. Org staff for 23 years and out now for 10. Probably not as intense or traumatizing as I’m guessing those who were at Int are haunted by, but still unnerving one way or another. Mine too have a recurring theme of wondering around my org (although it’s completely unrecognizeable physically) which is so packed and bustling that no one has the time to either recognize me or bother showing me the door. As you say, weird. But enough to wake me up with that disorientated and spooked feeling. Becoming less frequent as the years go by thankfully.
I really sympathize with anyone experiencing similar stuff – especially you ex Int execs. Hope there’s some closure soon.
I had it pretty easy compared to many of the folk who post here.
I was on staff at a Class V Org for 6 years.
I left at the end of my contract after refused to resign or even worse, join the Sea Org.
I had nightmares for years afterwards in which I had been talked into rejoining staff at my old org. In my case, the predominant emotion was not fear but exasperation.
The dreams always involved walking around an empty org and trying to drum up business It was all incredibly pointless and dreary.
Mike, “Gold” as a “workers’ paradise” is about on par with any of the so-called communist states’ “workers’ paradises”, but less believable, to those who know anything about scientology.
Mike, I elieve that if you did find yourself in that nightmare that you’d know that you could simply walk away, ignoring their protests. You also have the protection of being declared an SP: with superhuman powers able to defeat rooms-full of OTs, armed with only your mere presence. should they somehow trap you in Gold, they’d all soon get deathly sick; too ill to pursue you, much less try to physically restrain you.
YEs, of course. But nightmares are not usually long on logic and clear thinking 🙂
MIKE RINDER:”YEs, of course. But nightmares are not usually long on logic and clear thinking ”
With a little pre-thought, I’ve found it’s pretty easy to turn nightmares into directed dreaming where I can somewhat control the “action”.
Was handy after getting fired while I was on my first-ever vacation at one company. Company owner thought he was some sort of robber baron cum 17th Century English warship captain:”The floggings will continue until morale improves.”(Straight from a poster he sometimes posted near the Employee entrance — [rude word expunged] )That was the WORST place I ever worked, even edging out the FSO/SO/RPF for arbitrary, capricious, and spiteful rules. We only learned the rules AFTER we violated them, HE never wrote one down. My subconscious rained down disaster after disaster on him for a few years until I let my dander down. His shore house WAS carried away by Superstorm Sandy, as it happens.
He was SO proud of that ugly monument to runaway conspicuous consumption.
schadenfreude tastes so sweet.
“Another scientology kid. Aaron ended up in the Hole also. No idea where he is now.”
This is horrifying. No other organization has so many missing persons without any investigation from law enforcement.
Bitemark. NO police agencies consider someone as missing, and do a search, UNLESS they are reported not being where they ought to be BY A FAMILY MEMBER or other person CLOSE to the person.
There is NOTHING for police to investigate otherwise. Just because YOU don’t know where a person is that YOU aren’t connected to doesn’t mean they are missing. It means nothing to any police Dept.
Wynski offered:
“Bitemark. NO police agencies consider someone as missing, and do a search, UNLESS they are reported not being where they ought to be BY A FAMILY MEMBER or other person CLOSE to the person.”
So, maybe the plan of attack is to contact the relatives of known hole-dwellers and help THEM set up cases the police can’t simply stonewall. Might that be within the remit of the Aftermath Foundation? It might be more effective than handing out/distributing the Aftermath calling cards, though more work. The “sprung” hole-dwellers might then be willing to “contribute to the motion” of the suits, which could lead to all sorts of GOOD THINGS™.
Jere, sure you can do that. The police will contact the person if he’s at a local SO org and that will be that. The person will tell the cops to go away. Nothing new there.
Of all the horrors I have ever read on any news site, the many forums I used to visit and participate in, the exploitation of the young and old are the ones that make me want to chew through nails. The most vulnerable in society are the ones anyone with a conscience needs to do everything they can to protect, keep safe. They are such easy prey for the vultures if no one is paying attention. My dream is to send all the vultures to an isolated island where they don’t have anyone to prey on except each other.
Peggy, unfortunately it is the PARENTS of these kids – parents who are THEMSELVES victims – who hand over their children to the vultures. The cult vultures couldn’t GET TO the kids without the parents’s full agreement and cooperation. I point this out not to make the parents wrong, because, again, they are THEMSELVES cult victims. They so what they do with the best of intentions for their children. When you need to solve a problem you FIRST need to identify what the problem really IS. Scientology has NO power to snatch children, wailing and screaming, from their loving parents’ arms. Nor can one or two conversations in which the cult badmouths their parents to their kids be enough to turn said kids against their parents forever. No way. From day one these kids have been conditioned to think this way. From the day they’re BORN into Scientology of Scientology parents, from the day these kids are old enough to talk and understand, said parents are setting their kids up to one day become full fledged robots to one day be appropriated by the cult/ And if the parents acquiesce, fine, and if they don’t, well, the kids already know that “the greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics” is to dispose of anyone, including and in fact especially their parents “quietly and without sorrow.”
Aquamarine, thank you for your reply. I first sincerely want to apologize if I came across as targeting only scientology parents. I know those of you who were in know the manipulation all too well. No one who was never in that situation could ever really understand. That occurs in the outside of the bubble world too.
Last night child abuse cases I had followed just came back to me, and the ones I personally became aware of, and that feeling of being helpless to protect them when you had no idea. There was only one that I was made aware in of in time and did go to a person I trusted to act upon it. They did and that child was removed from the mother (and abusive brother) and went to live with their father.
I have a lot of respect for what everyone here does to shine a very bright light on what has, and continues, happening within the cult. By speaking up you are educating the outside on the dangers.
Peggy, thanks for your response. I didn’t take it that way at all. Then intent of your communication was very clear to me. And let me be fair also: some of the most caring, in communication parents I’ve ever seen have been Scientologists. ( I am not a parent btw.) There was no doubt that the Scientology parents I knew loved their children wholly and truly wanted what they believed was best for the kids. The problem is that Scientology teaches – drills it into a person, actually, that loving relationships, blood relationships – ANY and ALL relationships, actually, are expendable because they are ONLY part of THIS lifetime, and we ALL have lived many, many etc. etc. lifetimes and will continue to do so. Ergo, if your mother is disagreeing strongly with something, or your father is acting up and refusing to cooperate and donate the right amount of money, etc., well, they’re expendable. You can get rid of them. You can disconnect and hope that they come to their senses. THAT is what Scientology kids learn, what they have drilled into them, from the day they are born. They are thetans, all of us are all thetans, who have lived many lives, with a different body each lifetime. Only by adhering strictly to the cult’s rules do you have an “eternity” that will not be a dark horror. Your eternity is more important than ANY relationship with someone who is giving the cult trouble in some way. If that person, no matter how much you love him or her, cannot be “handled”, then you MUST disconnect. You see, this is what they learn. They’re trained in the cult to have hearts of ice. And their parents put them there. The good news is that with some kids the training doesn’t take. The bad news is that with many of them, it does.
Peggy, sometimes I have to treat all this as if it were a movie: It’s not really real. In fact, it’s all insanity that seems to be self-destructing quite completely under the Munchkin’s® firm management. No one else could as good a job as he’s doing; they’re too committed to reaching the goals Tubby described, then abandoned.
As the Internet Fora mature, it’s becoming easier for those damaged by DM’s self-made cult to get together to heal each other. One potentially GIANT part of that may be the Aftermath Foundation. The Foundation’s primary problems are that those still in probably haven’t heard of it, or have and rejected the very CONCEPT of its purpose.
Thank you Aquamarine and Jere lull, you are sweethearts to understand what I realize I may not expressing well. Sometimes things sound better in my head than they come across in writing. (amazingly not everyone gets me)
I am really beginning (I hope) to understand that the cult hard wires the rules and regulations into the heads of the members. They have even their private thoughts programmed to run the other way and never ever talk about them to anyone. Well, maybe in auditing?
It has to be an agonizing decision to break free knowing what could happen, but inside that bubble there’s nothing you can do protect yourself let alone those you care about.
The greater good – yea, right. Greater good for whom?
And – those papers they are coerced to sign! Damn the cult law agency. They have to know what goes on unless they are idiots. Why else would they provide these documents members have to sign if it isn’t to cover the butt of DM and the abuses he without a doubt has to personally OK. What a horrible trap and premeditated protection from liability.
Their minds are really lost Who on earth will promote recruiting kids? (Well, of course, with miscavige as a leader what can you expect?).
It is amazing how far scientology’s insanity can go…unbelievable.
What can you expect? Not a God Damn thing.
Dana Reid didn’t create the electrical team at Gold. She took over from her boss, a guy named Wells after he fled from the Int Base insanity. As far ass I know he is an UTR guy now.
Wells was busted to the Big Blue, last I knew of him he was working as a Volunteer Minister in the big yellow tent. But there have been several on the Electrical team. Dana got busted for her husband’s extravagant mistakes (long story) and has been out of there a long time now. At least 20 years.
Wynski, did you know Mick Thompson (sp?) who went to Gold a long time ago now?
No, must have been after my time. When was it?