I happened to stumble upon this yesterday.
It was put out after the “5th Anniversary of the Maiden Voyage” which means shortly after June 1993.
Yes, that is right. TWENTY THREE YEARS AGO.
And look at the requirements — OT VIII and SHSBC Grad (or Gard V and ALL Tech Specialist Courses), all orgs St Hill Size and a “A safe environment.”
More than two decades later:
- OT VIII’s are being pushed to do Student Hat, Purif and Objectives as their “set-ups” for OT IX and X. There is NO Briefing Course. You cannot do it even if you paid for it.
- There are less “SH Size orgs” (by ANY definition) than there were at that time. Now the push is on “ideal orgs” because nobody was making SH Size orgs. Ideal orgs was a better gimmick because the OT VIII’s were told they were responsible for collecting the money and “making it go right” so if there was no OT IX and X it was their fault.
- The environment is less safe than it has ever been for scientology, which is now the routine butt of comedians everywhere.
BUT — they are STILL SAYING “OT IX and X” are imminent.
Clearly, these original “requirements” were completely arbitrary. Just made up to try to promote whatever they thought would be the best thing to occupy the OT VIII’s with.
Plus this is a very clear indictment of David Miscavige’s “leadership” of scientology. He proclaims it is brilliant and the expansion is “unprecedented” – the truth is the only thing that is unprecedented about his “reign” as the self-described pope of scientology is that the movement has shriveled and today is on the verge of disappearing entirely.
And finally, if anyone needed tangible evidence that OT IX & X are just scented plastic carrots being dangled in front of the OT VIII donkeys who need something to keep them giving with the promise/hope they will achieve the amazing results they were expecting on each of the previous levels — this history should leave no doubt.
Well, there is enough tech from the 50’s and 60’s that never made it onto the bridge that they could easily make some OT levels from that, and it would be out of Hubbard’s mouth.
For instance, OT9 is labelled “Character”. That sounds a lot like GPM stuff from early St. Hill days. Packages of Opposing Terminals, and their Goals. Seems to me actually that it could be rather worthwhile.
OT 10 is labelled “Orders of Magnitude”. I remember one event 20 years ago where “Senior C/S Int” was taking about supposedly Hubbard’s research on it, with dates that go WAY far back track, like with dozens of zeros, numbers way beyond the ability of most people to comprehend that far back.
Another good contender for Orders of Magnitude is to essentially copy Excalibur from Ron’s Org.
The Route To Infinity Course has another good contender for an OT Level.
~ CSD99
It are stories from a widower of the first OT8 in The Netherlands. I have only some other proof. A booklet from 1976 where they sell OT8.
I feel bad now,
having just posted a bashing of OT-persons and what they “know”.
Let’s just think a moment…
Naturally, an “Operating Thetan” is going to have his or her sense of propriety… warped?
Is that a good word?
Bent?
I mean, come on. Spend untold thousands and years-turned-decades getting bricks bounced off your forehead until you can recite scientology policy backwards and forwards and NOTHING ELSE under threat of retribution usually reserved for criminals or indeed the insane and WHAT WOULD YOU EXPECT, omg, now I’m going crazy.
No, I’m ok.
I, after all, got out. I have been spared… that… monumental… abuse.
And, no wonder we never hear OT groups of persons standing up and talking about the wonders of scientology. Not even one guy. What we do get is a high-class lawyer, that’s who. That is the new speaker for COS, while the leader remains out of the picture, and behind the curtain, if you will.
Your TV has no live-action shot of him, right? Please, please, please, what is scientology, dear leader?
There is no wonder. There is no miracle. There is no salvation. There is no secret eternity.
There is no “higher knowledge” to share, no secret to reveal… except one. The biggest secret, the thing that no OT dare speak, not to you nor me and most sadly to himself…
scientology is nothing more than an empty dream. Always just out of reach…
It’s a very expensive and costly, empty dream. One man’s alter ego.
A reflection of a single man’s imagination,
period. Turns out, Lafayette R. Hubbard had some pretty fringe problems of his own…
Oh!
The things they DO NOT tell you, in the bubble…Please, please, please,… look it up.
Truth, and that’s one truth just a bit too much for the devoted OT to confront, much less talk about.
OT X
Sure. Let’s wait another 20 years, shall we? No, let’s not. Let’s have a bonfire TODAY!
And all scientologists are warmly invited to attend, really, OT persons too. Let’s see what the rest of the world has to offer, in the way of FUN, what do you say?
Why restrict your search for enlightenment, happiness and well-being to only one spot?
Come ON.
LRH and his promises inspire me to make you a promise of my own:
If you go to the trouble of finding ANY person related to, or once-married to THE INFAMOUS L. RON HUBBARD,
that person will offer you more important and enlightening information – about HUBBARD – than Hubbard ever told you himself. Just pick a relative, there’s three wives, for starters… Then there’s descendants all the way to… today! How about that? Now there is valuable research.
Especially when you KNOW that this scientology thing is not really working at all… only YOU are. Just like a slave. If you are on the inside, that has to be one truth you ARE getting straight.
Here’s a new angle, to serve your perspective:
Imagine YOU are the Universe, infinite realm of infinite possibilities, that’s right, YOU.
One day, along comes a guy named Hubbard who says he has the key to Supreme Knowledge.
The ONLY key.
Before that conversation begins…
– What would you know?
The world awaits.
Unfortunately, your time is rather limited. Same as mine.
May your sense of propriety be ever-expanding, bug out.
Apparently the ‘higher’ one goes up the bridge the greater chance, (proven statistic?) that one exits scientology for a real and better life. So here is a plan.
Just as the Super Power building finally burst open its doors and was probably spurred on to do so due to a lawsuit by the Garcias claiming fraud by the CoS and related entities (BT’s or NO…TS) will someone please bring a lawsuit for the >23 year old fraud of not providing the, in numerous cases of prepaid delivery of such,
The strategy is to get more OTVIIIs to move onto OTIX and X and therefore achieving the very practical goal of ‘exited scientology for good.’
The foregoing is a suggestion as to the often asked paraphrased question. how does one get a scientologist head out of the sand and stop participating in the fraud. What fraud? well the fraud of those levels being released very sooon…… DM is such a damned dilettante…. can’t he make anything go right without altering the original program and failing to meet the TIME MACHINE,
Check out all the trademark and copyright symbols in the propa-promo. So business-like and consumer oriented. Enlightenment for $ale. Come and get it, or dream on is more like it.
Check out that last foto…
it has the uncanny look of the Wizard’s chamber, Wizard of OZ
As the $camology base continues to shrink Demento has to find new ways to strip the money from the sheepbots that remain. One can almost see him slowly turning into Howard Hughes and hiding in his fortress.
The whole kerfuffle about semicolons was so obviously bovine-derived fertilizer; as a pretty literate guy and one who worked as an editor, it’s primarily a factor of which style book you were first taught; Personally, I avoided the beasties at all costs, but then I did a search and saw this site which seems to reflect modern usage:
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/semicolon
I’m inclined to think that since ElCon DID make a living as a writer, he might have been more right than that twit who dropped out of a highly-rated school
Some 5 OT 8 completions got together and compared notes. They had all done different versions of OT 8.
David Miscavige is making it up.
No, they were taylor made super OT special just for each Homo Novis just as LRH wanted. Snark.
Wow! Now that’s stunning! So he’s making up multiple OT 8 materials? They probably should have stuck with the, “I am Lucifer” edition. Remember, the name for OT8 is “Truth Revealed.” And Hubbard coming out as Lucifer would certainly be ‘Truth Revealed.’
LRH shouldn’t have let Capt Bill go, LRH should have called Capt Bill back.
Capt Bill went off, and did tons of extra OT levels, for the Ron’s Org.
LRH just missed having a true big being who thought like LRH and who could have taken LRH’s comments and thoughts and run with them and I think Capt Bill really sorely was sad LRH didn’t reach out to Capt Bill after he left.
Capt Bill was prolific, he could have come up with all sorts of OT levels for LRH to sell!
And, Capt Bill could sing! I heard a recording of him singing and he had one hellava range! I sent the recording over to Mike Goldstein who had never heard. Seriously, he probably could sing opera. Come back Capt Bill! We really need you…
Although I never took any of the OT materials I think I sometimes display OT abilities. A couple of weeks ago I took the dog to a very popular park to take him for a walk. When I got there the parking lot was completely full, I postulated that I was going to find a parking place anyway. I drove around the lot 3 or 4 times and just when I was about to give up someone was leaving and I took their parking place. I was able to talk to take the dog for the walk and said three hip hip hurrays to LRH as we walked around the park.
Wow! Think of all the money you’ve saved!
Only 3 or 4 times around the parking lot! Holy shit! You must be, what, OT 10 now? It took me 7 times driving around the parking lot for my postulate to kick in. Gosh, Doug, PLEASE share with me your power!
If I share the information before you are ready you can catch pneumonia and die, so please don’t ask.
That ought to put his ethics in Karen. And in the process HOPEFULLY he will give up meat. Not that it matters to me. 🙂
Karen ought to know— she’s a Class XII auditor. WOOWOOWAH!
The purpose of the Saint Hill Hill Special Briefing Course was
so all Scientologists could audit the OT Levels.
Naturally David Miscavige kills it !!!!
typo delete one Hill.
LRH Data from Saint Hill 1970
OT 9 & 10 don’t exist. Hubbard talk about it for the first time in RJ 35. It’s not his habit to lie on levels he has researched. Conclusion : Hubbard didn’t write nor said RJ 35 which is an invention of Miscavige to prevent scientologist in 1983 to join David Mayo movement. They had to say they have levels that Mayo don’t have to keep the customers in. The RJs are gross forgeries.. The actor who speaks in RJ38 do a very poor imitation of Hubbard.
YOu have bought into a lie. RJ 35 was absolutely recorded by L. Ron Hubbard. And obviously it suits your preconceived idea that Hubbard was not in the habit about lying about the levels he had researched. Come on FG. He lied about the “research” behind Dianetics and the pattern continued all the way to the end. It doesnt make everything a lie, but to make the statement that he didnt lie about the research he did is absird.
you are a comfort.
Seriously DM, have you considered doing the Crucifixion Rundown?
Now that’s a good idea!
Thanks for pointing this out, Mike but it’s totally possible that 0TIX and X could be released, at any time. What is to keep the Pip Squeak from “making up” some additional BT nonsense, then release it as is L Con’s 0TIX and X – and away they go, again. Seems relatively easy. Furthermore, my guess would be that it’s already there, to one degree or the other but being held back until “Pip” is forced to play his hand.
Yes, that is true. I meant “Hubbard OT IX and X” — of course he could invent anything and say it was from Hubbard and the donkeys would think they had finally caught up to the carrot.
I think someone said that its much harder to imitate a bad writer than it is a good one… I don’t think that DM and/or his minions could successfully make up these new levels and fool anyone but the most credulous of followers. Hubbard had a style all his own, and I think even DM is too smart to think that he could recreate Hubbard’s tone and style, let alone creativity. To release these new levels (in any form) would be to lose the last of his followers.
nawwwww. I think it would be fairly easy for them to make up whatever they bloody well pleased. When you’re IN you get a win on any old thing. That’s the way it was for me, anyway. I even used to say that…I could get a win on smelling your old dirty sock. 🙂
What a laugh if he got Sherman to make up OT1V and X.
Ah, the many faced bullshit god.
Scientology is so much a farce it makes your butt go tight. Miscavige truly lies for a living, that’s all he does and is capable of. Nothing about the OT levels delivered even resembles an exchangeable product – it’s all criminal. Just goes to show how gullible some are to keep lapping that crap up.
Good exposure Mike, the reference and proof to show how easily Miscavige can tell lies is priceless. Kudos to Ron Miscavige too. However, if I had the name Miscavige – I’d consider changing it, it’s acquired an irremovable odor!
Exchangeable product? scientology requires exchange?
You mean Captain Arturo Sandoval was lying at the SuMP opening when he said (I am going to try to type this without falling out of my chair laughing)
“What’s significant about the Church and its members is that you give and ask for nothing in return.”
Yeah, I want some of what he’s smoking.
I’ve got some right here, Valerie! A special brand just for you…
I’ll bring the Valeritas (special patented Valerie style margaritas) it’s a date. Bring some giraffes to pet.
Valerie, that sounds wonderful! Great Valerie styple margaritas as well as my giraffe, Lynn. Well, maybe we’ll leave Lynn in Nairobi at the Giraffe Center. She has lots of company there.
I wish I could meet you.
Yes indeed, the Church of the One Way Flow. Pass it over to me too if you get some, must be the stuff to puff.
You think!
I just watched a video by some ex-Jehovah’s Witnesses. They were talking about the annual conventions they had attended. Each one gave the impression that “This is the LAST ASSEMBLY before THE END.” Everyone had to “get ready” and improve their behaviors and practices before it was too late.
When the end doesn’t come–it is the fault of the congregations for not measuring up.
A destructive cult by any other name…
Would still be called the cult of Jehovah’s Witnesses. They have quite bit in common with the cult of scientology. They destroy families and protect rapists and sexual predators due to PR concerns.
yeah, those ‘End of the Worlders” used to give me comfort. At least I wasn’t THAT crazy. hahhahahahahah.
Worth reposting . . .
The excerpt below is from an email written around six years ago by 40-year career FSM Mike Smith (now deceased while waiting for OT 9 & 10). He flew to the Freewinds and pressed them about when these upper OT levels were going to be released. He was in his early-70’s and (I heard) pretty desperate to get going on these upper levels. The years were clicking by.
This is a portion of an email he distributed to his selectees immediately upon his return from the ship.
———————————————————————————————–
———————————————————————————————–
“UPDATE ON RELEASE OF OT IX AND X and beyond:
The word on OT IX is “no word,” not just a nothing, but the positive statement that there is NO data, and any earlier “data” or rumors or such were all invalid, just guesses or rumors.
There is NO data, no estimate of date, no official conditional targets, no length of time to do them, solo or HGC or combination, etc.
Nothing that was rumored before is valid.
The message to OTs and anyone else wanting to have OT IX released is “make your Orgs into Ideal Orgs”.
That is what is needed in order to get OT IX released. That is what we all should work on if we want to help get these upper OT levels released.”
———————————————————————————————–
———————————————————————————————–
This was the “official” statement circa 2010 given out to OTs who got too curious or pressed too hard while on the Freewinds: all prior statements were rumors.
Mike was sec checked during his trip, however. Or so I heard at the time.
sec checked sec checked and sec checked. It’s this thing that’s supposed to do something… I’m not sure what. Maybe they WANT us to want to poke forks in our eyes.
I knew people who have paid for it in the 1990s. They are now deceased. Sad? Yes. Criminal? Yes.
Tax exemption? Uhhhhhh yes…….?
I don’t know that it was actually “sold”. Source?
In the early 80s, before OTVIII was released, they sold 8/9/10 packages to people. Those packages were advertised in Advance and other of their magazines.
All of the comments today are tuned in to the truth of D.M.’s insanity.
I do recall hearing those 3 requisites at an event and later realizing
that they were so arbitrary.
Also like the other poster said, if they were so incredible, does not the
planet need them now.
In the end we can realize that LRH created an amazing fantasy.
He is not coming back, that I can ensure you. He just hangs around.
Didn’t Hubbard claim that he would be a political leader when he came back and that the church would not know his identity?
I’m him, Doug. Now don’t freak out. I just felt that coming back as a surfer would be a better fit.
As for that lying piece of crap, dwarf boy, I’d like to string him by his balls!
I want to sign up as being your second-in-command. You are the LRH I have always wanted to know.
You got it, Dan! Now let’s burn it down to the ground!
Many believe that he is already hanging by a thread.
Well, usually we use rope, so I’m not sure if the string will be enough. If not, we can add tourches & pitchforks…
OSD,
Stringing up the pope of scientology by his tiny testicles is like threading a needle. No way is anyone going to put a rope around his scrotum. But torches and pitchforks will add to the party atmosphere.
I know, huh? Ya gotta love torches and pitchforks.
two words: Householder Unit.
Can you write a sequel to Mission Earth? Of all the things you wrote in your previous lifetime that was my favorite.
Sorry OSD…I am LRH, Part Duex. You are an imposter. I can prove it too. But to ask me to prove it would be to expose yourself as a non-believer and then I would have to send you to the Hole. (Which does not exist).
Please send me a check for your CSCI.
Part Duex? I never saw it comin’. I’ve been exposed as a fraud. Your check is in the mail….
“OT VIII’s were told they were responsible for collecting the money and “making it go right” so if there was no OT IX and X it was their fault.”
The moving target scam was always the underpinning of all of $cientology. And the ‘you didn’t make it go right’ excuse is always the reason why it didn’t work out.
The carrot is supposed to distract the mule and make it work harder. Well, if the mule remembers that that particular carrot has been dangled for 23 years, the carrot loses its appeal.
So why the re-re-re release of OT 9 and 10 news? What function does it serve? The mule is looking around and has taken its eyes off the rancid carrot. Most of those eyes are looking at the real world and either going stealth or totally escaping.
Great catch Mike, the short term memory of clams needs to be re-stimulated by this news.
Mike, THIS is an incredible find. I’ve been kicking myself for having discarded my accumulated cult promo from the late ’80s and all thru the ’90s – 2 VERY large boxes filled flyers and mags like this one. If there’s lingering doubt in anyone’s mind that the CO$ is just shining you along while making you jump thru one hoop and then another in order to get your eternal salvation, read this. Read it over and over, and then make your plans to exit the cult.
no no, honey. You were right to get rid of it. We could have saved this crap but it’s like keeping Kryptonite. It feels too good to get rid of it. I wish I could have thrown a party.
Thanks for having this and posting it, Mike. I love these Pull The Curtain Back on the Wizard irrefutable damnations.
When super power was about to be released (this time actually for real) I had been inquiring about whether all the staff had done it. I recalled vividly the info on it, 30 odd years before – the hype about the ‘eval’ ron had done and how this was FOR staff and all staff would get it first before public etc etc.
Newer type staff didn’t know what I was talking about and others had no answers and escaped the questioning.
I wished for the old documents which spoke of it so clearly.
I suspect there is a good reason why El Con sidestepped some of the more astute observers of human emotion and reaction such as the Elizabeth Kubler-Ross five stages of grief surrounding sudden loss, death or ‘a severe reality adjustment’.
1) Denial
2) Anger
3) Bargaining
4) Depression
5) Acceptance
Note the stages are not a linear and predictable progression, just an observation of what some people go through.
Denial – we are the most ethical group on the planet. Dave would never do that!
Anger – That lyin cheatin son of a b*&^% !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Bargaining – I’ll get my auditing/eternity in the indy field. I’ll expose that (expletive) and my family members will see the light!
Depression – OMG, it’s all a farce and I fell for it. OMG what have I done? My life is wasted!
Acceptance – Each to their own here…!
Yo Dave,
What stage are you in good buddy. Still in denial on your shrinking cult? Or I hear you get pretty pissed these days, maybe you are in anger? How is the bargaining going with Tom and Bob? Depression is close at hand if not somehow directly connected to the Scotch intake ………… go for it Dave!
No, really Dave, PLEASE go for it as Coop says. You’ll be MUCH better off. I promise….
let’s pretend for one second that there really was an OT IX and X. what kind of church would withhold this from the planet they were responsible for saving?! wouldn’t the special powers gained from these two levels only increase the likelihood that the goals of the church could be seen in this lifetime?
either OT IX & X are “real” – which means dave is a dick, or OT IX & X are not real – which means dave is a dick.
Lol!
Well said Chris….you just laid it down perfectly right there.
Take your pick:
1) They are sadistic mutherfuckers who enjoy watching the planet self-destruct
or
2) They’re just making this shit up
(Note: this is multiple choice)
I’ll go with 3) All of the above.
I’m going to go with…..ummmmmmm……dave is a dick…
How little we talking here?
Microscopic….One would need an electron microscope to see it.
…and are we talking “Donald Trump has small hands” small?
Tiny…
itsy-bitsy, teeny-weeny, yellow polka-dot…okay, took that a bit too far LOL
The Hell you did! Posting that assures me that you’re probably my age: Old!
With scientology and the tech given by LRH .. nobody will ever become an OT .. it is quit impossible .. so for what OT IX and X ..
Chris,
That is a bingo..
“let’s pretend for one second that there really was an OT IX and X. what kind of church would withhold this from the planet they were responsible for saving?! ”
The kind of church that sells its salvation at a price the large majority of people on this planet cannot afford. (Even when I was “in” I knew the whole “clearing the planet” thing was utter tripe).
The kind of church that has – as its most notable, top-of-the-bridge, super-enlightened ubermensch – a loony actor his ex wife and child had to flee from, another actor who his church blackmailed into staying in his closet and a douchebag guttermouth wealth-obsessed “business guru”. What a great advert!
“Après nous le déluge” (“After us, the deluge”) once Marquise de Pompadour, the lover of King Louis XV of France said. COB already has more money than he can spend in his live so it’s no matter are there OT IX or X or not. This chariot of lie will be rolling to the doomsday
And meanwhile more and more people just stop showing up, and to keep the doors open every org will become a Sea Org org…
Of course there is no level where finally you are not a pre-ot anymore but you can really start to look through walls. Problem was lrh (or anyone else) really could finish the space cootie thing as Sarge Pflaum explains to us.
Davey’s strategy was that he hoped LRH would come back in a different body and then we would get the next instalment where it was really going to happen. It.keep on hoping in other words.
It`s been 30 years now. In spite of the sea org motto he did not come back. Should we slap him with a freeloader debt for the auditing received from David mayo and Otto Roos?
We do know something of the quality of lrh research in the eighties.
The Psychs had been around for more than quadrillions of years and invented pain and sex to degrade everybody. Say what?
Lrh did some research but the outcome was that 4 trillion was not enough. Now it started to run into the hundreds of numbers.Oops I forgot and 5 seconds.
Anyone smelling a rat here?
Now there is a kind of truce.
1.No raw meat coming in whatsoever rather than a couple of dazed Latinos from Sunset Boulevard whose reading and writing in Spanish is not quite up to par but who mean well.
The occasional inflow from some Eastern Siberian villages, Eastern Slovakian townships, and a couple of dupes in rural Taiwan.
2. The militant second generation who are definitively OT in exclamation points. These people can only work on staff. As public they have no money because they have no marketable skills except being superior and telemarketing.
3.Whatever is left from the stubborn geriatric crowd that is not about to admit that they were fooled and keep on clapping and hip hip hooraying and falling all over themselves to thank the little ankle biter that the sun comes up.
The world is getting cleared of scientology at an accelerated rate. Even in western Siberia western Slovakia and Taipei.
Lrh said you could clear a percentage of an insane asylum by saying: “Come up to present time.”
Can you think of an application somewhere else too?
I have said in the past that Scientology is like The Borg, rolling along capturing and consuming anything of value. You are correct that the modern West is burnt; leaving them the former communist-bloc, Africa and the East.
Thing is, these people really don’t have much money (save Russian mafia types). But, they are a thetan in a body, which means they are a resource (The Borg is an equal opportunity slave owner).
Second generation (or even Third) Scientologists will become the Ruling Elite (they speak English and have sub-standard education, which makes them dumb and dangerous), while the poor saps that got trapped in The Borg’s magnetic strip, will become the Working or Slave Class.
But Hey! Everybody’s goin free! Yee-haw.
Either things haven’t been going well for the past 23 years (therefore, management has been lying about how things are going), or things have been going well (therefore, management was lying then). But scientologists will stop those thoughts dead in their tracks.
I spent two years on OT7 and hated every minute of it. The wins really required some imagination on my part to convince myself it was all worth it. I couldn’t face confronting another ‘BT’ that I had absolutely no reality on, had never affected my life and even if they did exist, I felt were better left alone (except that LRH ordered that to do so was ‘treason’). However, in the Indie field I know some people who have done OT7 and OT8 twice (in the CoS), and have gone on to spend years auditing the RON Org style of OT levels, which I believe are still just BTs. Don’t they EVER get sick of it, or imagine they’re just mocking them up after 20 years and more of auditing them? I know of one OT in the CoS who has spent 30 years on 7. Jeesus!
I have found that using mosquito repellant works great with getting rid of BTs.
I’ve had similar thoughts on it too. I’ve concluded it’s actually part of a conspiracy to guarantee there will never be a spiritual technology worth a hoot anywhere near the term Scientology or an emeter. It’s been pretty simply done really but it’s not easy to pull out of once you’ve been overrun to such a degree they force upon you – it develops into a mental grind that results in an ongoing cruelty that only a true asshole could dream up. The whole NOTs saga is crap and should be avoided like the plague it is imo. I’ve stated over and over and will continue to do so – NOTs is ENDORSED and PERPETUATED by Miscavige and his lawyer controllers of RTC, hence the Cof$ – it’s a great income source and field nullifying agent all in one. If that isn’t enough to make run (don’t walk) away from it I don’t know what planet you think you’re on but how about loaning me some money, you’d buy just about any pitch swallowing that stuff. If you want to fuck around with Scientology, pick something pre 1980 and knock yourself out.
No Yawn. NOTs was endorsed and ORDERED by El Con and HE eliminated the prior OT levels, IV-VII from the Grade Chart. DM had NO say or input into that. (as was already told to you by M. Rinder) The only “conspiracy” was from El Con as he NEVER crated ANY spiritual “technology” in the first place.
Seek professional psychiatric help ASAP!
The one thing that makes me wary about you is that you often resort to personally degrading others to make a point. Every person here who has done time in Scientology has been personally harassed, degraded and generally had their human rights abused at a criminal level concerning Scientology, its practices & services, sometimes for decades. You are adding that to that and are no better than they are. No matter what you consider your version of the truth is, your obvious need to force it negatively upon others is tantamount to throwing tantrums if you don’t get your own way with your generalities.
To me you are a stain on the carpet.
More rambling Yawn. I was not the source of the truth I just wrote about NOTs. Mike Rinder, who HAD to document this item told us all on THIS blog. THUS, you are once again displaying your scamology scrambled mind.
p.s. Remember, I’m a COINTELPRO master, Head of the CIA, MI6, FSK, et al
Nah, you’re just a wana – be! I found one gets along a lot better in life using honey rather than vinegar. I generally try to get on with people and mind what I say to strangers. I’ve made it to an old age and have operated in some dangerous professions and places. I’ve met your kind before, along with just about every other kind of person, some good, some extremely evil and all shades of grey between. But the main difference between you and me is, I don’t shoot prisoners.
It’s your choice to keep looking at the stain on the carpet.
If you don’t agree with comments about things you can:
a) Stop reading
b) Comment with your own view
c) Criticize
I note that b) and c) above are not luxuries afforded to scientologists, which is one of the reasons scientologists are ridiculed etc.
Believe me, in 45 years, I had plenty of antagonism and ridicule as a scientologist. But only since I left can I say I have been harassed, degraded and generally had my human rights abused at a criminal level – by scientology.
Mike Wynski, I have to agree with you.
So what’s coming up next – arrest people who don’t agree with you. You path has been well trodden by others many times before in many varied subjects & beliefs.
Thanks Dawn. Such activities are just to cover up for El Con and shift the fact that the tek doesn’t work over to DM.
Auditing BTs is Scientology’s self-flagellation.
FTW! statpush
FTW?
OSD, — For The Win — 🙂
Thanks, Mike! Man, am I gettin’ old or what?
Hardly OSD. You’ll die young, — 50 years from now.
I dated some of my BTs. You’d be surprised at how pissed off they got if I just glanced at another BT. Such drama…..
hahahha!
OMG. I wasn’t allowed to say any of this. I was pretty clear that it wasn’t helping, and I was pretty clear about what was happening, but THAT was to the D of P. It’s F*cking AMAZING to be able to hear it from another “pc”.
Do you know..as I was, “working to get onto the level” I kept asking people, casually, “so…do you like it?” I had this…resistance to the whole thing – really didn’t want to to do it, but it was what I got INNN for, right? (the culmination of almost 40 years) But I had this gnawing need for some sort of feeling that it was going to be a good thing. OT auditing had been so much shit for some time.
Thank you.
I’m sorry.
I’m sorry for what you had to go through.
OT VII made me want to jump off a roof or jab knives in my eyes. It was horrible. And the loss, expectations, lies, putting on a happy face, it was alll just torture.
We’re OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@secretfornow, my ex mother in law died of a brain tumor a year or so after completing OTVII and then escaping. She described the level in similar terms to the way you do.
She once told me she wished she had seen the light and escaped earlier. After the shock of III (wtf???) I still did IV and V but then gave up. You were not alone in your resistance. I have a feeling you were probably in a majority, truth be known.
thank you. I’m sorry for your loss. It’s amazing to me to think of all the thoughts we have, all of our opinions and difficulties, and the culture of SCN that makes us just hide it all.
You’re not allowed to have a bad time. You can only share good things. It’s AMAZING to me how little we were actually allowed to say! AND
I UNDERSTOOD “WHY”. It was OK with me.
Drinking the koolaide is a frighteningly apt phrase.
Secretfornow, I share your jubilation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now THAT is a success story secretfornow! I lost one of my dearest friends on NOTs. from healthy to dead from brain cancer in 1 year. Glad you made it out.
thank you.
I’m so sorry about your friend. I lost “my person” to an accident. I share your grief.
I have read some conspiracy type theories about “the cancers in ots”.. at this point I don’t ascribe to it. I believe it’s just the great wheel of doom and bad luck. We may find out more about environmental/dietary/technology things later to answer to why cancer is so rampant.
But I don’t blame SCN for cancer. I’ve had serious life threatening illnesses cured/treated medically. None cured by SCN.
What I DO blame scn for is the lie of the bridge that makes people think that they can be above getting sick. (and keeps them from seeking treatment from “the know-nothing-medicos”)
I could write a whole blog post on THAT lie.
and….
one of the joys (oh the joys) of being out.. is removing all the BS about illness.
It wasn’t your friends fault. He/she didn’t pull it in. It wasn’t overts on an SP that did it. It wasn’t out ethics that did it. He wasn’t degraded because it happened to him. It wasn’t his bad track of overts and things that made it happen.
It
wasn’t
his
fault.
and nobody who was never in, would ever think so.
It’s only the scios who are trained in this most heinous and lowest type of evil.
All of my worst swear words are saved for this aspect of things.
It was the stress that did it.
https://www.mdanderson.org/publications/focused-on-health/december-2014/how-stress-affects-cancer-risk.html
Well, OT VIII (the first “REAL” OT) level, was B.S. Quite frankly, ANYONE who did 8 and didn’t at THAT point realize the El Con scam just isn’t that bright of a person. I mean El Con stated the E.P., which would have been completely world shattering if true, and NOTHING of the sort was delivered.
So I have ZERO sympathy for those people if they hung around after that still giving $ to the crime syndicate.
Describes me unfortunately.OT 8 was a joke.
Got nothing out of ot7 either after the first month.
Still volunteered(i was not regged) for l10,11,12.
And I am even trained on the data series.
It is a little bit like the Mormons,a well functioning group with a reasonable amount of smart people who believe the angel Gabriel came and showed one Joseph Smith the Golden Plates.
It is too socially costly for a Mormon to say “this is nonsense.”
It is easier to see what you believe than believe what you see.
Actually, the angel’s name was Moroni and having been a Mormon for thirty years I know by prayer and testimony that it is not nonsense. And that is not Kool-aid drinking on my part. You can believe whatever you like, Xenu’s Son, but the truth of Mormonism is known by faith and prayer. And, yes, I have read all that stuff about how science refutes the Book Of Mormon and so forth but I get my data from a higher source. And that is not drinking any Kool-aid.
Someone might have said… “Actually, the being’s name was Xenu and having been a Scientologist for thirty years I know by observation and experience that it is not nonsense. And that is not Kool-aid drinking on my part. You can believe whatever you like, but the truth of Scientology is known by auditing and training. And, yes, I have read all that stuff about how science refutes Dianetics, OTIII and so forth but I have a higher degree of knowingness. And that is not drinking any Kool-aid.”
Okay. Fine. I say no more.
It was the angel Moroni who showed Joseph Smith the golden Moronic Plates.
Written in reformed Egyption…
I’m so sorry. OT VII drove me insane.
I hope you get your sanity back, SFN.
did you do it?
Yes…whatever the hell you’re taking about.
My reply was directed to the OP -Mike Wynski – talking about OT VIII. i asked him if he did the level. There are so many replies it gets tricky as to what is an answer to what!
He seems a bit harsh about not having sympathy for people staying in after OT VIII.
I can’t blame anyone and I have sympathy for them all. For most of my time in, not in a million years would I have said I’d ever be out.
The only apt description I’ve seen or thought is that it’s the Matrix.
In is in, and out is out. Can’t tell and ‘In’ a bloody thing.
No worries! But…I did do it and I’m very sorry…
You goof. I did it and I’m not sorry at all.
Mike Wynski, I know OT VIIs who STILL act as though they are superior. Sorry to sound so spiteful about it. But I know quite a few. They’re still carrying on with auditing in an Indie group, to boot.
I don’t know HOW to think about them. Fortunately, I don’t ever see them anymore.
Hi Dawn, considering that ANYONE (especially by now) doing OT levels KNOWS that they have gained ZERO abilities above the average WOG, they are walking around probably wondering if anyone else (who isn’t doing OT levels) has figured out that they are living a lie. They probably act that way in order try to make people think that they are something “special”.
Funny because in a way, they ARE something “special”. LOL
Oh lord, if I have to hear just one more time about how superior OT VIII is, and how it lifts one above and beyond everyone else, how very very few people at this awareness exits, how it’s so difficult because no one else has this awareness, how it changes everything and no one else can know…
I
just
may
commit
homicide.
some days…it’s all I can do to not vomit.
Baghdad Bob works at Flag ! An Iraq scum to cream
success story. David Miscavige got a Gold Mine of PR
with Saddams secret weapon of the airwaves.
“And finally, if anyone needed tangible evidence that OT IX & X are just scented plastic carrots being dangled in front of the OT VIII donkeys who need something to keep them giving with the promise/hope they will achieve the amazing results they were expecting on each of the previous levels — this history should leave no doubt.”
Brilliant, Mike.
Those who start to look will doubt and eventually break free. The remaining handful of minions will continue to believe with every fiber of their being.
So glad to see so many others escaping the bubble and getting on with living a real life.
Mike Mike Mike You don’t understand.
It took miscavige 20 years to weed out the bad eggs (I think they are on the cover of Freedom Mag, Posse of Lunatics edition) who were messing up the tech with squirrel shit. Then dave channeled LRH and put in His true, for-real-this-time standard tech exactly precisely correctly. It’s only now that everyone can get the real deal super duper scooper powers that LRH intended. Thank Gawd for david miscavige; what would the church of scientology done without him.
Error: After “real deal super duper” you left out “pooper”.
I stand corrected.
I generally sit corrected….
I’m glad I wasn’t the only one to spot the missing “pooper”
Sans all the semicolons …
(sarcasm) Perhaps if Hubbard were to come back and route in he should be RPF’ed by Miscavige for writing his science fiction instead of going back through all his written Scientology texts and fixing all the errors. In the very least “that Hubbard guy” should be in “lowers” for leaving Scientology (as a subject) in such bad condition that Miscavige had to set everything right. No wonder OT 9 & 10 don’t exist! Hubbard was goofing the floof. All these prerequisites exists solely for the three B’s. To keep people Busy Buying and Believing. Gotta hand it to Miscavige. He kept the cash register ringing decades after Hubbard died….ahem…moved on to Target Two.
?
You’re right, Mary! Bless his little coal black, shriveled up heart….(puke)
???
These should be printed and distributed to current members to demonstrate the truth of the lie, the entheta of theta, and to bring the cognitive dissonance front and center where it might do some good.
thank you. This is pretty much what I was thinking. Surely things can be done with this. 🙂
I fear that would bring cognitive dissonance to the cognitive dissonance.
My dissonance is certainly cognitive…..
Well if Scions don’t believe two wrongs make a right than no one does.