Since Miscavige announced the “Golden Age of Tech” way back in 1997 (?) it seems that scientology has been in anything BUT a golden age.
While they have purchased plenty of buildings, the number of orgs and missions has DECREASED in this time. The number of active scientologists continues to plummet. The amount of public exposure of their abuses is at a constant state of emergency level.
Therecare constantly announcements that orgs are “going to go ideal” or “we ARE going St Hill Size” and now Missions are even getting in on the act “this is the year we build the ideal mission.” Why now? What have you been waiting for? You have been in the Golden Age for 20 years, why are you just going to get started now?
Obviously, this is a rhetorical question. Scientology is shrinking all over the world. The game is to convince the remaining people that the ship is NOT sinking and not to jump overboard. Part of this is to hold glitzy events concocting amazing accomplishments. Part of it is for Miscavige to yank ribbons on new buildings and tell everyone “look we are expanding”. Part of it is to ALWAYS say “we are really doing it now.” Some orgs have been saying they “ARE going St Hill Size” for DECADES (London comes to mind, so too New York and Buffalo) — you would think the pitch would be falling on deaf ears by now. But scientologists are eternally hopeful that something will happen that proves them to be right and their faith not to have been misplaced (and their dollars really didn’t just disappear down the drain).
You see this all the time. Check out this recent tweet:
It really makes you wonder about the IQ of scientologists.
They can selectively pluck anything they see that is good and claim credit for it. This is the “tech at work.”
But they are notably silent when things are going bad. Remember they used to make great claims about Venezuela and how the Way to Happiness had “handled the country”… Not a word today.
And one might ask — why aren’t the Solo NOT’s auditors in LA taking care of the homeless situation?And the traffic. My God, the traffic.
And if they are stopping people from committing crimes with their minds, why arent they getting those same people into the orgs? They are all EMPTY?
And for that matter, surely they are not limited by geography — why havent they sorted things out in the Middle East yet?
The delusion is strong in scientology. Very strong.
How’s violent crime doin’ down in Sydney, Australia ? Any new gruesome murders take place at scientoology’s very prestigious, empty sooper-dooper org? Still waiting for more gory details about what drove that Taiwanese Teenager to slash that sea-ogre’s throat a few weeks ago..pope davey’s pathetic attempt to blame A&E, Aftermath should come back to bite his puny little ass, as more info on this nasty Case is made public.I trust the proper Authorities Down Under are doing a thorough job of investigating this..after all, Sydney is not LA.
Great article, Mike.
“While they have purchased plenty of buildings, the number of orgs and missions have DECREASED in this time.”
And what amazed me shortly before I left were the number of intelligent (or so I thought) Scientologists who appeared to not know the difference between a building and an organization. They thought they were one and the same – at least, the ones I talked to did. About 10 people.
It blew my mind and still does.
How could they possibly be conflating the two, I wondered.
And they’re still doing it.
I guess you can’t fix stupid.
Crime is down in Los Angeles because OT 7 Cult members are exorcising their Body Thetans, (their attached spirits) !
At that level ~~ OT 7~~you are trained to jettison attached spirits on other people, miles away, even in other countries, 10s of thousands of miles away.
Lord have mercy on us all.
Who is ‘lord’ and what is ‘mercy’?
I’m Workin on it… The time after $
Dear Karen:
I was trained to jettison my own spirit while in the Sea Org.
Venezuela is in chaos.
Starvation is rampant.
But the Cult sucked millions of dollars out of the whales.
Tony Ortega posted images of Venezuelan whales giving Multi-millions to the cult
while the country starves.
Karen – Scientological Speaking – it makes perfect sense. $cientology eats their own so why would they help anyone outside of the cult, especially the degraded beings who deserve to starve in Venezuela. “Let em Die” says the Ecclesiastical Leader, David Miscavige.
Stealing the credit used to happen all the time in the org.
When public achieved an amazing feat, their auditor would start bragging how it was “their” pc and because of them. If a staff member pulled off an impossible feat, the Senior took and got the credit. When someone has any win, it’s because of the tech.
It is a huge put down to the person who does the hard work and makes nothing of them. Stealing someone’s thunder is covert invalidation and grandiose delusion at it’s finest.
It’s called Gaslighting. Look it up. My auditor Donna VanZant didn’t do that shit. There are good and ‘bad’ person’s inside and out. I was lucky ?
Dear Cece,
I applaud Donna VanZant, her integrity, and your good luck. She will be eventually rewarded for her good deeds, hopefully with escape. Not all are evil people and in fact most people who joined Scientology have good intentions. That is why we joined!
And yes, Donna is probably a good person and did not do that shit!
However, you have NO IDEA how the staff used to talk about public behind their backs at daily Product Conference about their “private” auditing sessions, to get more money from them.
A lot of your session data was used to help us, THE REGGES, to get you to pay for more intensives. Your ruin, your overts, were discussed in our daily Product Conference. You don’t have a clue, unless you were staff, pressured to pay the rent, electricity, phone bills, etc. It was not Donna VanZant, your auditor, who exposed your sessions. THAT”S RIGHT! I HAD ACCESS TO YOUR PC FOLDERS! As well as all the staff.
LOL, I was SO 20 years in registration, treasure sec and FBO 🙂
The Church of never ending bullshit. If one took the bs out of Scientology the true state of as-isness would be achieved.
Church of Bullshit. Isn’t that what COB stands for?
Technically he is the Commander of Bullshit.
Also Chairman of Bollocks and Captain of the Brainwashed. He wears many hats.
I thought he was the Captain? haha
I suspect GAT was partly an attempt to clean up “tech” delivery so that they’d have fewer bad results such as “PTS” cases – like Lisa McPherson. The problem was that Hubbard was following in the footsteps of the abreaction therapy he’d seen in the Navy – which had been abandoned by the late 1940s, because though it produced some impressive-seeming results and experiences, it also turned out to have too many adverse outcomes, including patients even getting worse sometimes. And it also turned out that while quite a few patients seemed to have impressive-seeming insights or breakthroughs in therapy, that did not generally result in long-term improvement, so the therapy was largely ineffective at best anyway.
Impressive-seeming but ineffective, and potentially harmful – that seems to describe Hubbard’s and Scientology’s “tech” as well. Hubbard had also piled on some additional esoteric processes to try to get people to experience other illusory phenomenon like “going exterior,” which is really induced dissociation, a step dangerously short of actual psychosis, and so there were yet other risks for pushing people into full-blown “PTS” in some cases. I think Hubbard knew the dangers, but in his cynical, end-justifies-the-means worldview, thought that it was acceptable to break a few minds in pursuit of the goal of turning some of the able into “big beings,” and that he could get away with it until Scientology was in a position where “the orgs say what is legal or not” and any human mistakes could be disposed of “quietly and without sorrow.”
I see Miscavige as stuck dealing with the fallout from Hubbard’s failed experiment. After nearly half a century, and under increased public scrutiny and more modern awareness about mental health, he had to more tightly control and even dial back on “tech” delivery to try to avoid “flaps.” The result is efforts like GAT, with auditing more limited to centralized locations such as Flag and advanced orgs, and even the shift from focusing on delivering services (with their potential dangers) to donations and statuses. I wonder if there is any internal justification that Scientology needs to try to create a safe environment, so they can go back to a more Hubbardian approach to delivering services, damn the consequences.
Those who still imagine a supposed “good old days” of the “tech” when they got to enjoy out-of-body experiences or whatever, must still be unaware of the heavy toll it took on others, as documented in a couple of threads over on ESMB:
How many people went Type III (ie. had a Psychotic Break) in your org?
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?38005-How-many-people-went-type-III-(ie-had-a-Psychotic-Break)-in-your-org
http://www.forum.exscn.net/threads/part-2-how-many-people-went-type-iii-ie-had-a-psychotic-break-in-your-org.43120
Two snippets from a google search:
“In 2016 more people were arrested for marijuana possession than for all crimes the FBI classifies as violent, according to 2016 crime data released by the agency on Monday”
“LEGAL POT IS LINKED TO LESS CRIME
A new study suggests it also decreases other types of drug use, including binge drinking.”
The most obvious reason for the decrease in crime in California is the decriminalizing of pot. It’s not a crime now, so there are no arrests.
This proves a couple of things:
-Scientologists lie about their “accomplishments”
-Scientologists are delusional.
-Scientology has had zero effect on the overall drug usage in California despite their millions of members in California avidly promoting a drug-free world. (Well, maybe it’s only a couple thousand members)
Excellent comment, LDW. Thanks.
When I was solo auditing on OTVII, the Berlin wall came down. I will never forget how it was attributed to all the theta us OTVII auditors were putting out that combatted the enmest to make it happen. I actually had people thanking me for making the Berlin wall come down. Even at the time, I thought wtf?
Right. Of course. The Berlin Wall came down because of OT auditors! Nothing to do with the inefficiency of Marxism! Nothing to do with the lack of consumer goods as well as freedom in East Germany! It was all those super theta OT auditors!
You’re right. They are delusional.
Spoken by a former cold warrior.
Scn has been in LA for a long time. So why is all the OT voodoo kicking in NOW all of a sudden?
If they’re so concerned about violent crime they can make a very simple and effective contribution: Turn their info on Danny Masterson over to the authorities, and have one violent serial predator taken off the streets. It certainly would be far from the first time that they would be sharing “confessional” data. At least, this time it would be for a good use!
It’s Great to see more and more new names in the ‘comments’ from day-to-day and week-to-week, and It is Especially gratifying to see so many of those admitting not only to leaving $, but leaving Because Of ‘The Aftermath’. Many, Many, Many Thanks to Mike and Leah – Ya Done Good – Real Good!
I hope and pray that when our grand kids are grown, Leah Remini and Mike Rinder will be famous names and celebrated like great war heroes while the name of Miscavige will just elicit a chorus of “who?”.
Great post Belynda. It is the kind of post that brings tears to the eyes of our heroes.
Good point. I doubt Miscavige will even have the rank to be an answer on Jeopardy.
Better would be for the name of David Miscavige to have equal billing with that of Adolf Hitler.
We trivialize the holcaust and the sacrifices of WW2 when we make such careless statements.
For Scientology – it certainly has been several decades of Golden Age ….
The Golden Age of Delusion
The Golden Age of Deception
The Golden Age of Extortion
The Golden Age of Fraud
The Golden Age of SCAMMING
The Golden Age of Disconnection
The Golden Age of Hate
The Golden Age of Rip-Off
For Scientologists – it has been a complete decade of Golden Ages….
The Golden Ages of Divorces
The Golden Ages of Financial Ruin
The Golden Ages of Bankruptcy
The Golden Ages of Foreclosures
The Golden Ages of Shattered Families
The Golden Ages of Robotism
For David Miscavige, the dictator of $cientology
It has been a Golden Age of Inurement, Thuggery, Criminality, Abuse and Beatings of Scientology Sea Org Staff, Wife Neglect and abuse, LYING, Conning, Deceiving and Drunkenness.
VWD Scientology – you are officially the Mafia of all Religions. You stand toe to toe with ISIS. You just don’t behead people….YET.
well….. we still don’t have a definitive answer on where Shelley is!
And what about genocide? As Dave is actively preventing births in the Sea Org, that qualifies as a genocide!
As the turnover of members is very high, they can continue with the « we are in the golden age of blablabla » and other « the expansion is so high ».
Except for the tiny percent of members who continue on the gangway of total captivity (who are anyway « forced » to continue, in one way or another) the subject of scientology is always very new for the people who start!
Isn’t that great for the management?
Foolproof,
“The Golden Age of Delusion” is a topic you need to pay attention to.
You have been making numerous comments about Hubbard’s “Spontaneous Combustion” on OT VIII. I want to make it perfectly clear to you that this policy was mostly responsible for the early death of my FSM’s after OT VIII in 1988. Out of respect, I will not mention their names. The first one died about two years after OT VIII after having developed very serious cancer. This was in about 1990. The second one died as a result of the fear OT VIII instilled in him about spontaneous combustion. I visited him at his house. He constantly could not get spontaneous combustion out of his mind. He read Hubbard’s policy and concluded that if he made the slightest mistake, he would burn. This is no joke, Foolproof. I do not know what your intentions are in regard to your posts. You have now crossed the line. Could we say that Hubbard was responsible for his death?
Secondly, Foolproof. Your technical discussions of OT VIII are nonsense. I am actually tired of responding to you on these matters. The issue if final. You may now address me as the only OT VIII on planet earth and your superior. Foolproof, I now have the keys to the Scientology Bridge. If you want it, settle down and relieve yourself of your ignorance. Fake Scientology is in the marble buildings with Miscavige. It has nothing to do with immortality. It is delusion. If you want to pursue Hubbard’s bridge which does not work anyway, you can follow original OT VIII to the letter. At least you will follow Hubbard rather than the other fool.
Good post GeorgeMWhite. Scientology KILLS. The clever technique Scientology uses is the L Ron Hubbard tech trains the staff to “implant” horrible ideas into people’s subconscious.
I had a relative – a drug addict – go into Scientology to do some courses on my recommendation. They were told by a Staff member (PES) that “if they did not do Scientology – they would die”
.
Within a year – the 33 year quit doing the Scientology course and shortly after that – died. The death was bizarre. Left behind a husband and 2 babies.
Another friend who went Scientology Clear – told me that she was really paranoid of dying of cancer due to the constant haranguing and fear mongering from Scientology Registrars.
The Registrars told her that if she did not get onto her Oat Tea Levels very quickly and pay a bunch of $$$$$$$ – she would die of cancer.
She had no money and was disillusioned after “Going Clear” because she said that she did not get rid of her reactive mind – she just had to say she can control it.
She read somewhere in the ACC’s that “she was mocking up her reactive mind but could stop it and control it” and that was the Clear Cognition.
She originated the Clear Cognition in session and was routed onto the Clear to Certainty Rundown, which she said was another RIP OFF. Something about going up to a rooftop and drew a picture of a sunset or something stupid like that and then received the Scientology CLEAR Cert.
Only – she was not Clear.
She still got sick, needed glasses, got upset and felt really ripped off by Scientology.
Within the year – the Scientology Clear friend was deader than a door nail. She died of Cancer.
Scientology fucks with your subconscious mind and implants false information. Very dangerous lurkers. You may want to walk out of that Scientological Door Lurkers, and do some independent research on mind control and hypnosis.
Scientology Bridge is a waste of money and time and will put you into confusion that will take another lifetime to get out of.
Scientology training is simply training to manipulate others to harm themselves and others by placing significances that are wrong – it causes them to commit crimes under confusion.
Don’t do Scientology. Deprogram yourself if you have.
Please – lurkers – do some research into what you are involved in. You are hurting yourself and others.
Let’s this be the year that we Stop Scientology!
I’m more resolved than ever to stop Scientology. Thanks for sharing. In the early 90’s I heard a rumor that Lynn Irons’ wife became very sick after Original OT VIII. So sick that it was a factor in pulling the level. My suspicion is that Original OT VIII was a far bigger disaster and was covered up by Miscavige. If I had the time, I might start to trace some of the people.
Magnificent post Thetan Removed
Curiouser and curiouser? I notice you have avoided answering on the other thread hoping that people will not see my prior remarks and questions and now want to stop answering questions on this (which is strange as you seem to want to spew this nonsense everywhere – until someone challenges you on it that is).
So, talking of nonsense – what were the processes of this OTVIII that you did then George? What are the 2 main procedures of Solo NOTs (which is a question you have avoided answering)? Why wasn’t your friend recalled to Freewinds to redo “OTVIII”? Who was your sec checker for your OT8 Eligibility? How many hours did you do on Solo NOTs? (We’ll forget about your 12 hours a day on Solo NOTs as I gave you the chance to slide out of that one.) How did the document get off the ship – in your luggage? And how do you explain the original OTVIII HCOB from 1969? etc. etc.
I am beginning to think now that perhaps it was you who composed this ridiculous piece of crap, perhaps in collusion with Brian as he seems also to be very keen on the subject and drops it in to his comments at any opportunity. You’re a fake and so is the document.
See the stories on https://www.mikerindersblog.org/friday-regraded-being-180/
and: https://www.mikerindersblog.org/ot-viii-is-lame/
As I said on another thread: “I particularly like FG’s remark in that same story: “Now there is the “Jesus is a lover of young boy” version, which seems to never have been delivered to anyone except to George White who apparently is coming from another time continuum !!”
Foolproof,
See my comment above. It answers your questions. If you think anyone on this blog is interested in your technical details about OTVIII, you are in a delusion. You really do not get it. Your “spontaneous combustion” stuff from Hubbard hurt my friend. Now you have inserted more BS about your technical details. You are totally confused about OT VIII. You should look at it from a different viewpoint. Now remember I am your senior. Everyone knows Hubbard wrote the Lucifer and anti-Christ stuff. Accept it as fact and move on. Scientology is at its end. Your only hope is to pick up the OT VIII stuff and look for a new market. Your new market is modern Occult. There are potentially more new members for you there. Drop the technical stuff. Look I paid for you people to get it right. All that you ask me about is your responsibility. I had nothing to do with your tech.
Foolproof,
You need to understand that the confusing technical details going around in your mind are not a good mental state for you to be in. You only put yourself in danger of a nervous breakdown. There is another kind of knowing which steadies the false “knowingness” of Hubbard. Take a deep breath.
Coming from someone who has not answered and avoided any of my straightforward technical questions to someone who has apparently done Solo NOTs and “OTVIII” this is getting interesting. And so now we move from spontaneously combusting to nervous breakdowns – as Chicago PD would say “he’s got previous!” Jeez!
Foolproof, I am long past answering any of your technical questions. I paid Scientology for its “tech”. They delivered what they had in stock at the time which is always changing as we all know. Now I will concentrate on digging up the details of the massive human suffering that Hubbard caused on Original OT VIII.
Check out the Lynn Irons story. I heard that his wife got sick on OT VIII. Let’s check the accuracy of that report first. BTW, it was logical for Hubbard to switch emphasis to the GE in the Original OT VIII. First of all, when he copied parts of Scientology from ancient Kabballah, he left that step out because he thought his meter would handle it. So he could play his game and demand more money for auditing the GE. He ended with an almost infinite bank of dead thetans to handle on the mental and physical levels. It was all about the money. He could also take control of tech with no one to challenge him and put Mayo in the past.
George, it’s obvious to all and sundry you can’t answer the technical questions. You have spent more time and effort avoiding them than if you had (even attempted) to answer them. To use the phrase used against my comment recently: QED: You haven’t got a clue as to how to answer them.
Fool (Not a typo) – the more you talk, the more you betray your utter Stupidity* – Where is *That on the Tone scale? Ha!
Looks like Logicproof is blowing a gasket. Many scamology adherents went the same route.
The waffling reply confirms it then. As to Wynski, any more “Senior C/Ses” who told you about “OTVIII” up your sleeve? Suggest you and Torquemada George and Brain huddle together and work out some other nonsense.
Foolish
Do us a huge favor and go find a dianetics volcano to jump in!
Classic!
Titter titter, snigger snigger. What larks eh? Classic kindergarten humor! Like your spoof “OTVIII”
Foolproof, a number of people have attested to the veracity of the OTVIII materials that George references, as I’ve noted previously, so you’d have to postulate more of a conspiracy than just him and Brian:
“during the copyright battle over Lerma’s web pages, the Church of Scientology’s attorney Kendrick Moxon identified the “Antichrist” document as copyrighted material…..Jesse Prince, former second-in-command of Scientology’s Religious Technology Center, reports that OTVIII was revised after early participants were “horribly upset” by the content.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OT_VIII
“in 1991, [Oliver] came across the document in Scientology’s own files….The red on white, I saw it,’ [former OSA staffer Frank] Oliver tells us, referring to the Hubbard document, which was typed in red ink on white paper.” https://tonyortega.org/2014/06/24/up-the-bridge-we-finally-reach-ot-8-but-was-its-first-version-really-a-hoax/
Hubbard is on the record as claiming to be a “very good friend”* of occultist and proto-Satanist Aleister Crowley who “signs himself ‘the Beast,’ mark of the Beast 666,” and also wrote describing Lucifer as the light bearer. Hubbard certainly understood the occult context of claiming to be the anti-Christ or Beast, and the role of Lucifer – and who else in Scientology would have had the arcane knowledge to write a reference like that? Certainly not Miscavige with his very limited education and knowledge – unless Hubbard had directed him to study Crowley, which would then still point to Hubbard continuing to see Crowley’s Thelema as an important basis for Scientology, just as L. Ron Hubbard, Jr. said.
The concept of Jesus as a lover of young boys is almost certainly a take-off of, and mirrors the specific language of, an incident presented in the Secret Gospel of Mark discovered by researcher Morton Smith (announced in 1960 and published in 1973) – something, again, that though rather obscure, I happen to have been familiar with due to my interests, before encountering Hubbard’s work (professor Stephen Kent has made the same connection). And again, that’s something Hubbard likely would have encountered in the esoteric and intellectual circles he ran in the 1950s and 1960s, but that no one else that I can think of in the upper echelons of the CofS in the 1980s would likely have been familiar with.
(And are you passing by “misunderstoods” when it comes to Crowley, Thelema, the occult, etc., or do you actually understand what is being referenced?)
* A claim you admit is a lie – which casts doubt on the veracity of many, if not most, things that Hubbard said or claimed, given that he has been caught lying blatantly in his public presentations.
Hubbard never met Crowley. I have mentioned this on the other links. It was a tongue-in-cheek remark and is the only time it is ever mentioned, once on 1 tape. Hubbard dabbled in it before Dianetics in 1950 but then Hubbard dabbled in many things to garner and sift out data. To imply that he is deeply involved in this stuff is again, nonsense. It is like saying that because Hubbard sat at the feet of a Shaman in 1932 or whenever that he was involved in Shamanism.
George and Brian have probably nothing to do with the origination of this OTVIII nonsense – that wasn’t my point – but they are certainly perpetuating the falsehood of its authorship in their constant attributions based on their hatred of Scientology. On the other hand they may be deeply involved from the inception – I don’t know and I don’t really care. I did however read somewhere that the GO or OSA had it in their files that it was one or two named individuals who composed it – a name or rather a group led by a certain person was mentioned but as I am not sure now if I have the right name I won’t mention it. Atak was apparently distributing it. When I first read it I thought it was a spoof and a joke, which it is of course. Really, only a fucking idiot would believe it. I know of no one in the independent field who believes it and don’t even give it a thought.
Thanks for that info about Frank Oliver’s “expose” of “OTVIII”. Of course it never occurred to you that if it was the real OTVIII, what would it be doing in OSA’s or any department’s file cabinets, rather than secreted away at Freewinds? Yes, I am sure that this document would be available for anyone flicking through the files to read (being sarcastic). It was obviously there as part of the info on who had composed this tripe in the OSA files. Still, reason and logic here are in another universe, somewhere far, far away.
Here is the post which has others chiming in and saying they did the original OT8. The first one. So it’s not George that’s mankind it up Foolproof. It’s the truth that’s making it up.
But you cannot accept truth. Truth is suppressive in Scientology.
Also you cannot fathom that the flawless image of Ron you have installed in your imagination could be that crazy.
It’s similar to how your reality gets bent out of shape because I did not get pneumonia running Ron’s make believe.
BTW, it’s on Marty’s blog.
So lurkers, this thread simply shows Foolproof for who he is: a cult fanatic. But he’s cute.
Take it away truth —
https://markrathbun.blog/2013/07/03/dangerous-thoughts/#comment-271527
I have heard now from one of my sources in Europe that it was originally Jon Atak who was pushing this nonsense. So as to Marty’s link you mean this:
“I did the first version of OTVIII which the Internet claimed had this Christ reference – I can tell you it definitely was NOT part of the OTVIII that I did and I rereading the materials several times returning to the Freewinds for various crams, fix ups etc.
LRH was dismissive but not anti-Christ as far as everything I’ve studied and heard (LRH materials)”
Or this:
“Even with my limited understanding, it’s clear that this turns Theta-MEST theory upside-down. If you accept the letter as being true, you’d likely have to accept that LRH’s idea of Theta-MEST had changed completely, making all the earlier teachings (not to mention Scientology itself) redundant.
Also, the GE stuff is strange, as LRH basically said the subject is unimportant and that there’s not much point in auditing it. But all of a sudden, it becomes so vital and urgent that he doesn’t even have time to explain in detail?
Whoever wrote that letter clearly had little more than a working knowledge of Scientologese, at best.”
Or how about contradicting what he wrote on OTIII?
Or this:
“I read and copied that OTVIII bulletin from internet in 1998. In 2010 I asked a Class VIII, OTVIII about it and he said that it was utter bullshit and not LRH and was not the version he did.”
And neither you nor George have explained how that document came down the gangplank from the Freewinds. And you won’t ever be able to do so without waffling either, will you?
And the list of processes now? Where have they gone? I saw them back in the 90s, now mysteriously disappeared (as it was kindergarten stuff).
Hubbard did not write that ridiculous document. The game’s up. I suggest you and George consult with your masters as to what other nonsense to come up with.
The real problem here is that while you argue about this incessantly, WHATEVER version of OT VIII you accept (who knows what that is, you seem to think it is some 1969 HCOB?) it does not deliver what is promised by any stretch of the imagination. In fact, for the most part, the grand promises of Hubbard were never able to be delivered, though people (like you) go on trying to convince themselves that the promises were not made, or if they were, they are sometimes met in part by some people (which is better than anyone else can do… or so you claim) or that those promises “will be” realized once you get to the top of the Bridge (though such a thing does not exist, because the “Top” will have to deliver and it never can so it will never exist).
The good thing is that people can believe anything they want. If you are happy in your beliefs more power to you. I don’t begrudge that at all. It gets annoying when you try to assert all-knowing certainty that you have the answer for everything because you have the power of the tech, but even that is nothing to be too bothered by. There are plenty of people who assert this and every one of them is convinced their answer is the only answer. From fundamentalist Christians to fundamentalist Muslims to people who only drink ionized water.
What is wrong is when you trick people into giving you money for something you cannot deliver. And then, despite promising to return it, refuse to do so. And you break up families. And mentally torture people. And work them a hundred hours a week and pay them cents an hour. And refuse to report crimes to the police. And blame victims of sexual abuse for “pulling it in.” Those things are real problems.
Now I could accuse you quite rightly here of using “what-about-ism” in deflecting the issue here off of the OTVIII nonsense. As I have often stated I have no problems with some of the stories you post here, but this thread is about the bogus OTVIII.
I would like to see some coverage on missions and orgs that are closing. Since they claim expansion but the actual number of orgs is going down, it would be helpful to chronicle when and where they are closing.
I am sure their claims of expansion are only in square footage and other weasel-wording of stats, but being able to point out specific examples of actual contraction would be instructive. “The org in Springfield closed this week”, “The org in Wherevertown has been in this tiny strip mall suite for 10 years”, or maybe just illustration of the joke that is all these orgs claiming to go “Saint Hill Size” when none ever has. Or maybe Saint Hill’s current size.
Among the pieces about missions posted here periodically is this one citing an effort to track the remaining missions, and recent closures:
https://www.mikerindersblog.org/scientology-massive-international-expansion-lies/
Scientology has a policy against closing orgs, and so that has not happened and I doubt will for a long time – with the exception that they have stealthily combined most of the once-separate celebrity centers into local orgs, effectively ending their independent existence, except for the ones in LA and NY.
The contraction of the mission network is the most obvious sign that Scientology is shrinking and failing. But their remaining members seem to be gullible or oblivious types who fall for the propaganda claims of “expansion,” and ignore evidence like how increasingly empty their local org is and how many times it has failed to go “Saint Hill size.”
Miscavige apparently mentioned a new focus on missions at the New Year’s event. My guess is that the best they’ll do is to get few whales to sponsor (and subsidize) some “ideal” style mission franchises, like the ones branded Life Improvement Centers in Seattle and Tampa – and that they’ll tout that “expansion” inside the bubble, even as more of their old missions fade away and die off.
The “No OTs” song says it nicely
“Everything good is us,
“Everything bad is them”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xyigdRxPOR4
I
How can anyone win at the Hubbard system, except to falsely report their delusional positive influence is working?
Hubbard’s system generates (by punishment, “correction” and by all types of Hubbard highly detailed institutionalized pressures) “successful” members who “succeed” by false reporting the quackery works.
Thanx Chuck! Love the song. Hilarious ?
Something I have to say is that I am not in Scientology anymore since the beginning of the 90’s but I still believe we are spirits in bodies playing games and that the physical universe is a created illusion. The reason is simply that I believed it much before being in Scientology. Scientology attracted me because it was said that you could get back on your time track and see what happened. First, I was just feeling as a number and I don’t think there’s one standard procedure that fits everyone’s « case » since we are all unique and different. I don’t like dogma, organizations, etc etc etc. And despite Scientology claims to take care of spiritual healing, I find it much more MEST oriented. Just to see those pompous buildings, auditoriums, orgs, etc is enough… Nothing to do with spirituality.
I went to the local mission here in Ventura to give all their mail they sent me back to them. When I pulled up, I saw three sea org members standing in the doorway. This is the first time I’ve seen them at that mission. Just made me wonder what was up.
The Ventura mission is going to end up vanishing if and when when the Santa Barbara org moves into their brutalist monstrosity of an “ideal” building down South in Ventura. While the theory is that orgs and especially “ideal” ones are supposed to spawn a network of missions, the reality is that there’s so little demand for Scientology that the missions are failing, and when, as in Dublin, Scientology moves into an “ideal” facility
in the vicinity and puts on a big push to increase their own stats, they will inevitably put the mission out of business.
It could be that the Sea Org members are there as some part of the ramp-up for the Ventura org, perhaps fundraising, or trying to persuade the mission holder not to throw in the towel. Or the mission may just be in some sort of trouble, anyway, maybe even having lost its mission holder.
The Golden Age of Con, Scam, Deceit, Fraud, Manipulation, Lying, Money Laundering, Abuse of Religious Cloak, Gaslighting and Extortion IS Scientology
Remember, the public that write this type of insanity are of the same mind set as our pet scamologist, Foolproof.
It actually IS delusion. Because if we “say” it…it’s true…yeah we created that…and because we said we created that we did. In theory it sounds good when you are in course but go out into the real world and there’s no evidence of even a drop in the bucket. There are some really good people inside the missions but the whole system sets you up to be delusional. I remember being delusional just like them and I was isolated from the rest of the world, but I was thinking the isolation was because we were “superior” to the rest of the world. That’s Delusion!
How many actual people have to be in one of the wonderful orgs for it to be considered a reason for the IRS to believe that they are being rebuilt, decorated, re-vamped, as a reason for being given tax exemption? How many IRS employees would it take to actually lay eyes on them to prove these buildings are nothing but brick and mortar empty shells?
How many people from the justice department would it take to investigate the LA police corruption? I am sure the majority of the LA police department are awesome sincere people, but it only takes a few to put a dark cloud over all of them. How about the DA office? How do they keep getting away with protecting the cult? If they are afraid of a cult what good are they?
What’s holding the FBI back, or maybe they are just biding their time until they can make bullet proof case?
When’s it going to be time to clean house.
Peggy, unfortunately, the orgs, though empty, are legally churches and the US government does not monitor church attendance, no matter how elaborate or costly their real estate value or furnishings, no matter how much money was donated to create them.
So, all they have to do is just take their word that this isn’t some Ponzi scam? Wonderful. No wonder the rest of us have to dig deeper taking care of government expenses. Well, if it took more to pay for scum like DM to sit in a prison then that would be ok. Until then I guess I will just whine about it.
Aqua, the CofS is an unusual case, and at some point the IRS could ask whether the buildings are providing any public benefit – or are just a subterfuge for hoarding assets, and in a way that might not be permitted with similar amounts of case. There is a presumption that tax exempt organizations classified as churches are providing a public benefit, though there is not as clear a test for it as there is in some other countries.
Scientology could not, for instance, close the buildings to the public – then they would be in clear violation of the public benefit provision. That would actually make them something more like a private club, and I think that actually suggests one of the routes the IRS might take, to downgrade their status to that of a club (or a religious community, still-non profit, but with much stricter requirements, including financial reporting).
I suspect the CofS’ tax exemption may end not with a bang, but with a whimper, as the tax authorities get out their sharp pencils and knives, and downgrade the status of at least some of the corporations. That would be harder to fight, and in the long run would force them to reveal something of their finances whether in a court fight or in newly required filings, which would probably then expose information that would lead to further downgrades.
I think there are probably IRS old-timers who have been waiting for decades to settle scores with Scientology, as well as newcomers of the generation brought up on media like South Park generation who understand Scientology as a farce, who are just waiting for the right time to tackle the CofS, particularly as it both weakens and its financial situation gets further out of whack with the status it was granted.
PeaceMaker, may this go from your lips to God’s ear. Well, either God’s or the IRS’s.
Peggy and Peacemaker,
While I’m with you 100% in sentiment and hunger just as you do for the IRS to take an interest in Co$’s tax exempt status as a church, what you’re each MISSING is that buying and renovating new buildings is HOW Miscavige satisfies the IRS requirement that church donations be spent for the public good.
Doing this is how he “proves” to the IRS that a sufficient percentage of the money coming IN to the cult is actually going ‘OUT”.
Now the fact that donations for new buildings for Scientology are obtained from Scientologists by LYING to them about how “necessary” they are in in order to expand the Scientology religion is out of the IRS’s purview.
Co$ is a legal church in America. People are asked to donate to buy more buildings so that Co$ can be ABLE to expand. They do. They fall for this BS hook, line and sinker and donate. There’s nothing illegal about this, unfortunately.
People donate money to their churches all the time, for all kinds of reasons. Its their American right, their First Amendment right, to do so.
Are they getting scammed? Hell, yeah! But then, the EVIDENCE that they’re getting scammed is ALL AROUND THEM and yet they ignore it and still fork over their money to their church.
So long as Miscavige keeps buying and renovating and opening buildings the IRS is satisfied. He HAS to do this. Its ALL that Co$ does “for the public good”.
Certainly, the cult doesn’t do anything in terms of ACTUAL MONEY or shelter or other substantive aid for the poor or the homeless, disaster victims, etc.
The Ideal Morgue program is IT. It alone satisfies the requirement of maintaining tax exempt status. Mike explained this all in a former article.
(Mike, if I’m in error about anything I’m saying here or missing anything, please correct me. )
Anyway, the long-winded point I’m making here is that it is the SCN PUBLIC who have to wake up and raise hell about the Ideal M’Org Scam. THEY are the ones who have to 1ST of all STOP DONATING and then start howling to the IRS and their congressmen and senators and media and and and anyone whol’ll listen about how they were and are being LIED TO so that they’ll donate their money to buy buildings that sit empty!
But as long as they keep donating, the cult will keep taking the money. And its all legal.
That’s why what Mike and Leah are doing is so valuable. Everything is pitched to the PUBLIC, to make the public pay attention, to make them LOOK. Once a person LOOKS he stops donating. Then he gets pissed. Multiply that and…you get the idea.
EXACTLY Aqua! Now, the number of real CoS public in the USA is down to about 5,000. If we keep spreading the info that number will fall to almost nothing. At that point the CoS is dead in the US. Statistically there are no Indies in the US so that will be that.
5000 Scn public? That’s it? I’m encouraged. I’m encouraged, Wynski!
The cult can’t survive without people no matter how much money they have.
Miscavige will keep on keeping on, though. To the end, he’ll keep bleeding anyone who’s willing to be bled.
At some point, when the active public has dwindled to a shocking few, he’ll decide its time to get out of Dodge.
But to end and even beyond he and the Cherch will keep lying about how Scientology is expanding by leaps and bounds.
And then one day – poof – he’ll be gone.
The few remaining Die Hards will be left twisting in the wind, still hoping, still wanting to believe the fairy tale..The old ones, probably, will die still believing.
I know you are right Aquamarine, and I really do appreciate your trying to get it through my head. I guess at some point in time my brain just shuts down but I do know that this is one dangerous cult.
I just can not understand why the really big donors even got into this, unless they wanted to find out if they could become even more wealthy, popular, or if they just joined in because #1 they have a pile of disposable income or #2 because all the really cool kids are doing it. If anyone has the freedom to check out what this cult is all about it’s them. So, maybe they just don’t care as long as they are one of the cool kids?
We may have to find a different way to take down the church. A CPA I know who works for one of the best firms, said he doubts the IRS will try to investigate the church because they don’t want to be inundated with lawsuits like before. The church had its parishoners flood them with lawsuits and the sheer paperwork of it alone overwhelmed the IRS and they eventually cried “Uncle!” That fear of history repeating itself is why he thinks the IRS will never go after the church again.
ctempster, in the USA there are only about 5,000 PUBLIC remaining. It is dying fast. The IRS needs to know that its membership rolls are a small fraction of what it used to be.
The thing is, though, that Co$ IS being taken down. Its active membership is shrinking. People ARE leaving. They’ve been leaving for YEARS. THAT is what’s killing and will continue to kill Co$. No NEW people. Loyal old public dying off with no one is replacing them. No new people walking into the fancy new orgs. People staying theoretically in for their own reasons but actually just going thru the motions. Doing cheap extension courses – at home. This is what’s been going on for years now. The orgs are not making clears. The orgs are not training auditors. They’re shels, facsimiles of what they’re supposed to be. This is death – of an organization. Slow, but sure. PEOPLE, ordinary people, are killing Scientology – by not supporting it, by withdrawing, by pretending to be part of it but being not really part of it. Scientology IS being killed. And the organization is killing ITSELF by not producing what its supposed to produce. Its a slow suicide, granted. But It IS dying and its own people are killing it and it is killing itself. The emptiness of the orgs is all the evidence one needs. What Mike and Leah are doing on A & E is speeding things up.
con·fir·ma·tion bi·as
noun
the tendency to interpret new evidence as confirmation of one’s existing beliefs or theories.
To quote a Hindu guru: “The universe is exactly as you think it is; and that’s why.”
$cientology is a bloody serious thing
depending on every members hard-working.
The ones standing in the way
removes but first in clay
If critics, psychs and communists are THE enemies to rondroids is it worse to be dumped by the easy goingness than it is to be dumped by a dick or a cunt.
The day rondroids find out they have an own breathing the stank from Hubbards rotten teeth disappear.
Maybe it’s the way out? OT TR 0 and no more. People finding out they have an own breathing don’t buy bullshit.
And, on the other hand, it is sad. Some Mission Holders feel they are helping. His or her intention is to give a hand to others.
Many of us were the same, stayed there for over 20, 25 or more years as we had the purpose to help another. At the top the violence started to be so obvious that there was no choice but to leave and little, by little trickled down at all level and 1,000s more quit.
But out there, in a small community, the ED of the Mission is far away from the tantrums of the tyrant miscabage. She only sees what she is told at events and meetings. Not an excuse, but that is the way it is.
Now, sooner or later she will open her eyes, as many have done, and will quit.
When that occurs ,someone will have to give him/her a hand to get through the betrayal this cult has been inflicting on others for over 50 years.
She can be helped to recover herself, whereas the tyrant miscabage has lost his eternity forever.
So true…….and really well said. Thank you.
“And, on the other hand, it is sad. Some Mission Holders feel they are helping. His or her intention is to give a hand to others.”
I do feel sorry for some of the people who are duped by Scientology. I understand that the forces of thought control can be overwhelming. Yet I can hardly ever give them a pass all the way around. At some point, they lied or witnessed lies. At some point, they chose not to look. At some point, they chose a lying organization over real bonds to family and friends. They were still wronged, and yet they definitely also had a hand in the wrong done to them — and often in the wrongs done to others as well. The only thing I can do is wish for them to wake up now and start living more authentically.
This is just cynical me opining here but I believe most of the adult still ins are WAY past the point of being innocently and trustingly duped I believe they are aware that the jig has long been up but are loathe to acknowledge it because then they would have to confront that Miscavige has played them for fools. Another reason would be that knowledge carries with it responsibility. Calling out the fraud would necessitate decisions. How much easier to pretend to believe, even if it means continuing to get rooked.
And cynical me also believes that Miscavige not only perceive their cowardice but counts on it to bleed them shamelessly and mercilessly for every dime they have, silently daring them to refuse. betting that they’ll always cave and say nothing to save their own faces and avoid having to make decisions.
Miscavige is playing a deadly game of chicken with the still ins.
Thank God one of my strong points has always been the willingness to admit to myself and others those times when I’ve been a complete idiot.
The missions are in some ways still a bit of an oasis from the madness of Scientology orgs. In many cases in the past, and to some extent still, they were based on the practice of a field auditor, who if they had some talent for talk therapy, was probably delivering something of benefit to their clients.
My perspective at this point, is that the missions and the local orgs in the old days, served as a sort of focal point or catalyst for well-intended people, particularly of a certain idealistic era, to come together and to try to help each others. As a wise old former mission holder once said, what’s really important is context, not content – I think it was the context that the missions and their people operated in, not necessarily the content of Dianetics and Scientology, that was key to anything positive that went on, though Hubbard and the CofS were very adapt at taking credit.
Yep, Slappy’s been peeing on everybody’s feet and telling them it’s raining.
Excellent news Mike
Scientology….stick a fork in it
Remember….intelligence has nothing to do with mind control
The people still in It are too far gone
Their minds have been hacked
They are walking clusters
Simply google the topic….”Crime is down in Los Angeles, CA.”
Apparently this is TRUE….there are several different articles from various sources….
However NONE of the articles mention Scientology as being the reason for the rate of crime being down.