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One thing you can be absolutely certain of.
No matter the circumstances, scientology will ALWAYS be asking for money. It is the real Axiom 1 of scientology. Hubbard said it was “Life is basically a static” but that was just an acceptable truth. He really meant to say “Life is basically a source of income.”
When disaster strikes, it is a reason to give money.
When you are unhappy or depressed, it is a reason to give money.
When you are doing well it is a reason to give money.
When psychiatry is succeeding it is a reason to give money.
When psychiatry is failing it is a reason to give money.
The “reasons” to give money are literally endless. And always VITAL. Urgent. Important.
It is interesting to note here that “some” staff even rely on their staff pay to get by… This is from Melbourne “ideal” org. They seem to be a bit “off-source” — staff are supposed to earn a “living wage” and not be distracted by needing any outside income. At least that is what Ron says… So how come ANY staff in this flourishing and prospering ideal org have outside sources of income? Rhetorical question of course. It is impossible to live on the wages of a staff member. They ALL have outside sources of income, even if that is a spouse or parent supporting them.
And some “Breaking News” — Joburg North will still be there? Was this a question? They just decided to stick it out and want the world to know?
But of course, it is very important to pay for your services now because… well, there is no reason. So just say it with an exclamation point.
“Randomity”? Send that woman back to the dictionary to clay-model “randomness”!
Scientology staff should be assigned the condition of Treason for allowing Covid-19 to crash the stats. They need their ethics slammed in!
When my father died and my mother went to Flag as an SO member, I was no longer supported. I was ordered—point blank—by the ED to go on the dole. There was no question. I was Day staff. Most of the Foundation staff had day jobs and weren’t hurting. They were more dilettante.
It was illegal to be on the dole while not actively looking for work, which was the case with us. We already had a job.
We were rarely paid. If a lot of money came in, we would see some, perhaps $50. I remember one time half the staff didn’t want to pay a new staff member who joined during the week of a staff pay, because the money was divided among the staff and our amount would be less. He did get paid, because he was one of us.
Imaberrated, the ED’s order to you is based on a Hubtard policy saying the same thing. Hubtard was a criminal so some of his policy advised criminal actions.
What a great name Xenya has.
“Hi, my name is Xenya, as in baby girl Xenu. As in baby girl Xenu in the OT III story of Xenu earth dumping “body-thetans” all nicely implanted with L. Ron Hubbard’s R6 implants.
As in when you do OT III, IV, V, VI and VII, just remember it was Xenu who dumped all those “body-thetans” onto earth which you are paying to exorcise off yourself.
Think of me, Xenya, little baby girl of Xenu.
You’re welcome.
scientology Axiom 1
OBEY LRH
Axiom 1 Gradient Scale
OBEY LRH
BELIEVE LRH
GIVE LRH MONEY
MAKE LRH MONEY
KILL ALL THOSE GODAMN PSYCHS!!!
“…..and some staff do rely on their staff pay to get by.”
That’s a good one! You couldn’t get by on staff pay living in a tent on Skid Row.
***Didn’t see the comment below until I posted mine. No doubt I must have picked yours up in the Theta Universe!
“…who got away from the scam for a few months & never went back”.
Whoa! I’d be going out of my head screaming you did it!!! You did it!!!
Good comment. They have to live with their parents and be supported by them to be on staff. Or they marry someone who will support them so they can be on staff. No one can support themselves with staff pay, not in the 60 plus years Scn has been around.
I have noticed that some of the orgs are using this crisis as just another way for them to capitalize on book sales and extension courses with “games.” When I was doing extension courses it seemed like there was always some “game” going on.
Example: “Let’s see how many courses you can complete as part of the LRH birthday game!” Followed by “We’ve extended the game! Keep going!” or “Finish your IAS annual donation as part of the LRH Birthday game,” etc.
Now, at least with regards to the who’s Whatsapp group I was in, it’s some sort of stay-at-home game. Oh! And I keep getting emails from Flag and others about the 70th anniversary of Dianetics game. Lot’s of games…all the way to play, always involving spending money and never giving any real prizes. The goal always seemed to be “give more money.”
Reading that Scientology post made me want to make an immediate reply back. I’d like for Xenia to explain why Scientology couldn’t spare a few thousand from their nest egg of Billions. There’s more than enough interesa alone on it to pay the slave wages of Staff during this lockdown and never touch the billions itself. After all David Miscavage lives quite luxuriously on it. While his staff of valets, chefs,chauffeurs and housekeepers continue to work tirelessly for a pittance in wages. Seems Miscavage sacrifices NOTHING in this lifetime of planetary clearance. I just want to shout at Xenya and others by saying “ Wake the F*@k up “ !!!
“…some staff do rely on their staff pay to get by.”
RELY?
RELY on their staff pay to get by?
WHERE, I would like to know.
WHERE on God’s green earth do Scientology’s Class V Org staff “rely” on their STAFF PAY “to get by”.
Where is this even POSSIBLE? Please tell me. Because I want to move to wherever this place is!
I want to live where one can RELY on, say $12-$20 per week to feed, clothe and house oneself!
And here I was thinking I couldn’t afford to retire!
Aqua. Just as an info. To survive with staff pay is impossible. Here why.
The overall income of the week is not fully spendibile. Many items are taken from the top. What remains is called CGI (correct gross income). Out of this CGI you have a 30% is staff pay. Execs get more and so on.
Based on this the question becomes: how much money must the org produce to have a good staff pay?
Answer: a lot! The average amount that they produce in 2/3 months to be done every single week.
Conclusion. They are begging for money. Trying to make just stats on their own members.
Pathetics to the bones.
“….. “some” staff even rely on their staff pay to get by…”
Month or so back, I thought the virus shutdown was grounds to implement the LRH Vol 3 policy that stated the purpose of reserves was to cover staff for a worldwide period of upkeep for one year.
They certainly have accrued enough reserves to over staffs for a few months measly staff pays and Sea Org staffs’ pays.
This must not have registered as a big enough world shutdown crisis, so staffs will suffer even worse.
At least, though, there is the other well known staff reference to utilize govt handouts, social services, and staffs of Ideal Orgs can go on the dole of their states or countries, during this time of shutdown, and if they do that, they will get more money on the dole than their Ideal Org pays.
Sea Org members are already likely covered, their pays are not going to be cut.
And if this all causes staffs to quit Ideal Orgs and Sea Orgs, escaping to local churches, I was informed by Clearwater ministers they will take in escaping Sea Org members, and they can get on the dole there, and also then I recommend escaping staffs contact the Aftermath Fdn,
Dire times cause staffs’ escapes (blows).
……………..
I remember in 1978ish, when I had my first escape/blow thoughts, was when Kerry Gleason decided to lower our 17 bucks a week pay to 5 bucks a week. That went on for two weeks, and people started to really mutiny.
I wondered if the Sea Org at Flag Clearwater was really the right thing I’d chosen, or not. I had joined Flag Service Org in Dec 1975 there in CW.
But when Kerry lowered all Flag’s staff pay to 5 bucks a week, I ought to have blown then, but I hadn’t saved up enough and I unfortunately got married to an Apollo vet, so leaving was complicated, I’d not really planned enough how to get back out, I thought I’d be in Sea Org for life, really. My wife at the time, we long ago divorced, she’s still in, I had been way back in the mindset I’d still be there like her today, but not for me in the end.
(Finally, finally, when I moved up through the ranks in Sea Org, finally got selected to move into ASI in LA, and then got close to the top atmosphere around Miscavige, the craziness and violent atmosphere appeared, my boss got trained at RTC how to product officer, she acted like a maniac, that was enough, really, and I then finally decided this was not for me, and went through the RPF for 7 years and finally routed out in 2003.)
Quit faster! And never join, that’s my advice.
Xenya sounds like a baby girl Xenu, LOL.
Hail Xenu’s “Body-Thetans” exorcism at AOs worldwide and Flag!
OT III, IV, V, VI and VII are all exorcism of good old Xenu’s earth dump of “Body-Thetans” he deposited here on earth to mess with everyone. Not. It’s a scam.
????SOME staff can rely on their staff pay??? That’s new! Even Flag staff, who were essentially salaried, with a fixed weekly income (theoretically) couldn’t rely on getting ANYthing in any particular week. I remember not being able to save even $100 each year for a train ticket home. (And I’m really good at saving, always have been.)
I think that by leaving the choich, I must have found about 100 IQ points based on this post from Petrou. Give the orgs money. That is the solution. How about fix whatever crappy set up that allows this to begin with. OH!! I just remembered, it was created by an administrative genius.
BTW, the GI is only good for pay that week. I guess you need to keep coming up with the bucks Chuck!!
I have only been out now for about three years. Whenever I feel down, or feel blue for any reason, all I have to do is see something like this. I could be broke, passed out in a ditch, living in a war zone, but almost anything would be better than to be so bamboozled by the farce that is scientology.
At one point in my cult tenure, I lived in an apt. with about ten other guys. That made the rent affordable, but I still had to moonlight. My annual income was around $ 2,500, and I had to pay child support, and support myself. Of course I had to moonlight, and the old staff pay system penalized people for moonlighting, and took units away. Makes sense, right???
Back in the early 90’s a girl I was friends with who was on staff at my org went totally broke. She had lived on her credit cards for a year, working full time at the org. Then her credit lines were maxed out. She was really gung ho about being on staff. She got herself some kind of moonlighting job. Between her full time org staff hours and her part time moonlighting job she was working 70 hours a week with no day off. But she was young and strong and very healthy so it was OK with her. As I said, she was very gung ho. Well, guess what? Our org had a Sea Org mission visiting then. A few Missionaires pounced on her “solution”. Gave her a very hard time. Made her VERY wrong for moonlighting. They wrote her up. Ethics cycles. She tried to make them understand that she had to eat and she had to sleep somewhere and pay for food and lodging somewhere somehow. No go. Not an inch did they give. Moonlighting BAD! Off policy, whatever. VERY long story short; she blew staff. After being full time staff for a year and a half, making something like 10 bucks a week, after going broke from having lived off her credit cards, she was now just a terrible thetan because she needed to work. An impossible situation for her. She blew. It was a shame, really. I knew her well. Enthusiastic, energetic, young , hopeful. She had done whatever she could to stay on staff and on post. The Sea Org Missionaires occupying the org at the time drove her away. Insane. Not for nothing did I loathe this group. And I still do.
Oh, and PS: the moonlighting job this girl managed to get for herself so that she could survive and still produce on staff and fulfill her staff contract was a job with a Scientology company, the head of which was in very good standing with the org and Scientology in general. She was to be his admin asst in some capacity. A very understanding boss because HE was a long term Scientologist. The perfect set up for all concerned, really! But, never mind, this was just other-fish-fryin’ TERRIBLE according to those Missionaires! Wrong, wrong wrong; she should NOT have to moonlight; she should have been making ALL her money via her org staff job! Just unreal! Of course, no one on staff was making any money on staff but never mind!
After weeks of getting raked over the ethics coals she finally blew. It was a big loss for HER, btw. She had had a real purpose to be on staff. And she was bright and smart and full of energy. But she blew and then Oh, this was even MORE terrible. Now she was an SP! She never went back to Scientology after that. Years later they tried, several times, to get her back, first to be on staff again, and then, just to be a public. She wouldn’t though. They couldn’t convince her to return in any capacity. She’d been quite young and vulnerable but she was a bright kid and a fast learner and this experience wised her up but good. She told me, back then, “Aqua, they’re CRAZY! I’ll never go back.” I was shocked hearing her say that because I was still in. Boy was she right!
Lots of eggs broken trying to make the omelet that never gets made. All in the name of “clearing” the planet. A planet that will never be cleared, because there is no such thing as a “clear”.
I never heard much in the way of good advice from a sea org member. In fact, the younger they were, the worse it was. As far as living on meager pay, the whole system was a farce. It still is, as I know people that are current staff. Before covid, they weren’t making much, now I’m sure it’s much worse. Exploiting the bamboozled few that could or would join staff. The only way it works is if someone else supports you.
Broken eggs, indeed. This girl was far from being the only valuable being the church lost due to its utter insanity, and yes, the younger these Sea Ogres were the more they seemed mired in magical thinking. The older ones now – they were the more realistic, more understanding. One could talk to them. The young ones were impossible; arrogant and opinionated with NO life experiences; they’d never had a job, never had to pay any bills, had lived in the cult’s bubble their entire lives- and yet the Cl V org staff, which had to juggle ALL of these responsibilities PLUS work full time at the org, were THEIR Juniors! Their “decision” to join Sea Org “qualified” them to tell the rest of us what to do, meanwhile the Cl V org staff juggling all these responsibilities got hell from these children. Just insane! And the principle reason I would never sign a staff contract.
Categorize that tome for what it is. A plea for help. I wonder how much help they will get? After all, they ‘pulled it in’.
Wynski, what makes you think that? I hope you are right.
Just a guess based on me seeing other scamologists over the years who got away from the scam for a few months and never went back.
This just drove me nuts.
All monies paid for services are to go into that person’s account and stay there until it is invoiced out for that service and the service is completed. The money is actually, physically to be accounted for until that time, not just on paper, but THERE. This is an Advance Payment, meaning not to be used for anything until that service has been invoiced and completed. So, this chick saying that staff are not getting paid since no-one can come into the org to do services (I’ve got news for them, this was the same scenario BEFORE Co-Vid 19), and the solution is to pay for your future services is fairly demonstrative that: A. The majority of today’s “scientologists” have not actually studied any scientology. B. The orgs of today are still run to obtain immediate money (as this article plainly shows) instead of using any Financial Planning whatsoever. C. Today’s “scientologists” continue to dig themselves deeper and deeper into the muck that is organizational scientology.
It always bothered me that most scientologists never took the time or effort to actually find out what scientology is, but instead just cherry-picked a quote here, a basic there and then enforced their own misunderstanding of that material on those around them. This was becoming rampant when I left, but it really does seem that now, there is no reason or agreement that one needs to actually study the subject in order to “apply” it.
LRH, Tiny Fists, the Exec Strata – all have much responsibility for the abuses that this cult is now known for. But, the average cherch member has just as much responsibility for blindly following others – to the point of harm to themselves and others – who know even less than they do about the subject they claim is so important to Humanity.
What unbearable, ignorant and arrogant hypocrisy.
I am very pleased to watch while this cherch completely implodes and cannot then continue to harm others in this way.
Well, this is the theory. But in reality, the money is spent LONG before the service is delivered. In every org, if someone demands a repayment for services NOT delivered, which is supposed to be made without question, they do NOT HAVE THE MONEY. They have taken to refusing to return repayments. It is ALL the Garcia’s are asking for in their lawsuit. Monies for which services were NOT delivered.
With no IRS oversight, they don’t have to account for any of the monies. In a normal business, money taken in for things which have not been delivered sits on the balance sheet as a liability. They don’t use balance sheets in scientology. When the money comes in it is spent.
Most orgs have tens of millions in “Undelivered Advanced Payments”. Advanced orgs have hundreds of millions. The FSO is probably in the region of a billion by this time — back in the 90’s it was around 400 million as I recall.
The level of financial malfeasance is hard to wrap your wits around.
Mike, orgs keep it logged and graphed as a liability and the stat is T.A.P. Total Unused Advanced Payments. FSO has never bothered to try to keep that stat under control to my knowledge. Back in the day the only major org that tried and to some degree succeeded with that was AOLA. Mostly because of Mike Silverman, Ivan O. and other person who sometimes posts on here.
Stunning.
Are there no more heroes in government/IRS? It’s a gold star hanging there for the taking.
Mary, IRS has no authority in this area being discussed. Nor any other part of the gov’t.
They’re the ones that granted 501c3. Why no transparency? Why not audit them?
I didn’t say to not audit them. I replied to a SPECIFIC action the church does noting that the activity was NOT actionable by the gov’t. Just because they granted 501 doesn’t then give the IRS powers beyond the law.
That would be like saying that since the DMV gave my a drivers license that they can search my car and person.
WhatWhenAllWho El Con Hubtard does NOT say that the Church cannot spend AP $. In FACT policy states that it MUST be carved up and sent up-lines. Gold gets a % for ALL $ AP’ed or in full for training. Management gets a % of ALL $ taken in, a % goes to building fund acct, etc. I’m afraid you also don’t know Church policy.
My understanding when I put down an AP is that it was not spent until I started, and I thought completed, the service.
Sorry to break the bad news to you Mary.
That money is spent the SAME WEEK it comes in.
Financial planning is done on the Gross Income of the organization (actually Corrected Gross Income which is the total income minus monies paid for books, FSM Commissions paid and any refunds or repayments). The first order of business with the income is to pay the fixed percentages: Money to CSI for its brilliant management. Money to Gold (also CSI) for using the films. Money to Reserves, just for the hell of it. For Advanced Orgs a percentage of the Advanced Tech VSD. Then it is “financial planning” time. And the percentages start with 14% to promotion. etc etc.
Inevitably, even in the FSO, it is a fight as to what money goes where and there are always things that DON’T get funded. Usually staff pay and in the Sea Org medical expenses and food. They are all considered lower priority than sending out tons of useless promo and paying utilities/rent.
In truth, every single scientology organization except CSI, RTC, ASI and CST is massively insolvent. The money in scientology is scooped up and kept at the top. Those organizations are swimming in cash. And they have no obligation to deliver any services…
Mike,
“Medical expenses”?? WHAT “medical expenses”? IIRC, they didn’t HAVE any, as they didn’t use “WOG” institutions; only had one “Medic” who did squat, AFAICT. Looking at it today, all evidence of disease or malfuntioning bodies is merely a pretext to send the person to “ethics” to find out what their OWs were, who they were PTS to. When I was rear-ended and catapulted off of my motorcycle, I felt too guilty (Of what, I never knew) to request any help for the aches and pains resulting from skidding through the gravel in that parking lot.
Wynski –
Not touching advance payments until invoiced out was the Finance Policy I studied while on the OEC at Flag in 1970 (we’re talking pre 1970 policies) when there was no Gold, no ASI, no heavy hierarchy holding their hands out etc. I remember in the early ’70’s ASHO FP trying to actually keep the money untouched, but couldn’t stick to it. It seemed like the concept was a pipe dream. Throughout the years it was surely revised into an entirely different policy.
There was also brief mention of this (handling of APs) on the Briefing Course and on the VIII Course I did way back when LRH was still on the line.
But you’re right as always, Wynski. I don’t know Church policy.
Anyway, that’s my story and I’m sticking to it. Oh, and Mary – I’m sure you were told that your money was held as an AP by the reg.
Nope WWAW. I know ALL the HCO PLs ever written regarding Treas and Finance and none stated that. You are thinking of a non-HCO PL. Hubbard NEVER stopped the flow of $ to management whether WW or the SO
It very well could have been a non-HCO PL issue. You are right.
I recall a policy of holding advance money and not spending it, but I believe it had to do with being accepted as a PC..? It was for dicey public, like psych cases …
“Special income”..? Was that what it was called? It was set aside until the person was accepted, returned to them if they were denied.
Right RVW, “Special income” was for that purpose as it might have to be Repaid. Not to be confused with Refunded.
AP money isn’t “spent”, it’s flowed UPSTREAM to Dwarfenführer’s accounts, where it sits until he finds something he wants to waste it on—such as getting down and personal with the fishes of the Caribbean when the mood strikes, OR for a case of some expensive guzzle —daily (or nightly).
WhatWhenAllWho. I don’t want had more to what Mike answered (as well Wynski).
I have been FBO (flag banking officer) for a while. And I confirm that ALL the money that comes in the org get spent every single week.
Any advance payments get spent too.
All of the 7 divisions of the org is have also the primary duty of producing income. There is a checklist of actions for each division.
The org is build to be a money machine. Each staff knows it and is asked to make money. The public is mainly seen just as an income source.
Hey Loosing My Religion!
Yes, I do know that all the money that comes in the org gets spent every week, and I will add that I believe part of that financial mess that is a scientology org can be traced to that along with the greed at the top.
All I am saying is that there was a policy – however long ago & no later than 1970 – regarding not spending Advanced Payments until the service was invoiced out. I totally agree with what you and Mike are saying and the more important takeaway of this particular article of “Stable Data: Keep Money Flowing into the Org.”
Also, I’m very aware that for just about any policy or technical issue found stating one thing, you can find another that says an entirely different thing. I can show you possibly five different HCOBs and/or tapes where LRH states unequivocally the ONLY reason for an ARCX is (fill in the blank – different each time).
Which brings me back to my point that galled me in the first place: in order to exist in this cherch today, one doesn’t need to study, or heaven forbid, understand the subject for one’s self.
Thanks for hitting me back, LMR. Hope you are doing well now that you are “out,” and that you don’t have nightmares of being an FBO (THAT was a totally thankless post!). I’m glad you found this site.
Dear WWAW. It is me who thank you.
Yes, that reference on the AP I saw it too but I don’t remember exactly. I think it related to a period between the 60s and the early 70s. Before it was more normal to sell a service and then deliver it immediately after. No backlogs.
Then the boost and attention on the GI increased and services that could not deliver immediately began to be regged. IE. Maybe one was receiving auditing and they were regging advance payments for the academy.
The only instance I know when an org doesn’t spend the money is if the public is considered a potential illegal PC or has serious trouble that you suspect could be refunded to, so it goes to a special account.
Thanks again. I am fine (and so I hope for you) and I have a super family. I left 15 years ago and have never regretted it.
I once had to close a checking account at TCF Bank. The person I was talking to was making excuses for not complying with my request. It was only when I told them that I would call the MN Attorney General’s office did they comply. I suppose it did help that the sitting Attorney General was the DFL goon Skip Humphrey, who had a reputation of being one trench coat short of being a proper Soviet thug.
This posting reminds me of the big argument I had with a registrar in about 1986 before I left Scientology. She kept asking for money and finally I said “Don’t you see that you are draining my capital and thus I am prevented from investing in stocks?” She said “No, Scientology ‘s expansion is more important”. She was 100% wrong. If I invested even a small percentage of the donations into the stock market index, I would have had massive returns. So if you Registrar can learn to wait a few years, there will be greater overall prosperity. When I got onto OT VII in 1987, the “in-charge” asked for money and read the standard Hubbard policies. Hubbard basically said all assets are worthless relative to Scientology. Total insanity.
It is Scientology that is worthless and I see that after thirty years out.
Money oriented worship, made of useless people, producing exchange zero in all possible directions and great stat pushers!!!
(with three exclamation points)
Something from an ABBA song comes to mind.
?? Would that song be “Money, Money, Money”???, otherles?
Yes.
When the lock down is all over I think about 50% of the remaining “flock” (aka food source) will have bailed…
Wynski offered up “When the lock down is all over I think about 50% of the remaining “flock” (aka food source) will have bailed…”
One would hope, as so few are left to be shorn by the Regges, so the pressure’s mounting.
Wynski, as they say: “Your mouth to God’s ears”. I can see this happening also.
Won’t any money probably go to pay utilities, or even to send royalties and other funds due “uplines,” anyway – rather than pay staff? Staff are set up to be last in line, so unless org income is fully up to normal (still minimal) they wouldn’t even get whatever pittance they typically do – plus the system setups them up to be blamed for having failed to overcome mere MEST reality like a little planetary bullbait (such a hundred-year pandemic), and thus held undeserving.
Ask not what the church of scientology can do for you, ask what you can do for the church of scientology.
Money is the simple answer.
Mary Kahn said:”Money is the simple answer.”
It’s the only POSSIBLE answer.
$cientology $olutions to the “ups and downs” to life.
Donate money.
It is a solution that has banked the cult BILLIONS of dollars where the leader is the only one who has access to it to spend it as he deems.
Why, exactly, are they not shut down in the US?
Is Scientology some type of experiment the US Govt uses to observe mind control and hypnosis?
I think it is.
Nothing else makes sense.
Scientology destroys people and ruins lives.
At least we are all contributing to exposing what it really is – an EVIL cult to stay away from.
Thank you Mike Rinder, for all you do!! We love you.
David Miscavige is a Monster said:
“Is Scientology some type of experiment the US Govt uses to observe mind control and hypnosis?
“I think it is.
“Nothing else makes sense.”
Correction: NOTHING makes sense. It’s as if the outside society really IS as degraded as Tubby taught and is in league with Dwarfenführer for some reason I can’t determine. My first thought is that the US government (particularly the IRS) is afraid of Davey-Boy starting the long march of lawsuits again