Tony posted this video on his blog on Wednesday:
There are a couple of things I wanted to note about it.
First, Lyle talks about becoming the HAS Chicago back in 1974. I went on Mission to Chicago in January 1976 based on an evaluation by Hubbard “EUS Ups and Downs” and extracted two people from the tiny org to be sent to Flag for executive training. Lyle was one of them.
She says she was staff member #9 in Chicago (that tells you how small the place was in 1974 — there were probably a dozen staff there when I arrived) and she was the second ED (as I recall, the ED was Dave Parker).
Lyle goes on to say she recruited a lot of people and built the org up to 40 people. No doubt she told them this was the most important thing on earth for anyone to do. Even in the good old days, they were proud of 40 staff! They are supposed to have at least 100 to above the “make-break” point.
And then, after x years, she left staff. Apparently it was no longer the most important thing on earth to do. It seems working in some WISE business with dentists is the most important thing for Planetary Clearing now.
But here is the BIG question. Applicable not just to Lyle, but to every scientologist.
If you believe so passionately in the “Ideal Org” program that you are putting out a video telling people to get behind and support it, and they already HAVE their building (so don’t need money, just staff to cover at least one for each room) — why aren’t YOU joining back up on staff in Chicago?? You are a Flag trained executive? You built the org to 40 people? You are pitching this as the “ultimate solution”?
If this Chicago Ideal Org is such a big deal, how can you be telling others to sign up and commit when you will not?
This is the cognitive dissonance that runs rampant in scientology. And they don’t even see it.
This blog and comments are filled with well-articulated points. I weigh in as a person who was only ever Public but was routinely recruited for staff. All those years, I found it odd that the OT 8’s in our area wanted nothing to do with staff. They would come in once per week as “OT Committee” to work on Central Files or plan holiday parties or IAS Fundraisers.
I could see many of our local OT 8’s were retired, they have pensions, a wealthy spouse, etc. If the rumors are true that you don’t earn much being on staff, then these individuals seem to have the financial wherewithal to be on staff. Plus, at that level “on the Bridge,” wouldn’t they bring the OT strength and moral fortitude to unflinchingly do a good job?
Cognitive dissonance striking again. If an OT 8 wants nothing to do with staff, with all they know and all of they have done, then…why would anyone else volunteer to join staff?
Have we mentioned here that the staff themselves are commonly a poor advertisement for joining staff because they often look miserable and harried? As a public, one experiences “the mass” of being on staff by routine exposure and observation.
I am reminded too of a skilled carpenter (and public) that the org was continuously hammering to join staff. (Forgive the feeble pun.) He was someone that the org frequently called in, hired and paid to do fix-its. To his credit, he saw through the ruse. He called them out, “Why would I join staff and earn low if any pay—taking on now two 2 full-time jobs, since I would have to maintain my carpentry business—when I can continue as I am: when the org needs me, you call me and you hire me. I do the work, I invoice you, and the org pays me fairly for the job.”
Darn, it’s so scammy. Ugh.
I want to thank Mike for today’s topic. It was a tremendous reveal for me.
I had often wondered how so many creepy people were featured in posters promoting these events that were essentially “scalping” events where people were driven into bankruptcy.
Well, thanks to a few of the posts today, it suddenly all makes sense. Those people are the FSM’s. They are the most unscrupulous sales people who have the best sales records. They sell this worthless tech to people who cannot afford it but are able to be driven into bankruptcy by getting more and more credit cards and maxxing those cards out by borrowing money to pay for the worthless shits. But the FSMs make a whole lot of money by collecting their ten percent commissions.
I had never before realized that. Suddenly it all makes sense. The whole pyramid would never work except for the fact that a small segment of sales staff (the FSM’s) who use high pressure sales techniques and will stop at nothing to sell this shit and collect their commissions.
And when I say, “Stop at nothing”, I remember a story someone told about how one of them used someone elses credit card and charged some courses against this other person’s credit card without their consent. Serious fraud but it didn’t matter because …
In this cult one cult member never calls the police on another member or sues another member. It’s a great big scam from top to bottom.
Holy Shit!
I just realised two songs that sort of sum up Tubby and $camology:
Ritchie Blackmore – Stargazer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmJIccPWnEk and A Light in the Black (when some people wake/woke up about him and his cult and bolted) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2m8TlDwNIk
Reminder: Monday June 7, 2021 is the day The Rapist will be back in criminal court and will be indicted for Rape.
I’d really like to know if anyone knows what the odds are that his bail will be revoked or continued after he is indicted. I would be very unhappy if his bail was continued so that he could remain “at large” after he is indicted.
Dave Parker the first ED did a Chicago org “ideal” event promotional video , too:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_kmvNym5DA
That was posted on the Underground Bunker at: https://tonyortega.org/2021/05/27/scientology-billionaire-donor-scores-kobe-bryants-rookie-jersey/
He says that in 1974 he was taken off the Briefing Course in LA to go to Chicago and ‘start something’ with 8 people who drove cross country, and that out of a budget of $5,000, they paid $2k for “books and packs” they used the remainder to rent a “really upstat funeral home in Evanston” they found. He refers growing the “forming org” to 44 staff delivering over 200 auditing hours a week 10 months later when in March, 1975 it was designated a regular org.
If I remember the other video correctly, he and the second ED are both taking credit for building up the org to that size. And, it’s all an interesting remind of scientology’s heyday, when there was the sort of popular interest that made such recruiting of staff and members possible – and when orgs were often located near college campuses to tap into what was then their prime demographic (Northwestern University in Evanston appears to have had over twenty thousand students at the time, and there is a cluster of other colleges and universities on the North side of Chicago).
Also, interestingly, he doesn’t say anything at all about why Lyle took over in his stead or what he did afterwards.
And I wonder if any of the current members will notice that they’re talking about a time when the Chicago org had a number of staff, close to what their active membership now seems to be in event photos.
I found that the first Chicago org in Evanston was 3 blocks South of Northwestern University, at 1555 Maple Ave. The address from old orgs lists matches the picture in the video, though the building has apparently been renumbered 919 Grove St. and given a somewhat more modern look.
The current org is sort of midway between Evanston and downtown Chicago. It’s in dated old retail space rather similar to their first location, though its big display windows give it the look of originally having been something like a variety or clothing store. It also appears to be rented, not owned by the org.
p.s. My apologies for typos in the original post
The money has never been in SERVING Scientology, its in SELLING Scientology. Push others to sacrifice themselves to serve for table scraps while you drive up in your new BMW for your 10% commission. I can tell you from running the income lines at Flag, many of the biggest money makers (collecting hundreds of thousands of dollars per year in commissions) are the most disaffected Scientologists that you will ever find. They don’t personally have any interest in getting auditing but they will say it is VITAL that you pay to do so.
Matt boy you really hit the naill on the head. What you wrote needs to be in bold and all caps and shouted from the rooftops.. I don’t know how it is now, but it used to be the richest ones in Scn were the FSM’s. They were paid 10% commission, paid to speak at evets based on how many people they got to attend who were then regged out or their money. They got free training as bonuses, training which many didn’t use but sometimes sold to their FSM selectees at a cheaper rate to help them out. And these FSM’s may be disaffected themselves, but somehow never leave or KR the out tech because it would end he gravy train they are on. I often wonder how Mr Standard Tech himself, Drew Johnston can still be an active FSM knowing all the out tech and alteration and squirreling that goes on in the church. The answer les in the club the church uses to keep it’s flock in line: Disconnection. Drew has a daughter who is or was on staff. If he ever blew the whistle on the altering of the tech and the abandonment of the tech a=when it suits the church’s purposes, he would lose his daughter and wife and big income.
But nowadays with so few people in Scn anymore, does anyone know how the FSM’s are doing? I once took a raw person to my FSM to get her some help and to have her FSM her onto the Bridge. Divona said no she didn’t want to help this person who needed it. I asked why because that is what an FSM does. She told me to bring her only people who need to get onto OT VII and to not deal with low on the Bridge or non Scns at all. Again, why? She said because those doing OT V and VII are where the money is made for an FSM.
Wow. Such a grand purpose.
Exactly!
Well, Divona is pushing this daisies now not schlock. https://tonyortega.org/2020/07/25/scientology-to-the-rescue-after-losing-son-and-wife-johnny-lewis-dad-is-happier-than-ever/
And why isn’t SHE back on Chicago’s Org board? As I see it, the Flag OT committee is there for FLAG.
Yea. I know of many big donors that don’t do shit.
But also, look at dave himself. I wonder when was the last time he got auditing
Apparently Miscavige hasn’t let anyone audit him for about 25 years. I heard Ray Mithoff was trying to pull a withhold in the Rudiments and Miscavige ran out of the session screaming that Ray (Senior C/S Int at the time) was an SP!!!
Mat that’s nuts!
And Ray follows his orders anyway fully knowing he is psychotic.
But a lot still listen to him including my X.
Wishing there was an easy way to break the spell.
Wow, amazing story. And now the man who tried to help him by auditing him, is in the Hole at Int, probably never to escape in this lifetime.
Around the 28 second mark of this video Lyle says, “We were able to do that because we had the most awesome dipsticks in Chicago.”
I’ve never before heard of anyone referring to people in the cult as “dipsticks”. Can anyone explain what that term means as it is applied to people in the cult? Does it mean something similar to the way it is used in WOG land?
I also got a big kick out of the part where she squinted her eyes as if to signify incredible joy when she said, “I am intensely proud to call myself a Chicagoan – even though I live in Florida.”
Did that strike anyone else as just more cult doublespeak bullshit?
Aha! Mike used the term “cognitive dissonance.”
I used the term “doublespeak bullshit.” But I wish that I would have said “cognitive dissonance” instead. That seems more suitable than “doublespeak bullshit.”
You heard Div 6 as “dipsticks”. Pretty big MU, Skyler.
Jere Lull and Glenn.
Thank you for replying to my dipstick post. I was just trying to be funny.
When I heard her say Div 6, I couldn’t make it out. I had no idea what she was saying. But since it kind of sounded like dipstick, I decided to try and have some fun with it.
I hope that I didn’t disturb you by doing this. It was just another one of my weak attempts at humor.
Skyler23,
I just re-listened to that video especially at point 23 as mentioned. Finally realized she said “Div 6” not dipstick. Reflecting on it all I think she should have said dipshit instead. 🙂
Glenn
Glenn – yes indeed. “dipshit” would have been much better all the way around.
Good on you, Mate!
Skyler23,
Thank you Sir
Glenn
Great question Mike.
I’m sure we can all come up with the probable answer.
When I joined staff in San Francisco in 1970, we had about 130 staff members. Make break point? My first week’s pay was less than four bucks. I was 19 at the time.
Joe, that’s because the 4 layers of “management” orgs above the SF Org PLUS Ol’ Tubby got FIRST dips on any money coming into the org and left barely enough for light bulbs for the org to operate on.
For Hubbard it was ONLY about amassing wealth and NEVER about delivering his “tek”. As long as the cash rolled into his coffers he didn’t care about people doing scamology. A hard cold fact for the remaining 5 Indies and MAYBE 1,000 church members in the USA.
Real, I figure maybe around 3,500 truly active members in the US taking into account the 35 to 50 people we see in major event photos at local orgs (around 40 of those in the US), plus around 1,000 in Clearwater and probably a similar number in LA who are only really involved in upper level orgs like AOLA.
Add in missions and be generous, and maybe it would come out to more like 5,000. Plus then there are reportedly about 2,500 left in the Sea Org – which also points the sort of totally disproportionate overhead that is part of the reason that scientology has to try get inordinate amounts of money out of each remaining member. On top of it all there are apparently a lot of largely inactive members who do little more than show up for major annual events, and then completely inactive people who hold IAS memberships — mostly lifetime memberships long ago paid for — but haven’t been involved at all for years.
And if nothing else, 5 people could probably count all the active US indies on their fingers and toes….
At the of 19 I was working 10 hours a week at minimum wage. I made a lot more than 4 dollars a week.
HAS – Tubbard Apprentice Scamologist
HAS was HCO Area Sec, IIRC; it HAS been 40+ years since I had to know that garbage.
Hey Jere,
Heh Heh. I looked it up in that Scamatology Dictionary and there is a listing there for “HAS” that says – “Hubbard Apprentice Scamologist”
Honest!
My wife and I arrived in Chicago in 1978, after I accepted a new job with the Pullman Corporation which was big time in the 1950’s. We called the org to set up an interview and some services. After a brief review I determined that there was nothing available in Chicago. We tried to network with Scio’s but that was also a total failure. I had completed OT III in about 1976 so we lasted in Chicago about three years but never met any meaningful people after numerous attempts.
“Turning the Tide event.”
“Help us before we drown event.”
“Digging out of the hole we are in event.”
“Becoming relevant, which we have never really been event”
“Somebody, anybody, join staff event.”
“Help us before we are gone from the face of the planet event.”
We have been asked to survey some new event names. We here at the Division of Marketing – Brain SuperTrust Bureaux (DM-BS Bureaux) have been working feverishly, (not a covid fever mind you, we have already had our monthly comm ev thank you).
How about this name “There is Something Really Wrong Here, and I Don’t Have Clue About It and Don’t Really Care That I Am Clueless Event”?
😁😁😁
Atlanta Guy,
Regarding staff recruiting and org expansion in general:
Postulating In A Gale
Waiting For Hubbard’s Return
Writing Letters To Dead Purchasers of Books
Tone 40 Solitude
Books Boom Busts
“G.I.”=Gross Invisibility
IAS=Inflated Asshat Scam
ARC = Artificial Reality Construct
COS=Culty Offensive Succubi
Littering With Leaflets
VM’s= Vampires Mooning(or Masturbating)
4th Dynamic Social Betterment Programs=Cosplay Photo Ops
Scientology, building a theta edifice of planetary salvation and universal peace, turd by command-intention-fashioned turd!
In the name of the grift, the grab, and galactic greed,
Ramen!
Straight up, “you believe in the dream enough to lie about it with clear conscious”.
Thank you so much for posting this stand alone, Mike. I saw it on Ortega and was itching to poke fun.
I had thought it was going to be a rah-rah, “I AM returning, and won’t you join me?”.
What an absolute uninspiring and joyless pitch.
I was snorfin and giggling by the end, this is another one of those feet to the fire vids.
bwhahaha.
THIS is what we are really free of these days.
I bet the last thing on earth she wants to do is to go back and try again.
…
idiots in ugly uniforms handing out flyers “body routing” to come into Stepford sterile spaces of screens.
What ever happened to cute chicks in bouncy sweaters inviting you in for a “free personality test”?
Boyishly handsome and outgoingly charming Jimmy Page was AOLA HAS/ Sea Org Recruiter, secure on post, for a reason.
…
If nothing else, she knows that 70’s staff and 2021 staff are two totally different worlds, except for being Hell traps.
….
Think I’ll put on some WHO this morning
“I’M FREE- I’m free,
And freedom tastes of reality,
I’m free-I’m free,
AN’ I’m waiting for you to follow me
Al Capone was the number one in Chicago. To have people to pick between scientology and a life in mud is to pick between life and a conservative lifeconserving movement.
I read an article in Jeffrey Augustine’s blog Scientologymoneyproject.com recently where in it he said, when referring to “spiritual enlightenment,” that “Enlightenment does not turn a blind eye to suffering.” I believe every good person inherently knows this and every remaining scientologist knows this – who’s not a sociopath. Maybe some interviewer ought to start asking some celebrity or scientologist that’s singing Scientology’s praises why they turn a blind eye to suffering or the follow up question which would be why they know don’t about the suffering that’s been caused in their “religion.”
Lyle and every other scientologist has a reason why they join and/or remain a scientologist but ALL OF THEM are turning a blind eye to suffering.
“Blind eye to suffering” – good question and I am sure you
already know the answer. The sufferer “pulled it in”. “Don’t
reward a downstat”. In session you ask; “what did YOU do??”
right before this problem, accident or horrendous situation
happened to you? But of course this goes both ways. Danny
Masterson, DM etc. Time for these guys to get in session! Ha!
Do not kwetch said: Time for these guys to get in session! Ha!
Time for these guys to go to prison! Ha! Ha!
Prison WOULD be an effective behavior-modification session for both pretty boys. In Danny’s case, “pulling it in” is pretty directly connected to the specific overts he’s on trial for. Being on the receiving end would give him real “mass” on what it’s like to be raped like that. Karma.
Especially if his cell mate is the infamous “Bubba”.
My gosh! That guy “Bubba” sure does seem to get around. He seems to be in just about every prison and no one wants him as a cell mate.
Yes, Mary!
You make an elegantly simple, profound point. It bypasses debates about doctrine and scientological chants of “religious bigotry” and addresses points even a scientologist can acknowledge the sense of:
Look at the shrinkage, look at the empty building, recall the endless regging…and honestly look at the current “product”, which includes the suffering and seemingly pointless sacrifices of fellow scientologists…
Why aren’t the courserooms and auditing rooms over-flowing? Why isn’t there a minimum of 120 people on staff, all well-paid? Why isn’t there a line of people wrapping around the building clamoring for jobs at the org?
The scientology word is “obnosis”.
In terms of the bigger picture of planetary “suffering”, even from the skewed scientology viewpoint, what verifiable, “obnosable” results are being achieved by that specific org? What impact is that org having on the gun violence ravaging that area? Homelessness? Poverty? What school systems and universities are implementing El Con’s study tech? And so on…
Speaking from personal experience, there’s a clear difference between not believing in a doctrine and being a religious bigot.
Not in the scn world. If you aren’t a devout believer, you’re a bigot in their tiny little minds. There’s no in-between in their bleak black-and-white existence.
“Planetary suffering”
Nailed it Mark
Love your posts
Obnosed and Out
@Mark: Precisely. Just in recent months in the U.S., major gun violence stories in both Minneapolis, Minnesota and Columbus, Ohio: two cities that boast orgs, and Ideal Orgs. Not that any sane person is “blaming” any church or group for these things. We know there are complex factors, and complex history leading up to these tragedies. Here we are examining the non-stop boasts and PROMISES presented by C of S as to WHY you need to take on loans to donate $150,000 or $250,000 toward making an ideal org in your area: it is because this is what is necessary to reverse the dwindling spiral of your state and your community. This is only way to do it. And you can be assured, once you have an ideal org in your area, the rushing in of a sane ‘new civilization’ is guaranteed.
I think those in this blog community know, this is how the ideal org fundraising demand is sold and how (darn them) they get so many often MODEST-earning people to go into massive debt and fork over their cash.
Mark, I agree: Where is the tangible fulfillment of those promises?
Peridot,
Well said!
May the scam soon be over…