Here is more insanity from the poor sheeple that are still struggling to keep the dream alive. Which is ALL they have.
Remember, this was one of the hugely hyped “ideal org buildings” — a derelict old building that was part of the Kellogg empire. It was purchased MORE THAN 15 YEARS AGO.
And now they have “new and exciting news”? (A clue — that new and exciting news is that you need to hand over more money, a LOT more money…. that is not really “new” and not really “exciting”).
The real story of the “massive international expansion” is that it does not exist. Anywhere.
Hello friends,
As you have undoubtedly heard, next weekend we are presenting something NEW and EXCITING to you about the Ideal Org project in Battle Creek.
You may wonder why it is that we want you to attend this particular presentation?
First, this is unlike any presentation we’ve held before about our Ideal Org. Of course, we’ve been promoting it as a “big mystery”. That remains true, for the data you will be hearing is not for public issue yet. This data is private, and it is for you. But of course, you have to come to the presentation in order to hear it for yourself. You must be curious! And quite honestly, this is some of the most exciting news regarding our Ideal Org project in quite some time!
But the primary reason we want you here in attendance for this is because of the power that can be generated by numbers. It has been proven time and time again that the more of us who gather– to form postulates together and work together as a third dynamic– the more momentum we can achieve. And momentum is exactly what is needed and wanted.
We have special guests arriving this week from management, to help unveil the news we have for you. You may have noticed over the past few years that something seems to be hindering our flows with regards to our Ideal Org. Think of the presentation next weekend as the solvent that will clear debris that has been blocking our progress toward having an Ideal Org in Battle Creek.
It will be a new adventure. Imagine how fond your memories will be when you look back at this time in the future, and reminisce on the obstacles that you helped overcome.
Please, join us next Saturday, April 15th. The presentation will be shown at the Masonic Center at 133 East Michigan Avenue, Battle Creek, Michigan. We’ll open the doors at 5pm.
Respond to this email or give me a call. Even if you don’t think you can make it, we’d still like to hear from you. (269) 965-5203.
Thank you,
Tim Jones
PES Battle Creek
Hopefully they will play some musical chairs during the opening event to this song: https://youtu.be/oi7KPDi_yQI
I am still getting mail from them! Lucky me. Not only Michigan sends me mail, now I get mail from Virginia too……whoopee!
Events, books, bullshit……dont need no more…..so my file 13 over glows.
I guess when they all die they will come back as zombies…..more walking dead, but, no money.
I know nada about the Scientology community in Battle Creek, so maybe there are more members than supposed in JPCap’s population distribution-based analysis. After all, the sample size is so small that other factors could easily overwhelm a statistical analysis. I’ll be charitable and peg the total population to the Kalamazoo combine statistical area, which includes Battle Creek, getting us to 335,000, which gets us to 10 local Scientologists, as per JPCap’s 1-in-10,000 supposition.
The big question is: How are they justifying the travel expenses, in advance, for a surprise bloodsucker from Management? I think that they must have baked in an agreement for a pre-planned donation of a certain size from some Ethically troubled local member, and that will at minimum cover the cost of “briefing.” Then there’ll be a game of pass the pen, which will approximately double the total haul.
Just thought I would like to poke into the flow of conscious folks that had been attracted to Scientology. i spent 40+ years chasing after what i had hoped it would give me. I was attracted to it because of the joining of western science and eastern philosophy. Although there were benefits and gains to be made I finally left after realizing that the original promise had been betrayed and that corruption had set in and that i was not becoming freer but was becoming more enslaved. Continuing the search for greater enlightenment I found a scientist, Thomas Campbell, who applied science to metaphysics and in his trillogy, “M
y Big Toe” (T heory O f E verything) has given me everything I had hoped for. OT is real and can be attained. I have had more cognitions and case gain reading MBT than in my entire bridge to OT7.
I have been a follower of Tom Campbell, too, for the past 5 years or more. I have his book but found his writing to be somewhat tedious. However, the youtube videos of his talks and workshops all over the world are superb, and I’ve watched many of them (the series done at Calgary in Canada is one of the best).
Actually, I think most of Tom’s “theory of everything” aligns very well with Scientology, and I don’t think I would have duplicated and appreciated it as much as I did (if at all) without having done Scientology, considering the data I got as well as the auditing gains. It might not apply to you, but people sometimes forget how far they’ve come. That would include their increased ability to evaluate philosophies and worldviews – even Scientology.
Anyway, good to know another Tom Campbell fan. 🙂
Hi Marildi,
i agree with you regarding the readability of the MBT trilogy. I am on the 4th time through and am discovering new concepts as I go along. The videos are great and I am enjoying the forum at https://www.my-big-toe.com/forums/index.php where his concepts are questioned and worked over quite nicely. I agree with you that my background in Scientology has helped me considerably in understanding his material and I get a lot out of the Youtube videos. Your observation about forgetting how far one has come is well taken although I am amazed with how many there are on the forum that appear to come from other origins. Oth the other hand maybe that is where a lot of the exes find themselves! Good to find you too!
Hi again, Richard.
I haven’t followed the MBT forum too much, but in one of the first threads I read there, Tom was being challenged by another physicist regarding a point he (Tom) had made about the double-slit experiment. After some discussion, he told the commenter that he was right. I really had to admire that – it was clear from the way he handled the whole thing that he was not at all a ser fac’y person. But then, as the discussion carried on, it turned out that Tom had been right after all. Anyway, above and beyond that particular example of who he is as a person, I would say he’s definitely an enlightened being.
Regarding there being many others on the forum from other origins, I consider that many different teachings can boost a person further along on his/her spiritual path, and Scn is definitely in that category, in my true opinion.
Lately, along with other spiritual teachers, I’ve been reading about Teal Swan and watching her youtube videos. Here’s the link to one that I just watched the other day that I feel fits nicely with and supplements Tom Campbell’s teachings. The key to hers is authenticity, and she calls what she is doing an “authenticity movement.” Check it out if you are so inclined. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXVTYje4gdI
Cheers!
To give you, or anyone interested, a little info about the Teal Swan video, the first part of it goes into her childhood a bit, although other videos and writings tell her story more thoroughly. But basically, from the age of 6 to 19, she was held captive by a man who was part of a radical offshoot of Mormonism – a cult that was into ritual torture. That experience relates to her spiritual insights, but most of the video is about her views on spiritual awakening — and they are simple and down-to-earth, and wise at the same time. She also has some brilliant things to say about educating children and other societal issues.
Hi again Marildi,
Yes, i have watched quite a bit of Teal swan. She does have a lot of insight. Another i enjoyed was Bashar, also can be found on Youtube. he is a channelled being with a bunch of wisdom. What resonated ost with him is his encouragement to listen to ones own resonation! Something I arrived at in Scientology about following ones indicators. Good stuff. Campbell is my favorite at the moment.
Agree with you again, Richard. The teachers who guide their students towards being their own teacher (so to speak) are the ones that resonate most with me too. Even Jesus said “The Kingdom of God is within.”
I just discovered and am about halfway through a new Tom Campbell video, part 1 of 7 of some talks he gave in L.A. this past October – in which he gets into the latest refinement of his model of reality, his ToE. At about 29.00 he gives the first clue of what it is. You probably know about it, but here’s the link, in case: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEuOGCEmiTg
Marildi – Try Aristotle’s Nicomachean Ethics, and think of admin scales as he describes men of varying dispositions from all walks of life at different ages. Scn opens up all the background because Hubbard sifted through and sorted it out into a coherent whole. You can go read stuff and appreciate it for its beauty and logic and insight, at the same time already in knowledge of the answers those guys were putting together, filling in the blanks, and not getting into confusions. The beauty of Scn is that it IS intuitive, it is “what you know”. I explained an admin scale to a woman just a little over a year ago. She didn’t get back to me on her own, so I asked her, next time I saw her, if she had found it useful. She said, “Yes, but that’s just how I do everything, everyday.” I said, “That’s my point.” It takes people some time to realize the obvious.
“The beauty of Scn is that it IS intuitive, it is ‘what you know’.”
Beautifully said, Nickname. I’ve seen the truth of that too, strange as it may seem to many former Scientologists. Thanks for your input!
Correct. And because L. Con knew scamming, felonies, lying, et al; that’s what scientology was.
Wynski, I think you’re being too simplistic about it. There have been others in history who were also geniuses but had their insanities at the same time.
Like most people, Hubbard was a complex person, and part of his complexity was that in spite of having obvious flaws, he did recognize some truths and from them developed some ingenious applications.
Differentiation is needed for a truly sane view.
In other words, we can’t just say that because he was flawed, all of his work was flawed.
Marildi, can you please make a list for us of what you consider his flaws to be?
His flaws summed up to being ego- and fear-driven. Which is actually not uncommon – but in his case, as with others who have achieved power, his flaws were magnified by it. “The bigger they are, the harder they fall” comes to mind.
See my other recent post where I’ve quoted Tom Campbell’s explanation for how such magnification of flaws comes about: https://www.mikerindersblog.org/more-ideal-org-absurdity/#comment-170747
“Differentiation is needed for a truly sane view. In other words, we can’t just say that because he was flawed, all of his work was flawed.” Brilliant observation, Miraldi.
Thanks, Cindy. Especially for your sanity. 🙂
Indeed, it is the logical fallacy “ad hominem” to critique a person’s statements or their body of work on the basis of their personality deficits. However, when the person’s behaviors are determined sociopathic it is fair to say they could not have been any kind of authority on normal human feelings, for instance.
A close examination of Mr. Hubbard’s Tone Scale shows how his personality deficits certainly led to deficits in understanding about human emotions.
I think it’s fair to hypothesize Hubbard’s development of the auditing methodology which is designed to help people, may well contain some of the same ruthless elements of his personality. Therefore it might be wise rather than forbidden to ‘squirrel’ that methodology.
Ok Marildi thanks
Ego and fear driven is pretty general. That may describe all of humanity.
Can you be specific? I could easily assign those traits to a sweet couple having marital problems or Hitler.
Could you be specific to Ron?
Okay, Brian. I’ll start by saying that in my view, Ron genuinely wanted to develop a way to address the irrationalities of people and to generally help them from their own point of view. This, I believe, would be perceivable by most people who have given or received auditing the way Ron directed it to be done – regardless of their understandable criticism of his personal behavior or the behavior of the church.
That said, in regard to the bad behavior, I see Ron as a typical human being in the sense that he acted on egoic impulses and fears – which meant that his approach in general was “us vs. them.” And he took actions to stop whomever he viewed as “them” – which, from his point of view, was the greatest good, not just on the first dynamic but the others as well.
Whether or not all the stories about him are totally true (they vary even among even those who had a close-up view), I would agree that this approach of “us vs. them” was misguided and mistaken. But if we want to be fair and honest about it, Ron’s actions were in essence no different from what the vast majority of people would have done IF they had the power that he had. It’s universally known that “Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.” Did you read that other comment of mine on this point, the one I gave you the link for?
You see “Ron” as a typical human being? marildi, EVERYBODY is a typical human being. Indeed. There is a bit of all of us in everybody. If our assessing of Mr. Hubbard is in the spirit of gossip, then certainly, it behooves us to be mindful of our own shortcomings and exercise charity in our judgements.
But if we are discussing the man for the purpose of bringing him down from the high alter where he has been worshipped to the detriment of many…then it is an obligation, a duty, to strip him of his medals in public! That’s the price all TYPICAL people pay for their abuse of power.
It isn’t a matter of punishment, the man is dead. It is for the sake of those who remain enthralled by him to their detriment and as a catharsis to assist people in their healing whereby they may rehabilitate their critical thinking skills.
Hubbard believed he was at war – and to him, it was a “holy war” no different from what many of the earlier Christian church leaders and the prophet Muhammed believed – except that they had the means to carry it out literally, and did so.
You say: “It is for the sake of those who remain enthralled by him to their detriment and as a catharsis to assist people in their healing whereby they may rehabilitate their critical thinking skills.”
Regardless of how much the it gets dressed up with fancy words, anyone who is “enthralled” by Hubbard isn’t going to be convinced otherwise by the level of criticism that goes on – especially the posts that are mean and childish and thus don’t lend themselves to any credibility whatsoever. (You are one of very few who at least attempt a rational discussion.) Even the comments about the church itself that might ring true for church members who are lurking are the ones that stick to the facts without all the over-the-top exaggeration.
The ranting and raving that goes on about Hubbard is not unlike what Tom Campbell described about the average person, who is also caught in the trap of ego and fear. He wrote:
“The only thing he can do is maybe kick his dog when he gets home. That’s all he can do. Maybe all he can do is just fuss, grumble, make a lot of noises, and rant and rave. But that’s all he can do.”
Hubbard “did what he could do,” and in that respect he was no worse than many people – unfortunately.
marildi, the Buddha says tenacity, however misguided, is supported by a great virtue. Having gotten that out of the way, you remind me of a mother defending her spoiled bratty child any possible way she can. “My baby-shnookums didn’t burn down that awful school and if he did I’m sure he had a good reason for after all who among us is perfect???”
You fault NOT my criticisms but the fact that I am making them. You argue that nobody’s mind will be changed. Fair enough but that objection is not an impersonal analysis but a COMPLAINT from a butt-hurt mommy! My criticisms need have no utility but to please me. You may of course, and SHOULD, object to my factual and logical errors.
Your comparing Hubbard-criticizing to Tom Campbell’s reference to ineffectual ranting, grumbling and “kicking the dog”, is a regrettably false analogy.
Mr. Campbell is describing a frustrated person. Hubbard-criticizing demonstrates a celebration, a liberation from frustration. The frustrated one is you. You, who are defending the spoiled baby-shnookums, are angry and are kicking the proverbial dog. Mr. Campbell’s comment applies to you, not to me.
“Your comparing Hubbard-criticizing to Tom Campbell’s reference to ineffectual ranting, grumbling and ‘kicking the dog’, is a regrettably false analogy. Mr. Campbell is describing a frustrated person. ”
Wow. You missed the whole point, or at least the major one. It wasn’t just that ranting is ineffectual. It was that the “quality of consciousness” (as Tom Campbell describes it) of “many people” is no different from those the consider to be the most evil. He said:
“…the major difference between them [the “evil” ones] and the average guy, or at least if not average then the one-in-ten man or woman in our population, it isn’t that they were exceptionally evil in their makeup. It was that they, for one reason or another, ended up with power. Because of the lack of growth, the lack of love, and the fact that they were driven by belief, fear, and ego, they had the ability to spread that lack of growth far and wide. They had the ability to do huge amounts of damage. The guy in the little shop in the alley who’s an old curmudgeon, who fusses and bangs his fists down all the time, he doesn’t have any power. The only thing he can do is maybe kick his dog when he gets home. That’s all he can do. Maybe all he can do is just fuss, grumble, make a lot of noises, and rant and rave.”
Thank you for your comment. Due to my charitable nature I limit myself to how much low-hanging fruit I will pluck in one conversation. Your generosity has been abundant on this tour so I give you the last triumphant word. (insert smiley face and a photo of a box of chocolates)
Rog, you are a relic from some bygone era. 🙄 🙂
Irrelevant marildi. Until it can OBJECTIVELY proven that his work produced the positive results he stated, my observation about it being negative stands empirically.
Anything else is just emotional rambling that has no place in a scientific discussion.
But DO keep posting in opposition to science as it gives an example of what scientology does to a persons mind.
Wynski: “Until it can OBJECTIVELY proven that his work produced the positive results he stated, my observation about it being negative stands empirically.”
You call an observation empirical? That and the rest of what you say isn’t something a true scientist would say. Real scientists keep an open mind to what hasn’t yet been proven either way. In fact, it isn’t logical by any standard to say that if something hasn’t yet been proven, that is proof it isn’t true.
I would say that you, Mr. Wynski, are the one whose “emotional rambling” is getting in the way of an ability to be rational. But do keep posting as an example of one of the more irrational critics. 😉
Yes I read it. It is well thought through. I agree with this person.
But I would disagree with you when you say the “majority” of us would be an asshole if we got power.
I would say that power in and of itself does not corrupt absolutely. Look and MLK and Gandhi.
There is such a thing as benevolent power.
With individuals who are unevolved in their ethical and dharmic natures, power reveals the corruption that already exists within the individual, because they are not living according to universal principles of decency.
I agreee, Ron did not see the spiritual liberating value in love. That is why he dissed Jesus so much. Jesus stood for love.
I continue this take down of Ron Miraldi, not because I am fixed or obsessed. I continue, because it’s fun. And I uncover things in myself and people tell me my criticisms have been beneficial.
I understand that you are blowing the horn for a new updated Scientology and distancing yourself from Ron’s dark side. I wish you and MYTC every success.
My advice to you:
Don’t take it all so serious. I could give a fuck if you criticize Yogananda. It doesn’t matter to me.
Ron criticism is not going away. I’d say meet it with cheer, love and granting beingness.
Then people will say,”boy that Marildi is such a nice person. What a free thinker. Let me learn from her.
But when you hunker down and fight people with sarcasm, ridicule and name calling, you do not further your cause of presenting a new friendly Scientology.
“Be grateful for critics”my guru says. The reaction we have to them gives a a measuring stick for how far we have come spiritually.
I’d say run a process on yourself that blows any inner reaction towards critics. If there is a button there to be pushed, it needs to be. And that need to retaliate against Ron critics is evidence of a GPM that needs to be resolved to its basic basic.
I would say that is pot calling the kettle black, except that your version of me as “kettle” is your usual Straw Man. The dub-in is amazing. But I’m not interested in going round and round with you again. Look in the mirror and follow your own advice.
You are not done with me. You have announced countless times over the years that you are done responding to me. That you are not responding anymore to my irrational case.
Because you have announced it so many times over the years, that you are done with me yet continue to respond is evidence of something is there that you are not aware of.
You can have the last say. It’s important to you.
Thanks for that I am going to take a look!
A quick google of Thomas Campbell and his book reveals he might be an interesting chap who advances some compelling arguments to fill the gap in empirical science left by its intrinsic inability to know that which is not material.
Your claim that “OT is real” is an assertion my conditioned mind is programmed to pounce on. However, since the term, “OT” has no specific meaning, there isn’t anything for me to pounce on!
I look forward to acquainting myself with Campbell. It appears Richard Dawkins is at odds with him and for my money that is an endorsement by itself.
Hi Roger,
” he might be an interesting chap who advances some compelling arguments to fill the gap in empirical science left by its intrinsic inability to know that which is not material.” What he says here is that there is consciousness (Theta) which creates a virtual reality (Theta is cause) which has the purpose of which is to give each of our individuated units of this consciousness (a Thetan) a place where our free will choices have believable consequences (to us). Quantum Theory with the double slit experiment shows us that physical matter reality only happens when consciousness observes it. From this comes the Hollographic Universe of Holbart (book) cosmology. Basically a discussion in both cases that matter is derived from spirit. These are big ideas and difficult to explain and I am still working on my own understanding which makes it ever harder to discuss!:)
In Scientology I was chasing OT, operating thetan, someone who could operate in the virtual reality Campbell calls the PMR or physical matter reality (LRH-Physical Universe) as opposed to the NPMR or non physical matter universe (Theta Universe) which is superset of the PMR.
Cutting to the chase, after studying Scientology all these years and training as an auditor , I find the MBT material has helped me to understand OT better than before and how to obtain what is possible in that area. As Tom says, the proof of the pudding is in the eating and i have so far tasted some pudding as a result of my greater understanding of these matters. This is graduate school in my estimation!
“which has the purpose of which is to give each of our individuated units of this consciousness (a Thetan) a place where our free will choices have believable consequences (to us)”. The importance of which is the lowering of entropy. Another way of saying that is evolution towards LOVE as opposed to raising entropy or de-evolution. This gets into the purpose of life. In Scientology the stated purpose is clearing the planet. The assumption is once cleared ARC will be the operating principal. First of all no one has been shown to have achieved what in DSMH is the state of Clear. Second of all, ARC has been long ago shown to not be an operating principal of Scientology Organizations, particularly the Sea Org which operates on force.
I can see from reading my comments that I have brought up issues that I didn’t cover well and will do so if anyone is interested. The issue of OT is a big one. What it is and why it might be important to a being. The issue of purpose of individuation of a unit of consciousness (a thetan) is a big one too. What is that Theta Universe LRH talks about and what is the purpose of Thetans as being separate from it as a whole. all this is covered in MBT. I chased Scientology to find big answers and ultimately was short changed by the old man. I feel well rewarded reading Campbell’s theory of everything. It covered everything and has made sense of just about every diverse path i have searched on. I don’t regret any of my Scientology past. The lessons were well learned including the loss of a 40 year group of so called friends and the death of my son as part of the lessons. Nor do I regret my Kindergarten experiences.
There are no individual units of consciousness because consciousness cannot be divvied up into pieces. There is only one of it. The illusion that makes it seem as though we are separate, individual entities is elegantly explained in the vedic scriptures.
I have exercised Herculean restraint in not responding to your earlier treatise which I enjoyed greatly. But the flesh is weak. Seriously, as much as I find Mr. Campbell a breath of fresh air in the halls of academe, he is trying to forge a path that has already been forged long ago to completion. He is attempting to reinvent the wheel and it’s not coming out round.
I simply dare not offer another vedanta lecture on this blog but I will suggest to any interested parties that they look into the subjects of non-duality, advaita, and the YouTube videos of Francis Lucille, et al.
Roger, on one of the forum threads, Tom Campbell replied to a question about soul or no-soul. Here’s an excerpt:
“It is a matter of language, metaphors, models, how we communicate, and on what level we communicate….
“You have heard me say in these forums many times that ‘guides’ are merely metaphors expressing a form of help the larger consciousness system provides to encourage and aid our evolution. Also that ‘Higher selves’ or ‘Over-souls’ are also merely metaphors for that non-PMR [Non-Physical Matter Reality] functionality of our consciousness – that we and our higher selves are one fully integrated thing, not separate things with separate functions. Add souls, IUOCs [Individual Units of Consciousness], Indra’s Net…and everything else that we have functionally defined as a separate component of the larger reality to that list of ‘merely metaphors’. None of it exists – not as separate objects/beings/stuff/units. It’s all virtual. Consciousness itself is the only fundamental reality – everything consciousness creates out of that vast informational field is virtual.”
Tom posts under his initials, twcjr, and you can find his whole comment at about halfway down the page here: http://www.my-big-toe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2668&p=9795&hilit=uncle+Tom+never+told+you
Thank you for the quote, marildi but it makes little sense to me. For one thing he is saying the lower self and the higher self are integrated to form a single whole and are not separate things. But if they are integrated they ARE separate things! That’s what an integration is.
I certainly give him the benefit of the doubt though for I believe this passage you have provided is taken out of a larger context which provides the necessary explanations for it to make sense.
I don’t suspect Mr. Campbell understands reality better than I, indeed I’m satisfied with my understanding therefore I’m not seeking answers from him. It is arduous to read material like that unless I’m in the mood to do so. I’m sure he says a lot of smart things and no doubt I disagree with some of them.
Roger: “For one thing he is saying the lower self and the higher self are integrated to form a single whole and are not separate things. But if they are integrated they ARE separate things! That’s what an integration is. I certainly give him the benefit of the doubt though for I believe this passage you have provided is taken out of a larger context which provides the necessary explanations for it to make sense.”
That’s insightful of you, Rog. My thinking was that the basic idea would become clear where he included not just the self but “everything else that we have functionally defined as a separate component of the larger reality…Consciousness itself is the only fundamental reality.”
To my understand, the key words there are “functionally defined.” Things like the body, the soul, guides (spirits), etc. are not fundamental reality. They are only “functionally” defined as separate components of Consciousness so as to describe its operations. Basically, Consciousness “broke itself up into many pieces” (my wording) and created a virtual reality as a “learning lab” for itself.
Btw, George White and I were in a discussion one time about the belief in Theravada Buddhism (which George follows) that there is no-soul, and this of course included Hubbard’s thetan. I asked him what the Buddha meant then when he talked about his own many lifetimes. George then explained that the actual point about “no soul” was that the soul was impermanent – but that it was “almost” permanent. That, I could have.
p.s. The most important thing Tom Campbell wants to get across is that all of us are going to have to change our operating basis from ego/fear to love – as that is the sole way to not only survive but raise the quality of our collective consciousness.
LOL. I can imagine what the anti-Scn people would say if Hubbard had written that!
Hubbard wrote more simply:
“Axiom 1 Life is basically a static. Definition: A Life Static has no mass, no motion, no wavelength, no location in space or time. It has the ability to postulate and perceive.
“Axiom 2 The Static is capable of postulates, considerations, and opinions.
“Axiom 3 Space, energy, objects, form and time are the result of considerations made and/or agreed upon or not by the static, and are perceived solely because the Static considers it can perceive them.”
(Taken from “The Axioms of Scientology”, “Scientology 0-8: The Book of Basics”, LRH.)
All of that is, to me, in the category of “ultimately” (true as it may be), but it explains why it’s impossible to “prove” anything to anyone who refuses to look. It also illustrates the degree of precision required.
Being facetious, the “mistake” Hubbard made was doping out a way to arrive. People have talked about this for a while, now, for hundreds if not thousands of years, but that was all “harmless talk”.
I speculate from time to time that if Hubbard had figured out a way for “only a few” to arrive, then the big battle would have been to secure a ticket, squeeze in the door, and the clamor would have been for more tickets and wider doorways. But when he made it available to e-v-er-y-b-o-d-y …! Oh, look out! Then the clamor was about it being fraudulent, false, hogwash, hokum, preposterous, impossible, subversive (and the unspoken, that it was “anti-privileged classes”, harumph, harumph, what an insult). Make it available, and no one wants it. Yank it away, make it top secret and unavailable, and you get protest marches!! You get those anyway, “How come it isn’t free?”
(Sorry to “ride” on your excellent post, Marildi, but I’d never looked at Campbell.)
Life is NOT a static. A static is something which doesn’t move or change. That is the opposite of life by universal reckoning. If Hubbard wanted to define life differently as something that doesn’t move or change then it was his burden to define it thusly which he did not do.
The only thing I know that can think thoughts is a mind. A mind is required to think thoughts because such an activity requires a multitude of things such as storage of past impressions and discriminating machinery. Such an activity can’t be achieved by something that doesn’t move or change.
Roger, your disageements with Hubbard are based on fundamental misunderstandings. Here are a few defintions of “static” from the tech dictionary:
4 . something which has no motion. The word is from the Latin, sto meaning stand. No part of mest can be static, but theta is static. Theta has no motion. Even when the mest it controls is moving in space and time, theta is not moving, since theta is not in space or time. (Abil 114A)
5 . has no motion, it has no width, length, breadth, depth; it is not held in suspension by an equilibrium of forces; it does not have mass; it does not contain wave-lengths; it has no situation in time or space. (Scn 8-8008)
6 . the simplest thing there is is a static, but a static is not nothingness. These are not synonyms. We speak of it carelessly as a nothingness. That’s because we say nothingness in relationship to the space and objects of the material universe. Life has a quality. It has an ability. When we say nothingness we simply mean it has no quantity. There is no quantitative factor.
Very good marildi, now you’re showing some real pizzaz!
Hubbard created his ‘static’ and he has author’s rights to bestow any capacities upon it he fancies, but unfortunately it must be true to the world outside his imagination. He isn’t writing a science fiction story this time so his imagined reality cannot simply be an accepted conceit for entertainment purposes. He may NOT employ magic! Not even God employs magic, for even He stays within the parameters of His own laws (physics).
Hubbard’s static doesn’t move, it is unchanging, fair enough, but it THINKS! Uh oh, Huston we have a problem! Thinking is movement and it requires moving parts.
Perhaps you want to say it is theta’s mind that does the moving, not theta itself (is there a reference that explains the difference between ‘theta’ and ‘thetan’?). Problem not solved.
Hubbard claims theta, not the mind, deliberately causes effects. Well, to deliberately cause an effect requires DELIBERATION, INTENTION, and again, that is movement, activity. The very DESIRE to cause an effect implies movement, change, a ‘bubbling up’, an appearing and disappearing.
To deliberately cause is to ‘create’ and something creative cannot be static. “The winds of karma blew across the sea of prakriti” which is a reference to some vedic poetry about the creation of the universe. But anyway, we do have to give Mr. Hubbard very high points though, for at least acknowledging the existence of a STATIC. There IS a static, it is consciousness but consciousness does not directly do anything. It doesn’t even think thoughts. And we do have to give him high points for acknowledging “the lie” otherwise known as the mysterious veiling force called, “maya” but then we have to subtract a few points for him saying there is no mystery.
I’ve decided there’s no point in going in to it as I did in the first draft of this response. It is just too lengthy to adequately explain and I’m very nervous about exploiting Mike’s generosity. Besides, my objective is to show Hubbard to be wrong, not to teach alternative viewpoints however superior they may be.
Roger, as for the difference between theta and thetans, I think The Factors explain that. They state that in the beginning was a Cause (theta), which decided “to BE” – and the result was a “viewpoint” (a thetan) and then “there were other viewpoints.”
Now, you say that your objective is “to show Hubbard to be wrong, not to teach alternative viewpoints however superior they may be.” But that is precisely the way you go about the attempt to show him to be wrong – i.e. you compare his views to the ones you happen to consider to be true.
Hubbard believed that individuals had an autonomy and will of their own. Whereas, you believe the philosophers who state there is only only a general consciousness. To them, the universe is an unfolding of events that consciousness is merely aware of and only observes.
You do realize, don’t you, that many others of the world’s great spiritual teachers see/saw it the way Hubbard did?
I read your comment, and suffice it to say it is now a pile of smoldering ashes, so may we just skip ahead to the part where I crack a joke at your expense and offer you the last word? 🙂
I accept your concession of defeat. 🙂
Hi Roger,
“I simply dare not offer another vedanta lecture on this blog”
Please don’t hold back. What was the greatest of fun in the early days of scientology (early70s) was the discussions we had of this kind before the suppression of anything not LRH. I remember being very upset at a particular book banning that happened back then. Then when in the SO being shamed on the shuttle bus for reading a non LRH novel! Holy not-the way to happiness!
” as much as I find Mr. Campbell a breath of fresh air in the halls of academe, he is trying to forge a path that has already been forged long ago to completion. ”
Good point! you can say the same thing about just about all of LRH. What I like about Campbell is that he brings the core belief of LOVE in the language of the majority religion of today, SCIENCE! He shows, using the scientific method that LOVE is all you need. his thesis is simple. There is consciousness and there is evolutionary process. Evolution selects out the unprofitable and leaves the profitable to thrive and expand. Connection and cooperation is profitable forming more complex organizational groups. Attention outward is profitable, inward is unprofitable. Attention outward (caring, support of others, unconditional love). Inward (ME me me me me). LRH had a lot of good stuff going but somewhere he derailed himself and after he left DM crashed the bus. Maybe it was the money motivation, $500 shoes and private ship to support his scuba vacations. I don’t know.
“There are no individual units of consciousness because consciousness cannot be divvied up into pieces. ” Please tell me what I am thinking. Is that enough pudding for you to see that there might be something to the concept of “individuated unit of consciousness”? Of course there are not pieces of consciousness. Consciousness isn’t part of it’s own construct, MATTER. Just discussing your own awareness, while you are trying to come up with some brilliant response to my comment are you putting an equal amount of attention on what you are going to eat for lunch and what you are going to do to protect your energy configuration Virtual Reality body operating in this illusion you are constructing one pixel at a time when the nukes start coming down as a result of the saber rattling going on on the other side of this rock? Even LRH talked about differentiating the focus and intensity of attention units.
Thank you, Richard, for the entertaining read. I don’t think we are quite on the same page. My reason for holding back on the vedanta talk is for poor Mike who has to read all this shit. Besides, the subject is too complex to discuss casually. My objective on this blog is to deconstruct Hubbard’s assertions and prove them to be 1. bunk 2. gibberish, and/or 3. extravagantly worded bits of common knowledge.
When we say consciousness cannot be divided into individual units, that flies in the face of our experience so it must be explained. The Buddhists say as much with their “no self, no mind” doctrine. There are individual minds but only one consciousness. The mind is the domain and generator of thought. It is the arena of subjective experience.
Consciousness does not itself have thoughts. It is simply self-knowing and self-experiencing. The mind is the machinery that makes it SEEM like consciousness is individualized. A sort of reflecting mirror. Individual consciousness is an illusion but it is a good enough one that rules are in place for appropriate and inappropriate actions within that illusion. The mind is not, itself, conscious. Thoughts are not conscious. The only thing that is conscious is consciousness and it isn’t a ‘thing’ it is YOU. The consciousness that I am is the same consciousness that you are.
I think I’ve pretty much demonstrated how this matter can get extremely detailed and why it is inappropriate to use this blog to teach it. However, I think its value here is to show that Hubbard’s cosmology is rightfully and effectively refuted.
Richard (Royce): “LRH had a lot of good stuff going but somewhere he derailed himself…”
When I was looking for a quote of Tom Campbell that explains his view on self vs. no-self, I ran across another comment of his that I think puts LRH going off the rails into perspective:
————————————————-
“We think about the great evil people (the mass murderers of our time, the ones who do genocide, and other sorts of terrible things) – the major difference between them and the average guy, or at least if not average then the one-in-ten man or woman in our population, it isn’t that they were exceptionally evil in their makeup. It was that they, for one reason or another, ended up with power. Because of the lack of growth, the lack of love, and the fact that they were driven by belief, fear, and ego, they had the ability to spread that lack of growth far and wide. They had the ability to do huge amounts of damage. The guy in the little shop in the alley who’s an old curmudgeon, who fusses and bangs his fists down all the time, he doesn’t have any power. The only thing he can do is maybe kick his dog when he gets home. That’s all he can do. Maybe all he can do is just fuss, grumble, make a lot of noises, and rant and rave. But that’s all he can do.…
“There are lots of people who use other people. Often they’re just a boss and maybe they just have twenty people that work for them. Maybe those people are generally miserable because this guy is a real jerk. Would that guy do things any differently if he could control armies and nations? Save us all from that sort of thing! Hitler was not such an outstandingly evil person, as he was somebody that reflects what’s not all that uncommon among us. Many would do the same if they just had the power to use it in a way that made a big splash in history.
https://www.my-big-toe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=8468
————————————————–
“It appears Richard Dawkins is at odds with him and for my money that is an endorsement by itself.”
+1
We need money but more importantly we need to know how many rusted-ons are still out there to prop up our rapidly growing cult. Did we mention money? Surely we mentioned money?
“Rusted-ons,” I like that, very descriptive/
There is some news which is NEW and EXCITING but you have to show up in order to find out what it is!!!!! Oh Lord have mercy on my soul that is sooooo lame!
As if everybody didn’t know it was a shakedown again as usual. Let’s give the poor writer of the invitation some credit though for acknowledging the nuclear explosion in the room. Yes, there is a teensy weensy problem with ‘flows’. Indeed there is, it’s called, “NOBODY wants anything to do with scientology”!
It’s not easy to keep the scientology daydream alive in these informed times but long-term exposure to scientology provides the required erosions of intelligence to keep you on that hamster wheel running in place day after day, year after year, win after win after win…
“NOBODY wants anything to do with scientology”! Hilarious and sooooooo true.
And those still in don’t want to admit that they’re Scientologists. The laughter is just too much for them. Poor little Clams, snap, snap, snap.
Happy ? Birthday ? Mike!
Thanks for what you do!
“We have special guest arriving this week from management…”
Hey, I know an attic they can hang upside down in.
c’mon – take a bow for this one.
Thanks. Its not original. It was one of “Carla”s” wisecracks on “Cheers”.
Happy Birthday Mike! ???
“…sheeple…struggling to keep the dream alive. Which is ALL they have.”
Rhetorical Angst-Ridden Rant Alert:
True. Its all they have – this delusion, that something exists (that doesn’t exist), that they have something (that they don’t have because it doesn’t exist).
They CLING to it so, this delusion!
And, Miscavige continually dishes out lie after lie to nourish and sustain this delusion!
And their response is to swallow every lie, and beg him for more.
It appears they can’t get enough lies. It seems that those Still In are addicted to being lied to.
And not because they’re dishonest themselves, but simply because if they get their regular dosage of lies and false assurances, they’ll never have to face the too gruesome truth.
How Miscavige must LAUGH at them.
OMG.
Well, I was one of them once, so I have no right to be on any kind of high horse as regards the blind Sheeple.
For years, I believed what I was told.
For a long time, it never occurred to me to fact check.
Of course, that’s all changed now.
And, as my viewpoint changed, and as thousands of former Still Ins’ viewpoints changed, so can the Still Ins’ viewpoints change.
I need to have patience. I need to have an authentic attitude of not making these people wrong for still not seeing and understanding what I clearly see and understand.
But its hard, when once one knows!
Its tough, once one clearly sees!
Aaaaahhhhh!
Ok, I’m done 🙂
The entire lot of them are people with HUGE O/W’s and unflat amends. PTSness is rampant in every org. Some staff members still use drugs. Extortion represents Ideal Org services. How can an individual knowing these things about himself or herself go out into the world and call themselves a Scientologist? 🙂
Its true, Lawrence. They do have HUGE O/W’s and unflat amends. Why, they’re regging public to donate their hard earned money, to go into debt, to not pay their own taxes and other bills, to forego paying for their children’s education, to applaud their teenage children for quitting school at 16 thereby dumping them into a demographic that can’t even work in Walmart because they don’t have a HSD…huge overts, yes. And it doesn’t matter if they may be unaware of how damaging their actions are. What matters is via orders from the top they are SUPPRESSING, knowingly or unknowingly, people who trust them. Huge overts. They’ll never make gains doing this. On all their dynamics they are doomed, really. Even the staff with money are busy doing themselves in, spiritually, by their criminal actions in obeying Command Intention.
Brilliant insight.
Lawrence, you just described L. Con hisself. How can someone like that NOT call themselves a scientologist is the correct question…
“You may have noticed over the past few years that something seems to be hindering our flows with regards to our Ideal Org.” Yes, we in RTC have seen this before. Our diagnosis is spiritual constipation in Battle Creek. The cause is the suppressive counter-intention on COB and the hidden crimes of Scientologists in Battle Creek. The guilty parties are theetie-wheetie dilettantes.
“Think of the presentation next weekend as the solvent that will clear debris that has been blocking our progress toward having an Ideal Org in Battle Creek.” Translated, this means Battle Creek will be given an intense Sea Org Enema using a fire hose. Such harsh measures are necessary given the overall lack of enthusiasm in Battle Creek.
🙂 🙂
Earlier this morning when reading this I wondered if it was possible to get them on a RICO violation. They used RICO against the Catholic Church and their cover-up of the sexual abuses. If only there could be a real forensic investigation to prove that this money does not go towards the purposes they say it will, that they are strong arming people to go into debt like your Regraded Being comic this week, forcing abortions (which may not be criminal depending on where you live). Certainly there is criminal conspiracy going on here. Also mail fraud. They are sending these emails and mailing these flyers out. The US Post Office really goes after fraudsters!
Somewhere hidden away in the deepest and darkest recesses of the “organization” have to be documents to show what has been going on and what continues to go on. In many corrupt organizations, there are DOUBLE books and “cooking the books”…..the walls are shaking, no cracks appearing in them yet, but it will be every man for himself once the walls begin to crumble.
I am sure the “empowered one” will be sequestered safely away from harm….
Yes there’s always a trail! They must be brought down!
There have been situations in other organizations where an “underling” was told by those in power to “destroy those files” and they did NOT do so, but said they did. Someone has to have something stored away “just in case” to use as evidence……come on folks, NOW is the time to bring those documents to light.
For “momentum” substitue ” money” and then it is more truthful.
“And momentum is exactly what is needed and wanted.”
Well, when you normally operate on 3 speeds: Slow, Super Slow, and Not Moving, then, yeah…
To be truthful, why do they think this for? There is not ever any public or statistics to back up any of the church’s expansion claims. So someone in the church should be able to answer at least that simple question. Why do they think that this means their church has expanded for? Because it says so in writing? 🙂
Lawrence, maybe because – I’m guessing – maybe because they take it for granted that OTHER ORGS are expanding, just not them…? This is all I’ve got by way of an answer to your question. Frankly, its beyond my comprehension that people who live and breathe for the Birthday Game and are otherwise obsessed with statistics require nothing more than verbal assurances and cartoon graphs from Int Management to be utterly convinced that Scientology is expanding, etc.
The Birthday Game? Memories. That was supposed to mean a good time once. 🙂
You’re lucky you experienced Scientology and the Birthday Game when it was still “fun”. I can see that it could be fun, if played lightly, and with flexiblity, and with all due emphasis upon the quality of the product being delivered and not the stat. Games and targets can be fun and stimulating and helpful.
I pretty much loathed the Birthday Game from Day One. But to the degree that it was played “for blood” by them, I didn’t see staff enjoying or being helped by it, no, not at all. I saw them and the services they were delivering harmed by it. And they’d pretend to love it. They’d mock up a kind of phony cheerfulness and enthusiasm about it. But beneath this false veneer they were fearful and desperate. Everything had to get done by Thurs at 2PM. Insane. It was a harmful arbitrary. They were auditing people, training people, THAT was important, not some arbitrary time inserted into the action.
I could see the fear in their eyes when they’d approach us, to put in extra time, buy this or that a day earlier, whatever. I pitied these staff, truly I did, and I don’t mean that in a condescending way. I looked at them as trapped in an insanity. Which they were.
The way the Birthday Game was played created ARC breaks and all KINDS of unecessary complications, misunderstandings, problems and ARC breaks which needed handlings, for staff, for public….sheer insanity, week after week, year in and year out. I’m shuddering just writing about it.
Whew! What a rant this turned into…sorry!
What got me out was contemplating how I could continue to get my stats increasing week-over-week for the foreseeable future. Heck, that’d been easy for a couple of years, since I fell headlong into a massive backlog of unfiled “stuff”. As I saw it, I doubted that Flag’s CF had ever been up-to-date, which seemed strange, since filing isn’t exactly rocket science. simply DOing the filing and not dithering around pretty much guaranteed up stats. Once I’d organized things and gotten current, I probably should have switched to a stat more likely to rise such as: “# of up-to-date folders” or some such that more closely aligned to CF’s purpose, “To collect and HOLD”. Of course, I didn’t, and plunged into a deep depression, which was worsened by not being able to get any help, not even friends with whom I could talk it out, since that’s verboten, “discussing your case.” Shortening the story a bit, the “help” I was given was being RPFed…. i.e.:”The floggings will continue until morale improves.” Eventually. I “broke” and got too angry for them to control, at which point they gave up and routed me out.
Never did find an O/W worth writing down. Oddly, that was also depressing.
“Imagine how fond your memories will be when you look back at this time in the future, and reminisce on the obstacles that you helped overcome.”
Like those 3 bankruptcies and 4 marriages and all the people you had to disconnect from. No wonder most clams are flying under the radar. They have nothing left to give. There must be a few whales in Battle Creek, no other way anyone would pay for this stupid idea.
Or is Tom Cruise or Travolta or a Duggan on the hook for this one? If you see a ‘all donations matched’, you’ll know why.
zemoo, you said, “No wonder most clams are flying under the radar”.
Do you have actual facts to back up this assertion or is more what you want to be the case?
Don’t misunderstand me, please!
I’m not being sarcastic. Its a sincere question. I WANT for this to be true!
Even if you can’t give details, if you assert that you have evidence that most Still Ins are “in” under the radar, I’ll take your word for it.
During my last 2 years in the cult I was UTR. I was pretending all the time that I was easing myself out.
I’d like to believe that others – the majority of those officially still in – are doing the same thing.
Its the easiest and least dangerous way to leave, and when you’re in, its also the most obvious plan that presents itself.
PS: I should add that going UTR and easing oneself out gradiently is also the least courageous method of exiting the cult. I didn’t have the guts to come out publicly. I still don’t.
No matter what way you chose to leave, you DID leave. That took a great amount of courage to separate yourself from something you lived for something you’ve know little to nothing about.
You HAVE not you say “come out publicly”, but you ARE here, where you feel safe and comforted among like minded friends. Do NOT beat yourself up “Aqua”, sometimes we can’t see the forest thru the trees until we dig deep down inside ourselves and strive to find the truth, which can be very ugly, but the truth is the truth. Pandora’s box has been opened and many are taking their first peek inside it, where only more will eventually come out.
.
You are stronger than you know, and if you found the way you left, your own personal BEST option to “blow”, congratulations my friend! Many others have not yet found the courage to leave, and they still don’t WANT to see the truth. For you friend, I AM so proud of you!
Thank you very much, L Yash, for reaching out to me in this way. Yes, I agree that we each find our own way out. And I consider myself privileged to be participating here. I’m in good company here, and grateful for it, and for your kind and comforting words.
You are so welcome “Aqua”!
Someday you will learn to “forgive yourself”….as many do, for being “sucked in” to an organization where you expected all things good and light only to find out what’s really going on. Yes, you are in good company here from the “formers and the never ins”. Needless to say as one of Mike’s posts indicates….there IS STRENGTH in numbers and those who are OUT, those strength in numbers continue to grow and greatly improve their lot in life. Stay strong and keep smiling, the best is yet to be, many hugs and shoulders to cry on and ears that will LISTEN to you always.
Thank you to Mike and Leah and Aron & Tom, Jeff, Marc, Tony, Ron, Jenna etc for their bravery in telling their own horrific tales for without them the majority of people on the OUTSIDE would never know what’s happening on the INSIDE.
Bless you!
Right back at you on everything you’ve said, L Yash. Its great to have you here. A friend of mine has a favorite saying. Its a Jewish thing: “Your mouth to God’s ears.”
Ah, yes, the fond memories! Debts, Disconnections, Bankruptcies. Those were the days! 🙂
Stuck / One way flow. Using Hubbard’s Havingness scale to make my point. Scientology is down at the bottom – minimally @ “Must be contributed to”. I find this odd considering Scientology has “the most effective and workable technology” on this planet and in fact, any other universe. Scientology can be considered “no case gain” as well as “no-ethics-change” and their “ethics folders” (Media coverage abuses) are very very thick. How to spot an SP as an administrator? This is for you PTS/SP trained Ethics Specialists graduates to ponder over while you are fence sitting waiting for things to blow over.
HAVINGNESS SCALE
Create
Responsible for (willing to control)
Contribute to
Confront
Have
Waste
Substitute
Waste substitute
Had
Must be confronted
Must be contributed to
Created
Good one. That illustrates what Scientology actually is, as opposed to what the individuals in the Co$ have made of it with violation of policy and practice as Mr. Rinder’s blog vividly documents..
Yes Doug. Matches Hubbard’s own life. He was always in financial trouble and had to be contributed to or he would outright steal or black mail in order to survive. Thus his “religion” simply mirrored that psychosis.
Mike – does Leah Remini have a contact e-mail for people to get in touch with her to tell their Scientology Horror story? Where would we find it? Thanks.
Write to [email protected]
okay – thank you Mike!! Is this to Leah directly?
“We have special guests this week arriving from management….”. Best reason in the world to go visit an ailing friend, clean out your closet, clean the toilet, anything to keep from going to this event. Guests from management are never a good omen.
“special guests” mean pro sharks (oops I mean pro registrars) coming to fleece the crowd and separate all from their money.
Despite the brilliant comic remark in these comments by JS “The Why is God” — why are we making fun of this poor guy trying to get people into his Church and donating? Of course we see it now as ludicrous. But, why do we make fun of it? One of us saying how stupid Scientologists are and how smart we are is not only arrogant but misplaced.That isn’t a useful issue to me. Maybe others feel differently on this blog. Discussing the false data we (former Scners) were given or working out what really was workable and what wasn’t or which EPs were pie in the sky or whatever would be useful and in some case enlightening. Terra has recently posted on the concept of false data and that is a subject worth discussing as there is some truth in it and some not. Even Leah has now twice said don’t make fun of Scientology beliefs. She is sticking to real issues that are important. Why would someone want to make fun of some poor guy desperate to get money for a new building his seniors are crushing him for? I’m actually asking for further comment on this and how others feel about this. I’m not looking for an argument but how others feel about this kind of posting where we make fun of Scn staff or beliefs. Hopefully, this could be a beneficial discussion of this topic.
Reggie,
I respond, but with first with a caveat; that if you really are a Reg from the SO this is even more applicable.
Scanning down the posts I see little in the way of personal attacks, and little in the way of degrading their beliefs. You should compare this blog with others on the web. Mike has a mild mannered group in comparison.
What I do see a lot of is objection and protest to organized and systematic false promises, false pretenses, and false (bait-and-switch ) tactics to lure public in so they can be billfold raped. Taking people’s money by force is generally called robbery.
Personally, I like joking, puns, double-endentures(sic), irony, sarcasm, and overall insouciance. I took things too seriously for the first thousand or so lifetimes, and am now taking a break from all of that nonsense.
Reggie Workman: “I’m not looking for an argument but how others feel about this kind of posting where we make fun of Scn staff or beliefs.”
I feel the way you do. It’s one thing to express a sincere point of view about Scientologists’ beliefs, but making fun of them is, as you say, arrogant and misplaced, and I would add juvenile. The same people who make fun of Scientology would probably never do so with any other belief system and would consider it to be way out of line.
Ridiculing is another way of putting it.
I poke at all belief systems. I don’t think I’ll ever get stuck in a particular complacency (mindset) again. Although I’ve been able to rein in comments for the last 10 years, out of respect for loved ones, it’s irresistable, talking about McSavage’s poofy hair, waterproof mascara, and his obvious exaggerations and hypocrisies. Same with LRH, the Crowley/Parsons wannabe. Oh my gosh, don’t even let me get started on televangelists.. Benny Hinn (FRESH!!!) Jimmy Swaggart, JAN CROUCH!! Can I gidda witNESS?
I will confess to having a block about Hubbard. He treated people, women in particular like shit. Cheaterbeater. Isolated his followers from information other than what HE approved, took their money, ad libbing all the way.
I’m genuinely curious about positives in Scientology, if those came from Hubbard, what he claimed as his, and if he cited his sources.
I wish there were a way to reach the people still in.
Agreed Reggie , the comic relief has its time and place. The thing is that everybody moves through the decompression at a different pace or deals with the betrayal in different ways , so it is difficult to figure out what is appropriate or not for each individual.
“Let it be ” might be the best thing to do. But I appreciate your comment and agree.
FDS is not wrong of course , but as in many of LRH idea and practice it is the absoluteness and the underlying mind control that gives it eventually a bad name.
It cannot be applied sensibly in a Scientology course room , impossible , since the premise is that Hubbard is never wrong. Just more confusion.
@ Dear Reggie Workman<
In am a Never In….. so cut me some slack please! IMO I think the comments you are referring to are made out of genuine concern & FRUSTRATION that some of the "still ins" have yet to see the truth. Keep in mind that folks ON this blog who either have BLOWN or just simply quit CO$ WERE at one time n themselves, & some of them still have loved ones who are STILL IN…& are horrifically disconnected from them.
Sometimes when we have been hurt we strike out…..I can assure you that everyone on this blog has great concern and even love for those still in……and the topics discussed within this blog are SHARED OPTIONS.
Some here believe that some of the CO$ "tech" was helpful to them, others feel financially "fleeced"….
it's a matter of OPINION as is common in other blog sites.
I wish you well
A priest, a rabbi & Reggie all walk Into a bar…
Now, everyone finish it. C’mon! It’ll be fun!
Alright, so they walk into a bar and the rabbi says, “You guys want to hear a joke?” The priest says, “Yeah, I love jokes!” Reggie says, “Okay but only if it doesn’t make fun of anybody”. There’s a long pause then the rabbi says, “Okay…knock knock…”
Lol!!!! Now that’s some funny shit! Well played, roger!
A Priest, Rabbi and Reg walk into a bar one behind the other. As the seat themselves at the bar, they notice a large white rabbit hopping around on the bar top.
The Reg says to the Priest and Rabbi:
“Excuse me sirs, but WHAT are those little round brown things sitting on the bar”.
The Priest and Rabbi chuckle thinking what a good joke they can make of this situation!.
The Priest says” “Those are SMART Pills”
‘
The Reg Says..”.WHAT the Heck are Smart Pills??”
Rabbi says: ‘ Well, you eat a few and you get smarter!!”
The Reg grabs and handfuls and chews them up and says loud.
.”Holy Smoke…these tastes just like Crap!!!”
Priest & Rabbi in unions say: “See you’re getting smart already”…
.
!!!LOL!!!
Cute 🙂
Brutal…
David Miscavige was the bartender and…
He leaped over the bar and started to pummel all the people in the bar. Then he claimed he was the greatest in the world…
Then the bartender yelled out: Alright, WHO stole the damn toilet paper!!!!!
He reflected for a moment but added in a respectable but commanding voice. “However, all is forgotten as do we ever have a status level tailor made just for you, will that be cash or card today sir?”
The guy at the end of the bar is going to pay up…his name is XENU & he carries the “Galaxy Gold Card”…..Don’t leave space without it…….
Yeah, you’re right. He’s only doing his job, poor fellow. I’m so glad he has someone on his side so understanding about the pressure he’s under. I’ll just sit in the corner all quiet like and watch my family remain separated and ignore watching my wife cry at Thanksgiving, Christmas & birthdays. I’ll just ignore the sickening gut feeling of being lied to, going hungry for a decade, having my money coerced out of me, my future destroyed & being no more expectant than what I was promised time and time again. Maybe we should set up a donation account to support this guy and others like him, his building means so much to him. I feel so bad I’ve made fun of Scientologists now!
Yeah, we shouldn’t make fun of hard working & dedicated people who are too stupid to see they are criminal conspirators, it hurts your feelings. Manners are so much more important than ridicule in getting justice served, see how effective they have been regarding curbing Scientology’s abuses?.They must be trembling in their boots and begging forgiveness for their behavior with our understanding of their worker’s plights.
I’m also really glad we only ever used standard issue ammunition, it’s so much more humane.
Agree Yawnalot. Having my youngest son ending all contact with us for over 2 years now and not even knowing where he lives doesn’t make for much compassion for this criminal cult or for those pushing it’s agenda.
Further, these guys like the PES of Battle Creek will steal your last cent to help a $3 billion cult buy some worthless buildings do not deserve any sympathy. When I was able to speak with him, I used to tell my son how insane it was that such a rich company is demanding huge donations from young men and women who are barely making a living.
I do not care if my son wants to practice this Hubbard stuff and would not try to dissuade him from doing so but it is the disconnection, fair-game, forced abortions, bankrupting families, cover up of crimes (crimes as horrifying as rape), child abuse, elder abuse etc., that I will not turn a blind eye to. And I don’t care too much if my comments ruffles a few feathers.
Perfectly stated, I Yawnalot.
Well done.
Do you think David Miscavige has ever felt any sympathy to the rank and file struggling in scientology? Our rage isn’t against the humble folk trying to make sense of an uncaring universe. Our rage is against the predators who exploit and abuse those humble folk.
The gloves are off, so Reggie, if you are so sensitive to scathing criticism, go cry in your pillow. When you are done, and ready to fight evil, come back and appreciate the growing anger.
Different people have different healing processes folks. Humor is a coping mechanism, and if it helps exes to vent that way, more power to em. Try to understand, be open minded, and take away from this blog what helps YOU, and let the tomfoolery go in one eyeball and out the other lol! Everyone’s process is individual.
I agree with you, Reggie.
Reggie, I hear you. I fight with MYSELF all the time to not make these people wrong. Funny, but before reading your comment I posted something about my struggle to maintain an understanding attitude toward the still blind Still Ins.
I know one couple. long time Scientologists, OTs, who’ve described themselves to me as
“silent” Scientologists. They know of my disagreements with the cherch. They know that I’m no longer there, that I’ve privately withdrawn and am no longer on lines. And I cannot go into further detail without outing them but suffice to say I also know that their reason for remaining UTR is fear of being disconnected from their social network, their business network, and their adult children.
Historically it has been rollicking fun to laugh at ridiculous things and nothing is more ridiculous than a deluded person who will not see. A fool. The reason we laugh is because there is a little bit of that fool in all of us. You could say we are laughing at ourselves from a safe distance.
Well said, rogerHornaday. To laugh at the ridulousness is in my opinion a healthier and more healing reaction than crying over it. Look at the way Mel Brooks made people split their sides over – of all things – The Holocaust, in the movie, “The Producers”. With Mike Rinder, there are people posting here who are coping every day, every hour, possibly, with tremendous loss. Sometimes they may share it as it is and sometimes they may make a joke or pun or laugh at someone else’s jokes or ridicule of the still ins. Sometimes there is bitterness, regret, anger, fury, grief, and sometimes there’s something really funny at the absurdity of it all. Other than attacking or cursing each other, which Mike doesn’t allow, It doesn’t matter how people here choose to heal, choose to learn and understand. They’ve been traumatized. They’re doing what they’re doing to get better. It can vary, and Its all good.
Nice people tend to be gullible, we never want to think, know, or feel someone is out to harm us……
Because there are real victims here, not the reg, but the people whose lives will be harmed.
Reggie – I’ve said for a long time that if you want to hit a target somewhere in the center of the range, you increase your chances of that when you do not aim to the right or left or behind you.
Scientology takes a leap forwards that virtually no one was prepared for. This goes back a long way to the story or philosophical parable of the men who had been in prison for so long, that when released, they begged to be let back in. That seems simple. It seems like just a story. The reactive mind is the prison.
Hubbard lectured on this many times. The subject is Responsibility. In Dianetics The Modern Science of Mental Health he used the phrase “dead men on battlefields”. One could add: dead men in Coptic churches, dead men in political caucuses, dead men in classrooms, dead men going to dead-end jobs, dead men standing in soup lines, dead men sitting on couches watching TV.
If for every dozen “critics”, we had one solution, we’d be sitting pretty. The battle isn’t church v. independents, really, nor every other religion v. radical Islam. The battle is all about sanity v. insanity. Hubbard said words to the effect that the great religions of the world are dying, and there is nothing there to replace them. He also said that when you have a deterioration of sexual values, that has always marked the ending stages of a society. I’m not saying Hubbard is the word of God or anything like that, but it is a bit of a coincidence that he seems to have been right on the mark fifty years ago.
The thing about life – and “life” is what we are talking about – is that it is so hard, seemingly, because the goal posts aren’t there. It’s an infinite, eternal thing. And it does come down to the individual, whether he’s praying in church or having his best thoughts on the throne or singing in a shower For example: man wants “Peace”. To do what with? It is hard to look up into the night sky, by analogy, and contemplate the infinite in real terms, and contemplate achievements unknown because no one has achieved them because they are “ahead” and no one has contemplated them. Much easier to get involved with the traffic and the paperwork. “Peace” I would say is to contemplate the unknown. One can say “eternal”, and “it’s all about being” so easily.
But “criticism” of Scientology – the data, the philosophy, the procedure, and the practice – has become a cottage industry. Life is about the unknown. You get dead men who would turn even that around, and ridicule it, and call it “known”, call it “terra cognita”, and point to a basement room, and get applauded for it. And we have “critics” who shout out that “Scientology is not science!” yet are completely unable to define the word “science”. And we have dead men who turn the prison backwards into a “prison of belief” without understanding at all that the prison is the very tangible reactive mind, and NOT looking, and that has nothing to do with belief. And really, you get dead men so enraged at what has become of their lives, by their own doing, that they reach out for anything to blame for it. If it isn’t ridiculing Scientology, then it’s blaming “foreign powers” made up by George Orwell type characters.
We may think of Ancient Egyptians as a bit off the mark with their beliefs in multiple gods, but at least they pointed upwards and outwards. (Paradoxically, they built the biggest tombs known of, way deep inwards beneath goodness knows how many tons of stone – but that’s the reactive mind for you, or at least a portion of it: dichotomies, reverses, opposites. And Scientology addresses that. Goals, Goals Problems Masses. And, in my consideration, personal admin scales. It’s all laid out there. Sanity is an individual thing, not cheerleaders for the White Hats v. those for the Black Hats.)
“If for every dozen ‘critics’, we had one solution, we’d be sitting pretty. The battle isn’t church v. independents, really, nor every other religion v. radical Islam. The battle is all about sanity v. insanity.”
Well said, Nickname.
Since you bring up radical Islam, it occurs to me that even with that extreme group, which is obviously far more harmful than Scientology, I don’t think any of their critics would go so far as to ridicule their physical appearance or other personal matters – yet it is justified by Scientology critics when it comes to Scientologists. I’ve said it before – I think they are defeating their own purposes by presenting themselves in such an over-the-top way.
You said it right: “The battle is all about sanity v. insanity.”
Oh Marildi , comic relief has always been and always will be .
Charlie Hebdo paid with their lives , and they made plenty of fun of radical Islam.
Satirists , stand up comics , and just plain funny people who do not have a stick up their ass , will find something funny in every person and situation. Freedom of speech should always protect them.
I love them , they diffuse the time bomb that is seriousness.
Marie, being funny is one thing, but some of the comments aren’t actually funny – they just ridicule in a demeaning or childish way. Those are the ones that lower the caliber of the blog and degrade its message, IMO.
I feel so much better when I can laugh. You know, there’s healthy laughter, like when my chihuahua brothers run so fast they do somersaults, or watching Andy Griffith reruns. I think someone new to the blog might appreciate a break from the rhetoric/philosophy they have been inundated with. Also, I think it might be a nice break from the culture of KRs, not to have to see someone being chided for their degree of sensitivity. That becomes stifling, IMO.
Nickname, your reference to the parable about the men who had been in prison for so long that when released they wanted to return to it, is a relevant one.
Their desire to return to prison was merely because they preferred what was familiar. That’s basic human nature. That’s what “home” is. It’s what is familiar and a slavish attachment to it creates the ‘PRISON of belief’ in Lawrence Wright’s metaphor for scientology.
When you say that people can’t define science, you’re just making shit up. Science is a number of things:
— the scientific method, which is the best known and well proven means of examining and elucidating reality by means of hypothesizing, observing, experimenting and theorizing testable, falsifiable predictions;
— the current, yet ever-changing, collective understanding of reality, as predicted by use of the method;
— the community of science practitioners and their ongoing endeavors, including the publication of results with detailed experimental and statistical methodology, so that other practitioners can attempt to falsify;
— the underpinning principals for application of technology (in English, not Scientologese);
— etc.
Scientology ain’t like any of those things. Hubbard never had the foggiest notion of what science is. This is known from his many writings and ramblings.
“If for every dozen “critics”, we had one solution, we’d be sitting pretty. ”
But scamology doesn’t. It has no solution for every 100,000 critics.
That’s why it has been going downhill since the mid-70’s
Reggie, another way of looking at it is that con men like Tim are extremely lucky that the only bad thing that they’re experiencing is a little ridicule and derision for being such fuckwits. They could be in jail, where folks who defraud others of their assets belong!
What hinders the flows, is that Scientology does not deliver what it promises. If it did, it would have lines around the block. If one could obtain ANY O.T. abilities, the buildings would be full. And if anyone could demonstrate ANY of these things; exteriorization with full perception, whole track recall, cleared theta clear, etc., etc., don’t you think they would? Damn right. But they can’t. I actually think there’s some good data in Scientology, I still use some of it today. But the orgs are run by morons, especially the big one at the top.
And the thing they’re best at is driving people away.
“What hinders the flow, is that Scientology does not deliver what it promises.”
Truer words were never spoken, Overrun! Scientology is one giant turd trying to be a flower. And that’s never going to happen…
Oh, I don’t know Dude. They promised to put this universe back into native state. Who are we say they aren’t doing just that – they have the sauce you know?
The secret sauce? I tried it once. It made me want to give all my money away…
Yeah, I got real bad heart and bank balance burn from it!
ROTFLMAO! I Yawn, you are one funny motor scooter!
Better than getting the “runs” and having NO TOILET PAPER……just sayin”’
Want to know how the Ideal org’s are doing? Why not visit the Inglewood one as we did. The IRS will not like what we find!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aPAV_JWtok
Nice, AGP! Thanks for going in! I seemed kind of empty…
Oh Pope!! I love your youtubes!!
But, should the youtubes be tied?
What, and make cyber sterile? Oh, what a dark place you visited there Dude!
Been meaning to ask, do you use one, two or three fins?
Three. But that’s a trade secret…
Completely his choice.
Angry Gay Pope, you are doing the Lord’s work. I love what you are doing, bringing light on the evil darkness of scientology.
Any time I have needed a lift and a good belly laugh, your vids have never failed to cheer me up.
Keep it up brother!
Thanks,
What I thought particularly interesting, or strange, was that when they tried to actually buy a copy of a $35 book, they were told it would be $54 because of an “org tax.” I’ve never heard of that before, and it makes their already uncompetitively expensive books prohibitively expensive, which I think would really deter anyone who wandered in off the street from buying anything. I also wonder if it is illegal not to include such surcharges in the listed price.
Great video tour! Scn has that “separate but EVIL,” thing down pat with their special black folks issues of their cult mags…Elron would be proud!
MYSTERY SOLVED:
“The power that can be generated by numbers”……Ok, soooo how about all the FORMER Scientologist…those who are DECLARED & those who are Still NOT DELCARED show up…..& be counted. …..the more FORMER members who gather….the more momentum that can be achieved………and you won’t have to donate a cent.
“hindering our flows” … tell me again why this isn’t all about making money for the person running Scientology.
“Of course, we’ve been promoting it as a “big mystery”. That remains true, for the data you will be hearing is not for public issue yet. This data is private, and it is for you. But of course, you have to come to the presentation in order to hear it for yourself. You must be curious! ”
Classic $cn “mystery sandwich” PR move! The only trouble there is that it’s been tried countless times before and always with the same result: There is no big “reveal,” just more predatory money grubbing waiting for you if you’re foolish enough to fall for that bait again, and by now, almost every single $cilon on the planet is hip to this old tired trick!
Yeah, that whole thing just screams, “REG CYCLE!!!”
The whole thing screams Recycle? Isn’t that a good thing? Wait….what? Reg Cycle? Never mind…
Didn’t they try to recycle Mike’s garbage once (that we know of), It could be suggested they’ve been collecting people’s garbage for decades – PC folder data is a prime example & then putting it back in circulation, all embellished like. See how conscientious they are, Recycling garbage over and over.
When it comes to scientology there is ALWAYS disappointment, but only 100% of the time!
They can’t try harder? Bunch of sissies…
“Even if you don’t think you can make it, we’d still like to hear from you. (269) 965-5203.”
A scientologist only makes this mistake once unless he or she is really stupid and likes getting grilled as to his or her duty and the formulas to “making it go right” and ultimately to making a phone donation.
I have been to Battle Creek. It’s the 30th largest city in the state of Michigan. Not in the US. Just in the state of Michigan. If you look at the “Metropolitan Statistical Area,” which includes surrounding towns that are economically related to Battle Creek, it’s the 300th largest MSA in the US.
Yet another reason why Scientology is dying: they can’t admit that an org way out in the weeds should never have been started in the first place. So they keep soldiering on with increasingly ludicrous and failing attempts to try to ignite this perennial failure into something that it will never be.
If you look at the demographics of the Battle Creek MSA, with a population of 136,000, and if you apply the number of Scientologist public in the US, which I estimate at just under 10,000 out of a population of 310 million, you get a total of *FOUR* Scientologists in the Battle Creek MSA (4.38 to be a little more precise). And that assumes that the number of Scientologists in the US is evenly distributed, but as we all know, there are significant spikes in the LA and Clearwater areas, meaning that this estimate could well be higher than the actual number.
If you waste resources on what we in Global Capitalism HQ that deal with economics call “externalities” (i.e., things that don’t make you money but make you feel good), you will eventually go out of business because the more externalities that pile up and distract you and suck money away from the core business means you lose more money over time. The more time you spend away from making the core business grow and making it maximally profitable, the less money you have to fund externalities in the future.
But is it still an ‘externality’ if it doesn’t make anybody feel good? (That would be David Miscavige looking for a loophole.)
It’s interesting that their geographical distribution is based on accidents of history, rather than any strategic planning. Since of course Hubbard laid down the law that no org can ever close, they can’t adjust to reality, and do something rational like downgrade a small location like this to a mission with the more reasonable expectations that would go with that. It does seem like management is focusing their efforts on orgs in larger and more promising areas, including apparently now some subsidizing of the building of ideal orgs. I wouldn’t be surprised if Battle Creek’s announcement is part of the flip side of management’s strategy, to give up on some of the long-stalled historic renovation projects and have orgs buy less expensive modern commercial buildings that need more modest upgrades – though I suspect the announcement is likely to be about some other initiative.
In comparison, a place like the Cleveland-Elyria, OH MSA, which is the 32nd largest in the country and would seem a much more likely candidate for an org, has only a mission run out of a suburban dentist’s office.
“You may have noticed over the past few years that something seems to be hindering our flows with regards to our Ideal Org. Think of the presentation next weekend as the solvent that will clear debris that has been blocking our progress toward having an Ideal Org in Battle Creek.” Is this where the SP’s are announced as the WHY? ..or maybe those lying documentaries or docuseries?
Happy Birthday Mike. Wishing a year filled with happy memories made and birthday your wish come true.
It’s all Leah’s fault! If she hadn’t left, the cult it wouldn’t be looking for SPs behind every corner! And with the next series coming, I don’t give them any chance of survival.
Flows, schmoes. They’re dying. Plain & simple.
Hey Scientology! I got your flows right here (grabbing my croch)
Oh, Happy Birthday as well Mike. Wasn’t aware of that (thanks Mary).
Happy Birthday, Mike!
OSD, go to your corner 🙂
Awwwww….. do I have to? Well…..ok.
Happy Birthday, Mike! May the BEST day of your past…be the worst day of your future!
Happy Birthday to a very dear brave & compassionate man Mike Rinder!
One of the maxims I learned in Scn is that confidential briefings are neither confidential nor brief.
http://twistedcity.shugartmedia.com/archives-4.html
The PR version of Battle Creek’s building:
https://www.google.com/search?q=66+Michigan+Avenue+east,+Battle+Creek,+MI+49017+google&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwisl7jjoJrTAhUPx2MKHecFDVEQ_AUICCgD&biw=1352&bih=666#tbm=isch&q=66+Michigan+Avenue+east,+Battle+Creek,+MI+49017+&imgrc=Hg87OUI-k9D12M:
The read downtown site:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/66+E+Michigan+Ave,+Battle+Creek,+MI+49017/@42.3173764,-85.1806477,3a,75y,228h,90t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s76YWEezVyF_NdBS9yyyO9Q!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D76YWEezVyF_NdBS9yyyO9Q%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dsearch.TACTILE.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D392%26h%3D106%26yaw%3D228.65317%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656!4m5!3m4!1s0x8817f18dd9b186a1:0x930934e40108cb78!8m2!3d42.317217!4d-85.1808944!6m1!1e1
It’s no wonder they have to meet at the Masonic Lodge, their current building is nothing more than a hole in the wall.
Beautiful comparisons . Difference between the bubble reality and real reality.
There’s a real reality? Whoa! Now that’s some good shit!
OSD,
Real reality is when the curl is biting the back of you board for a hundred yards, and the spray is hitting your neck the whole time.
You just described Paradise. Especially the times I lived in Hawai’i…
Dave,
Ideal? Your ass.
Sea Change Update:
This is not a green-eyeshades Wall Street analysis of chasing an elusive Black Swan event; those all in on the wrong side of British sentiment and the American middle finger.
This is not a stuck pig’s DNA propensity for tone deafness or Blueocean cray-cray silliness.
This is not a matter of deconstructing your cult and supplanting Hubbardisms with Starbuck Philosophy being peddled as wisdom, fueled by caffeine and wi-fi.
Think of it as 59 missiles with GPS guided by a moral compass aimed straight up your butt.
Good film and great read: The Journey to Wellville. It is a fictional account of the Kellogg Sanitarium in Battle Creek around the turn of the 20th century. As a former scientologist I got a good chuckle out of the similarities of the health claims of John Harvey Kellogg with his devotedl followers/believers and the bridge to total freedom.
The “big mystery” is that they’ve had to downsize the Idle Morgue to a cornflakes box.
Ditto, Mike!
“It has been proven time and time again that the more of us who gather– to form postulates together and work together as a third dynamic– the more momentum we can achieve. ”
Translation we’ve noticed if we get a lot of you together with some shills to start the giving then apply plenty of pressure, we can extract more $$ than if we go at you one at a time. Social pressure unblocks those excuses. “Susan and Frank have 5 kids and they made their patronicus maximorus. Surely you can do your humanicus level 4?”
+1 Ka, my thoughts exactly! Shills to start off the matching donations and the rest have to cough up the bucks to save face and one-up each other. As my usual fence sitting self was curious… I witnessed this once, at an AOLA “free” dinner.I didn’t know what to expect and I don’t recall the reason for the donos but I left feeling sick to my stomach and it wasn’t from the cheap spaghetti dinner. I went to look and saw through the shill act as soon as it began. Uugghh
“Of course, we’ve been promoting it as a “big mystery”. ”
Of course. If they said, “We will hold this event and lock the doors until you donate,” nobody would come except a few true believers.
A crowded event is critical. Everyone has gone to something that was not hugely attended. It’s a very awkward feeling.
“This data is private, and it is for you.” And will be published shortly thereafter on MikeRindersBlog.org!!! ROFL Scientology “news” has become a sieve, leakage everywhere AND very quickly.
“We have special guests arriving this week from management, to help unveil the news we have for you.”
WTF??? It takes a “special” person to read this “news???”
Hmmmmmmmm……..yep, it’s going to be special alright. When everyone is in their seats, out comes the big white board. And at the top it says, DONATIONS! It’s probably in a locked room too…
They’re not going to read it. They’re going to unveil it. Maybe the “news” is a bust of Miscavige. You know, from the waist up, standing behind the podium with his hands on it in that particular way. With his pompadour, in his little suit. Maybe He found Lost Tech that says that in each org a bust of Him should stand next to that of LRH – that this is what LRH always wanted, and NOW, finally, its occurring, and all orgs can be TRULY Ideal, with Planetary Clearing a reality. The time is now.
What a nightmare that would be! Busts of the dwarf in every Idle Morgue. Scary…
Garden gnomes
How about a gargoyle of Miscavige on the the facade of each Ideal Org. Right above the main entrance. Think of the regging possibilities…Command Intention. The time is now.
That’s the ticket!
I like the term “gnome or gargoyle” much better than “dwarf”. Sadly
dwarfs “little people” through no fault of their own are born that way…..and are good people….unlike the “gnome/gargoyle” who rules with an iron fist.
Oh hoe Thetans love a Mysytery?
It Keeps Scientology Working / Scamming / Conning / Extorting / Killing / Maiming / Money Laundering / Enureing / Bamboozling / Lying / Criminal – ing / Ying a Ling Ling ing….
Today’s post reminds me of this oldie but goodie
This has always been one of my favorite videos
It’s PR – Scientology style!
Involving the Co$ of Michigan vs a local news team
Can they really be so clueless as to not realize how bad this kind of stuff makes them look?
It’s not dauntless, defiant or resolute
It’s moronic, idiotic and juvenile
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9uXd_71yrM&sns=em
Whoa, that was truly hilarious! That poor defrauded heating and air contractor learned a valuable lesson about just how criminal the cherch actually is and no one could have summed it up for the viewing audience any better than he did.
What really killed me there was the $cilon who was sent out to confront and shatter the SPs ran like a scared bunny when asked to comment on why the cherch hadn’t paid its bills, then came back a second time and did the same thing over again!
These poor delusional $cilons get all pumped up by their fellow Thetanists about how great the tech is until they actually try to use the “confront and shatter suppression” tech on real people, then the comedy ensues! Worst of all, this silly $cilon was probably blamed for his mistakes in not doing the tech right, which then got him sent to cramming or worse.
In $cn, everything that goes wrong is always your fault, never the Holy Tech, but everything that goes right is always attributed to the miraculous efficacy of Elron’s magical tech.
Just watched the newsreel where the air conditioning business was not paid monies owed. That got me thinking about the Better Business Bureau. I found the BBB listing for $cn LA and there were 7 complaints. Unfortunately, the cherch is not rated. But there were still complaints logged against it. Here’s a thought… if everyone who is now out were to submit complaints against the cherch that fleeced them and never delivered on what was being sold, perhaps we can save one poor uninformed soul from making a horrid mistake.
Hey Chee, I remember that interview! They send some idiot out to try and handle the situation. He promptly botches everything. Now that’s a a Scientologists, turning everything into F.U.B.A.R.
Thank you for the link to that priceless video! That poor scientology goofball comes running out then runs away then comes back to mumble a threat, squeezes the reporters mic, lets it go then runs away again! WTF was THAT about??? I laughed myself silly!
I laughed so hard I couldn’t breathe! Maybe he was running back and forth for exercise! Although he looked kind of sickly…
“You may have noticed over the past few years that something seems to be hindering our flows with regards to our Ideal Org.”
Yeah, it’s called exposure…..and that light of exposure is only going to get brighter (see Aftermath, Season 2). Your “flows” aren’t only getting “hindered”, they seem to actually be flowing in “reverse”. For any Scientologists still in, as we say in the South, “get out now while the gettin’s good.”
And the “gettin’s good” RIGHT NOW! And it’s very simple. Get up from your chair and calmly leave. No muss, no fuss…
Don’t let the door smack you on the Ass on your way OUT running at full gallop……
A smack in the ass could give ‘me a good start!
Oh… I love it when you talk dirty!
I know…you sick bastard! But, you’re still the funniest person on this blog!
Gee, now that you mention it, we have noticed that things are not proceeding according to plans. Thanks for finally acknowledging this completely mysterious “hindrance”.
Could the solution which this $cn “fluffer” is alluding to be a detailed preview of the new XenuVision programming that will be airing 24/7, beginning this summer?
If so, then that “solution” is sure to feature another “Bataan Death March” money raising effort, designed to suck out whatever remaining cash/credit these poor souls might still have left to their names.
Yep, y’all aint walkin in high cotton no more
I just love southern sayings. I’m fixin’ to go and eat some grits myself…
The reason there is a problem with their “flows” is they have bled everyone dry already and there aren’t any new sheeple coming in. The “big mystery” is some middle management flunky from INT will fly in to scream at everyone who is crazy enough to show up, (knowing they will be regged to death) blaming them for not getting it done and to give MO’ MONEY, MO’ MONEY, MO’ MONEY! They’ll be lucky if they don’t get locked in the building until $cn has pried open their wallets, remortgaged their homes, maxed their cards, and taken their first born. Oh no they wouldn’t do that, no kids allowed and that would be more mouths to feed. bring ’em back when they’re old enough to be able to work 18 hrs. a day, say, like, when they’re 12.
Mike,
Thanks for all you’ve done. I’m looking forward to season II, hope all is going well.
ml
Rob
Rob, you summed it up quite nicely. That’s exactly how those things go down. No, thank you!
But what about all those medal winners who give millions and millions and have new awards invented for them depending on how much they give that year?
Rob, I just shuddered reading your comment. It was that powerful. And once more have I given thanks to God and/or the angel over my shoulder that got me out of there.
If that’s not a come on, I don’t know what one is. The Amway days are over.
Scientology is the Amway of spiritual cults. Who needs 200 rolls of toilet paper and 200,000 BTs?
Actually, BK, I have it on solid authority that at least every org in the world is in DESPERATE need of 200 rolls of toilet paper!!!
I beg to differ, BK, but, there’s NOTHING spiritual about this cult. It has been and always will be about extorting money. That is their one true goal.
Geezers Dude… what about the scotch! Best spirit on the planet, COB confirms it’s top shelf status! The 12 men of Twain, wisest of all businessman… barley is the base of all respectable spirituality as far as Scientology is concerned. The rest are just fertilizer.
Ney, laddie! You can keep the scotch, I’m a wine drinker! Haven’t you been paying attention?
Big empty buildings are just monuments to honor former Scientologists that gave their money in exchange for the false hope that the buildings themselves would increase the number of Scientologists. But, alas, it’s just a failed plan by Miscavige that has morphed into real estate scam to increase the wealth of this non religious, business enterprise/empire. The truth is, by building up all these assets Miscavige is painting a target on his back. Even an out of court settlement with the IRS would get the government some $ billions into their coffers. The diminutive emperor may have tons of money but he also has a giant angry mob of ex-members that would throw in their support to the IRS in taking down the Gucci Emperor.
Robert, I don’t think the Ideal Orgs will actually add to the wealth of Scientology. Most of the old org buildings they’ve sold have been at a loss or at prices significantly below the typical price of a normal transaction in that market for a building held for that length of time. They lost money on the first building they bought for the Portland Ideal Org, something that was hard to do in the PDX market of the time. There are other cases but I don’t have time to dig them all up.
Going forward, the new Ideal Org buildings will not fetch the amount of money that Miscavige is putting into them. They’re overimproved, often far more ritzy than the neighborhoods they live in. For example, the Cincinnati Ideal Org is in Florence KY, a relatively lower to middle income community. They won’t get what they put into it when they leave.
Also, the interior build-out will have to change significantly for new tenants, reducing the value of the building. Auditing rooms are too small and the lack of windows means they can’t be easily used as offices. Buyers will discount the cost of the improvements they will have to make from what they’re willing to pay.
Scientology will likely make far less money on the real estate (with a couple exceptions like Saint Hill and the buildings in Hollywood) than they would have if they had put the money in an index fund.
Mike — I hope your attendance with Leah at Deadline’s The Contenders Emmys means “Aftermath” is being given serious consideration for an award.
The show was so well done — informative, heartfelt and disturbing at the same time. Plaudits again go to The Intellectual Property Corporation, Alex Weresow, Leah, and the other producers for creating such a touching and meaningful series.
Hear Hear!
Sitting on the edge of the chair awaiting Season II and hopeful that an Award is won for reason I….
Happy Birthday Mike……may all your wishes come true! Love & Prays for your family.
Where Where? Oh.. There There. Can you Hear me now?
I’m hoping for a nomination! And a win!
I just voted for you…
From Tim Jones letter: “You may have noticed over the past few years that something seems to be hindering our flows with regards to our Ideal Org.”
Tim, look to the obvious: A well-informed public that is wary of Scientology and Scientologists waking up & leaving. A renovated building doesn’t solve those issues.
The Why is God.
Wow! So ‘God’ is responsible for this shit? Who’d of thunk it…
Didn’t God get assigned lowers by COB?
God now resides in the RPFs RPF. I hear they treat her like shit…
Earth To Tim Jones:
The fact that Scientology’s PR is at best in a condition of Enemy might have some bearing on your org’s “flows”.
You see, Tim, when an organization is perceived by the vast majority of the general public as a ruthless, greedy cult, people tend to “flow” away from it.
Cappice?
Ah, me. Wasted sarcasm. Totally wasted into the ether. He’s not reading this.
No, he’s not reading this.
Right now he’s probably mid some kind of Ethics program to assist him in “taking full responsibility” for his org’s dismal stats.
Patience, patience, patience, and more patience.
The truth has set us all free and will do the same for him.
Patience.
Mike Rinder is my inspiration for this quality.
He just keeps on keeping on.
Thanks, Mike.
Indeed! The flow is away from the cult. Of course, their reputation is so horrid, they just dismiss them. Tough being a Scientologists…
Moved from Scamontology to Lieontology. Now Golden Age of Retardology.
BIG chuckle!
Retardology. I hear it’s course that everyone MUST take! The stupider you get, the more praise you get.
Oh geezes… where’s the airsick bag?
The same old formula of “hidden, special only to you information that’ll blow away all the stops and barriers” is so hackneyed and threadbare it is nauseous. I hate to be critical of dumb animals and other not so bright critters who end up dinner for some superior, more savage life form but Scientologists who buy this bunk are stupid beyond belief. They pitched that crap decades ago and obviously continue to do so, it’s their only tool in the shed apparently & NONE of it has worked, EVER, except to fleece the sheeple and drove any intelligent being away from Scientology.
Images of Babe and the sheep pig come to mind but without the comedy angle – those smelly boars with rotten yellow tusks are serious!
I Yawn, the fact that they brought up the stuck flows really lays out what is really going on. No new people. And this is freaking them out big time!
Poor little Clams, snap, snap, snap.
Yawn, lest we not forget, we all bought this crap once. The good news is that we cognited and are out, and if we could, they can too.
Lest you think I’m being pejorative of you, I’m not. Today is one of my compassionate days 🙂 All too often I read the stuff that Mike posts about the cluelessness of the Still Ins and figuratively grind the palm of my hand into my forehead. I really have to remind myself again and again, “I was once one of them”.
Aren’t tattoos a bitch to get rid of…
I can see getting married and having a couple of kids. But, a tattoo just seems so permanent…
Not if they are on someone else……..
Fool me once, shame on YOU.
Fool me twice, shame on ME.
Fool me decades and I must be a SCIENTOLOGIST.
That’s actually one of the better “action definitions” of a Scientologist I’ve ever seen, very clever, but it seems something is incomplete about it. There seems to be something like a genetic alteration taking place with the long term, hard core Scios. Wanting to be be fooled must be in their DNA. Like putting a stupid hat with propeller on a dog, the animal is all smiles and eager to please, no matter how ridiculous it looks.
I Yawn, yes definitely must be some sort self selection for people in for decades or deep changes to the psyche. Maybe subtract those born in with no where to go otherwise.
A lot of older SO waking around PAC Base. I wonder if they think about the life they’re wasting…
Now, that is cute, Wynski. Stick with this brand of brew 🙂
I cannot eve imagine what goes through their mind OSD. If they thought too much about it they would probably off themselves like L. Con tried to do.
Indeed he did. So what’s the message to all of us? It was all one giant scam?
OSD said:”Was the message “It was all one giant scam?”
“What’s true for you is what’s true”
Frankly, I believe he bought into his own Kool-aid pretty early on.
Yes OSD. It was just one giant scam. From the moment he thought about becoming rich by starting a religion…
For the most part it attracted people who wanted TO help or wanted help themselves.
That was the real tragedy & crime.
“…a genetic alteration…”
That’s funny!
+1! Great post, Mike!
Thanks OSD. A few hours at the beach-side bar (along with many brews) brings out the Bard in me. 🙂
A few glasses of a great Merlot, coupled with some killer cannabis, out on my deck, is paradise.
…and promise to continue fooling me for uncounted lifetimes to come and you must be the creator of the one of the biggest and longest running con games ever perpetrated in all of earth’s history!
H.F. maybe they are going for a Guinness record for longest conned?
The ‘Longest Yard,’ has been replaced by the, Longest Con…
I was born in Michigan, I left 25 years ago for central Florida, it was a dead city then and I’m betting it hasn’t changed, do they except locals to show up or is it a requirement for all people of the Scientology cult to show up for this “Big surprise”? I’m happy I never was apart of a cult especially one that’s so greedy!! I do remember the big Tony the Tiger on the Kellogg factory, I guess that will be interesting for those who make the trip!!!
I’m glad you are free Mike enjoy your sweet little kids !!! I’m praying for you and your family, please keep doing what you’re doing. I can’t imagine how busy you must be,stay strong you are appreciated and needed!
Shelley, I’m guessing they’ll never let you in, and not only because they’re paranoid about outsiders, but because, frankly, even if you’re not using your real name here, you also sound far too happy and normal. They’d be suspicious for this last reason alone.