In altitude teaching, somebody is a ‘great authority.’ He is probably teaching some subject that is far more complex than it should be. He has become defensive down through the years, and this is a sort of protective coating that he puts up, along with the idea that the subject will always be a little better known by him than by anybody else and that there are things to know in this subject which he really wouldn’t let anybody else in on. This is altitude instruction … It keeps people in a state of confusion, and when their minds are slightly confused they are in a hypnotic trance. Anytime anybody gets enough altitude he can be called a hypnotic operator, and what he says will act as hypnotic suggestion. Hypnotism is a difference in levels of altitude. There are ways to create and lower the altitude of the subject, but if the operator can heighten his own altitude with regard to the subject the same way, he doesn’t have to put the subject to sleep. What he says will still react as hypnotic suggestion.(Hubbard, Research & Discovery, volume 4, p.324)12
ALTITUDE INSTRUCTION (my edits, first person)
In altitude teaching, I am the ‘great authority.’ I am probably teaching some subject that is far more complex than it should be. I have become defensive down through the years, and this is a sort of protective coating that I put up, along with the idea that the subject will always be a little better known by me than by anybody else and that there are things to know in this subject which I really wouldn’t let anybody else in on. This is altitude instruction … It keeps people (Scientologists) in a state of confusion, and when their minds are slightly confused they are in a hypnotic trance. Anytime I get enough altitude I can be called a hypnotic operator, and what I say will act as hypnotic suggestion. Hypnotism is a difference in levels of altitude. There are ways to create and lower the altitude of the subject, but if I, the operator can heighten my own altitude with regard to the subject (Scientology) the same way, I don’t have to put the subject to sleep. What I say will still react as hypnotic suggestion. (Hubbard, Research & Discovery, volume 4, p.324)12
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Terrific, Brian. Spot on. It gives me the willies reading this, and I agree with you that Hubbard did this to control others and it was extremely effective.It kind of freaks me out reading this, to realize it was basically that simple, but I see it all the time online, too. Marty Rathbun did this on his blog, writing in a convoluted mess and using as many large words as he could (usually incorrectly), taking simple concepts and making them sound intricate and difficult. He would endlessly claim he was present and personally knows about this or that, but only say so much, never give the details. He even claimed on one of his tapes that he knew personally about an event that happened before he was in the Sea Org.
Then Marty’s followers would gush and praise him for being so smart, and Marty would tell them how they were smart, too, for seeing things that only they could see. GAG!
So Hubbardesque.
There are many, many pretend authorities all over the Internet, there are even more followers who believe in these authorities for this or that. Just talk in that weird, obscure fashion with absolute confidence and authority in the 3rd person (even when you have no idea what you’re talking about) and BINGO!
Very good article. Thanks.
From above “This is altitude instruction . . . It keeps people in a state of confusion, and when their minds are slightly confused they are in a hypnotic trance.”
The last part of that quote reminds me of when I first started reading about scn “processes”. I found that a bit confusing since it didn’t really fit was was being described which in normal King’s English would be “procedures”. I guess I just let it go by as a sort of synonym and for the next several years I allowed myself to be “processed”. LOL
Okay – I checked a dictionary.
process 4. a particular method of doing something, generally involving a number of steps or operations
So I wasn’t really hoodwinked on that one and getting processed was fun at times.
Process is one of those words with multiple usages. Processing occurs in sausage factories and also in auditing rooms. There are similarities.
Hubbard doesn’t seem like a genius to me, but neither was he an idiot. He was a pulp fiction writer, glib and fluent. In particular I think he had the pulp writer’s most valuable gift: a knack for taking familiar tropes that everyone would accept and polishing them up just enough to make them seem fresh.
Altitude teaching is a real thing, all right. Hubbard probably saw a lot of it in the Navy, where there were a lot of training courses taught by instructors who had themselves been trained in peacetime and were probably overwhelmed and terrified by the job of preparing so many new recruits for a shooting war. Better writers than Hubbard have given more sensitive portraits of people like them, but Hubbard’s little sketch is the work of a decent professional writer who lived through the war.
He probably hated the altitude teaching that he encountered, but that doesn’t mean he didn’t do it himself when he found himself in a similar situation, facing a lot of bright young people without having anywhere near enough to tell them. If he knew enough to define altitude teaching then he would also have known that it worked—for the teacher. Most of the class would accept the teacher’s posing and the few that saw through it would have no effect on the rest.
I don’t buy that altitude teaching is hypnotic. I think it’s just an appeal to the students’ vanity. Nobody wants to believe that they are just a bunch of poor saps listening to a schmo’s helpless blathering. Everyone would much rather believe that they’re the privileged audience of a wise and brilliant teacher. So when the teacher pretends to be the second thing instead of the first, most of the class will be glad to agree.
Good point James. It’s been mine. When I first read of Jon Atak’s labeling Scientology an hypnosis, and that all auditing is hypnosis; I did not agree.
But when I read this writing of Ron’s and how it’s him, Ron, who defined the teaching method as hypnosis.
It’s subtle.
Ron used the redefinition of words and his marketed PR beingness (altitude) to instill some mighty sico concepts.
What he did to our ability to deal with human beings by slicing the world into wog and Scientologist was a well planned, designed and well executed psychological propaganda. By demonizing scrutiny, Hubbard secured for himself a kingdom devoid of critics. Free from those who want to see proof. Free from being found out.
Free from being seen as a liar.
Control………. with Scientology it is always about control.
It’s the altitude backed by force that makes it hypnotic. Altitude backed by force makes one the “pack leader”. The leader has the ability beat up any other member of the pack and determine if they even remain a member of the pack. In a case like that, their teaching is hypnotic.
If the person doesn’t go along with the authority in CofS, they will have their family destroyed, their business destroyed, possibly kicked out of their home. The person who can do that is hypnotic on the person below them. The person they are abusing has to bend their will to the will of the authority or have their family destroyed or whatever, so they have to rationalize what they are doing as perfectly normal even when it clearly isn’t to someone not under the same duress that they are under.
Even in the Navy I would imagine if you disagreed too hard with an instructor you could find yourself in serious trouble, so Hubbard indeed could have got some of his understanding of how to do this to his followers from his Naval times. However, I think today’s Navy is more civilized than Hubbard and wouldn’t go along with throwing people overboard as a punishment if they ever make a single mistake like Hubbard did to his followers. I would sure hope so, at least.
Hi Brain,
Getting in late on this discussion due to circumstances. My take is that the altitude data ties in with the Occult and the Affirmations to produce a mind set for Hubbard. The Hub seems to be hypnotizing himself with the desire to hypnotize the public. His reference to control over “Elemental spirits” is Occult and taken straight from Blavatsky.
I might just add that Hubbard compulsively hid his sources. He had to hide his sources to make himself source. He used a variety of twisted logic to do this.
This ability to hide his sources only gets exposed when you find a stolen word or an idea in another source that he obviously read but did not credit. Hubbard was a master thief as well.
Best,
George
Hubbard ‘Hypnotised’ us good and proper. He may have just gotten Dianetics and the religion idea from the Nazi Krill society, who got it from the Reptilians based in Antartica, then it was given to him by a German Intelligence Officer and was sent back to the USA to release it. And this cover up he could never recover form, but instead spiraled him out into the land of self delusion.
As part of his dealing into the black magiks, and introducing interdimensional beings to earth, who showed him how to travel through wormholes,,travel on psychic chords manipulate space and time, and exist outside of the human bodies eyesight, etc – wow OT Magic and Bingo he had us all hooked.
He knew it was all a hologram, a holographic universe, but never really gave the keys to it. Some of it he does divulge in the PDC. The Objectives definitely provide a hypnotic opening the gateway which allows reptilian takeover of the subject doing them. Then they become servants to the religion.
Hubbard completely swerves the alien influence on the planet, hiding the origins of the religion, which had been around on other planets as far back as 400 million years ago. And the orgs super controlled by the same dark forces wouldn’t allow anyone to even talk about aliens for fear of being declared pts type 3.
RJ 67, is so superficial to the truth it borders on bedtime reading for children.
He got us all addicted to EXTERIORISATION from a body, only to be hauled back in by the electronic frequencies surrounding the body and the hologram around it. We were all chasing the rainbow, when in fact we are never here anyway, we actually exist outside this holographic universe. But he never told us how to once and for all Exteriorise and leave the Holographic Universe because he too never figured out who created it and how it was set up. There was an earlier beginning.
To be fair to Hubbard, gave it a good go trying to figure out how to control the masses. He was a real mastermind, bluffing us all on the way, made a million dollars and became a real big baller…
One of the greatest show Hypnotic Magicians ever to have rolled out on earth.
I hope he comes back does treason and corrects himself and makes up the damage, and if he doesn’t well like he always said… build a better bridge.
WOW! Great stuff johnno. I get the same idea from RJ 67. He was playing with everybody. He had deeper theories that he was hiding.
I clearly see his connections to the German Vril. Hubbard got a lot of material from the Nazi’s but he could not mention the source after WWII.
From my perspective, I see Hubbard with a sugar coat of sweet and sour. Underneath it all, he was in the cross currents of severe self delusion.
GMW
Hey George,
I think he may have studied Hitler. Check these quotes.
Let’s make some Hitler comparison. I don’t usually do this sort of comparison as it’s so easy to use Hitler. I was reading these quotes recently and wondered if Ron studied Hitler. Ron worshiped power. These quotes seem familiar to me from a Scientology stand point.
“Strength lies not in defense but in attack.” Adolf Hitler
“The leader of genius must have the ability to make different opponents appear as if they belonged to one category. Adolf Hitler”
“All critics have criminal pasts” L Ron Hubbard
“The art of leadership… consists in consolidating the attention of the people against a single adversary and taking care that nothing will split up that attention.” Adolf Hitler
The SP?
“Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it.” Adolph Hitler
“If you want to control people lie to them” (paraphrase) L Ron Hubbard
“The greater the lie, the greater the chance that it will be believed.”
Adolf Hitler”
Hubbard selling us he is a Buddha and the wisest man ever
“Great liars are also great magicians.” Adolf Hitler
“By the skillful and sustained use of propaganda, one can make a people see even heaven as hell or an extremely wretched life as paradise” Adolf Hitler.
How many graduates from RPF felt that they had case gain? Or could make a child consider that mom and dad are SPs?
Hi Brian!
Yes, bro we are tracking together on this one in regard to an overall pattern that Hubbard had and to his copies of Hitler’s statements.
This pattern of copying and changing the idea to suit his needs is what, IMO, made Hubbard the biggest thief in history.
You are discovering that he copied Hitler. I have discovered that he copied most of this Theology from Hindu sources and the 19th Century spiritualist movement. I recently discovered that the word “Cognition” was copied point blank from Rudolph Steiner.
I never really understood Hubbard until I started to track down his statements to historical sources. Take, for example, Theta and the Time Track. All he did was read Occult sources and change the terms. People always say Crowley. This is True. He took tons from Crowley. But Hubbard stole from everyone who wrote anything. He just changed the words. Hubbard at least gave credit to the Veda for some of Scientology. But this is mostly false. The Veda had become ritualistic dominated by the high priests. Hubbard actually stole most of his theology from esoteric Hunduism, Jainism, and Kabballah. It is impossible to consider Hubbard in any sort of original Buddhist tradition. You might track Buddha back to esoteric Buddhism but most of this research is subject to questions.
IMO, Hubbard was really dumb and ignorant. He read some material and put together what he thought was a consistent religion. But Scientology always was just a partial view of Theology. You can prove this with one simple point. In his OT VIII theory Hubbard suddenly thinks in 1980 that OT VIII’s should audit the GE. There are at least fifty religious traditions since the Egyptians who solved that problem earlier. The fact that it ended Hubbard in a contradiction, proves that he did not have a valid religion. Then Hubbard claims that he is the synthesis of Eastern and Western religion which is pure nonsense.
George, I want to add here that I think that the problem of Hubbard’s sources is almost exponentially complex. He got a lot of things through secondary sources like Theosophy, and other more obscure ones that would be hard to figure out, rather than from the original sources themselves – maybe even rarely from the original sources, he may have been too intellectually lazy for that. I suspect he also picked up bits and pieces at lectures, discussions and cocktail parties, particularly when he was hanging around Jack Parsons’ mansion. Then there is the aspect that is all too easy to forget, of Hubbard’s now-banished early collaborators and contributors, who introduced their own knowledge and perhaps training to an extent that we will never know – and that may be far greater than is obvious. The more I delve into it, the less I think that Hubbard really came up with himself.
Blavatsky was mentioned above. The Nazi’s studied Theosophy and apparently got some of their ideas from Blavatsky, including use of the swastika iirc and some of the racial ideas.
Hubbard has talked about studying Rosicruciansim, and I believe the Rosicrucianists have acknowledge he took a certain number of lower level courses. I have not heard any such thing regarding Hubbard and Blavatsky, but it would not be surprising if he studied her and/or Hitler and just didn’t mention it.
We here all know that just a bit prior to founding Dianetics Hubbard was doing Babylonian sex magick with Parsons designed to manifest the goddess and bring about matriarchy. Instead, it manifested Hubbard (apparently by “channeling” an aspect of the goddess Hathor who he described as a naked red haired woman wielding a sword) and made him a lot of money at the mere expense of baby killing, the destruction of families, the sacrifice of the lives of his followers…
Prior to that he claims to have had a mystical experience due to nitrous oxide consumption during a dental procedure where he claimed to have died and visited a place where all knowledge was revealed to him momentarily, before he was forced to return to life. DM even made a multimedia presentation about this event in the mid-90s.
So while Hubbard claimed to be a scientist, at least initially, he was actually some sort of revealed mystic, along the lines of a Blavatsky or a Crowley, who apparently channeled Thelema from an aspect of the god Horus, after performing the same ritual that Nibs said that Hubbard performed, the ritual of Abramelin, which is designed to put one in contact with one’s holy guardian angel.
Interestingly, Robert Anton Wilson also performed that ritual and also claims to have contacted a higher intelligence. It was due to reading him when I was young and his understanding of how conspiracies work that helped me understand what was going on in CofS in terms of information compartmentalization and things like that
For instance, some of the darker writings that I was told initially had been cancelled and were no longer in use such as the HCO Manual of Justice were actually just locked up in the DSA’s office where the general public couldn’t see them. The DSA assured me that it was in full use. I was shocked. The person who told me that it was cancelled probably didn’t know himself that it was still in use because CofS uses “need to know” data compartmentalization to keep the nasty parts away from all but the most loyal who will go along with crazy viciousness without question or protest, which Scientologists seem prone to doing, unfortunately.
George – I like your new avatar. Doll bodies are the best. 🙂
Thanks, Richard!!!
I don’t mean to be rude but I believe this is Jon Attack’s theory originally. If I’m wrong I apologize.
Yes good people, that is who I first heard that Scientology can be associated with hypnotism.
When I first read it I did not see how it could be true. It was only after reading and coming to these blogs that it started becoming true for me.
When I read Altitude Instruction a light bulb went off and I started to see that being hypnotized is not only the popular notions of “look into my eyes” or “watch the swinging pendulum.”
So it became my knowledge and then I had Jon Ataks view to back it up.
So yes, I believe Jon may have been the first to see this.
It really doesn’t matter to me who thought about it first.
As far as I am concerned Jon Atack is the first to have peer reviewed Hubbard’s complete works and is the first to show some of his tricks, for which we should all be grateful.
I just had an interesting thought:
All critics have criminal pasts who are bad people, makes all critics into demons.
What is the result of this doctrine?
WE WILL NEVER BELIEVE ANYONE WHO IS CRITICAL OF RON. THEY HAVE BEEN NEUTRALIZED; DEAD AGENTED
And what about it’s our evil that is at the bottom of being critical of Hubbard or Scientology?
THIS DOCTRINE SABOTAGES OUR ABILITY TO BE CRITICAL OF RON AND SCIENTOLOGY. WE DEAD AGENT OUSELVES.
Ron coverd all basses. If some in the outside world is critical of Ron: they are evil
If you have any personal thoughts of criticism: it comes from your evil!
This doctrine of demonizing the discriminating intelligences ability to scrutinize and see truth directly was a well planed psycho manipulation.
All of these distorted doctrines could only be accepted by someone who is in a low level Altitude relative to Ron. Hypnotism without the “look into my eyes” command.
“All critics have criminal pasts who are bad people, makes all critics into demons.
What is the result of this doctrine? WE WILL NEVER BELIEVE ANYONE WHO IS CRITICAL OF RON. THEY HAVE BEEN NEUTRALIZED; DEAD AGENTED”
Even worse, once you’re really deep in the Kool-aid, and have crossed over from indoctrinated and mind controlled to self-indoctrinating and perpetuating the mind control of others, your own skeptical-minded, critically reasoning self becomes the enemy, so that you’re pitted against yourself, with the deluded, mind-controlled cult personna that you’ve assumed being put on constant guard against the kind of “thought crimes” that, when disclosed during sec checking, will get you in deep shit with your $cn masters.
Thus, the “prison of belief” that Wright so evocatively described is created, maintained and perpetuated.
Hubbard’s genius was that he weaved huge whoppers into a rich fabric of psychobabble and science fiction. The biggies are easy to spot: the existence of “clear”, “OT”, “cause over MEST”, “total freedom”. He promoted these states solely for marketing purposes, dangling the carrot (“the only way anybody gets stuck to anything is by a mystery sandwich”) above the heads of interested newbies and those already hooked on the euphoria provided by his trance-inducing introductory drills and talk therapy.
The hypnotic nature of Scientology mirrors the insidious pattern of Hubbard’s bullshit. Seduced by the claims of higher states and x-men abilities, students are gradually drawn into a web of “observable truths” (aka misdirection) regarding the phenomena they encounter along the way.
It all starts with perhaps the biggest lie of all – “hypnotism is not used” (DMSMH) – and extends from there. It’s not imagination, it’s a “past life”. It’s not disassociation, it’s “exteriorization”. Proof that you are a spiritual being and that Hub is a dude worth taking seriously. “Exteriorization” is arguably one of the most sinister, imho, as it is often the first, the most significant and addictive experience a scientologist has, used as the first of many hooks to lure the beginner in further and to start accepting (and submitting to) Hubbard as an authority.
Is it possible that in a closed system, possibly a reform school, that a person could be broken down to nothing and then ‘hypnotized’ to become what those in authority want? Is it possible for this to happen without the child’s knowledge or consent and no one stop it?
He sort of defined sympathy differently. I’ll agree that there can be a lack of genuine sympathy in Scientology. Someone is in grief over loss of a loved one and it’s just something a session will handle. No case on post, etc. But I do see that the “sympathy” on the tone scale is a different definition than the traditional “wog” meaning of sympathy. If you’ve trained in Scn you know that.
+1
and Brian, about this thing with critics of Scientology having things to hide:
If Scientology were what it says it is, a technology that enables one to go back in time and erase something that hinders one and/or make oneself more aware of who one really is. (It did that for me and still does.) So what are the motives of someone who does not want this to happen? Now since the Church has become a criminal organization the whole thing has become inverted. So, IMHO, is your take on what LRH says re. hypnotism and altitude. They way I see it, all he does, is telling you one more thing about how he found the mind mind to work. Why would he tell you, if that was what he does?
Marcel Wenger
Research on trauma was being conducted in the US in the 1940s. The US military continued to research PTSD. The first DSM was published in 1952.
There is a brief article in Wiki about Mesmer and his work with hysteria sufferers and metal rods.
https://en.m.wikibooks.org/wiki/Applied_History_of_Psychology/Perspectives_on_Psychological_Trauma
Things that make ya go hmmm..
Marcel, please complete this sentence fragment for us, so we know what you’re talking about here: “If Scientology were what it says it is, a technology that enables one to go back in time and erase something that hinders one and/or make oneself more aware of who one really is.”
“If Scientology…” then what?
Sorry, Harpoona Frittata, guess that wasn’t so well written. It should read “If Scientology were what it says it is, a technology that enables one to go back in time and erase something that hinders one and/or make oneself more aware of who one really is, it would make sense to assume that the guys attacking it would not be the cowboys with the white hats.
Marcel, that sounds like the logic that Hubbard and Scientology promotes. The problem is, that it obfuscates by mis-defining the terms, because Scientology is a complex organization that has multiple technologies, all of which have extended and complex implications to evaluate.
The question isn’t whether Scientology may have delivered one thing that it said it would, but what is the totality of what it did and what that cost. It’s an old trick to give people a little bit that is actually of value, and then use that as a lure to get them into something that in the long run does more harm than good; untrustworthy people from con artists to budding dictators, have used those tricks since time immemorial.
If Scientology really just delivered something good, at a reasonable cost, and did nothing else and cost people nothing more, then it wouldn’t be attacked like it is – and there would certainly be good reason to question the motives of any attackers. The problem is, that it’s not that simple, or so beneficial.
We also know that bandying about verbal tech like that will get you sent to cramming or worse, so if we’re going to play the “a real $cilon would know that” game, then you better play by all the rules here. What’s the source reference(s) that you’re referring to here?
If Elron alter-ised the standard definition of sympathy to mean something that is lower on the tone scale than hate, then that view has some very direct logical implications because the further down on the tone scale you go the less pro-survival your temporarily embodied theetan is capable of acting. Thus, if hate is more pro-survival than sympathy in a $cn believer’s mind, then they’ve bought into, and are perpetuating, a belief system that is sociopathic by definition.
“theetan” – funny! – my theetan is laughing
I really love this rhetorical speech given by Hubbard and he even admits that Book 1 Dianetics did not produce a Clear. About 3:17 into the vid and up to 3:44 minutes he admits he didn’t produce a Clear.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAVjFpKdbt4
Sympathy so low, no wonder David signed up. Which is more dangerous, Hubbard’s mystifying consent inducing mind control or DM’s compelling, brow beating control stasis?
You made me think, Brian. Thanks.
I think hypnotism can be scaled, both by the person doing the hypnotizing and the person being hypnotized.
Some people seem to have a knack for “putting people under.” Others wouldn’t dream of doing it if they could.
Some people are more susceptible to suggestion than others. On one end of the scale you have people that will fall into a trance at the drop of a hat. Some are impossible to hypnotize.
Maybe LRH had the “knack.” Or maybe he just attracted the sort of people susceptible to the particular junk he was peddling, and hypnotism had nothing to do with it.
I’d like to believe I wasn’t hypnotized when I was in, that I was simply fearful and stupid. But who knows? Does a man know if he’s hypnotized?
When I was actually doing it, I found that most I worked with went under easily. Most of those I worked with wanted to stop smoking…and it worked. This, mind you was back in the mid 50s. After about two years, I came to the conclusion that I did not know enough about the mind to continue doing it and quit. But, if the person is opening willing, it’s a very simple thing to do. TV advertising is a good example. One needn’t actually be put to sleep. 🙂
I think it was Ron’s science/spiritual angle that got me.
He sounded so good when I was 18 years old. He was extremely charasmatic. And I loved his way of making eastern concepts more westernized.
Then when I read Hymn of Asia………….
I fell under. The Altitude of him being Metreiya, come on earth to finish the Buddha’s work acted as a deep command.
He knew what he was doing.
Chuck and Brian both touch on aspects of Hubbards skills at controlling others for his own craving for admiration and security. His methods were fraud, fables, fairytales and phony philosophy pilfered from others who came up with original concepts.
Bottom line he wanted to control others for his own personal gain regardless of the cost to those he was manipulating. That is sick. He died as he lived. One sick puppy.
I have no idea what the hell any of this means.
It basically means that if a person can elevate their status to someone, the words of that person will be given more weight and accepted as true.
When people say,”Ron says” all the time, those folks have installed Hubbard on a the pedestal that Ron himself built.
And when a person has enough Altitude the hypnotic subject will accept any command as true.
“All critics have a criminal past” is a control command that Hubbard created.
To have a mind that can accept this absurd statement without question is evidence that some form of mind control has occurred.
Normal minds could never even think with this statement.
All blows come from evil intentions and overts is also another mind numbing control command.
Hubbard knew what he was doing.
Brian, good analysis.
I didn’t grant Hubbard an elevated status until I experienced benefits from some of his “tech”. Following that, his altitude instruction worked very well on me.
It took me a long time to accept that anyone would use techniques that initially benefited me as the means to control me.
Having experienced benefits at the lower end of the Bridge (Grades, NED), I readily accepted everything else Hubbard put forth as truth BECAUSE HE WAS OBVIOUSLY MUCH WISER AND HAD ATTAINED A HIGHER STATE THEN ME.
What kind of person uses spiritual & mental help to control others, enrich himself, and elicit adoration from others?
In the end, his cleverness didn’t benefit him very much. He died in isolation, separated from family, friends and followers and in bad health.
Typo correction: BECAUSE HE WAS OBVIOUSLY MUCH WISER AND HAD ATTAINED A HIGHER STATE THAN ME.
“It took me a long time to accept that anyone would use techniques that initially benefited me as the means to control me.”
WW, your statement there is both poignant and right on the money in providing insight into how folks of normal or higher intelligence can get sucked deeper and deeper into the scam!
Early “wins” on lower bridge auditing processes (largely “borrowed” from others without proper source citation) act as bait which draws you further into the long con that is $cn in its essence.
Exactly! The “guards” which keep $cilons in their individual “prisons of belief” are uncritically adopted “stable datums,” like “everyone who is critical of $cn has hidden crimes” or “BTs are the real cause of all of mankind’s deepest spiritual enslavement”.
They’re all just as bogus and ludicrous as the day is long, but if you can get folks to jump for that rubbish as a group, then that kind of mad space opera nonsense gets perpetuated as Holy Gospel…which is exactly what Elron was most concerned about, i.e., smashing his name into history.
Not “…jump for that rubbish…” I meant to say “…CHUMP for that rubbish…”
😀
The word empathy and compassion are not mentioned by Hubbard.he had none. He commanded by fear.
Probably not moreso than a top sergeant in the US Army! LOL
Thanks Brian, for a very thoughtful and well-written essay about this key topic, which goes to heart of addressing the crucial question of whether and to what extent Elron was consciously, purposefully and strategically employing explicit and systematic methods of covert influence and mind control in order to dupe, deceive and defraud any and all who came into his orbit – either directly or through his written words.
The conclusion that many who’ve studied the matter deeply and for years have come to is that, not only was he a master of covert influence and mind control, but that he also created an organizational structure in the form of the Co$ which embodies and perpetuates those very same methods in a systematic fashion that continues to operate to this day under the absolute dictatorial control of his successor.
Elron often revealed his own malign intentions by speaking in the third person, as if to indict some anonymous group or type of individual, when in reality his words most accurately describe him and his intentions/actions to a tee…just as it does in the key passage on altitude instruction that you’ve focused in on here to reveal one of his principle methods of gaining influence over others.
Harpoona Frittata, you’ve said so wisely things I felt upon reading this wonderfully thought through post of Brian’s.
Brian, changing third person to first made a very chilling change. One that really got me to thinking. But the brilliant phrase “definitional rape” just caught me up short. I love it.
To digress when a teen I had an unwanted sexual encounter. I couldn’t stop it, so I relaxed and endured and was not hurt. Physically. Why did I feel like a such a slut afterward? I don’t know. Decades later a friend told me it was rape. I instantly felt un-slutty about it. Peaceful and clean. She called it. I appreciate that.
Reading this reminded me of that. I discussed with my spouse a scenario as an example of why definitional rape was a valid concept. My scenario is attempted definitional rape, in a perfect world. (Yeah, I’ll be thinking of that for a while.)
Let’s say you are new to Scientology and someone says, “Tell me what you think when you think the word, “reasonable.”
You say, “hmm, well someone who is diplomatic, maybe a good negotiator, someone who can hear both sides, someone who can sympathize with the other person’s situation, environmental factors etc, someone who could be a good arbitrator or judge.”
And then they say, “what if I wanted to give you a new way to think of that word? A way that would have you thinking that being reasonable is wrong, it’s weak, it’s stupid, it’s the way that losers become losers, it’s the way to fail, it’s the way to let others fail by not making them ‘do the right thing’ or the way to not be strong, and the way to let others walk all over you?”
You think, “huh, well this original one is in the dictionary and I like it fine. This other definition this person is suggesting would taint my good feelings about being flexible and open minded.” And you say. “No thanks!” And then they suggest a new definition for “Open minded.” And it means you’re bad. NO.
But that conversation didn’t happen. I just learned to look up words. And the altitude of Elron affected the definitonal word rape quite thoroughly. And fairly invisibly.
I feel slutty about agreeing to the new definition Scino hypno-definition of “reasonable.” OK, I hereby declare that being “reasonable” means what it used to mean to me. If some $cintologist uses “reasonable” with me their way, I’ll substitute my way, in my mind, because they just have a hypno-word definition they are using. I do not need to use it.
I’m a nice person, so I won’t point out their error. After all, I am a reasonable person and after reasoning out where they are coming from and how they would react if I told them my stance on the disputed word, I choose not to say my truth to them. It’s a Webster vs. LRH thing. It is kinder to smile sweetly, not react, move on and finish the talk we’re having so we both feel fine.
There I can say reasonable now and not feel slutty.
Brian thank you for that.
PS. on Terra’s, “PTS in Scientology: Bug or Baddie?” (May 6, 2017) I left a comment dated 5-13 to you, Marildi, TJ, Wynski and Ann Watson. I thought you’d like it so I wanted you to know it was there. I mentioned Chris Shelton and Dave Fagan too. It’s kinda long.
Your method of handling such folks is superb. 🙂
Hey Clearly Not clear, yes I did get your kind words on the SP/PTS blog.
I wanted to respond but I thought it was so far back I did not want to create more work for Mike.
Thank you Clearly More Clear Than You Think. 🙂 I truly appreciate it.
And I resonate with your take on things also. Appreciate your looking.
That makes me smile. And I’ll try to be a little more up-to-date my comments for Mike’s benefit to.
Harpoona you said
“Thanks Brian, for a very thoughtful and well-written essay about this key topic, which goes to heart of addressing the crucial question of whether and to what extent Elron was consciously, purposefully and strategically employing explicit and systematic methods of covert influence and mind control in order to dupe, deceive and defraud any and all who came into his orbit – either directly or through his written words.”
Exactly! That’s what I’ve been thinking recently about Ron. He was strategic in everything he did.
He used the science of the mind to ensare others for personal gain.
This, I hope, could maybe be a true clinical study of his writings and his life.
Ron was sharp as a wit and sly like a fox.
Interesting take on it and a timely treatise on Scientology. Only a fool would disagree with the available and obvious evidence that Hubbard burnt the candle at both ends and his hypocrisy knew no bounds. Even his agendas swung both ways with lots of secretive stuff throw in and it all developed a life of its own. Miscavige is just a quick thinking thug who hit the mother-load of a jackpot. It’s easy to think very quickly if you’re a complete asshole!
I just wish I knew or have had experience in a system that gave an inkling to which way the truth of benevolent mind assessment and processing goes. I can’t say I favor any religion or scientific approach really. Enjoy yourself with a good job and family plus having a foreseeable future for them is about as good as any pursuit I suppose, but that’s pretty tough, especially in 3rd world countries. I’ve seen military think and training operate in real life, I have a policeman friend who’s been in that game for a long time (too long I reckon) and have been in business for a long time too. Mind control from altitude in the above context is rife throughout society. Mankind goes about following leaders and religious beliefs and gets done to the soul destroying work of slaughtering other humans and their beliefs with great conviction on more or less a regular basis. Now we experiencing unprecedented financial dictatorship spreading globally with the use of electronics which is scary to say the least.
I do think with Hubbard, he stumbled onto something and it surprised the hell out of him the effect it created on others. He ending up following certain guidelines, very well delineated above (good work Brian) without much choice in he matter. He probably felt if he made Scientology benevolent it would quickly be uncontrollable or branch off in countless ways very quickly as everyone has the potential use of the mechanisms of hypnotic suggestion, lies or being a confidence trickster with altitude, in any of it’s forms. Teaching people how it’s done was something Hubbard feared the most. Nothing is more potentially dangerous than a human being with developing power over others. Throw lots of money in the mix or methods of getting it (legal or not, doesn’t make much difference) plus an understanding of the extant legal, political and policing methods and bingo, life can become a crap game with loaded dice.
If anything this treatise is indeed useful in shoring up self-determinism. Putting Hubbard in perspective with the mechanisms of mind control/manipulation/processing/development he followed not only did it rip us off but it also taught us just how vulnerable the human mind actually is. Scientology (plus an honest look at Hubbard) is organizationally on it’s way out and may just be becoming useful as a diagnostic system of comparative value for other “gurus” who show up every now and again. It’s got quite the tools in it but the road to long term sanity is anyone’s guess, if it exists at all. Aging alone fucks you up anyway – in old age you become more or less dependent on others and their altitude over you.
I yawn a lot, I just loved this of yours, “Interesting take on it and a timely treatise on Scientology. Only a fool would disagree with the available and obvious evidence that Hubbard burnt the candle at both ends and his hypocrisy knew no bounds. Even his agendas swung both ways with lots of secretive stuff thrown in and it all developed a life of its own. Miscavige is just a quick thinking thug who hit the mother-load of a jackpot. It’s easy to think very quickly if you’re a complete asshole!”
And it’s easy to make those snap decisions when you have total certainty, right? If you know it all, there’s no need to waste time thinking. I mean that’d be reasonableness right? And wasting time-ness right?
I like your idea that future academics could use Elron’s con/manipulation/etc as a diagnostic system. A comparison tool.
That “unprecedented financial dictatorship” has been in effect for well over a century. We’re just learning more about it thanks to the internet. It didn’t suddenly “happen”. Such dictatorships are “normal” whenever there is strong force at the top. And that’s been going on for a few thousand years, at least.
The internet wasn’t around last century, nor personal computers. Financial dictatorship has been around ever since money was invented. The more people bank on or rely on computer finance control and employ micro-chipped debit/credit to control things for them the less cash is required in circulation. My brother in law is a forensic budget/financial accountant for large corporations and his stories of how the electronic and software advancement of record keeping verges on open criminal conspiracy in the way it is manipulated. They keep their systems highly complex and confusing for a reason. He hates the banks with a vengeance but works very closely with them and dare I say profits from them with his wiz-kid efficiency on making them an extra shackle or two with no more than writing a bit of code.
I don’t trust where a cashless society is heading anymore than I do of a politician’s promises of reform.
Great post, thank you
Quite enlightening. 100% logical.. what a blessing to have left all that behind.
I think this is spot-on, Brian, particularly as his driving intention.
Spot on Brian. That explains the difficulty of pulling people out of the cult. Witness on this blog the few who are still thoroughly hypnotized. Even when physically shown that they are NOT flying in a space ship at 20,000 miles altitude they refuse to accept it and just blame the messenger for never understanding Tubbolard and his “tech”.
Also, Hubbard was projecting most of the time when railing against people too.
I tend to go along with your descriptions, Chuck. I studied and used hypnotism in my late teens for several years and found I was quite good at it. I’m in disagreement that scio has always been about hypnotism. And I feel that Jon Atack has sort of hypnotized a lot of folks to believe his take on things. If it were truly that good, the numbers of adherents would have been wildly higher. And certainly lasted longer. I went a long way in scio and found a great deal of it to be useful and “door opening” for me. And I (quietly) disagreed with a lot of the things he stated. Even in auditing, I always felt I was in control of where things were going. A lot of it helped me a great deal. Are there “engrams”? Sure. That’s hardly a big deal. (It was first developed around 1910 by some German fellow, as I recall.) Have I run some of them out? Sure. Again, no big deal. I actually did that “earlier similar” thing about six months back and an entire stretch of my life changed. And *that* was a big deal. At least to me.
We all got in because we were seeking something. Some found it, and left. Some didn’t, and left. Some didn’t and stayed, willing to swallow the whole thing. I’ve stated here and on the Bunker – many times – that there had to be a lot of truth for so many of us, especially college educated, to have gone so far.
Can I fly through the air at will? Not at this time. Can I read minds? Yes, to an extent. My wife and I do it with each other constantly and we’re both fairly good at spotting attitudes in others.
Do we live more than one life? Well, if not, none of it makes ANY sense to me. Some “intelligence” put this vast game into play and stating that we only get one time around seems quite absurd. Am I right? Perhaps. I think so and I’m the only one I need convince.
Do I have any ansers? Yep. For me. No one else. We make our choices and play with the cards which come to us. If we’re really lucky (or smart) we learn when to play the hand we have and when we ask for a different deal It’s called “Life”. I’m enjoying it a lot. 🙂
Gman77, I am interested in your take on the hypnotism idea. My spouse and I had quite a convo on it today. We came up with the fact that maybe there is a spectrum of altitude sliding up to hypnosis when people make decisions based on their affection for someone asking them to do something they do not want to do.
We failed to come up with how to draw the line between affection/altitude and when it becomes a hypnotic command of sorts.
I liked hearing your take on what you got out of it.
Truly for all the stories I share there were good times and good realizations.
I’m glad you are enjoying life a lot. Me too.
thegman – I share your viewpoints. What would be the point of having a Universe if there wasn’t consciousness to observe it? Of course, on the flip side of the coin, the Earth did just fine with just dinosaurs on it. All viewpoints allowed. lol
Try this, anyone – The Rollins Band, “Liar” – Rollins understood scn
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCLizTg9Wo
correction
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCLizTg9nWo
Here is Milton Erickson´s take on what hypnosis is:
¨Milton Erickson defined hypnosis simply as “communication,” and as “concentrating exclusively on your own thoughts, values, memories and beliefs about life.” He said that the “trance state is active unconscious learning”. During the trance state there is a shift of attention from external to internal reality, the highly focused attention being directed on one experience at a time. It is considered that all hypnosis is self-hypnosis.The hypnotherapist’s role is to assist in this process. What is Hypnotherapy? Although there are many different hypnotic inductions, most include suggestions for relaxation, calm, and well-being. Most people describe the experience of hypnosis as very pleasant. Hypnosis is not a type of therapy, but a procedure that can be used to facilitate therapy. It has been used in the treatment of pain, depression, anxiety, stress, habit control, post-traumatic stress disorder and many other psychological and medical problems. Hypnosis should be used as an adjunct to treatment with a qualified health-care professional who is trained in the use and limitations of clinical hypnosis.¨ http://nyseph.org/what-is-hypnosis/
He is recognized as one of the most skilled practitioners/developers of hypnotic methodology in the 20th century.
Just adding this to the discussion for readers to ponder…
I listened to a couple of his lecture’s it was so nutty the way he talked it made me wonder how in the world could people take this seriously? Especially calling it a religion,and the tax free status?My daughter and son-in-law are both army staff Sgts.they”ve been to Afghanistan 3 times my daughter helps mankind she helps the women and children, I’d much rather see that tax income taken away from Scientology and put on her paycheckshe’s risked her life, been shot at,and is now getting her nursing degree to help more of mankind, at least stop the tax exemption status please!!!!!
I find the words of LRH extremely dull and rambling at times.
As for taking away their tax exempt status… YES YES and YES!
Everyone else is paying an extra price because of this criminal organization being allowed to have tax exemption. This is a travesty and must be revoked. Please write your representatives.
Look DEEP into my eyes Brian…You are full of it!
Can you expand your ideas? Please be specific if you choose.
I’d love to know your thoughts Gayle?
Free communication on any subject?
I’m game.
+
Oh, you’re game, Brian? Okay, here goes!
Apparently you’ve never read DMSMH where Ron explains how dangerous hypnotism is and advises people never to use it. Your whole article appears to be full of generalities and innuendos rather than established facts.Then again, you are so opposed to Scientology that anything you say must be accepted as truth even without facts to back it up.
Terra Cognita’s articles have more facts than your drivel.
Hey alcoboyy, thanks for your reply.
In Altitude Instruction it is simple. The hypnotic operator only has to put himself on a pedestal to influence. Here are some concepts that Ron conveyed to us that fall in that catagory:
1) Ron sold that Scientology is the ONLY road out
2) In Hymn of Asia he sold that he was the prophecy of the Buddha
3) the ONLY person to know the REAL truth about life.
4) the ONLY person to learn about and survive OT3
5) he is considered the wisest man in history by his disciples.
How did this happen? How can people think Ron is the wisest man in history? This sentiment did not happen in a vacuum.
It happened because LRon Hubbard implanted those views carefully, purposefully and with great knowledge of how the mechanism of control is instilled to make a “believer”; a paying customer.
Throughout his writings are statements, by Ron, of his uniqueness, his “only way” statutes. And he disses other paths and teachers as only “keyed out clear”,”dramatizing implants”, “designed to trap you in a body.”
This is Altitude Instruction. Because of this promoted elevation in Ron’s status, Ron could tell us anything and it will know go into our minds, bypass the analytical mind, and just become our point of view.
“If it’s not in writing it is not true” is a statement that similarly acts as Altitude Instruction.
This statement “if it’s not in writing it’s not true” could be considered a hypnotic command.
Because it presupposes that Ron’s ideas are always true, Its absurd.
And proof that Ron used his Altitude to control with lies? Here is proof.
Remember what Mayo said in his 3 part interview? He said that Hubbard told him and another executive that “people don’t blow from overts, they blow from ARCxs”
He told Mayo to not let “anyone in on it” (just like in Altitude Instruction) and that if people found out the truth he would loose control of the church.
Ok, let’s look at this fact.
1) LRH uses the tech of Scientology to control in this scenario
2) he cause his students to introvert and make it “their fault” for wanting to escape from an untenable situation.
L RON HUBBARD ASSOCIATED THE DESIRE TO LEAVE A DYSFUNCTIONAL AND ABUSIVE ENVIRONMENT WITH HAVING EVIL INTENTIONS.
HE MADE STUDENTS BELIEVE THAT IT WAS THEIR FAULT FOR WANTING TO BLOW.
HE LEFT THIS LIE IN PLACE FOR THE STATED REASON OF CONTROLLING.
HE GAVE NOT A WIT OF SYMPATHY OR CONCERN FOR THE HUNDREDS OF INTROVERTED AND BRAIN FUCKED PCS TRYING TO FIND THE EVIL IN THEMSELVES TO JUSTIFY WANTING TO BLOW.
He lied on purpose. He set up a situation in which NO ONE WILL LOOKED AT HUBBARD DIRECTLY BECAUSE THEY HAVE AGREED THAT EVERYTHING HUBBARD SAYS IS TRUE AND IT IS ALWAYS OUR EVIL THAT ATTEMPTS TO SCRUTINIZE HUBBARD.
To cause a mind to introvert and search for personal overts and evil as the cause of being critical of Ron and Scientology was a carefully planned strategy by Ron.
He told Mayo he keeps this lie in place in order to control US!!!!!
Ron was not concerned about the psychological damage this doctrine can cause naive followers. His only concern was for control.
Control……… that is all what Altitude Instruction is about…….
CONTROL
The word “altitude” is just a short-hand metaphor for “credible and authoritative”.
Folks who’ve become true experts in their respective fields earn the “altitude” they achieve, not by confabulating space opera gibberish (which will supposedly kill you dead if you hear the story before you’re ready for it), but through real scientific research, published in actual peer-reviewed journals, and debated openly by every single skeptical colleague who might care to…the exact opposite of the fixed belief, received wisdom, “held down seven” hypno-bullshit that Elron pulled from out his ample ass!
I agree with what you’re saying but , in my case, the tech has been an enormous benefit to me. And, no, I don’t put LRH on a pedestal and acclaim him as the greatest being who ever lived. Of course he had faults.
Of course he was flawed. Yes, there are Scientologists who elevate him to the status of a god but to say that they do this because they’re hypnotized absolves them of any personal responsibility in my opinion. To me, it’s like saying that Hitler hypnotized 70 million Germans rather than saying that they chose to buy into his hype.
I honor the fact that you experience Scientology and have maintained your independence Alcoboyy.
If there where no truths in Scientology it would not have made it this far.
I experienced good things also in Scientology.
But it took me a long time to uncover within myself some of the lies. And how those lies have affected my life.
Brian an excellent reply and a great essay, got me realizing a lot. I don’t often comment on your posts but I want you to know that I appreciate them all, they’re definitely food for thought.
Thank you Ms.P 🙂
Hubbard frequently gives himself away when viewed as Projecting his personal short-comings upon others.
Hubbard had his own criminality and his solution was to attack, but further, to create thousands of attack-bots like a cushion around himself.
Over the years I have availed myself of hypnosis to quit smoking or diet.
I studied up on it, and learned much that is helpful.
It is true that someone can be swayed this way without their awareness or permission, so it is best to learn what it’s all about.
I have gotten to be aware of the feeling, and sometimes have to shut out hypnotic scenarios in a drama or on a stage – lalalala!
When you can become facile in self-hypnosis, you really begin to understand the permission you give to another to go in there, unplug one response and replace it with another.
The practitioner must want to partner with your goals alone … a lot of credential-checking, preliminary discussion and trust-building should go into it. And to work, a lot of re-inforcement is involved. Forever!
‘Altitude’ is a funny word for it … reveals Hubbard’s narcissism and paranoia … maybe his essential position as an infant … but I’m not a professional!
For Hubbard though it seems every relationship was a deadly battle of wills for domination, so the efficient thing to do was cheat.
I am Kaarli Makela, I guess I have a wordpress page now! I’ve done nothing there yet … Nattering Never-Ins. 🙂
I guess if other never-ins want to shoot up a flare and say howdy, I’d be mighty pleased.
Great essay Brian.
Much of the ‘gurus’ work is building up their reputation so a transactional analysis type of attitude is generated. Lron got that through to enough to get the show on the road. Once you get a core of devotees, getting more is that much easier.
Hypnotism is important in getting that first group of devotees started down the gurus road. The first group of devotees becomes ‘blessed’ and they do a lot of the work in spreading the message.
Also sounds like that fat madman in North Korea! Maybe President Trump should put dm on his “List for Discipline”!
I hardly think President Trump gives a single thought to scientology or any of its history. LOL
I wholly like your views Brian.
But I don’t agree.
Milder people going into Scientology, come out, eventually, and return to being their basic nature.
In my years inside Scientology/Hubbard’s indoctrination and prejudices, I sensed that all along, I was walking into some new angle to “wisdom” but I knew from day 1, Hubbard could just be a crank, or a wierdo in the same sense that William James said the various 1800s “new religion” leaders all had “mental” ailments, and that mental ailment in the “religion” leader is almost a common characteristic.
Hubbard allows some picking and choosing, but if followers wish to move up into the top staff ranks, yes, you have to adopt the fuller panoply of Hubbard’s hundreds and hundreds of fine line prejudices and practices.
The presentation and atmosphere of the movement’s behavior today, I do enjoy your characterizations.
But I’d not agree yours is the definitive view one would see printed in an encyclopedia.
One of my life’s experiences was when I was on the RPF’s RPF, and my only window to the rest of the thinking world was the Encyclopedia. I should do a small paper on the importance of Encyclopedia since today, as we speak, Hubbard’s rules do say that Encyclopedia ARE to be in the RPF course training rooms, and Britannica is there, World Book is there.
In the end of the day, I think the public who don’t read encyclopedia nor Wikipedia, will stumble upon the media stories that get written ongoing.
Replace “hypnosis” with conditioning, mental conditioning, and I’m aboard that.
Hypnosis which means mental conditioning, fine, I can accept that if I keep translating hypnosis to mean mental conditioning, where propagandizing and opinion leading is also included.
Sure, it’s word play, it’s changing people’s views to suit the wordsmith’s goals.
Hubbard’s goals pretend spiritual salvation (soul flying, soul abiilities that ancient pure souls each of us as pure souls long ago supposedly had in our “Home Universes” etc), Hubbard is way more than just hypnosis charlatan hypnotizing unsuspecting dupes.
Dupes rush in where wiser people don’t go!
My dupe hope was that I was a soul, who through Scientology would regain soul-flying and my other “OT” ESP abilities. Hogwash malarky to me now.
I never felt hypnotized, nor did I think I was hypnotizing others, even when I personally daily ran the “Chinese Schooling” chanting for several years, in the admin course rooms.
I joke I was a brainwashing central training officer, I trained the execs who ran the brainwashing centers (aka the “religious angle” churches of fake religion Scientology), but I joke this as that is a common condemnatory way to dismiss, and it is correct to dismiss, Scientology.
but of course it isn’t hypnotism when you poke in depth into the “training” of staffs.
In session, I’d say auditing for sure is false memory instillation, namely past-lives are bogus, and for sure in Scientology’s auditing ladder of levels, you on the Class 5 level, New Era Dianetics will receive the “Past Life Remedies” if you as a preclear do NOT come up with “past lives” trauma engrams to resolve your case.
You can’t resolve your own case unless you delve into Past Lives. And Scientology’s Class 5 training materials contain ALL of the Hubbard remedies to help a person delve into their past lives.
That coercion to start entertaining and then accepting of one’s past lives I think of today as a form of false memory installing.
Past Lives Hubbard rememdies are direct steps for weening a person up to accepting their imaginary mental pictures as real past lives.
That’s a form of indoctrination beyond just “Chinese Schooling” Hubbard’s administrative or other lists of Hubbard’s principles and concepts.
The Golden Age of Tech drilling, the verbatim Patter Drills, are likewise more indoctrination, not hypnosis, unless you let the meaning of hypnosis splurge into indoctrination.
It’s all discussable and debatable, and I as an ex member hope people educated themselves enough to see hypnosis in the one on one sessions done by people who openly call themselves hypnotists, that those people if they were given the FULL Hubbard procedures I touched upon above, I think even open hypnotists would not consider but a tiny fraction of Hubbard’s procedures as hypnotism.
You have to give hypnotism a different wider meaning to enclose Hubbard’s procedures within hypnotism.
Hubbard’s crap is indoctrination, false memory instilling, propagandizing, wishful human thinking elevated to “reality” (what’s real for you is what is real—the downside is this leads the thinker into unknowingly becoming a looney like Hubbard).
You make some excellent points, Chuck, concerning the differences between hypnosis and mental conditioning which are important to consider, especially when we conceptualize them as existing along a continuum of other-determinism, in which those and other related terms (such as brainwashing, psycho-terrorism, group hypnotic induction, etc.) can be comprehensively understood as they are interrelated.
Brian’s argument is that Elron considered himself to be a master influencer of human minds through every possible means, including hypnosis. Elron was a dilettante and dabbler in most of the fields that he borrowed from in coming up with his space opera cosmology, but in the dark arts of mind control and persuasion he was very well studied and practiced. My view there is that he considered himself to be much more than a mere hypnotist – a grand master of mind control so deep that its practice could justifiably be described as “soul enslavement”.
Hypnotist is a job title, but those who are dedicated to controlling the minds and behavior of others for their own ends need that intention to remain entirely covert and unsuspected by those whose minds are being targeted for control. To me, that’s $cn in a nutshell and sums up the Source it sprang from just as concisely.
“Hubbard’s crap is indoctrination, false memory instilling, propagandizing, wishful human thinking elevated to “reality” (what’s real for you is what is real—the downside is this leads the thinker into unknowingly becoming a looney like Hubbard).”
Pretty much sums it up nicely, Chuck.
You bring up some good points Chuck. I do remember being somewhat amazed listening to an earlier 50s lecture about “home universe.” In that lecture Hubbard remarked, not many (if any) thetans liked their home universe or their abilities with it when the MEST universe showed up (BANG!). Some of them considered their own universes failures when they didn’t elicit the prized admiration they so eagerly sought. He went on to explain none of them had a “workable tech” to play around with energy and other stuff and at the same “time” other thetans were making a game out of them etc. (re the Factors). Thetans were reduced to seek the guidance of others to give them their jollies
Fairy-tale stuff maybe, but he covered all aspects to give his axioms credence if you followed the direction he considered workable and his theories of what life is composed of. He pulled off quite the illusion or delusion as they case now may well be, but I sort of accomplish the same thing with flyfishing. Hubbard, (like Miscavige) never did practice ‘catch & release’ though.
Dear I Yawnalot,
I enjoyed Hubbard’s “Home Universe” big end goal of returning all souls (since each one of us is a single soul, but our bodies have zillions of “body-thetans” many of whom emit “case” stuff into our own minds) all someday getting again to Native State for each of us as single souls and for everyone else someday regaining this too good to be true OT without a body Native State,
That was my foolish hope that I really hoped was being attained by others (I never got past Clear, and I determined I was a “false” Clear since I didn’t feel “Clear.”) So getting to OT 8 was for others, and I hoped they were happily attaining it.
If only Sarge had a video camera and posted video footage of Hubbard admitting to Sarge that Hubbard failed at it all.
Hubbard’s cosmic promises for the regaining of one’s long lost God like soul Native State full attainment, has nothing to do with hypnotism.
It’s just massive sales of “Blue Sky” for which Jon Atack’s book is just titled the simplest and best, to get across that Scientology is ALSO about selling people Blue Sky!
Scientology is galactic/universe grand in size of a con.
It’s just massively too good to be true.
Faith to me is wishful thinking and hope. I certainly gave faith, hope and wishful thinking willingly to Hubbard’s Full OT sales pitch.
Wishful thinking seems a separate factor to hypnotism.
They seem seperate factors why contributing to getting stuck in Scientology. My problem was more wishful thinking than the hypnotism problem.
Yes Chuck, it is indeed remarkable what wishful thinking can do and where it can lead. My analogy with fishing seems adequate (but a bit base I admit) in my estimation of the bait we sometimes swallow, then get played.
Hey Chuck, I am using the definition of hypnotism that Ron is using here.
No doubt we could say any learning could be a form of hypnotism.
We look up to teachers, experts etc. and they have Altitude. That Altitude is really trust. It’s trust that’s at the core of Altitude Instruction. My teacher says so and so and it must be true.
My point is that Ron knew how to redefine words, concepts and human values. He used this information to create a church of unquestioning believers with this knowledge.
He used and consciously created this knowledge of trust and Altitude to secure paying customers.
Whether we are put under by a hypnotic command like “look into my eyes and become a clucking chicken” and the person starts jumping and clucking…..
Or
ALL CRITICS HAVE CRIMINAL PASTS
And Scientologists rant against critics…..
What’s the difference?
The outcome is the same.
Psycho manipulation by way of Altitude Instruction.