A revealing look inside the mind of the scientology vultures comes by way of an email from the infamous Barbara Dews,.
It’s all about the “close” to extract money from the mark.
These are the tricks to getting someone to give you their money — removing their “brick overcoats” of objections to handing over their money. My favorite is the “Unattached Female Buyer” — get her with flattery. Nothing like some good old 50’s sexism brought forward into today’s world. Why? Because in the 1970’s L. Ron Hubbard recommended this book, so this horribly outdated drivel will endure for all time as the gospel on how to sucker cash out of unwilling prospects.
It all sounds so “religious” and “caring” and “public benefit.”
The bottom of the scientology barrel has a really unpleasant aroma…. Down there where the various and numerous reges slosh around.
PS: How does this square at all with the notion that the money scientology rakes in are “donations”
PPS: You can argue that all churches solicit funds, but the only ones that make this part of their “doctrine” are the creepy “TV ministries” that are derided by satirists and comics and are routinely shut down by the IRS.
I attended a Les Dane sales seminar in London in the early 90s with some other UK hotshots.
“In his singular planetary genius, COB RTC David Miscavige long ago realized that women are stupid and weak-headed and can be easily lied to and manipulated…”
….Lou! What are you doing my office?! I told you to stay out when I’m posting on Rinder’s blog!
No you can’t read what I just wrote… Lou! No! *POW* Lou, no! Stop! I wasn’t talking about you! *KAPOW* OMG Lou, I didn’t say you were stupid *GRAB* Lou leggo my testes pleeeeease!
HCO bring order! Danny! Warren! Norman! Someone please save me from this mad woman!
Hi OTVIIIisGrrr8, I have enjoyed your posts for quite awhile now, but this one is a keeper and thank you for pure laughter! Love, Ann.
During the time I worked for Pizza Hut I was an effective driver and took a proactive stance with tasks such as dish washing and store maintenance. I even helped out on making some the simpler items on the menu. The stone manager liked this and paid me above the standard rate.
But there was a problem, when I would call in an order for food for myself I hated the push to buy items I didn’t want and I refrained from using those tactics when taking orders on the phone. The local franchise holder was monitoring the phones and noted that wasn’t pushing the customers and the woman in charge of training tried to correct this. She ordered me to call other stores and pretend to place orders and then rate how the person on line was performing.
Now in the United States Army when someone fails at a task I training they have to do the procedure over again until they do it right. So from my view the order was wrong and I reused to follow it.
I was fired.
No matter how you look at it the Church works on arrogance……….
Full stop…. with almost anything it does
WELL an old Italian saying (translated into in English) says:- Arrogance goes by horse, but returns on foot
With so few koolaiders (about 20k world wide) left in the cherch, surely Davey’s GI stat is going down… down … down… Probably about 0.00% of the 20 000 are whales – I’m guessing. My observation over the years is that most koolaiders struggle financially to stay in scientology.
He’s panicking, of that I’m sure. What a lovely thought to start the week with.
hmmm,
the purpose of marketing is to drive in more people than the org can waste.
huh, what about 100% standard tech will handle anybody, why are the orgs wasting people?
Oh, there’s PR Area Control too.
GAT1 and GAT11?
I’m rolling over from laughing my ass off.
Dude! I’m sooooo wasted! Where did you get this great pliff?
Les Dane’s book is creepy, sexist, and outdated. Scientology’s recruitment is running on fumes, no one is buying what Miscavige is selling. Dane’s book will not change that, its techniques will not recruit anyone. I doubt it is being used for recruitment anyway. At best, it is being used to break the “brick overcoats” of a few wealthy members. At worst, it is being used by Miscavige as a test that members are surely failing, thereby giving him his greatest joy–pounding people, literally and figuratively, until they have no self-esteem.
Les Dane was an incompetent. Time has not changed that. Anyone who uses Les Dane’s book is a crappy sales person.
If a job applicant told me they used Les Dane’s techniques I’d politely but firmly show them the door. If an employee started using Les Dane’s techniques, I’d talk to,them, and if they wouldn’t stop I’d fire them immediately.
Hi Wayne Borean, Good to see your post! Even better your take on Mr. Dane. A Big Thank You. Love, Ann.
saw the mission holder of los feliz, patrick renna. he followed the COB model and fundraised his way into a new building.
I don’t have any idea who Les Dane was or is other than a fantastic car salesman who wrote a book or two about sales, but I must say I think he would be unhappy if he knew that Scientology uses his material to fleece people out of hard earned money.
He sure wasn’t unhappy when the Scilons hired him on to do lectures about how to do sales in the 80s and 90s. I’m sure he was pleased as punch when the checks cleared.
Hi Espiando, You know I love more of your posts each time I read.XO Ann.
Do you think that the low-life who wrote Big League Sales would not be happy that it was being successfully applied? I tend to disagree. As a matter of fact, didn’t Dane actually work for Scientology, like delivering seminars, at some point?
Hi hgc10, I liked your post. I do not want to speak for anyone else, but I am in agreement with you. BLS seemed to me from the start out-Source and I never cared for the book at all. Laughter those who have known my posts awhile here, know my likes and dislikes!
Those who have no problem with the book or have used it to their benefit fine.However I had a Supervisor Dissemination Head who had a very strict constructionist take on regging.Get all you can get and then do it again! BLS was her bible,when I would start originating about free everything if it was what was promised.Ann no wonder she was always after you! Love, Ann B.
Yes, I attended one at Flag.
I answered some key question at the seminar and he handed me $20 on the spot.
Hi Corky,It is good to meet you.Your post is perfect,my first laugh of the morning here in Baton Rouge,LA.Always,Ann.
Coincidentally, i’m in the middle of reading Surefire Sales Closing Techniques. I was curious about it due to its association with Scientology. Seems like a simple, not necessarily sleazy book on sales. I got it used for about $40. So far I haven’t read anything about showing up at a prospect’s house in the middle of the night, locking them in a room for 12 hours at a time and getting them to over extend their credit limit. Maybe that comes later though. My guess is that Scientology could have taught Les Dane a thing or two about squeezing marks dry.
Hi Thomas Weeks, I enjoyed your post. All the latter situations you posted are written in invisible ink, and magically appear when one word clears BLS for the millionth time! Always, Ann.
Can I ask where you bought it used? I want to sell both my books, “Big League Sales Closing Techniques” and “Make It Rich Prospecting” by Les Dane and need to know where to advertise it?
Cindy, ebay has listings for Les Dane books, there are usually a few people selling them at any time and for pretty high prices… so you might try selling them on ebay.
I’m not sure what the appeal is for his books, as there seem to be other sales techniques books these days that are more comprehensive and up-to-date than those; maybe it’s just that these were originals that also encompassed the psychology of selling? I’m not sure.
As I posted earlier, I read the book online for free from an online library. I thought Les Dane came across as very unethical. As far as sales techniques, they were probably effective for that time period, but are a bit outdated now.
I know for sure that I could never work in sales. I guess it takes a certain personality. Some people enjoy matching up people to things they need, I can understand their fulfillment in doing that, but Les Dane just wanted to sell stuff to people, regardless if they needed it or not.
Wait just a minute…is this Barbara Dews a scientologists or is she a sales manager for some company? She said, “Happy selling freedom & let me know any help that you need! Don’t forget to send me your suckers…….my bad, prospects!” This certainly sounds like transactions are going on with the reminder to the salesperson to send their prospects to this Barbara gal, where I guess she’s supposed to close them. As any salesman worth is salt, would certainly do! So…this is a business, right? I mean, if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, flies like a duck, it’s a business!
I went to Flag for a Les Dane Seminar with Les Dane.
The first thing he did was instruct us to go to the chapter
where you calculate how much the”Mark” can afford
and cross out each page because it’s wrong ( the formula)
Then he gave us the correct data.( verbal data)
Big League Sales was squirrel from the day it was printed,
it has been twisted and perverted even more ever after.
Mostly with BLACK Dianetics and REVERSE Scientology.
Hi Jose Chung, You made my evening, thank you! I know what I recall from my time in Sea Org Asho Fdn was not crazy memories,but backwards application of tech, it was what I thought was Truth reversed.That is sobering still.And Ron knew this but honestly I can never say if he hand picked dm or not, I have read a little on that, but I have no knowledge of what actually happened.
I feel the point is,whoever is head of cos man or woman after dm,will be hard pressed to continue the current course of deception as the veil between Scientology’s version and the truth grows thinner and thinner for the cult by the second. Love Always, Ann.
I’ve got a question for those who were in in the 90s and beyond: Barbara Dews states here that Big League Sales is a book that LRH “recommends”, present tense. As we see every Thursday, Mighty My Mammy is “the org LRH counts on”, present tense. LRH, of course, has been dead for thirty years as of last month. There is nothing present or tense about him.
Are Scientologists forbidden from acknowledging this little fact? Or is this some sort of social conditioning like with the Hip Hip Hooray crap? Please don’t tell me it’s because they believe what DM said at the LRH Death Disco about Target Two and all that. Gullibility has to have some sort of limit, although it’s stretched in the case of everything in Scientology, like OTIII and the Putrif.
Does Les Dane have anything to say in his magic tome about cannibalizing your customer base? Because that’s what they’re doing right now. Twenty thousand and falling…
You know, the problem with cannibalism is that you eventually run out of other people to eat.
Brilliant!
Who’s freaking out with staffers at Int Base
Screaming at everybody he sees?
Who’s reaching out to order more sec checks?
Everyone knows it’s Davey
And Davey has stormy eyes
That go with his tortured lies
While Davey chants “Let him die”
Into the phone
Who’s hanging out with TC in LA
Hoping the media captures the scene
Who’s living off the public with money?
Everyone knows it’s Davey
Terrific parody, Gadfly!
Yeah, Mike, Barb seems to be a real peach. A little back-story on the use of Big League Sales, is that I believe Alan Walter first introduced it into scientology circles. Back in ’73, we had a pretty fair number of realtors and car salesmen on lines at the Sacto (Arden) mission, and Alan (known to be a pretty fair hustler himself) thought that we could do some sales training for these folks to help ’em make more money in their jobs, which would give them more money to “go up the bridge”. So we put together a course with the book, some beefed up TR’s and Upper Indocs, and, voila, we had public making a ton of money. Word about the course- and the book got to the orgs, ‘cuz that’s where these guys went for upper levels. In those days, of course, there no church fundraising or soliciting for donations unattached to services, but some of the reg’s may have familiarized themselves with the book to increase personal stats, but I don’t ever remember it being a regular regging tool even up until I exited in late ’80. DM, of course, can *smell* money lines like a pig searching for truffles, and so was bound to come across this little gem as he proceeded to destroy all the missions, and may well have gotten Hubbard to give it a nod before ’86. Then DM, as he did with everything, perverted it into subjugation, sabotage, debasement, and ruination of those who refused to recognize who and what he is. The book itself, seemed to me a little dated even back then, but it did provide sales people with an opportunity to take an objective view of the mechanics of their jobs- much like the TR’s do for communication. Otherwise, it was just another book on how to sell.
Ever notice how much the behavior of salespeople mirrors the behavior of carnies trying to lure you into playing games at a fair? I grew up in a larger metro area, but my grandparents and cousins lived in a small town – only thirty years ago and they still had a drug store with a soda fountain in it – a couple of hours away and we spent A LOT of time in that small town. Twice a year the fair would come, and I learned at a very young age how to avoid carnies – just keep on walking. And when they would get really obnoxious, calling you things like “pretty lady” before you were old enough to be called miss, you wave them away in a pointed fashion, with as much venom in your eyes as you like.
I loathe sales, I loathe sales tactics, and in too many cases I loathe sales people. Trying to hard-sell me something that I haven’t specifically asked you for information about, is the quickest way to turn me around and send me out the door. And if you lead with bullshit compliments, I won’t be back no matter what you’re selling.
People hawking the CoS are exactly like MLM and business-scammers – con artists who’ll do anything to sell you the magic bean, even if it means taking your last cow.
@clever I despise salepeople so much to the point that even if I have specifically asked for information on something, the easiest way to get me to not buy it is to hard sell it.
If I want it after I get the info, I will buy it, if someone feels they have to sell it rather than just give me the info I will refuse to buy the product from that person whether or not I want it.
I actually walked out of a car dealership once when I had come in with the funds in hand to purchase the vehicle because I felt pressured to buy. I went to a dealership elswhere in town and bought the same vehicle.
Attempting to force me to make a decision RIGHT THEN will always result in NO being the answer.
@Valerie – I’ve never been in a position to walk-out as you described, but I certainly would.
What’s funny is the whole “unattached female” method has been used for so long, that I think made a lot of women resentful of all persuasion techniques and those who employ them. One of the things that makes me craziest in this world, is people who treat me like an easy mark. If you think blind flattery, condescension and emotional manipulation will work on me, not only are you not worthy of my time and/or money, you aren’t even worthy of civility and respect. Too many years of having men who’ve never even seen my photo call me beautiful, having mechanics try to upsell me on services I don’t need and listening to male support techs explain RAM to me like I just woke up in 1975, have made me impatient for anyone who thinks that my female brain is ripe for being led down the primrose path.
Please don’t be one of those IMPATIENT females! A guy likes to feel smart next to a woman. Can’t you see your way to cooing, “Oh you’re so smart! and look at all those muscles!” ? Would it kill you?
Yes Roger, I’m afraid it would kill me. At least it would kill my self-respect, and with it, it would destroy my self-identity. If a guy’s ego will falter without my stroking it, or worse yet reducing my own, he’s shit out of luck.
That’s another element of the old-school male superiority racket I’ve never understood either. Why do they imagine only men have pride, ego or self-worth that needs to be protected or elevated? If I’m in a relationship with a man, it can make him feel emasculated if I make more money than him, if I’m demonstrably smarter than him, if I’m better at sports or physical pursuits, if I’m just more successful than him. But it never seems to come up, what it would do to my pride and ego, to avoid success and downplay my intelligence, just to make him feel better about himself. I guess to that antiquated mindset, the woman’s pride comes strictly from her children, her household, and her husband’s accomplishments.
For all the issues we still have with equality in this world, it’s a good thing I’m lucky to been living in the time and place I am. If I lived in a time or place where anyone with a brain actually expected me to sacrifice my own self-worth to protect a man’s, I’d go insane.
@clever, LOL I don’t know if you will come back to this thread but I once told a guy “sorry, I can’t date a guy whose neck is thicker than his head” Ooops! shoulda stroked his muscles. Nah, I would have puked.
Valerie: In an constant effort to streamline my life, I no longer email subscribe to blogs, newsfeeds or even individual threads – I do everything via RSS these days.. When I want to track comments on a thread, I stick it in my RSS reader for a few days. So yeah, I’m generally keeping up with an individual thread for a bit before I stop.
Don’t get me wrong, there are men I wouldn’t mind stroking and cooing over – non-euphemistically of course. But there are men who expect it and barely appreciate it, and there are men who appreciate it but would never expect it. I have zero interest in the former.
Though that’s good line. I also avoid dating men who are physically intimidating – residual from an ex who thought it was fun to pin me to the floor for extended periods to prove that he could – and the neck to head ratio would be a valid remark to detract such men. And I can adjust the snark level based on how bad I feel turning them down. 🙂
“Split up the family if you can…”
Jefferson Hawkins, I adore you. I read your awesome book “Counterfeit Dreams” some time ago and you are the only author who ever wrote me back when I emailed you to say how terrific I thought your book was. Just a nice friendly little note, it was quite some time ago, no reason you would remember me amongst your many correspondences, but it stayed in my mind. 🙂 I hope life is treating you well these days… I intend to read your newest book “Closing Minds” very soon, I’m sure it will be as wonderful as your prior writings. Much respect and admiration to you for how you conduct your life and the efforts you make to help others. – T.J.
I completely agree, JH really reached me with his book, it gave such a clear sense of the utter degradation and abuse. I found myself literally cheering when his brother also made it out. I was also surprised that Jeff answered me as well. His book more than any other left me morally feeling compelled to do something.
I was intrigued by the constant mentions of Les Dane’s book “Big League Sales Closing Techniques” a couple of years ago, so I searched for it. I discovered that it was out of print, and used copies were being sold on ebay by various sellers for more than $120! No way would I pay that much for a used paperback, so I was able to get a copy for free from an online library. Not the hard copy, but I was able to read it online, the whole book, including illustrations, and I then made a copy for myself. I actually felt ill from reading it, the man really has no integrity. I echo the comments made of manipulative and misogynistic, the man lived to sell and did not care about those he sold to. I also agree with the poster who said that reading it helped to be able to resist sales techniques.
Les Dane’s book was re-titled several years after publication, (I think it’s now named “Surefire Sales Techniques”) and it was then put back out in the marketplace, but it’s the exact same book, just with another title. I did a search today out of curiosity and found it’s still high priced; a used copy on Amazon starts at $125 and newer copies are being sold for over $300. I found a used copy of the re-titled Les Dane “Surefire Sales Technique” (same as Big League Sales) on sale today on ebay for $175, the description says: “Very good condition, has one word, “Qual” written on the inside of front page…”
Hi T.J., Isn’t it amazing where Qual keeps popping up! I’m with you, I would never pay a cent for any tome by Mr. Dane no matter how repackaged.I would say buyer beware to those that succumb.Always,Ann
I haven’t read Dane’s book, but “Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion” by Robert Cialdini is written by a psychology professor on techniques used in advertising and sales. (And many of the techniques are also used to gain undue influence, of course.) Recommended.
Thanks for the book suggestion, I ordered it online based on your recommendation. – T.J.
Although I am now married and have been since 2006, I have had “Unattached Female Buyer” run on me by salesman for lots of years when I was single.
How did that work out?
The minute they went into “Unattached Female Buyer” mode, I went into “you just lost a sale” mode.
There were times I even pointed out to the salesman in question that he was using tactics from “Big League Sales” on me and that’s why I wasn’t going to buy from him. One idiot tried the tactic “oh you’re so smart to see through that” after I pointed it out. Yeah, didn’t work. I laughed in his face.
I guess for the people who are still in, it may still work, but looking at the truth in numbers from the masses exiting, it appears as though the hard sale still is not working. Maybe it’s time to try something new? Too bad that’s not an option.
My long since ex husband (I got rid of him and scientology over 30 years ago) has always operated on the dark grey side of the law when it comes to financial dealings.
Why do I tell you this? Because when we were still married and still in we called them DIAMONDetics and SCAMatology.
In the 1980s when we started pulling away, HE commented that they were the most ruthless money grubbers on the planet. When the pot calls the kettle black and runs away from it, there is something there IMHO.
Hi Valerie, Thank you, the terms you both came up with back then,classic! Happy ?Day to you & yours.Love,Ann.
Ann, back when I was little, I believed today was a day invented just for me VALentines day. So I’m enjoying happy me day. 🙂
Hi Valerie, I love that. Enjoy enjoy your special day! xo Ann.
I dig my lady so much that I think every day should be Valentines day. How does it get better than this?
Wow! you & your Ex knew the truth back then! I am impressed
What an incredibly sickening subject. It made my butt go tight and my eyes narrow even in the enthusiastic 80s when I saw the vulturism ripping money of staff members who could not afford it and were literally sacrificing the food off their table. Seeing many struggling public do the most drastic things like sell their apartments and homes to handing over their life insurance, family savings & kids education fund. For a brief time there was a “high” around the org as the commitment was made and their freedom assured. But one by one a black curtain slowly descended and the promises so lavishly given then gave way to even more reasons and excuses why even more money was urgently needed. Policy stated one thing but the actions of regges and execs did another. It took varying amounts of time for individuals to wake up and some never did but the scamming of scientology would have to rate as the most despicable and low life endeavour ever experienced and witnessed. What always staggered me was the worst of the vultures were never trained, couldn’t and wouldn’t audit and strutted around as complete experts on a subject they knew nothing about. All they knew how to do was use that horrible technique as written and endorsed in that email above – it’s poison!
Few things I actually hate in this life but scientology as presented is high on the list as the worst of socialist endeavours forwarded by low life assholes. It’s a cancerous vampire that is finally beginning to fall to its knees. The only true sentiment to life in all this mess is that every penny in the scientology coffers stands in testament to those poor souls who put their help and hope of a better life for mankind before their own. It is spiritual blood money and those they revel in it have no idea of the consequences. A dark tomorrow awaits for those that spend it on themselves or worship it as the end game.
The money of scientology, think about it… Would you wear a Nazi gold chain?
Hi I Yawnalot, A bravo post,thank you.Happy ❤️ Day, Love, Ann.
Ditto!
sex appealk has always been used by sellers to get clients. It become more difficult to see when such an old ugly fatman like Hubbard or an old shortlegged mean guy like DM have still a bit of attraction to sell their shitscam.
Hi Mike, Oh no, first I have Quinn and now Les Dane!! I will never ever forget the roasting to a Crisp I got because I was not closing all in sight 100% of the time. And I loved your comment on the ” unattached female buyer” I am all for romance but I suddenly saw along with BLS,as much as I wanted male and female to be totally equal in tasks etc in the Sea Org.I now see the mid-70s were a re-run of the mid-50s.The amount of honeys,up-stat honey, darling honey I got every SO1 reply, no wonder at a young age I fell for it! But when I was down-stat it was get your condition to Normal at least or else! Laughter,Love,Ann
“Our greatest unhappiness comes from always wanting something more, something else.”
Didn’t Hubbard also recommend the Tao Te Ching by Lao-tzu? No, probably not.
Hi RogerHornaday, Now your post is funny! Thank you.From my heart to yours, Happy Always,Ann.
He recommended the Art of War by Sun Tzu and perhaps the writings of Otto von Bismark also. There were other Intelligence books but I have forgotten. They were part of GO and OSA training.
Certainly Sun Tzu. Not heard about Bismarck. But definitely “On War” by Carl von Clausewitz. “Black Boomerang” BY Sefton Delmer and “The Spy and His Masters” and “A Short Course In The Secret War” by “Christopher Felix” (James McCargar)
The one I remember best from Dane’s book is the “Ice Water Dip”.
His example was of an elderly woman refusing to be closed on the new car. The salesman then relates the terrible accident involving the very model she is currently driving.
Her reply “Young man, give me those loan papers. I’m not going to endanger my family!”
Dane’s methods are so effing slimy. Everyone was a mark to be manipulated by him and his followers.
Every week at Flag there is a printed list of every public person that is scheduled to arrive that week. It is called the “Arrivals List”. Every reg on the base is given a copy and a “Reg Meeting” is held. Every public that is arriving to Flag for the first time is labeled as being in one of the 4 groups as covered in Big League Sales or BLS as it is commonly referred to. Their “group” is determined by previous intelligence gathered on the person. Based on what the persons “buyer type” is, they are assigned to the reg which is most likely to get the most money from the person. Lets say the new arrival is a single female. She will be assigned to a male. As a note, the financial and personal intelligence gathered on these “prospects” is extreme to say the least. That intelligence information is often traded and bartered between the different reg units. Also, if anything comes up in the persons counseling (auditing) that could be useful to the assigned reg, the information is immediately given to the reg. Staff can be awarded “bird dog” awards for passing on good information. Its usually a coupon that can be used in the Canteen to get a free protein drink or even a free meal in one of the “church” restaurants. When a public person walks onto the Flag base they are walking into a well oiled machine, tuned and geared to do one thing. Extract maximum MONEY, period.
OMG! That is just amazing what sharks these regges have turned into. I don’t remember those sharks being that hungry when I was on the Apollo when they had FCCI’s on board.
It would be nice intelligence if someone could get a hold on those weekly “Arrivals List” to see how this list probably keeps on shrinking in numbers.
I must have been labeled “No 1 Patsy.” I noticed, even after I finished 8 and thought I was done with their shit, that whenever my husband was “going in on his Refresher,” I would be called in to be regged WITH him by the IAS – even when I told my husband (because I was so sick of it), “Give the IAS what you want; whatever you decide; I don’t care; I will not go in on another reg cycle.” Even that didn’t work cuz I got a report written on me for THAT too.
Mat, thank you for this info. This was a disgusting setup of the unsuspecting public. I was also shocked to learn that the reges had listening devices in their individual reg offices. If you were in there being regged for money with your husband or another person, the reg would make some excuse of why he had to leave his office for a few minutes. Then he’d go listen in to what conversations you were having with the other person discussing your finances, or more likely, hear you figuring out how to lie your ass off about having no money. They did not tell you anything about their hidden microphones. It just turns my stomach how deceitful and manipulative they are.
I learned that they were a bunch of money grabbers quite early on, it never made sense to me that you had signed up for a named service and yet you had this ridiculously long routing form to complete before you could start it. The routing form was just so they can put you in front of every regge in the place for their chance at a piece of you. I even complained about this locally – a waste of time of course. They don’t seem to realize that just like the store with pushy sales assistants which you learn to avoid, similarly you learn to avoid scn.
To me these sales techniques where irrelevant, I was not sold on any of it, I just paid what I could get away with to get out the regge situation as quickly as possible.
” Also, if anything comes up in the persons counseling (auditing) that could be useful to the assigned reg, the information is immediately given to the reg”
there’s your organised criminal fraud. This is why criminal cases based on the files of the criminal organisation known as the “church” of $cientology should be run in every country. France has done one, we’re waiting for the result in Belgium.
While the undue influence exerted by the Co$ stops the victims making complaints, this is one of the real crimes and it can be prosecuted. No, this is not the fault of the victim, this is a criminal organisation doing what it is designed to do.
Is it just me, or is there some “peculiar” word mishaps in this email? HHhhmmmmm…..
Ok, I had to expand my knowledge of the word “peculiar”. I guess it works. I just found that line very peculiar. LOL
They asked me how I knew
My true mark was true
I of course replied
Something here inside
Cannot be denied
They, said some day you’ll find
All who reg are blind
When old Dave’s on fire
You must realize
Smoke gets in your eyes
So I chaffed them, and I gaily laughed
To think they would doubt my cause
And yet today, my mark has gone away
I am without my mark
Now laughing friends deride
Tears I cannot hide
So I sigh and say
When a ghastly flame dies
Smoke gets in your eyes
Hi Gadfly, A sweet ode for today! Love it! xo,Ann.
Thanks Ann. Thanks Jerome Kern and Otto Harbach for the inspiration. ?
Family Buyer — “Split up the family.” Yup. Divide and conquer. Isolate individuals. Remove support structures. Scientology thinks nothing of destroying families if that will boost next Thursday’s stat.
There is NOTHING this cult won’t do to boost Thursday’s stats. NOTHING. Especially, but not limited to, lying their collective asses off.
Back in the 70s I did some smaller version the Big League Sales Course that was being offered by the cult. I read the entire Big League Sales book by Les Dane. Since I always hated sales, I never attempted to get another person into scientology. This made me feel like a big failure as a scientologist, I felt like there was something wrong with me because of this, so I did the course to see if it could help change that.
I became very enlightened reading the book and it definitely helped me a great deal. But not in the way you may think. I never became more interested in trying to be an FSM because I still didn’t like sales. I didn’t feel comfortable trying to sign someone up for scientology. Instead, reading that book gave me the greatest successful sales resistance I ever had. Any time I was ever regged after that, I was practically immune from anything they were saying because I could spot the exact sales tricks they were trying to use on me. My big win was gaining sales resistance. LOL Maybe that’s why they finally stopped delivering that course, because people were learning to spot how they were being conned by the registrars.
Hi Maureen, Good to meet you. Smart very much so, how you handled Big League Sales. I should have thought of a similar plan, but I would have had to blow to implement it & back then I had to soak in Kool-Aid three more years, before I could rip myself out of the cult.Love,Ann.
Les Dane, in BLS, also said not to use your sales techniques on another salesman. He will just critique your sales methods.
Quite true.
There are lots of other hard-sale techniques around. All quite similar, and in use all over the place (including politics and used cars).
Simple solution; train up on it, and enjoy your critique.
I am surprised she left out the enforcement technique – like when Wendy threatened my wife with a generic D of P order to go to flag, which they (FSC) faxed her during a drive by at our house. This came after my wife refused to leave for her 6 mos check when she was in the middle of a work sit, as well as not having money pay for it.
Or when they threatened to deny my friend the completion of his L that he had started until he paid for his patron status. He did and he has never set foot in Clearwater since.
Great way to treat your public.
Mimsey
mimsey, you can’t possibly be surprised at their tactics. From 1990 on, the focus has been on one thing and one thing only: Draining the pubic of every dollar they have.
Yup. Charmaine flat out told me when she got off the phone with some guy that ONLY gave her $10K that he would be denied his eligibility to get onto OT VII because he could have given more and refused.
Are you f***ing kidding me, Mary! So this poor sap hands over $10 big ones and that’s not enough to get routed onto OT 7? My profanity level would have been through the roof if I was talking to that reg. My head might have exploded too.
“Happy Selling Freedom”
Surely that’s an oxymoron that even a blinded koolaid drinker can see is not quite kosher.
WTF.
Don’t forget the fifth group: The critical thinker who can smell bullshit within a hundred mile radius.
Lamentably I recall the two times my first spouse, Ann Halblom (Beatty), arranged two of the Les Dane seminars.
Ann today, last I heard, was in the FSC network, and a street photo of her in FSC (Flag Service Consultant) uniform was taken on the street outside AOLA about 6 years back.
Sadly I think followers who have “historic” execution incidents on their staff timetracks results in those members feeling deeper loyalty to the whole setup.
Hubbard’s prolific writing and orders into details of how to operate as a staff and public follower, when those do did the orders for the first time and were validated by Hubbard for that execution, it makes it tougher for those members to undo their loyalty to Hubbard and his system.
Sadly.
The Hubbard personal pats on individual Scientologists’ heads has deep loyalty ramifications in some followers’ minds.
I pity those who received too many of the personal Hubbard pats on the head, it has gone to their heads and keeps the whole irreligious secular fake “new religion” going.
Getting “Well Done” or “Very Well Done” or “Brilliant” from LRH when you complied with his orders, certainly goes to the followers’ head when they get these personal acknowledgement from LRH.
Some of the older timer Scientologists know of this loyalty headiness direct LRH orders compliance mentality, and I think some like this Barbar Dews must wish she’d been there to get a few of those LRH pats on her head if she could have been in the movement just a few years earlier in her life.
This post cuts right to the bone (“the close is the end of the enlightenment”). Great one Mike. Thanks.
Scientologist suffer from what is called the telescope bias..The smart tek empowered Scientologist looks at the sucker through the right end of the telescope and sees everything..The sucker through the wrong end
Even lrh thought that putting a picture of a boy looking out of a window on self analysis (old edition)would get the customs officer to automatically waive you through at customs.Fortunately with the Internet nobody is falling for this crap anymore.
That’s an amazing story supporting Hubbard’s magical thinking of the power of suggestion being so effective in creating people’s allegiance and compliance.
Hubbard must have loved movies where characters did OT psychokinesis (mind moving matter without the body or other physical means).
“Dangerous Dimension” was a Hubbard very short story of an OT professor popping around the solar system using his thought alone.
“Death’s Deputy” is a Hubbard story of a character who caused all around him to go PTS and die unexpectedly.
Magical effects Hubbard was stuck on all his life. Never did he produce any nor did any of the followers do anything OT for real (all in their heads only).
Interesting to see the note on confidence. It is worth noting that “con” man is an abbreviation of “confidence” man.
I spent years as a reg in a Class V org, and I’ve done my time in Cramming with ol’ Les Dane. I could never be the type of salesman outlined in Dane’s books. To do so, I feel you have to stop being yourself. Dane’s salesmen was always scheming, always manipulating, always one step ahead of the mark. All that mattered was “the close” (and keeping the mark from backing out).
You can see why Hubbard pushed this. Dane formulated some type of methodology or system on how to approach the subject of sales. Everything broken down into a series of steps (just 3 easy steps). Hubbard ate that shit up.
I am certain there are more than 4 groups of buyers. Maybe:
The No-Buyer Buyer
This is the experienced buyer who can see right through your lies and bullshit. Locate a senior member of staff, preferably in uniform with lots of medals and scrambled egg. Have this member say he worked with LRH, if that doesn’t work have them make veiled threats and instill fear in your prospect. This is known as the Fear Tag.
If the No-Buyer is still resisting, pull out a piece of paper and write Knowledge Report in large letters, then look up and ask the prospect how his name is spelled.
” I could never be the type of salesman outlined in Dane’s books. To do so, I feel you have to stop being yourself.”
Which is how you can tell it’s a cult, not a religion. Well spotted.
Hi Jens TINGLEFF, I liked your post and it made me see that the hot water I jumped into in Sea Org was that I wanted to do everything perfectly for Ron in the beginning,except reg like Mr.Dane! So of course I go right into Desemmination with bells and whistles silent.It took almost three years for me to begin to see I was splitting myself in two.One part adored Ron and all that went with him and the other part thought if theses policies were so amazing ,all could be given for free around the world to all,if the tech worked as intended.That does not fly in SO. Was I ever a stubborn cuss-it took GO/Intel almost another year and one half to finally get me to flee! Love,Ann.
What you don’t get from the above excerpt provided by Ms. Dews is how TRULY terrible this book really is. The flow of the book is how to manipulate people by taking away their own self determinism and dominating the decisions that should be THEIRS (to say nothing of increasing their desire for MEST and the embarrassing sexism in the book to boot). Do I even have to mention that the whole point of the book is the exact opposite of what LRH asserts is the goal of Scientology in his own early books?
Though as bad as this book is (and I remember well when the Big League Sales Mission waltzed into our org in 1973 led by a Cl XII auditor named Mike Maueur) it still pales in comparison with the kind of stuff that is run on people now, pushing every single third and fourth dynamic button that can be pushed, with the added extra force of essentially letting the person know that if they DON’T contribute what is demanded, they are not only bad and failing in the eyes of their fellow church members in the grand mission of saving the world, but they will not really be allowed to even continue in the group as accepted group members. Yeah, the Big League Sales stuff was bad and it got WAY worse.
A short amusing story: It was sometime in late summer 1973. I was standing in our Qual area with my buddy and fellow staff member, one Bob Waldmann. Our Qual had five auditing rooms made out of sheetrock against one of the walls. The two Big League Sales Missionairres come into Qaul, with their fancy Sea Org uniforms, carrying their briefcases and silently go into Auditing Room A and shut the door. Waldo leans over and says in my ear, slowly and with meaning, “The Integrity Co-Audit.” (Integrity Processing was what Sec checking was called that year) … well, maybe you had to be there … but that line hit the spot at the time …
*yes, I do remember the Postulate Check Scheme (public were asked to write checks for money that wasn’t at the time actually IN their checking account … I guess it was their commitment to make them good). Sometime in 1971 or 72, David Light and maybe Kerry Gleason, SO regges running this scheme.
Hi Joe Pendleton, Oh god The Integrity Co-Audit! I had put that phrase in the cellar of my mind! Your posts always enlighten.Love,Ann.
Thank you Ann. Hope you are having a great day today.
Hi Joe Pendleton, Found your post. Thank you for wishing me a great day. With all you shining,bright, brilliant spirits and minds how can I not? Laughter, Love Always, Ann.
I totally agree Joe, I was shocked when it came out, I was at asho.all the staff were reading it.they were hard selling people before the book came out. By the mid 90s from what I heard. It’s a 100 times worse.no holding back get everybody’s money . When they are Broke get them to borrow more on new credit cards. Mortgage there house, borrow from parents, give hem your inheritance,etc.
This book Big Leaque sales was already back inearly 1980’s used. I even told LRH my success in using this and their were good results there then was no misuse back then nothing like reported here. here.
Yeah, well you obviously missed the postulate check era of the 70’s. There were PLENTY of abuses on reg lines.
A lot of it was helpful. I refer to the closing Tech of a Sale / for Servcies. As within the book of Les Dane’s books also his tapes..Those tools if used correctly were useful without abuse . I certiantly don’t discredit your statement of it how it became.
The closing of the sales is one thing the abuse of the use of it is another
The SO #1 line failed long before that.
The SO#1 line was always exactly as El Ron wanted it. So “failed” isn’t applicable
Hi Mike Wynski, Nice to meet you.I like and echo your post as my knowledge and use of the SO#1 Line to me,was exactly as Ron intended.The SO#1Line set the hook as it were for me. Always, Ann.
Thanks Ann.
You missed the point. Try using logic (as opposed to Ad Hominem).
Missed WHAT point 1984? And you are upset about a person saying “El Ron”? After all the people he harmed? Go seek professional mental help my friend.
You don’t seem to notice that you are demonstrating the mind set that you complain about. Perhaps you should consider your own advice.
WHAT point did I miss 1984?
Last time I ask before I give you up as yet another irrevocably damaged mind courtesy of Hubbard’s criminal enterprise and practices.
What point- To make conclusions from Hadley’s comments would be dependent on the purpose / efficiency of the SO#1 line, at that time. (BTW, things change with time, if you haven’t noticed.)
Last Time – “One becomes what one resists”. I find this quite true. But I found this in Scientology, so it must be false, even if it is true…..
Forget the HE&R. Use logic.
Vultures are wonderful creations; Cult of COS: NOT wonderful
discusting that this is encouraged by a “church” & “religious” teachings
I wonder how many Jewish, Catholic, Muslim, Protestant, Jehovah, Baptist, Methodist, Buddhist etc clergy are practicing their sales and closing techniques this morning?
Happy Valentine’s Day to all of you today <3
Hi Tommy J, Across the miles, Happy ❤️??? Day to you and yours XXOO Ann.
Just hope that none of them are using BIG LEAGUE SALES as the basis for their methodology.
Lol you left out Mormons. But yeah, let’s practice out closing techniques. How ecclesiastical.
If a person really needs and wants something and a sales person has it to offer there is no need to “CLOSE the sale via customer types”. A valuable final product will sell itself. The Church of Scientology is held together by criminals desperate for a sale not eager for one. Pretty grim picture of a church that deals in eternities. 🙂
And one that deals in “donations”….
I agree, Lawrence. I had a business and I just educated them on what I had to offer and gave them a chance to either want it or not. Word of mouth had me booming and I moved it twice to new cities and it worked every time. Patience and believing in your product are the “keys”, not trickery. It made me sick when I read where it suggests to separate family members and sell to them individually. I experienced that only once in the church…and then I was out!
I know. I had to do that when I was working stress test tables. FREE STRESS TEST! FREE STRESS TEST! Then you weren’t supposed to let the person leave until they bought a copy of DMSMH. Something I wasn’t in agreement with.
Dianetics is useful knowledge. The Church of Scientology is good to know about too, especially if you are someone in law enforcement. 🙂
This email is just another exasperated attempt to trick money out of the “unaware.” She obviously doesn’t believe in what she’s selling. What a whore.
A prostitute who delivers a wanted service to a customer as promised is the opposite of Barbara Dews and her fellow Scientology scam artists. Don’t insult prostitutes.
I stand corrected.
I agree Mary! Calling her a whore is an insult to all whores everywhere…
Barbara Dews is is a whole other creature. I’m not sure what name we should call her, so, I’m going to leave it up to all the posters here. Take it away, folks.
Call her a scientologist
Hi Chee Chalker, Laughter! Love your post! Happy happy ? Day to one of my heroes and all she loves.XO Ann.
Barbara Dewes is a whore all right, but her client is David Miscavige.
Lol! Hit the nail on the head, Aquamarine.
I hit my head on a nail once…..
Barbara conveniently left out the #1 rule of selling: have something of use or value that people need or want. This is why no one is buying your product, Barbara. Fewer and fewer people see any value in it. It could have something to do with you packaging your religion as a product to be bought and sold.