Episode 0 (Introduction) is now available to download on iHeart and everywhere else podcasts are available.
You can even google it directly.
Unfortunately, the website that was going to accompany the podcast has been hacked and sabotaged. Should be fixed in the next few hours and as soon as it is live I will update with the link here.
Update: Site is now live. It is simply a resource for documents and will be updated as each podcast goes live on Tuesdays.
Meanwhile, for those who are looking for the documents that are talked about in this episode, I have included them below.
Leah and I are interested in your feedback. We will read the comments on the podcast sites where they are allowed as much as we can, but there are a lot of them to get to, so if you have some thoughts about the content, format or future episodes you would like to hear, we would love to hear from you here.
Here are the documents — and for a more in-depth look at them, read Dealing with Critics of Scientology: the L. Ron Hubbard Playbook:
The Fair Game Policy Letter
“May be deprived of property or injured… May be tricked, sue or lied to or destroyed.”
Fair Game “Cancellation”
The term isn’t to be used any longer as it causes “bad public relations” — but the treatment of SP’s (enemies) is NOT canceled.
Ethics Order “Racket Exposed”
These people are “Enemies of mankind, the planet and all life” (for distributing Hubbard writings that he did not authorize).
Process R2-45 is to be used (shoot them in the head with a .45 caliber revolver).
“Critics of Scientology”
Anyone who criticizes scientology is a criminal with “embezzled funds, moral lapses, a thirst for young boys – sordid stuff.”
“Discuss his or her crimes, known and unknown. And act completely confident those crimes exist. Because they do.”
Is there any way to get someone from the FBI on the podcast to talk about what can be done to combat and/or shut down this horrible cult?
hi! love the podcast! you and leah are too cute!! i’m watching the netflix eps (thought i’d already seen these but turns out only the ones on a&e are the ones i saw).
with every recounting of these horrible stories i just get more and more disgusted with the sham of a religion. i have a couple of questions…
the hole…thats kidnapping. why haven’t reports been filed with the FBI? telling them is one thing but filing is another. its a thing that happened to you and there were witnesses. there must be people coming out recently…have they been encouraged to take legal action? like the #metoo movement the more people that file legal complaints even tho they are possibly over the statute of limitation it will go to them HAVING to go into Hemet and collecting evidence. the websites could be classed as slander, because they cant prove those things are true with evidence.
then there’s the CA labor laws that are very strict in how they define what and how people can work and that they have to be paid. every person that comes out of the org in CA needs to file a claim with the labor division (one office is in dtla on 3rd st and one is in van nuys on van nuys blvd). they WILL go after employers for that money, and make no mistake. no 501c3 is going to cover human slavery. they cant get away with an 80 hour work week with a “$50 stipend”. so use them as a tool.
also in LA – if people are standing in the street with video cameras (doing the fair gaming) they need a permit to do so. they cant obstruct traffic, they have to have insurance etc. so you call the LAPD film division to report them. for this purpose they would also need you to sign a release since they are being paid to follow and capture a persons image. them taking video isnt for “personal use only”. LAPD can confiscate their gears, their transpo, issue them tickets, issue who hired them tickets.
just some useful tips as i know you guys are helping people when they come out. also someone like Lisa Bloom or Gloria Alredd would be interested in representing victims since the “church” has so much money.
thank you for all you guys do! you both are angels! <3
Hi Leah and Mike. I am British and live and work in France and listen to the podcast while working and I am fully immersed in your world now you have left. Your guests over the last few episodes have spoken so well that I really am starting to understand the reason why people join these horrendous cults .I always used to be of the opinion as to why didn’t they just leave or call the cops but it is much deeper and harder than that but I do have a couple of questions to ask. Firstly has anyone tried to infiltrate Scientology to expose the abuse and theft of money etc with the use of covert cameras and recording devices etc and secondly I really think that the tax exempt Status of the “church” is the biggest hurdle to completely ruining the cult and so do you know of any senators or public figures that we can petition to help get status removed.
“Desperately seeking Shelley”
A small little podcast I came across.. informative if anyone would like to check it out. I’m all caught up on Leah and Mikes podcast so I’m getting curious and seeking information.
I am just watching the aftermath on Netflix. I am astonished. I was in a cult myself for 26 years and it took me 3 years to be able to get out. I just wanted to show my support and I think you and Leah, who I first got to know about through the series, are doing an amazing job exposing this evil cult which had spread so much devastation and destruction over the years. When I was visiting New York I walked down Manhattan and the church of Scientology was right across a theater that was showing Hamilton. As a curiosity I dragged my daughter and say; look that’s that Scientology church.. let’s check it out. We did the personality check, of course my daughter said, mom, let us not waist out time.. we could be in danger by now, but for some reason a red flag went off and we knew it was a scam.. are you finding a legal way to stop this non sense for good?
Glad you didnt fall for it!
So thrilled to have found your podcast. My question is how is the cult explaining the Covid pandemic?
Hey there you guys! Loved the show and loving the pod cast! 2 questions for you guys!
I’m currently watching the money episode of the A&E show where it was revealed that there are billions sitting unused on Parishioners accounts. Knowing that they barely pay anything to or for sea org members I did wonder, do auditors get paid? Are they a typical sea org member? And also when they buy up real estate, do they pay outright or do they owe mortgages all over the world? Why the constant demand for more money? Who gets it I guess is where my mind goes? Or is it all just appearances? So crazy to me!!!
Also…you mentioned in episode 1 of the podcast mentioned Marty Rathbun but didn’t circle back to it. What’s the deal with him?
Keep kicking ass you guys! Leah, I’m sharing your book with everyone!
Excellent podcast. Glad that you guys aren’t letting up on them and are continuing your efforts to wake the world up. I am wondering if you have had a chance to watch the documentary “My Scientology Movie” on Netflix. It’s quite intriguing and I think it would make for an interesting discussion on a future episode of the podcast. Keep up the good work!
I loved the show, and I now love the podcast. Dont worry about cadence, it sounds like a conversation. Not a script. Already following both of you and the podcast! ❤❤❤
Hi Mike,
I just tried going to your website and it’s still showing this site as being hacked.
Are you using Chrome, IE, Safari, Firefox?
You might want to clear your caches…
Plenty of people are not having any problem.
Used a different browser. Thanks for the help!
Hi Guys – All the way from South Africa.
I watched the series when it was on an now I’m following the podcast. I’m not a Scientologist and dont know anyone who is, but I’ve always been interested in trying to understand cults.
I love this podcast, I will you been able to say what you mean and not be censored. I do agree with a previous post that said “fair gaming” should be called what it is – terrorism. It is quite beyond me that this is allowed to happen in the USA, a country that the rest of the world looks to as a supposed shining example of justice.
Good luck guys, I hope you dig deep and shine a very bight light on all the grimy dirt hidden. At the moment there is just so much disgusting behavior coming to light, it’s pretty disheartening.
Best wishes
I personally loved this podcast, and despite Leah’s protesting to the contrary, you all did an excellent job. It’s a skill like any other; you learn how to focus and narrow your topics within the time allotted for the recording.
Perhaps my one “complaint” is that Leah has a tendency to talk over you. And that’s just Leah, and I love Leah. But sometimes she’ll go to finish a sentence which won’t be entirely what you were trying to say and either stop your train of thought or force you to go back and make that point separately.
Also, maybe it’s just because I grew up watching King of Queens, but she doesn’t have a weird accent. Neither of you do. I could listen to you two talk about the groceries you bought last week, every week. But before you get any ideas…I’m glad it’s about Scientology instead.
Look forward to how this progresses, and I really hope this is a thing for the longhaul, even if the production schedule eventually changes (once a week is a lot for a podcast). It’s pretty much my preferred medium.
It’s time to get our language straight here.
‘Fair Game’ and ‘Fair Gaming’ needs to now be referred to as what it actually is; terrorism.
It’s time to stop saying, “OSA Fair Gamed Bixler by xyz.” Scientology terrorizes people it deems enemies. Saying they Fair Gamed them lets them off the hook. It is a terrorist policy which includes murder as an option.
Understand how the PR game is won and lost in this regard.
Hi Mike,
Love the podcast with you and Leah. I think the personal interchange is so great and leads to comments that just come out as the come out! The best.
Forgive me if this has already been mentioned and I missed it, but, how often will these podcasts be airing? Weekly? Randomly?
Also, I would love to hear more of the personal experiences that you and Leah went through that made you question your “dedication”.
We have all had those and, for me, I love to hear the personal experiences in relation to the overall issue of abuse of the cherch that is presented. Thank you!
The podcasts are scheduled to be weekly, every Tuesday (midnight from that Monday, actually). iHeart releases new episodes at midnight for whatever reason.
Thank you!
I am interested in hearing about John Travolta and his wife, and how much you and Leah think he might leave Scientology and other details like how much Scientology has been up his ass since his wife died.
Also, what’s up with the Aftermath cards, are there any good stories of people who have been former Scientologists that found the cards sitting in a public area somewhere and contacted you?
Me too!!! I am really interested in this topic!
me three! i work in the film industry and have heard things from credible people….
Hi Mike,
I would like to hear you and Leah do a segment on all things Marty Rathbun. I read that he has possibly gone back to Scientology, a reality that’s consistent with his criticism of your Aftermath show and with his regret for participating in My Scientology Movie. Thanks, Mike.
The term ‘Fair Game’ has its roots in the hunting of wild animals in America.
Game is any wild animal hunted for sport or food.
‘Fair Game’ (related to ‘Fair Chase’) is any wild animal considered ethically permissible to kill, within the value system of ‘Fair Chase’.
To bring this home, Hubbard equated his perceived enemies as wild animals permissible to be killed; not only considering their destruction ethical, but obligatory.
When I go to the fairgame site Firefox says this:
… “Firefox does not trust this site because it uses a certificate that is not valid for fairgamepodcast.com. The certificate is only valid for the following names: dock.shp.mcafee.com, *.dock.shp.mcafee.com
Error code: SSL_ERROR_BAD_CERT_DOMAIN”
Unless I override Forefox security it won’t open the site. Someone messed with your credentials
Thanks — I know this was resolved on Google Chrome and IE. Was not aware it was still an issue on Firefox. Will get it looked into. Thanks for the alert.
Apparently this is generated from a misbehaving McAfee security product on your computer (the names the certificate is valid for in that message belong to mcafee.com). Not showing up for anyone else.
Nope. I’m running a clean install of Linux (no security s/w) Firefox is rejecting your server credentials. The message wasn’t from the PC but from Firefox. Firefox uses mcafee’s site advisor service on the backend. (in the cloud). In this case when I went to the site the browser goes to the Firefox server which holds the data from McAfee’s Site Advisor Server. Which rejected your websites credentials. Has nothing to do with the PC viewing the site.
Hi Mike – I thoroughly enjoyed your first podcast. I like the natural conversation between you and Leah. Leah can’t tame her passion and that’s what we love about her. Her NY attitude and mouth comes across loud and clear, gotta love it. In contrast to your calmness, this is perfect. You explain very well the inside insanity of this cult for those never-in.
Moving forward I would like to hear those people who didn’t make it on the show tell their stories. Oh, yeah, the audio was great. I could hear you both perfectly. Sometimes with other podcasts the audio is too low or muffled but yours was perfect, keep that up.
My two cents worth. Keep on going.
Although it sure wasn’t a funny topic I had to laugh at times and give a thumbs up to Leah’s passion and Mike’s calm response. They do compliment each other in so many ways. The Fair Gaming is something that I would think that many people who never even thought about scientology could identify with on some level. The extent that the cult goes to is just horrifying though. Criminal to say the least.
Great first episode! Since The Aftermath ended, this is a great way to keep people engaged in the cause.
Regarding some of the earlier remarks, it may take a few episodes to develop your rhythm. I’m okay with Leah’s passion as it is why we love her, A little digression doesn’t hurt as it is a podcast with real people, not a news broadcast. I am a never-in and know other never-ins who follow you. Just remember that we are not familiar with many terms in Scientology speak so a brief clarification periodically is helpful.
Excellent job you two! Thank you both, Leah and Mike, for your time and ongoing efforts to bring the co$’s abuses and criminal activities to a wide audience. I’m a never in but I’ve learned a lot from Leah and Mike’s show ‘Aftermath’, all 3 seasons. I wanted to suggest a few topics of interest that I would like to hear specifically on the podcast. Just ideas;
*Disconnection ; the written policy that continues today and the damage it does.
*STAND; Results and damages done. Ed Parkins, his behavior,etc.(including thought processes caused by co$.). Tom Cruise jumping on couches and his famous turtle neck rant. Lol.
*Illegal activities against the US government.(including Snow White;Mary Sue Hubbard and several other members being prosecuted and going to prison for those crimes). Mary Sue Hubbard’s banishment from the organisation after her release from prison. Paulette Cooper’s story.
*co$’s Front groups; (ABC mouse, Way to happiness,etc.)that not only hide their evil intent but benefits financially for the group.
*Children born into co$; Including aspects of children being brought in at young ages.(Leah, at age 8(?),Mike at age 5. The adults in their lives got involved, which pulled the kids into the group too.
*Good and bad Public Relations; the importance concerning both aspects and the effects to co$.
*Follow up on former guests from the show; Mary Kahn, Aaron Smith-Levin, Marc and Claire Headley, Ron Miscavage and his wife, Jefferson Hawkins, etc., etc.. Everyone/Anyone who wants to partake in the podcast. ( We’d love to hear from them all!).
* Shelly Miscavage; Had they brought her front and center at the very mention of her disappearance I may have had reservations about their ulterior motives.
*Lisa McPherson; because she’s important and relevant.
Keep up the good work. I’m looking forward to the next podcasts. *Leah, keep dropping the ‘F’ bombs! It adds character to the show.Lol
Never in?
Bloody hell, good job.
Thank you! After watching Leah and Mike’s show(all 3 seasons) I proceeded to read several books and listen to a ton of podcasts too. It really opened my eyes.
I wanted to add a couple of other important topics;
*Danny Masterson’s trial(for raping 3 women.)
*The trial of Hanan and Rizza Islam(for cleverly ripping off Medicaid of $380,000 using high school students as a ploy).
*Valerie Haney(The brave slave to david miscavage) who escaped in the trunk of a strangers car.
There’s a load of interesting topics. No shortage of valuable, truthful podcasts.
An episode about the PI’s they hire and how much of that tax free money is used on them as well. We know they wasted 10 million or something tracking down Pat Broker.
I was wondering about the podcast website. But you said in the post it was hacked. Unbelievable. Look I love you and Leah so much. Leah has a wonderful voice and I can’t wait for next week. My heart goes out to you and everyone that has been though such atrocities because of scientology. I guess i am an enemy now… I would love to hear how someone who is just now learning about this cult, can help you guys and others. I want to do something but don’t know what to do. Keep fighting! I support you however I can.
I was just looking at something that TUB wrote and it struck me as incredibly infantile and stupid.
He said words to the effect that ANYONE who did certain things are considered enemies and he recommends those people are treated in a very heavy handed manner.
But consider some native tribes people who have never gotten any education and never learned any language. How can it be OK to do harm to these people based on some peculiar definition of right and wrong that they cannot possibly understand.
Surely this is all some stupid scam to have people feel good about hatred and the bottom line … OF COURSE … is that it’s all designed to have people with money get separated from that money and have it move into the pockets of whoever is sufficiently devious to cheat all the others out of getting any of that money for themselves. Doesn’t that sound just like the philosophy that lies at the heart of this crooked scam? Dirty rotten cheating fuckers!
Doesn’t that sound like a perfect description of some little rat we all know and despise? Here is a hint!
He has the same initials as the Donkey Punch Dork.
That was always one of my arguments for the ‘Clearing’ the planet BS. What about the indigenous tribes in the Amazon, Africa, Oz or Nunavut? How are you going to ‘clear’ them? Their monetary system is very different than ours and just as important. I never got an answer. Always a tap dance about making the ‘able more able’ i.e. making people who had no ability to make cash money more ‘able’ to make cash money then hand said money over to COS. Of course indigenous people want nothing to do with COS but it was always an argument I tried to make especially as an opening to try to wake someone up. I’ve always found that the quiet placing of doubt into the minds of those trapped works much better than shouting about ‘Zenu’ etc. Establish critical thinking and hope it takes off.
Like Ron Miscavage told Karen de la Carriere during a podcast several months ago,, “the co$ can’t clear the planet, they can’t even clear a fucking cul de sac”. Lol
I can confirm that Scientology is still watching me after 5 years. When I moved, I had a private investigator call and pretend to be a employer looking to hire me. I didn’t post my resume out on any site, nor my phone number. It was a cover to ask questions. He asked a few questions to try to figure out my new area code / phone number and when I was moving. I told no one that I was moving. They track you for life, like a criminal gang makes its members sign for life. Any major life change, like relocation, and they will be sniffing around.
Not only that, but I re-enabled an old email address. They send an email daily to check if this email is still in use. Not only that, but I believe they cracked my wifi and captured the data to gain all this personal information (emails, phone, address, etc). There is no other way they would have gotten some of this personal information, as it is new and not shared. #EndFairGame
I wonder if the spying and PIs could be construed as spying. I used to have a secret clearance when I was just out of college, and now Scientology is fair gaming me for life? Looks suspicious to me.
So glad you two are back.
I enjoyed episode ‘0’. Good series lid-lifter. In time you’ll both find your cadence/style delivering an audio format. I would say since you’ll attract new listeners who are foreign to this topic, make sure to include a glossary of terms on the accompanying website and mention the website EVERY episode.
The contrasting delivery between the both of you is great. Please DON’T try to be something you’re not. Podcasts are supposed to be organic, continue to be yourselves.
Episode 0 appears to be more of a primer….
When each episode’s specific topic comes around, try not to divert away from topic too much.
-Best
O/T. The Final Call, the official newspaper of the Nation of Islam, has a front-page story entitled, “The Synagogue of Satan and Destroying the Right to ‘Free Speech.'” Scientologists promoting the story so far include:
Church of Scientology Dianetics Auditor of the Year and Scientology Classed Auditor-in-Training Nation of Islam Sister Charlene Muhammad:
https://exscn2.net/threads/church-of-scientology-dianetics-auditor-of-the-year-nation-of-islam-sister-charlene-muhammad-tweets-about-powerful-satanic-jews-and-imposter-jews.1626/post-47285
“Highly Commended” Scientology Field Staff Member Nation of Islam Sister Renata Muhammad:
https://exscn2.net/threads/scientology-field-staff-member-and-scientology-commendation-winner-nation-of-islam-sister-renata-muhammad-attacks-imposter-jews.1574/post-47279
/
That’s not the worst of it. Found this article: https://townhall.com/columnists/marinamedvin/2020/07/20/taxpayers-have-been-sponsoring-farrakhans-nation-of-islam-for-decades-n2572720
Scientology is paying “Field Staff Member” commissions to these guys and the federal government is also bankrolling them. Can’t find out whether they are also getting PPP but since Scientology is, they are probably also on the gravy train.
Hi Leah & Mike –
We in my family were/are big fans of your tv show, and now great job on the first podcast! You should know that you are having a great impact on us non-scientologists; not only is it important to learn about (just as it was important for non-Catholics to learn about the priest scandals), but I think it really helps give critical insight on how to spot cults in general, and abuse in particular. You are empowering people to speak out who may otherwise feel alone in their suffering or guilt or confusion, and maybe even to escape from abusers. That’s a big effing deal.
I am not a podcast person. My brain does better with visual media, and even that can be a challenge. But I was excited to hear about this, missing your show and your faces, so yours is just the second podcast I’ve ever listened to in its entirety. I still miss your faces though! Hopefully you can find a way to incorporate some video once in a while.
At this point I can’t give you any suggestions for topics, since I don’t have any scientology background to draw from (just that my sci-fi loving dad once read a LRH book, and I remember an enticing “psychology test” booth in the mall where I grew up). I’m glad you both explain some terminology & procedures that people like me aren’t familiar with at all. As a technical thing, your voices come across great, clear & lovely on my otherwise crappy laptop with awful speakers.
I’m glad you’re doing this, and I hope momentum continues to grow, in spite of all the government chaos and COVID disaster and our newest iteration of fighting for equality & civil rights. It may be more important than ever now to keep your fight going to get all this out into the open. There is suffering happening to many people on a daily basis that goes unnoticed as the enormity of other news crowds it out. Keep going, keep on it, keep shining your bright lights on it.
Now I can go from saying I don’t listen to podcasts to “I only listen to ONE podcast.”
Cheers to you both, and thank you again & again.
Very good!
You and Leah are a good balance – she being the cussing, screamer and you being the calm steady one. I guess Angelo will be glad when the church is stopped, loses its 501c3, is held accountable…; then he can find out where the forks are. 🙂 Very funny.
Leah’s rawness is what I really love about her. It comes from passion, and that’s why she is an appropriate person to take on Scientology. Mike is a good foil. It’s amazing how well these two mesh!
All efforts must be made to get the 501(c)(3) rescinded. This will be the death knell of this criminal organization.
Absolutely needed Tim but don’t delude yourself into thinking that will kill the virus. It WILL harm it but before it was legal to write off dono’s the Church had more adherents. It WILL help but only broad education (like what Mike & Leah are doing and people publishing all those great books) kill kill it.
I used to feel the same way – that the IRS decision allowing them to operate tax-free was keeping the cult alive. But now they have so many assets, so many whales, and so much money stashed away that they could weather any normal storm, or even this pandemic, at least for awhile.
I see that the Christian Science Monitor is still publishing decades after Mary Baker Eddy was known to be pushing a science-free type of ‘healing’, and they are reduced to a few ‘reading rooms’ in major cities. Is that the future of Scientology? A few reading rooms and a news organization? I doubt it – first because the CS Monitor reports genuine news, unlike the COS which by ecclesiastical order is not allowed to tell the truth if it possibly could show LRH in a bad light, and second because they want to sell you their literature, not allow you to read it for free in the comfort of a well-padded chair, arranged for privacy, and in an air-conditioned reading room.
I am concerned that you guys (especially Mike) are not getting paid for the podcast as you did for the TV show. I know it takes a lot of time and energy.
I am shocked! Shocked I tell you.
Never in my whole track scouting and hobnobbing with the creamora de-creama since before time began to be gone have I seen the level of absurdity of this out-of-context use and abuse of things i may , or not, have lightly suggested at one time or another. So, remove those misuses of religious rites, knock it off and stick with an appropriate shore story. Honestly it’s not that hard. KSW! Don’t make me come back and pull your missed-missed-missed-missed withholds.
And while I’m at it: Dear Compton Curtis, LRH 2.0, you may have the name but you don’t have the game.
ML LRH
Target 2
Telex via cloud#2, Version 1.1
7. Any Sea Org member contacting any of them is to use Auditing Process R2-45!!!
Now that sounds like fun!
OSD. I have still to understand this stuff even if I have been in the SO.
Looks like a process where you meet the SP and you apply this process and he explodes.
Bunch of theta-heads they had more court cases that any other group on history. Why they don’t stop and check what’s wrong with them.
Fair game isn’t a tech. It is just crazy stuff. A bottle of good wine or two with friends is more workable than any other crap tech.
Did someone mention wine? Wonderful wine? Wine that costs $90?
Hey, LMR!!! Let’s go out and ‘wine’ a bit.
OSD. Come to Italy. Good wine wouldn’t cost absolutely that much, and as my uncle used to say, gather a few good friends and after two glasses the quality of the wine lose its importance but the moment takes importance.
“RJ-45” means literally shooting someone with a .45 gun. I guess it was supposed to be tongue-in-cheek, but as he said it, it probably started to appeal to Hubbard. It’s unhinged, and it did bother me when I first read it in my studies.
Imaberrated. Nice to read you. Thanks a lot. Got it now. This is why it says powerful process to get someone exteriorized (forever). Damn.
Great start! I’ve been interested in all this stuff since “Going Clear.”. Keep up the good work. Let’s close this torture chamber down. Proud of you both.
Loved the maiden episode.
Both your voices and viewpoints are refreshing.
I look forward to more information about how OSA handles flaps.
Keep this up.
No person, business, local, state or Federal Government is safe from $ci fair game tactics. The list that has been and is still being fair gamed is endless. The money $ci has spent fair gaming has to be astounding.
Mike,
If Angie’s on the Freewinds, then would there be a person on the Freewinds, either RTC, CMO or the OSA person on the Freewinds, who knows that Angie CANNOT come back to the USA for X amount of time?
There will be orders to NOT allow her back.
Someone who is “handling” and chaperoning Angie, there will be orders to them, to NOT allow Angie back to the US and not to California.
But, a wide world “watch” by outside concerned citizens COULD be drummed up, and there is ample knowledge that Angie is right now missing.
A concerned citizens worldwide watch for Angie, could be done.
The people where the Freewinds sails, could be informed, those ports.
There are people worldwide who would help watch for Angie.
Angie’s parents and California friends and family will know!
A lot could be done to find Angie and get her to talk to LA prosecutors!!!!
Great start to the podcasts. A couple of points, for whatever they’re worth:
1. I hate to say it, but there seemed to be a lot of digressions from the topic at hand on Leah’s part during the discussion. Focus is needed, or those who don’t follow $cientology on a regular basis will drift away from listening.
2. I’ve heard a lot worse during my 20+ years in the military, but Leah really needs to work on getting the cussing under control. Groucho Marx said something on “Your Bet Your LIfe” back when I was a kid that’s stuck with me all this time, “If you speak when angry, you’ll make the best speech you’ll ever regret.”
Again, people not already familiar with the situation regarding $cientology are going to focus on the cussing instead of the message and tune out. Better to focus the anger on $cientology instead of wasting it on verbal outbursts.
3. Focus, focus, focus. Minimize the video and just listen to some of Chris Shelton’s videos. He’s really good at dissecting $cientology like a frog and at the same time staying focused on the topic at hand during a particular discussion.
4. For some topics at least, you might consider using a staight ‘Question/Answer’ format relating to a particular issue regarding $cientology. That might help maintain the focus on the topic being discussed, without as many digressions. Especially if the questions could be prepared ahead of time.
Again, as a long time critic of $cientology, I thought this was a great start. It’s just while I was listening, I kept thinking, what would someone who just considers $cientology, “Another fad for Hollywood types.”, thinkk about this?
I see your points but in this day and age, why buy into others biases?
I hope Leah and Mike don’t.
They were both refreshing because they are not like everybody else.
Biases instilled while in Scientology 33 years was the 1st unhealthy habit I had to work to overcome.
There are 100s! (long comm lag, gay, downtone, god etc.)
I’m working on the god one now.
I don’t believe I’m “buying into others biases”. I’ve been fighting $cientology for a long time, but I am also a “never-in” who’s trying to look at this from the perspective of other’s who’ve barely heard of $cientology.
They are the people who need to be brought into the fight if things are ever going to change. And they need to hear a clear and focused message if that’s going to happen. Yes, listening to Leah go off on $cientology is fun. And exes and long time critics can follow the off topic digressions. But both are things that will cause the average person listening to drift away. And that’s counter productive to what the podcasts are trying to accomplish.
The plain truth is, there aren’t enough existing critics to grab the attention of Congress regarding $cientology. We need the public to understand the menace $cientology represents and get on board with fighting them.
Yes, Pick, I see what you mean. I’m not a never-in so possiably dont see your view. Thank you for the help bringing scientology into the light 😘
As another never-in who gave a far less constructive and more conversational review of the podcast, trying to hit similar points, I agree with Pick.
I only started my personal crusade about a month ago after powering through Aftermath. I went very quickly from “that quirky Hollywood religion with a penchant for lawsuits” to “oh my god, how is this going on?” Now you could pretty much talk to me in Hubbardese and I’d be nigh fluent (always wanted to learn another language, but not like this!) but that comes with a lot of research.
I’m not your typical never-in. Someone like my mom sees the show and then gets all her information from it. I powered through Aftermath while reading various news articles, picked up Underground Bunker and this blog for a daily read, did the deep dive into Going Clear and then watched the documentary, and also took to wikileaks for the rest. I have a copy of “The Bare Faced Messiah” sitting on my desk waiting to be read. I know way more than I did a month ago, but I’m a librarian; research is what I do.
When I listened to the episode I was doing so from the perspective that I already knew who Mike and Leah were, had seen their show, and knew the topic. But if they hope to reach a wider audience, they are going to have to have an introductory phase. Maybe even just a few primer episodes where they break the basics down for people unfamiliar (or a segment where they review these topics).
If you weren’t already familiar with the church it would be incredibly easy to lose track of all the terminology like Freedom Magazine, “sec checks”, Freewinds, Sea Org, etc. Scientology is a giant machine with a lot of moving parts that can be hard to keep track of.
Thanks for your thoughts. I agree.
It’s a fine line to walk between boring the millions of fans of the Aftermath telling them things they already know, and going over the head of newcomers.
I have made a short glossary that I put on the podcast website (fairgamepodcast.com) to try to help solve this dilemma.
Wow, so many wogs that give a shit.
Thank you.
Pick –
I agree on those points. For me, it was like listening to 2 old friends and I loved it. But when I listened a 2nd time and had my hubby listen a bit (& he LOVES Leah – she’s a definite longtime crush) he said the interrupting and digressions made it a bit confusing to him and that’s when he’d pause and ask questions.
I actually think something like Ep 0 will be ok as time goes on, as new listeners will have “caught up” on some of the things we all know about the scam, but for new listeners I think at least the first few should be something of a primer so those tuning in from the show and even those who didn’t watch the show because they prefer this format should be kept in mind.
That said – it was GREAT to hear you guys! The way you guys go back and forth – Mike you do a great job of restating, clarifying and then answering… while Leah’s all passion and it IS refreshing in a sense. So many familiar with the subject are so completely frustrated and fed up with the fact nothing has been done (though Danny’s case being pushed forward finally is a huge relief) really resonate with how Leah is feeling and it’s nice that she’s candid and less polished as she was on the show so people really get both your passion behind continuing here!
My first listen was purely, “I’m SO glad they’re back!” But with my husband, once comparison he made (& I had to agree through his eyes) was to Good Day LA I think it is… we used to watch but it got to the point where it was grating having Jillian B interrupt nearly anytime they’d get to a more serious viewpoint and we eventually stopped because we came away feeling almost frustrated afterwards (& I’m obviously a talker… my whole family – me especially/included – as obvious from my verbose writing… tend to debate everything, it gets loud and there’s almost “competition” to get your viewpoint heard. So for me, Leah’s communication style is pure family and “at home.” For hubby who’s the quiet type who’ll open up one-on-one, that tends to be stressful). So I definitely got the reference he made, though I didn’t feel it 1st time through. With him though, I def felt the “let him finish… hold on…” a few times.
But your repartee is SO much of what makes you two so fun and natural to listen to and keeps it fun when things get too heavy. So I wouldn’t want to hear you guys lose that, either. And it was a 1st time out, which is felt like you guys are feeling out the format. And that’s what so many who prefer the podcast format like about it. It’s far less contrived than most media these days, which lends more credibility to what’s being discussed!
SOOO glad you’re back
I agree with with Pick. The discussion is great for those already well-informed.
A topic begins and veers from the original, stated goal, ex. Lisa McPherson travesty. That particular part jumped around, even for me. A newbie would definitely not follow so well.
The PPP is outrageous and Leah is right to call it out. It was an abrupt diversion though. That could be it’s own podcast.
Great opener overall!
Pick AnotherID. Please allow me to say just one thing. I respect your view.
As you say you have never been inside the cult. Personally I have been there for 15 years in the SO and I have dealt with recruitment, money and events that related to these two topics.
One thing I have learned about sales and PR is that the genuine is listened to and sells. People are not stupid and understand when something is artificial or not.
In my opinion Leah is passionate sometime because she has a mission and as an intelligent person she is, she gets also very pissed off at what she has experienced and knows what is going on.
I’m not an easy person to sell anything to, but if she asked to do something I probably wouldn’t have doubts about her intentions and would do it (as well as for Mike). Clean people inside and genuine without compromises . This is what people are looking for.
That’s are the people we need
Oh Bless your heart Pick ❤ sounds like you need a hug and to do some cussing of your own. Some good ole passionate cussing is good for the soul, a release! Brew yourself a cup of Celestial Seasonings Tension Tamer tea, relax and do some good cussing! Caution, this excersize may produce a smile so careful
Mike & Leah, this was great!! You will get more comfortable 😘 Love you both SO MUCH!!
Ditto to all these great points.
The interruptions, unfinished points, and cannon ball zooming away and ricocheting were maddening.
It was fairly understandable, if you’re a seasoned Ex familiar with all the old fights and lies and are fully up to date on all the court cases, and exact details of all the fair gaming.
But you screamed a lot at the end. 🙂
………
Leah, love you, love your energy, but if you want people to be enraged, you have to bring them there, you can’t just whack ’em over the head with YOUR rage. You have a zillion details about the zillion nasty tricks our cult has played, but you guys didn’t actually lay out a basic fair game. You didn’t tell a story.
Don’t supply the emotion. Supply the story and the details, let your audience react, THEN you let loose your rage. Your rage, and how you’re fighting – that’s when the bench clears and we’re tumbling out to back you up.
…. Otherwise I feel like I’m being told what to feel in advance, and I’ll accept that with a Disney flick, but let me decide on the big ones.
Thanks for doing all of this.
ignore me totally. I was in a cult for 40 years. I’m really good at being wrong.
…..
(PS, Mike: VWD Pass)
Leah and Mike…love hearing you. But Pick has some good points. It was a bit rough and wasn’t what I’m used to from you guys. I think you and Leah realize this and that things will smooth out from here.
Calm things down a bit. Sounded a bit salesman like at times. Just chat. If you’re relaxed that will come through. That’s usually the way it is with both you guys. It wasn’t that way last night.
Brilliant references.
The Hubbard writings need to be absorbed and spat back out, authoritatively by academics, and internationally so, in an Oxford or Cambridge University published “anthology” of papers and chapters, exhaustively into the thousands of pages of paperwork and programs that Scientology’s based on Hubbard’s voluminous writings.
“Operation Angie LeClaire”
That OSA program would be gold to send to LA prosecutors.
Mike, is there a wider scope OSA program that exists with the targets you spoke about?
The papertrail can’t all be hidden.
OSA’s got to have all sorts of snippets of paperwork targets the OSA staff simply can’t all hide.
There would also be the paper trail to CREATE ‘evidence’ for the ‘crime’ being leveled against the SP.
The point here is that when no crime can be found then OSA will fabricate one (or many) along with the evidence and plant it so a ‘discovery’ can be made. Nothing new here in the playbook of dirty tricks but Hubbard likes to create the idea that everyone the cherch declares an SP has many crimes to be found.
Of course the biggest one is speaking out about what one has observed!
Yo Dave,
When you sent that dildo into Marty’s wifes workplace did you purchase a new one or send it from yer stash ………..good buddy? Just wonderin!
Truer words were never spoken.
Loved the first podcast! Can’t wait till next weeks episode! Love the energy and passion that you and Leah exude on it! Keep up the great work!
I just found a note about a huge delivery of boxes of McCallan 12, 36 and 72 in the area of Riverside County, California, near San Jacinto; and Hemet.
God knows what happening down there in south California? Some local festival?
L O L !
Chris, shouldn’t that be LOL? Oh well.
Chris. Really a LOL!
Mike and Leah,
Really great show and very funny. I enjoyed it. As I said earlier you guys are transmitting a good energy.
I can’t wait for the next episode.
Someone has hackered the site? Wow! Must be ‘fair games’ desperados!
Fixed and up now…
Mike thanks. That’s good news. I found it.
What did you find?
Hey dude! Oh nothing I just found you haven’t found it yet.
https://fairgamepodcast.com/
If still some problem I come personally to push play.
And you know something, coming personally from you, that’s big. Really big.
OSD. Received. My personal view is the following; be there if needed, be useful as needed, but remember that any moment as you realized it exist is now just leaving, it isn’t needed anymore to think about it.
Zen.
I’m still having trouble, Mike.
Tri7ble with what my friend? Can’t get to the website? Or the podcast? Or something else?
Yep!
Can’t get to the website. Or the podcast. I’m a failure.
What happens when you click on the links in the blog post?
Mike i have sent to OSD the link.
I got it! And we’re listening to it now! Many thanks!!!
Excellent
https://fairgamepodcast.com/
How long will the Loosing keep going?
OSD. The Loosing is done.
ROTFLMFAO!!!
????
Sono italiano. (I am Italian)