Tony Ortega has run a number of articles detailing the activities of scientology “Anti-Vaxxers.” This is his most recent.
One of the prominent scientology “conspiracy theory” purveyors is a guy named Jim Rego. He sends out emails almost every day to his scientology friends outlining rumors about vast government conspiracies, the “Deep State”, George Soros, vaccinations, the World Bank etc. etc.
This time, he sent out, without comment, a quote from Hubbard I had never seen before. If this is known within the scientology world, then it explains why scientologists would be against vaccinations. Hubbard himself proclaims they don’t work and are a hoax, based on his vast experience and knowledge about the first 100 soldiers admitted into military hospitals in WW II. This is certainly a made up “fact” but that never stopped Hubbard.
What is especially interesting to me about this quote is his second paragraph where he described EXACTLY what he just did, and did thousands of times. By stating this, he implies this is NOT what he is doing. It’s a clever technique. It’s a trick he employed often, “I’m no ivory tower philosopher”, “I’m just a man,” “money is the lowest motivation,” or the best of all “What is Greatness?” where he proclaims: “Never use what is done to one as a basis for hatred. Never desire revenge.” There are hundreds of examples.
Here is Rego’s recent email:
From: Jim Rego
Sent: May 29, 2020 8:18 AM
Subject: LRH: (On vaccinations…)
“They go around scratching people for smallpox and they’ve cut the smallpox down in the world most amazingly. I am very sure they’ve cut it down to the degree they’ve made people believe they wouldn’t get smallpox or something of the sort. But do you know that the first 100 soldiers admitted into military hospitals with smallpox in World War II had each one of them been vaccinated properly and in the proper period of time to be immune?
The first 100 soldiers admitted into military hospitals all been properly vaccinated and they all had smallpox. You see science has a habit of saying “that is the answer!” And after that instead of being reasonable about it, to point their professional pens, to point their lecture guns, their grades systems, straight at the individual and say now don’t think about it anymore, don’t examine it again, don’t look it over because we’ve said so. Get the idea?
And all you have to do is go around and take some of the favorite theories held by these people, like vaccination, just take this favorite theory, and now go out and actually look. And know and deduce and have intuitions about it and finally come up with an answer everybody can agree with and the answer that everybody can agree with is that vaccination has very little to do with the situation.
Now it’s very true that those American soldiers who had had typhus shots when they were put in prison camps in Europe did not in any large proportion, get typhus. And with great glee we see all medical science making a great deal out of this saying “look look look! Look how effective our typhus shots are.” Let me point out something else to you. There’s very little typhus in the United States. These soldiers just happened to be, possibly, a strain of people that don’t get typhus easily, see? You see how smelly the scientific logic is if you once hold it up? So cover it up quickly and put it away if it begins to smell like Limburger and go on your own ability to know thereafter. You got it?”
–LRH, From The Detection of Engrams, The Search to Know, 5 November 1958 5th London Advanced Clinical Course
Scientology wasn’t my first cult and I just wanted to say that, it seems, a mockery is made of science and medicine in most cults. It may be a necessary element to make other outlandish beliefs more acceptable.
Love the comments on here! 💚
I worked for Scientologists in Clearwater, FL that brought their unvaccinated daughter to work for 5 weeks. We all got sick and I was told by a doctor that I had Whooping Cough. This was in 2014 when it was spreading around again. I was never so sick in my life! This is when they were discovering that the vaccination didn’t last as long as they thought so many adults were getting it from unvaccinated kids.
This is just another example of Hubbard talking about stuff he knew nothing about! Nothing! He was NOT a scientist, NOT a nuclear physicist, was NOT an engineer and never did any clinical research on anything! He could not stand to be criticized or corrected so he never subjected his work to peer review. He only sold for outrageous fees whatever he made up out of whole cloth or stuff he copied from others, to those who were mesmerized by his charisma…whatever that was. I was one of those mesmerized youngsters. I believed all that shite because he said it was true! I was young, naive and uneducated. Not anymore. I hope other young folks who are “in” learn in time to save them selves from decades of brainwashing.
I’ll 50 mega bucks that ol’ Hubtard was vaccinated for everything under the sun and then some. A bigger health paranoid you never met. He ALWAYS blamed anything wrong with his body on something in his environment. And NOT people.
When I was found to have full-blown AIDS on the freewinds 13 years after receiving contaminated blood products in 1989 I was sent to see Dr Denk in 2002. After he verified that I was HIV positive he had his office personell get me an appointment at the LA AIDS clinic. However the Freewinds execs ( I do not know who exactly; but the Captain had to approve the change) sent me to Sacramento to a Scn chiropractor James Keppler. Keppler was anti-vaccination and had me read a book that talked about not putting anything in the body that was not alive and specifically not screwing with the immune system. He told me not to take the standard meds for HIV as the meds were “worse than HIV”
Keppler knew LRH and, with Dr Denk worked on LRH in 1978 when LRH was in a coma. I do not know if Keppler’s views were greatly influenced by LRH.
There was an effective treatment for HIV AIDS at the time. The result of his false data in the area was that I was all but dead and had dementia when my then wife who had happened to get off of the ship because OSA was afraid that my father would call the FBI as she was being held on the ship against her will took me to an HIV doctor in violation of Command Intention instead of putting me in a hospice to die as directed by the ship. I recovered quickly once I received the standard treatment.
After I recovered and showed Keppler my new blood tests his only question was when was I going to stop taking those deadly drugs.
I told him that I would stop taking them if and when I decided to die.
Dr Denk was very happy that I was recovering. I did not get that from Keppler, who had never treated anyone with AIDS before me.
There are similarities between Keppler and LRH in that both wanted to be heroes by curing someone of a deadly disease even if they had to ignore actual research and case studies.
It was as if Keppler would rather have me dead than admit that he was wrong.
Had there been an actual cure for HIV AIDS at the time I believe that Keppler would have told me not to avail myself of it. I would have survived and in actual fact, only survived because my wife got off of the Freewinds. Yet the Captain fought continuously to ensure that she did not get off if the ship. The result is that I would have been dead.
Sadly, the current problem today are the environmental industrial & all other types of unhealthy lifestyle exposures that never existed a century ago accumulating in human bodies causing genetic mutations, altering DNA, compromising immune system & other natural human evolutionary processes suppressing functions ultimately compromising the human body, then modern day medical products that are developed with these related heavy metals & chemical adjuvants & preservatives no matter how minuscule only adds to these combinations of toxic free radicals inundating the human body that also ALTERS HOW MEDICAL PRODUCTS are intended to work, causing lack of efficacy NOBODY IS TESTING for.
Read manufactures inserts & ingredients then read material safety data sheets for all other related types of products man has unnaturally developed that would never enter the human body in such a way.
If naturally immunity fails to exist, vaccinations certainly won’t develop immunity either. Research CUMULATIVE EXPOSURES , what exact exposures exist naturally occurring in the environment against manmade processes causing pollutants to enter the human body that reacts with medically invasive & unnatural exposures including manmade mutation vital strains.
Great post, Jeffrey. I particularly liked this, as it is so true, “If the Cult could develop a vaccine it would be against entheta. At present, the Church cannot do this and so has to rely on Fair Game, disinformation, SP Declares, and Disconnection. The adverse events arising from these so-called Ethics actions have harmed the Church irreparably over the long term.”
Wow I guess all of the TENS of millions of people who have gotten this vaccine in the 3rd world who didn’t know what the F it was for magically knew all about small pox and decided to not get it after some missionary lined them up and “scratched” them. The criminal insanity of Hubtard (YES Indies, he was a CRIMINAL) never ceases to amaze
And I believed to this guy! What a mess! Every word. Miscavige was a continuous piece of doubt, as he always reminded me on the German Stasi-style or Goebbles, the Minister of PR.
But Hubbard? I believed this guy, despite I worked in “wog” – agencies and read official newspapers.
Incredible how stupid I was for so long time, and how infantile one can be.
A vaccine making Corona to something haywire is in control.. A vaccine making scientologists to people is delayed because money talks. A virus making the body inactive activate the brain.
In the beginning of the 80ties we stayed at the Fort Harrison Hotel and one person in the Hotel had Hepatitis A and everybody had to get a vaccine for Hep. A. People who refused had to leave the hotel. I guess it depends which MLO is incharge
Seems Hubbard could lie out of one side of his mouth and then say the opposite out the other! Back in about 1978/79, I was in the Flag RPF in Clearwater. The city (or county) had a Hepatitis B (I think) outbreak and Hubbard ordered everyone at the Base to get Hep B vaccinations. I don’t remember where the MO, Ginny, was as she would normally have administered the shots. Someone remembered I was an RN, probably Ken Urquhart, and within hours and while wearing my sweaty black boilersuit, I was set up in a small room in the Fort Harrison with boxes of vials of vaccines and alcohol and swabs, and I was jabbing everyone in the rear for about two days.
Hehehe. What fun.
I got RPFed from Treas Sec post and by golly there was actually crew bringing me checks to sign and wanting hat write-ups for certain things. I said ‘nope’.
Hana. Great comment about something you personally witnessed. Thank you.
Smallpox vaccinations ended around 1968 on the general public because the disease had been eradicated. It is the ONLY vaccine known to do so. It is now only kept in stock by US govt for biowarfare reasons. That’s why military received it. It was a vaccine developed around 1796.
Now, I ask you this: Why do Sea Org members get flu shots. I thought it was to keep production on post going. My former Sea Org sister had several of them. How does that comport with Scientologists or Hubbard being anti-vaxxers?
In 23 years in the S.O. I never received a flu shot.
Dr. Hubbard reversed “Look don’t listen” in his own Church. In Scientology, the operative principle is “Listen don’t look.”
If the Cult could develop a vaccine it would be against entheta. At present, the Church cannot do this and so has to rely on Fair Game, disinformation, SP Declares, and Disconnection. The adverse events arising from these so-called Ethics actions have harmed the Church irreparably over the long term.
*****
Outbreaks of communicable diseases such as smallpox and measles have historically devastated armies — and in some cases more than actual combat. Of the 750,000 deaths in the US Civil War, 2/3 were from diseases: “epidemics of chicken pox, mumps, whooping cough, measles, malaria, and tuberculosis, among others, tore through the camps with their poor sanitation and bad hygiene.” https://blogs.ancestry.com/cm/the-civil-wars-biggest-killer-lack-of-good-medical-care/
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Smallpox vaccinations are extraordinarily effective. US Army studies have shown this in WWII and in a 2003 study that examined post-911 deployments to the Middle East. There are always some adverse events, but even these are extremely low. The benefits of vaccinations far outweigh the risks.
Antibiotics were also revolutionary in saving lives in the military. The leading cause of death from combat wounds (gunshot, shrapnel, stabbing, etc) was often the result of an infection and not the actual wound.
*****
The US Army had 12 million troops on active duty at the end of WWII. During the period from 1939-1947, there were only 215 cases of smallpox in the US Army. This comes from a US Army medical study that is easily discoverable online:
“United States Army policy with respect to vaccination for smallpox during World War II was stated in Army Regulations No. 40-210, 15 September 1942; in Circular Letter No. 162, Office of the Surgeon General, 28 November 1942; and in War Department Technical Bulletin 114, 9 November 1944 (revised 28 February 1947). These regulations required vaccination against smallpox as soon as possible on entry into the military service, with revaccination at intervals of 3 years thereafter. In addition, revaccination was to be accomplished before departure for overseas duty unless the individual had been vaccinated within the 12-month period prior to departure. Vaccination was required, also, on exposure to smallpox or in the presence of an outbreak, regardless of the date or the result of the last vaccination.
“In the 20 years before World War II, improved local and State programs of immunization and the apparent low communicability of had resulted in a decline to a negligible incidence. However, during and immediately after the combat period of World War II, American troops entered most of the areas of the world wherein classical smallpox is endemic or recurs in epidemic form. The disturbance of war increased the epidemic potential and thus led to increased incidence in various areas of the world with consequent exposure of troops present in those areas. The low incidence (a total of 215 cases during the period from 1939 to 1947) among troops was remarkable. A single case overseas in 1942 was from the Middle East theater. There were 4 deaths among 15 cases overseas in 1943. No cases of smallpox occurred among Army troops in the India-Burma theater in 1943, but in 1944 there were 23 cases with 6 deaths from that area. The peak month, March, accounted for 14 cases and 3 deaths. There was a high incidence of smallpox among the civilian population of that area during the period. — Ref: https://history.amedd.army.mil/booksdocs/wwii/PM4/CH09.Smallpox.htm
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From 2002-2003, the US Army administered 450,293 smallpox vaccinations to troops deploying to Afghanistan and Iraq. There were 37 cases of adverse events. See the JAMA study: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/196807
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Anti-vaxxers are having quite a time in the pandemic. Many YT videos suggest the entire pandemic was designed to take out the Queen of England among other goals. Her majesty is 94 and was born in 1926. When she passes from old age, the conspiracy crown will insist it was all part of a plot.
Great post. To think of how many generations could be harmed with just one infected child mixing in with others.
What a control freak whack job LRH was. Quite a legacy he left. Big shoes for DM to fill but he’s trying. He leaves a lot of suffering in the wake of his psycho mania.
Really good reminder and example to this new pandemic wave! This explains alse the fear behind that virus. Mostly women take it as serious.
Typical Hubbard – accusing others of being as unscientific as he was. Among what might be called his psychological projections, he himself had an infamous ‘habit of saying “that is the answer!”’ over and over through the decades, about one supposed discovery or breakthrough and another, and then having to walk it back and spin the resulting failure when it turned out the new technique or process was actually ineffective, irrepeatable and perhaps just coincidence or placebo effect, and so on.
Let’s try turning that last paragraph around:
‘Now it’s very true that those [scientologists] who had had [auditing] when they were put in [the chair] did not in any large proportion, get [tuberculosis or leukemia]. And with great glee [Hubbard and Scientology were] making a great deal out of this saying “look look look! Look how effective our [processes] are.” Let me point out something else to you. There’s very little [tuberculosis] in the United States. These [people who joined] just happened to be, possibly, a strain of people that don’t [have tuberculosis or leukemia], see? You see how smelly the scientific logic is if you once hold it up? So cover it up quickly and put it away if it begins to smell like Limburger and go on your own ability to know thereafter. You got it?”’
I just love this! You totally nailed it PeaceMaker!
I should have mentioned that Hubbard said Scientology could cure tuberculosis and leukemia. Tuberculosis, a frightenting threat when he was young, had been vanquished by modern antibiotics; and while he claimed leukemia was an engram that his techniques could run out, I suspect that as with other chronic illnesses, actual sufferers either understood the medical reality better than to be lured by pseudo-science, or were quickly turned away by Dianetics and Scientology, allowing the missions and orgs to self-select for a generally healthier demographic they could the try t take credit for.
Thanks, glad you liked the comment.
And I wonder if I shouldn’t have modified that last sentence, as well:
“So cover it up quickly and put it away if it begins to smell like Limburger and go on your own ability to [believe me] thereafter. You got it?”’
O/T. I posted the underlying story earlier. Here is my take and tweet.
Scientology joins letter calling for restrictions on police following deaths of Ahmaud Arbery, Breonna Taylor, Dreasjon Reed, George Floyd and Tony McDade.
https://twitter.com/ISNOINews/status/1267859983250554880
/
Speaking of hypocrisy, I’ve seen it pointed out Minneapolis CofS staffers’ killing of a black man in January, was disturbingly similar to the Ahmaud Arbery and George Floyd cases:
Man who died in downtown St. Paul was held down by Church of Scientology employees after attempted robbery, police say
> https://www.newsbreak.com/news/safety/0NuORfvE/man-who-died-in-downtown-st-paul-was-held-down-by-church-of-scientology-employees-after-attempted-robbery-police-say
‘You see science has a habit of saying “that is the answer!”’
Nope. A scientist only deals in maybes. Evidence is what makes a theory/argument more robust. Even when evidence is overwhelming, it will never be considered absolute.
Hubbard knew this. He rejected Joe Winter’s pleas for scientific testing, decided dianetics was the answer, and yet was still somehow butthurt when the APA needed more than just his word.
A man of lesser ego would have gone back to his “lab” and humbly “made it go right” via the scientific method. Hub, however, opted for quick cash, cultism and global ridicule.
The butthurt lasted for the rest of his life.
Thank you!! As a former science major at uni, I consistently seem to drive those close to me nuts with my habitual, steadfast refusals to ever commit myself to any absolute answers.
But it was drummed into me that there’s simply no absolute scientific certainty that gravity will still work the same way tomorrow that it does today, or that the magnetic polarity of the earth won’t reverse a few minutes from now.
The overwhelming goal of science, as it was taught to me, was not ever to say, “that is the answer,” but rather, “that is the QUESTION…now let’s attempt to test, falsify and replicate.”
Science is, at its heart, not about answers…but about questions.
That said, I’m monumentally unsurprised (to put it both mildly and politely) that Dr. Hubbard got this most basic definition wrong.
Haha! I know exactly what you mean! 😆
Reason can be an uncomfortable path for those craving certainty.
That Hubbard was wrong on basic scientific definitions is unsurprising considering the path he chose. What’s sinister, imho, is that his error wasn’t made out of ignorance.* It’s one of many efforts to condition his readers to dismiss criticism, reject logic, and embrace his own “science of certainty.”
Scientologists believe their religion is an exact science.
They believe their word is evidence enough of its efficacy.
That knowledge is certainty.
That being open-minded is superficial or insincere.
That doubt or “a state of maybe” is rooted in poor intuition (aka lack of faith)
That those demanding evidence should be ignored, if not pitied.
That criticism stems from wickedness.
These particular beliefs aren’t arguably native to the everyday person outside of scientology. They are conditioned, purposely imho, to ensure (i) the individual remains invested so that (ii) they obtain the optimum placebo effect so that (iii) see (i).
*See Hubbard’s phony love letter to the scientific method, ‘A Summary on Scientology for Scientists’. It’s hilarious. The poor guy. Despite no research grants, death threats, an attempted kidnapping, WW2, and ever so much more, he made it. “Few have the courage or stamina to stand up to such opposition and still carry on their work.” So brave. So heroic. Oh…and the reason he never opened up his “research”? He was scared of being looted by a raging peasant mob. 😂 https://www.lronhubbard.org/articles-and-essays/researching-in-the-humanities.html
EXACTLY mwesten. My wife often complains that I won’t give a simple yes or no to most questions involving anything technical or in the realm of science. Once again Hubtard was projecting. Blaming educated people for his own stupidity.
OMG. I was an engineer from a good school. I was great in math and science when I was training to be an auditor in the ‘70s. Still I learned a great deal from LRH without believing everything he said.
I trust the scientific method and so do most of you, even those among you that embrace pseudo science and conspiracy theory otherwise none of you would buy a cell phone or plane ticket.
I always liked to listen to Hubbard, but I used to grasp the gist of a lecture rather than hang on to every word, although it is necessary to understand every word. If one doesn’t understand the difference between the words probable and possible, for example, then they would not understand much.
Holy shit, this Hubbard quote is rich. Rich with the wafting smell of bullshit. I’m feeling particularly brave today so I read this one twice and was actually able to glean a bit of truth in the ol’ grifter’s ramblings.
“…now go out and actually look.”
Hubbard later refined this in the ‘Data Series’ to, “look, don’t listen”. That is my favorite Hubbard quote and the only worthwhile one as far as I’m concerned. I would challenge any scientologist to apply this to dianetics, scientology, Hubbard or Miscavige and I’d wager big bucks that if they did it honestly they’d be leaving the building as fast as they could so the door wouldn’t hit them in the ass on the way out.
Further into the Hubbard quote (“You see how smelly the scientific logic is if you once hold it up?”) they would be left with this slight modification. “You see how smelly the SCIENTOLOGY logic is if you once hold it up?”
Of course no one in the cult dares question the ‘founder’. Perhaps because he has such outstanding credentials. After all, he penned his classic ‘All About Radiation’ as Medicus & A Nuclear Physicist. Those lofty titles are probably based on Hubbard’s achievements in the wog world such as getting a real and gen-u-wine Doctorate from the esteemed Sequoia University.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sequoia_University
I don’t think that “Medicus” was Hubbard. Most likely it was Dr Joseph Winter, an early supporter of Dianetics. The nuclear physicist was Hubbard and much of the same material was present in the Tech Volumes.
Almost all of Hubbard’s “research” on radiation was dreadful nonsense and potentially injurious for anyone who took it seriously. For example, Hubbard said that holding a newspaper in front of you provided good protection against radiation. Don’t think I would like to try this out.
After GAT1, this book was entirely rewritten with different authors, presumably to make it less controversial and to protect against legal suits.
Huh! I’d always heard that “Medicus” was Dr. Gene Denk.
Now I’m dreadfully curious as to who it really was!
Dr Gene Denk was one of the authors for the rewrite after GAT1 (around 1996.)
All About Radiation was originally published in the early 1950s.
I imagine that Dr Denk would have been too young way back then.
Ooh, the intrigue deepens! I love it!
My impression was (like Ms. B. Haven’s below) that it was published after Dr. Winter had bailed.
That said, I’ve never actually compared the original publication dates with Dr. Denk’s arrival on the scene.
Now I’m more curious than ever as to whether it was Winter, Denk, Hubs himself…or some other, as-yet unknown to me contributor. The only certainty I do have is that Hubs likely would never have wanted to attribute credit where credit was due, unless it was due to him. (And of course, in his mind, it ALWAYS was!)
Jospeh Augustus Winter, MD, was a Proctologist and General Practitioner from Benton Harbour, Michigan. His sister Sonja was married to John W. Campbell, Hubbard’s mentor and literary editor at Street & Smith Pulp Fiction publishing house in New Jersey. Campbell has been recently linked to MI6 and OSS/CIA operations.
Hubbard sent a copy of The Original Thesis to Joseph Winter around 1946/47 and asked him to validate the DIANETICS writings with a Doctor’s perspective. Winter may have participated in clinical research with the HDRF around 1950 to 1954. He was one of the appointed Board Members. Hubbard altered some of the foreword for DMSMH and pissed Winter off. The AMA started to attack in the press. Winter suggested better clinical protocol over Hubbard’s methods. AE Van Vogt agreed with Winter’s concerns. Winter was a trained hypnotherapist and saw that Hubbard was using unethical methods and calling it DIANETICS. Hubbard finally dumped Winter after Wichita went bust. Winter delivered Alexis Hubbard and was her godparent. Winter stayed friends with the second Mrs. Hubbard and Richard De Mille and many of the Founding Dianeticists despite Hubbard’s peregrinations. Winter did write the original contribution to ALL ABOUT RADIATION, but before the book was published Hubbard altered it and tried to get other Medical Doctors to endorse/contribute. Several took their names off their initial endorsements. Hubbard may have simply written the final (original published) chapters/segments himself. Later changed and replaced. Winter went off and wrote his 1954 expose book (which Hubbard hated so much) Winter moved to a practice in Peoria and was not heard of again. I think he died around 1961. There is some new suspicion that Joseph Winter may have been a medical covert agent for the same people who operated out of Saint Elizabeth’s Hospital in the 1950’s where LRH said he undertook researches on PTSD patients. (Chestnut Lodge too). Does anyone have any more biographical info? No-one seems to understand the important connections Hubbard had with Psychiatric Hospitals such as his mysterious trip in 1953 to Louisiana. I think Mike MacLaughry covers that better with recent 2018 CIA FOI document releases.
Cavalier, I don’t have the exact date, but I believe that Dr. Winter bailed much earlier than the publication of All About Radiation. When someone comes up with a bogus name like ‘Medicus’ and doesn’t claim responsibility for the writing it is difficult to find out who exactly is behind the ruse. Pseudonyms are acceptable in works of fiction but not a well researched “scientific” treatise like Hubbard claimed he was churning out.
I’m sure that someone reading here can offer up more information.
I checked this out.
It seems that All About Radiation was first published in 1957.
I think you are correct that Joseph Winter was gone by then and so I got this wrong.
Typhus “Currently no vaccine is commercially available.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Typhus
Again, total bullshit from Lron’s mouth.
Zee moo. Great point. I love the “total bullshit from L Ron’s mouth”
Thanks Mike for another very interesting topic.
Here also in Italy that of vaccines is a very current fact that makes us discuss. Personally what I think creates some confusion is that vaccines are discussed in a generalized way rather than being divided into at least 2 categories.
The first are the vaccines already recognized and used for a long time which have saved many lives and prevented children from falling ill with certain trivial but also dangerous diseases as in certain third world countries.
The other are what I call “business vaccines” (it’s my opinion) like the one for the seasonal flu that honestly pecks regardless of almost everyone and where they then explain to you that the flu viruses in circulation amount to more than 200. Well thank you then.
I add that I have read around that pharmaceutical companies are also veering on vaccines to make more cash. But it’s another matter.
Just as long as hubbard said or wrote something that became God’s word to them. A friend who was also clear had a brain tumor. Instead of going to the hospital he went into session and did assists because ron had treated cases like this.
Well he died and never even improved. Who knows how many others have ruined it. Fraud.
Ex-wife died of breast cancer at 47 years of age. She was (last I knew) class 6 and ot7. She was also a ob-gyn nurse practitioner at a major hospital and refused their treatments to, instead, get auditing. Destructive beliefs tend to minimize destructive cults.
Jim. Thank you. I am really sorry for her and that one must believe in this crap and bet about his own health and life.
My wife got the same illness but she was doing controls twice a year and found it in time and got cured. She wasn’t never on cult lines of course.
LmR observed:
“A friend who was also clear had a brain tumor. Instead of going to the hospital he went into session and did assists because ron had treated cases like this.”
I suspect anyone who has been “in” for awhile has a similar anecdote; Mine was early -ish at the Flag Land Base: guy, IIRC, named Ralph; Not a close friend, but a co-worker’s husband. ‘Twas a tough way to go, and I believe it was a needless death.
Jere. Thank you. You just say the truth. Sure that we could write a book about it. So many stories lost in the silence. And in this silence the cult continues its own activities, where these deads are taken just as a collateral side effects of clearing a planet.
To be honest: What a damned crap!
LMR,
Maybe this thread could be titled: Death by Scientology….. or… Suicide by Scientology.
Jim, yes. After all these are just collateral damages for the cult that is trying to save our ass and we don’t understand it.
Thru a friend I heard of a long time Scientologist OT 8 who had to undergo a QUADRUPLE bypass. Cause over Mest, huh? Riiiight. Not clogging up the old arteries with cheap sugar and fat might have helped this magical thinker to achieve “cause over mest”. Never mind what the reassuring, gold framed OT8 cert on the wall says, a little self discipline exerted in real time easily demonstrates how much “at cause” a person actually is over Matter, Energy, Space and Time.
Aqua! Look I don’t like to say anything on these bad stories but at least let me say that was obviously mest being cause over him. 4 bypasses damn!
And maybe he was even finding a good way to explain it.
@Loosing,
My UTR friend, who is health conscious, told me this OT8 got VERY uptight, very defensive before abruptly shutting down and refusing to answer when asked a few questions about why this extreme operation had been necessary.
Around 1998 I was called by my senior on the Freewinds to go to a public’s cabin with him. The guy was dead when we got there, heart attack. The MLO got the machine and zapped him to no avail.
Turned out that he was supposed to get Quad Bypass surgery and witheld that from the MLO. The ship had just sailed from Tortola and had to turn around and go back into port and offload the body.
Bill. What a story! You made me laugh (not laughing for the poor dead guy of course)
Don’t feel bad for the guy. He received all of the gains he came for.
He wanted to be creamated and that was not allowed in his home country.
So the Freewinds was the solution. He was “Freed” and got his cremation and everything he came for. I just hope that he wrote a Success Story before he was routed off the ship.
This was better than Shirley Pollack on the Apollo who went to see LRH when routing out.
LRH said” I hop that you got everything you came for, Shirley” to which she replied ” Maybe next time, Ron”.
LRH sent a messenger to get her folders and she was there another 3 week.
Bill. Really?
The guy came on the freewinds to die.?
Not a free service I believe.
Jesus Christ!
Why not? It is as good a place to die as any. I almost died there at least 3 times.
I suppose so, but then, it obviously wasn’t good enough for you, Bill 🙂
You have a point, Aquamarine.
I had no great objection to dying; a few months before then I was suicidal on the ship and it seemed to be the only way out. But I strongly objected to the way it was handled; it was assumed that I would just lay down and die which I had no real problem with doing until they held my wife against her will and she was calling me nightly begging me to get her out of there. She was taking abuse because she wanted to be with her dying husband and therefore was in Treason for wanting to leave. She could only talk to me on the phone when there was a security guard with her; sometimes I talked to the guard too. The guard obviously heard everything we said to each other but nothing happened, i.e. our Treason when unacted upon. To die because I was injured or ill was one thing but to die just because that was what was expected went against everything I knew as a Sea Org member. I had pulled hundreds of all-nighters to get the stats up against all odds when a piece of equipment went down in the Engine Room.
My body was just another piece of equipment and there was no excuse for not making it go right. I had always considered that as long as I was alive that I would get the stats up and I did against all odds.
I had no desire to be in conflict with the org but the org was now in conflict with it’s own purpose as far as I knew. I just had to pull it off once again. It was actually my wife that saved the day when she got off the ship but had I not done what I did I would have been dead long before she got off. She later told me that she would not even been allowed to go to my funeral.
I don’t know how much Hubbard understood about what he was doing. Clearly, the logic he uses here is poor. I think he had a very good sense of what he could get away with when speaking to or writing for his followers – people who were dazzled by him. For someone under his spell, this rhetoric would be more than good enough.
It’s interesting that the kind of ignorance he was capitalizing on, which exists in so many people today still, that makes people think they can play armchair scientist without having to actually go and look at the science, he probably had himself. I think he was ignorant enough of science and so impressed with his own intellect that this rhetoric was good enough for him, too. In this way, he was under his own spell, a devoted follower of himself.
Hello Scnethics. It is my opinion that he knew full well what he was doing when it came to getting people to give or “donate” money to his phony church . After all, the process of enriching oneself at the expense of others using commonly understood “con man” tricks is not difficult to understand.
As long as I’ve been reading about this crook, it seems clear to me that he knew exactly what he was doing. He was conniving people into giving him their money using well known tricks and techniques that are often understood to be illegal techniques used by “con artists”.
It’s just too bad there no laws making it easy for law enforcement to slap the cuffs on these “con people” and put them into a prison cell for lengthy sentences. In most cases, it seems to me that people who try to con others into giving them money they don’t deserve belong in prison – especially when they use violence to extort money from others and in cases involving large sums of money a kind of violence is used (such as unlawful confinement or the deprivation of food, water or sleep).
It sure does seem clear that most people who have done this in the name of this scam surely do belong in prison for lengthy terms.
Almost all of us have heard many tales about how high pressure con artists connive people into giving them large sums of money under false pretenses. That is what these crooks are all about. They live to collect money that they do not deserve from people. In any moral civilization, these people deserve to spend long sentences in prison and they also deserve to work in order to compensate their victims and pay back those victims every penny they have taken from them under false pretenses. It is worth noting that these con artists have been taught their trade by the con man “in chief” – Mr. Con Man himself – L. R. Hubbard.
Hubbard: “You see how smelly the scientific logic is if you once hold it up.”
Surely Hubbard was in the know. This is an example of how he did his scientific ‘research’.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CEsS2LaYx0&t=376s
The word salad is a classic example of PIOOTA. Pulling It Out Of Their Ass.
It’s difficult to listen to the ol’ con man whip this shit up because there was a time in my life when I was buying into all of it whilst chasing it with a tall glass of Cal-Gag Kool-aid. Maybe that is why it is so ‘restimulating’ to listen to the Donald speak. The similarities are disturbing. Once one extracts themselves from their delusions it’s not difficult to spot a cult or scam in the future.
I don’t know if it was worth it, but that is one positive thing that I got out of being a cultie.
I recall my auditor talking about someone he knew who was dying of cancer. He thought she should stop all medical treatment and get auditing instead. He made the comment, “I know they could cure the cancer with auditing”. In his world there was no opinion about it, it was an indisputable fact that an engram was causing the cancer and that auditing could without a doubt cure it.
Do they still teach the 5th London Advanced Clinical Course? Or was it disappeared during the Golden Age edits?
Either way, a classic case of projection: Hubbard accusing them of telling people “don’t think about it anymore, don’t examine it again, don’t look it over because we’ve said so”. What ever you do, do NOT think about Hubbard’s original thesis, don’t examine the original cases, don’t look over his war record, because we’ve said so – it’s all a totally solid base for a modern science of mental health and not a very bad ripoff of talking therapy, occultism, mysticism, and Buddhism.
His word salads always make me doubt myself because I don’t understand them. I have to read it at least three times to get anything out of it. His earnings hurt my head.
Dawn. I am Italian. Imagine what I have to through each time. It is even worst when I read time to time the source code on Ortega blog. It is like a old alien dialect to me. All these “you see? Blabla… you see blabla? ” he uses to force agreement.
You know, I have a feeling it doesn’t matter WHAT language you’re reading Blubtard in. It’s always run on nonsense. I can’t read more than a few sentences of his stuff.
Bridget. Really true. On the lectures he gets even more watered with other blabbla. A pain in seat waiting him to finally land on the punch line. Do well.
I’m sure this was just another one of his strategies to reduce the mark’s critical thinking abilities in order to have him/her accept his nonsense. Take away all logical reasoning and substitute it for cult indoctrination crap
O/T. Church of Scientology National Affairs Office joins June 1, 2020 letter urging Congress to take swift and decisive legislative action in response to ongoing fatal police killings and other violence against Black people across our the United States.
The letter has ten pages of signatures.
https://civilrights.org/resource/civil-rights-coalition-letter-on-federal-policing-priorities/
http://civilrightsdocs.info/pdf/policy/letters/2020/Coalition_Letter_to_House_and_Senate_Leadership_on_Federal_Policing_Priorites_Final_6.1.20.pdf
/
Another of Hubbard’s crock of crap! His opinions can be very dangerous
I am constantly amazed at Hubbard’s total lack of any scientific evidence for his claims. It is totally Occult. Even Blavatsky saw the value of science. Hubbard talks off the top of his head. The issue here is not whether vaccines work. It is the statements made. Hubbard never ever proved the existence of the thetan. He just said it was a knowingness or feeling of certainty. He stole the work “knowingness” from Blavatsky but never gave her credit. Hubbard rode on Blavatsky but took the Occult to a negative extreme.
Personally I was heavily vaccinated when I entered the Army in 1968 but had no negative signs. My good friends’s brother, however, was totally ruined by the Anthrax vaccines given before the gulf war. He is on total disability. So it proved to me that vaccines can be dangerous.
Perhaps the efficacy, side effects, or possible harmfulness and/or deadliness of a vaccine depends upon the person’s own body chemistry.
As a child I got a polio vaccine. We all did. No parent refused to allow their child to be vaccinated for polio back then. I remember lining up for it. Right arm swelled up a little afterwards around the injection sight and it left a kind of mark that lasted for a while and then disappeared. None of us considered this a big deal. No one in my elementary school had or got polio. Who knows, maybe many of us wouldn’t have gotten it anyway, even without the vaccine, but back then, you just got the vaccine, that’s all. A few of the kids were afraid of needles and cried but they got their shots, tears or no, because they wouldn’t have been allowed back in school without them. Refusal was not an option. That’s how it was then. In my class I knew the all the same kids in my elementary school from age 4 thru 12. We all grew up together, the same kids, pretty much. There was a real fear of polio back then, as I recall. To refuse to get a polio shot was just unheard of in those days. It would have shocked most people to know that someone refused to be vaccinated or to allow their child to get the shot. I’m not trying to be right about this btw. Just relaying what I observed to be the popular viewpoint about vaccinations back then.
I had a similar experience with the polio vaccine. Everyone got it and no exceptions. The anthrax vaccine administered during the Gulf war was an exception. They finally had to pull it after many soldiers had negative side effects.
OMG, anthrax. That means a teeny tiny amount of anthrax gets injected…yow. Well, it the same principle for polio, flu, small pox, etc., vaccines…except anthrax isn’t a virus, its bacteria! Bacteria right into your vein…OMG. Maybe there was too MUCH anthrax in the vaccine, George? God only knows. I’m shuddering just thinking about it. Those poor guys.