You may have seen something I put in the Thursday Funnies about how Tampa “model ideal double St Hill size” org is working on making it viable to be on staff.
This is a another of the whopper lies in scientology — somehow these organizations that charge people hundreds of dollars AN HOUR for services, do not have money to give a decent wage to staff members. Most live on income levels that are unsustainable without: a) a spouse or someone else who supports them or b) they work a second and sometimes third job in their “spare” time — usually for a local scientologist.
This working on another job in addition to staff is called “Moonlighting” in scientology. L. Ron Hubbard despised the practice. The entire reason for the existence of WISE was to “get scientology businessmen off the ‘backs’ of orgs” — and Hubbard viewed them that way as they staffed their businesses with “his” org staff. He considered giving staff jobs to be poaching them, distracting from their ability to perform their functions in the orgs.
Hubbard wrote Policy Letters about it, laying down the law. His 1982 LRH ED 339R which is the bible of all orgs — the “game to make all orgs the size of old St Hill” had as a primary purpose the idea that org staff members would make more than a comparable job in the “wog” world once their org was “SH Size.”
Without going into great detail — believe it there is a LOT Hubbard had to say about the evils of “moonlighting” and that it represented not only incompetent local church leadership, but also incompetent management.
Of course, the catch phrase these days is “ideal org”. This is now supposed to be the magic bullet that solves all problems, including staff pay (of course, everyone knows this is a lie as the first “ideal org” and SH Size Org for decades, Tampa, still cannot pay its staff enough to live on). For the uninitiated, the reason is because there are written in stone allocations of funds that come in to scientology orgs — at the MOST they are entitled to 14% of the Corrected Gross Income (Total income MINUS all strict “donations” to IAS or Ideal Org or anything else, minus book, lecture and E-Meter sales, minus FSM Commissions, minus refund/repayments and a few other things). If a “service” business (which a scientology org most certainly is — it manufactures nothing and apart from books sells nothing other than personal services) tried to operate on about 10% of it’s revenue it would go belly up in a week. The only reason scientology doesnt is because it is artificially kept afloat by the staff who essentially run the business without being paid.)
But nobody is told this when they are being recruited to join staff in scientology organizations. They are told how excellent things are and that they “are expanding” and “pay is going good” and “the new system is terrific.” Any lie the person might buy will do.
Everyone knows the big push is on ideal orgs. It is the panacea to all that ails scientology (except where the ideal orgs already exist…)
So, one of the very prominent NON ideal orgs that has been being talked about for a decade now is the “Harlem ideal org”. Talked about and talked about. CGI videos have been shown of this “org” numerous times. They have been promoting their “imminent” opening for years.
Well, the “ideal org” in Harlem has a full time, dedicated SEA ORG member who is posted specifically to assist anyone they can get signed up to find a MOONLIGHTING JOB to supplement their “staff pay.”
And guess who this person is?
One of the “Let’s Make A Date” poster girls also seen in Thursday Funnies. Hannah Mets
“The organization is forming, and the staff need supplemental income.” Wow.
But then, perhaps even more shocking is this: “Many of them have moved from other states to join the team….”
Seriously, there are not enough people in NY? Even though the NY Org itself in the same city, is one of the first 5 “ideal orgs”? And is one of the oldest scientology orgs on earth. They are bringing in people from other states to man just the second org in the largest city in the US?
More evidence of the “big lie” — scientology is not expanding. Not even slightly. It is disappearing.
CLO EUS budget for the marble facade $30,OOO. The Filing cabinet to hold the PL and Bulletins for copying – $10,000. 1988. Staff pay: $30.00 per week except most of the time they used staff payroll to pay bills.
Oh and the marble was required to have 0 gray flecks or grain or veins because that was a color used by psychs. It was a crema delicatta variety with a reveal behind.
Ha Ha Ha Ha This is a joke of the century because I and a few others in 1972 brought the NY org to twice it’s size and more approaching and meeting the targets set out and I know that I did this since I have the reach and could disseminate.
Somewhere around 2005-06 (2-3 years before I was done!) I offered some work to a Portland Org staff member who I knew was financially crippled. At the time I had a cabinet shop. I wasn’t by any means doing great but I could spare some help.
A few weeks later I received a call from WISE. I bet you can guess where this is going…
I found out that very staff member wrote a KR on me for trying to help him. Yeah I was miffed by that as well.
When I mentioned how the Orgs were struggling and that I was just trying to help I got the usual….”That’s black PR.” The conversation of course went in circles.
It’s very interesting how Scientology pushed me away. But I’m so happy to be out from that control.
On January 11, 2016 at 10:24 pm
Mike Rinder said:
“It was the genus of WISE. It was the start of the heavy targetting of “scientology businessmen” and in fact it was the start of the dismantling of the GO as the data collection kept showing that many of the businesses that were hiring org staff were owned by members of the GO.”
Mike, this is kind of OT (Off Topic), but this particular misuse of the word, “genus” brings up a significant incident in my story of how I eventually left the Cherch. I hope everyone will indulge my little anecdote here.
In one of my courses, I read a line by LRH about catching something–meaning stopping or preventing it–“at genus.” I wish I could remember the reference but that was mid-70’s–sorry. Anyway, I looked at that sentence and its context every way I could look at it, and it clearly meant “at its beginning.”
I checked several different dictionaries, all I could find, and…
“Genus” means a class of things that have common characteristics that can be divided into subordinate kinds.”
Synonyms are “kind, sort, type, genre, style, variety, category, class, breed, brand, family, stamp, cast, ilk.”
The word “genesis” means “The origin or mode of formation of something.”
Synonyms are “origin, source, root, beginning, start, formation, development, evolution, emergence, inception, creation, formulation.”
Note that, although the two words come from the same root, they are nowhere near similar in meaning. There is no overlap in synonyms, and none of the synonyms of one approach similarity of meaning with any synonyms of the other.
In LRH’s document, he had used the word “genus” but clearly meant “genesis.” “Genus” simply DID NOT FIT the sentence and its context. No matter what I tried to contrive the sentence to mean, I COULD NOT make the word “genus” fit into a coherent meaning.
Any of you who remember your Study Tech can see what’s coming: If I thought there was a mistake in Ron’s writing, then the ONLY possibility–per Scripture– was that I had misunderstood a word. But I wasn’t adequately brainwashed enough to be able to doublethink my way around this discrepancy. It clearly WAS a mistake–I chalked it up to a typo at the time, but now I realize that Ron may not have just been using the wrong word. It’s an easy enough mistake to make—unless you’re perfect.
After half a day’s word-clearing and still unable to reconcile “genus” in the sentence, the study room supervisor (sorry, don’t remember the post title) finally sent me…somewhere else. after nearly 40 years, I don’t remember exactly how I finally got there, but I wound up in front of the Ethics Officer to be sec-checked, presumably because I persisted in thinking that Scripture written by LRH had a mistake in it. When he explained that I would have to pay for the sec-check, but (he said) there would be “case gain,” I finally balked (politely) and left the building.
I didn’t leave the Church then and there, but it probably was THE critical incident that precipitated my leaving not long afterwards—when I started tallying up the discrepancies I’d observed.
This was one of the basic courses. Every serious Scientologist in the CoS has done this course and had gotten past that error–not by correcting or ignoring the error (not allowed in Standard Study Tech) but by reconciling it in their minds.
This incident, where a minor typo or vocabulary error brought my study to an impassable halt, COMPELLED ME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT EVERY SINGLE SCIENTOLOGIST WHO DID THE COURSE–which was everybody in the Cherch– WAS COMPELLED TO ENGAGE IN COGNITIVE DISSONANCE. I couldn’t see how anybody could get through the course otherwise. They were COMPELLED to misunderstand the word “genus”, regardless of the ubiquitous dictionaries. It was the ONLY was to get through the course.
Well, there WAS one alternative: They could lie about noticing the discrepancy and pretend they’d reconciled it. But then, that wouldn’t be Standard Study Tech, and they’d be carrying an Overt and Withhold.
( Perhaps that explains why there are no Clears or OTs? Because everybody in the entire organization went past this sentence with either an MU or a W/H? )
(Sorry, I can’t get the satire font to work.)
I recall a sentence like that in Dianetics 55 – something like being in comm with the world “as it existed, as well as it exists.” WTF???
In desperation, after I blew a whole bloody course period on that, I pulled out my slim green mid-’70s edition when I got home: “…as it existed, as well as as it exists.”
One lousy “as.” Typos happen, they are not “scripture” haha. The older book was correct, and the newer one was not. It’s since been corrected in Miscavige’s new new new new release of the book. Or maybe it was the ’90s edition where it was corrected. I lose track you know, they shoulda just left those damned books alone 😉
On the Apollo in the 1970s, the weekly pay was $12 to $15 a week no matter if you had worked 40 to 60 hour weeks.
Over the decades many CSWs were sent to Hubbard to increase staff pay.
It never ever got handled.
Meanwhile Hubbard died with some $465 million and the cherch has at least 3 billion here and there.
when I was on staff at NYO I was making $2-$5 a week in the late sixties. That didn’t cover my subway fare. And yet we were being validated as the org that was supporting the Apollo. I finally got the job of night cleaner, which paid decently (for the time) and it pissed off other staff members who here execs and top auditors that I was getting more money than. That proportional pay plan was the pits Mimsey
Mike can you fix my post? it should read: who were top execs
Mimsey, you are right. The weakly “pay” ranged from $2 – $5 a week at the NYO back then – and the Org had a FULL academy and HGC!! I was one of several staff who sold plastic flowers in Times Square late Friday and Saturday nights.
We weren’t “money motivated” in the least – the late ’60’s was generally a period of anti-materialism.
Unfortunately Hubbard never got the memo.
Hi Len Zinburg, I like your post.I got $11.00 a week from 74-77, then the pay “soared” to $14.00 and in 78 to $17.00 at Asho Sea Org. Love, Ann.
That’s the reason staff of Class V orgs go wild on IAS, FSM and other regging, because this way they get paid something. The Org receives 10% commissions from IAS, Super Power…. They are NOT paid on their regular production. Most go hungry, no personal hygiene and no means to finish the month. What a Shame.
This is probably one of the most disgusting parts of scientology, and the thing that will cause the downfall of the COS. The outright lies that people who WANT to disseminate and spread scn are told to get them onto staff and then that they are castigated for having to do such mundane tasks as eat, sleep, shower and have clothes to wear is revolting. Particularly when I think of Miscavige and his 50,000 square foot mansion having 4 meals prepared for every meal – because he simply MUST have choices! – sleeping until noon and playing around with his $150,000 stereo systems! ugh, it just makes me feel terrible for the organisation staff. Especially in NYC! it is so ridiculously expensive to live there, I went to college in NYC and had practically a full time job in addition to help from my parents and STILL had to take out crazy loans. it’s as if the COS expects people not to be human, and by browbeating people enough they can make it so they don’t need things like food, shelter and clothing. what a loathsome organization.
I’m curious, if a staff member goes to Flag for training, does the church pay for that or is that on the staff members dime?
Technically the Church pays for it, but the reality is, Church’s are sooo piss poor they never pay Flag, then Flag will pull out of its ass a special Flag only LRH Directive which states that the Trainees are responsible to foot the bill. I know this because I used to have to deliver memos to staff and some of those came from Flag demanding the staff who trained there to pay up because the Church is not able to…
Ultimately it gets added to the staff member’s freeloader’s debt.
There was a radical sea change in the attitde towards staff moonlighting exactly around 1982 and exactly date co-incident with Miscavige’s usurpation of power. Before that the Orgs that I knew were relatively well-staffed with the majority moonlighting and no one was really bothered about this. From that year onwards I distinctly remember the SO Execs’ (or some of them) attitude became snarling and nattery about staff moonlighting. I don’t think that this is anything to do with Hubbard at all. Again he may not have liked it (but we don’t really know that) but he would not write a policy and the LRH ED you mention and then covertly undertake actions that by their implementation would shrink the Orgs – which is why he wrote the policy! But Miscavige would – and did.
Moonlighting, whether the SO Execs like it or not, meant the Orgs were at least relatively well-staffed (but not necessarily well paid – sometimes they were sometimes not) and since the implementation of this Miscavige alteration or covert destruction of the Moonlighting HCO PL since 1982, again has only helped to shrink Orgs to virtually nothing, along with his other nefarious schemes to do so, like donations. Whether he did this out fanaticism, stupidity or malice one can only take a guess and my guess is that all 3 are involved. But I don’t think it had anything to do with Hubbard.
Believe me, it has EVERYTHING to do with Hubbard. He did an “evaluation” that he called “ConEvil” (Confront of Evil) that was all about outside influences “taking over” scientology. This began in 1978 or perhaps 1977 (if Mark Fisher is reading this he can no doubt correct me if I am wrong on which date it was). It was the genus of WISE. It was the start of the heavy targetting of “scientology businessmen” and in fact it was the start of the dismantling of the GO as the data collection kept showing that many of the businesses that were hiring org staff were owned by members of the GO. This then led to the Mission Network (which was under the GO – GO WW was funded by the Mission Office WW) and they became a big target in Hubbard’s eyes.
The heavy ethics that started to be seen at the end of the 70’s and then into the bloodbaths of the early 80’s were directed specifically by Hubbard. He sent those people to SFO to declare the Mission Holders and when the recording of that whole event was sent to him he directed that it be transcribed and published and Highly Commended those involved, led by Miscavige.
Mike, I hope you keep this subject up for another day. It’s a VERY key subject of he Scientology experience. Your comment above on Ron and the infamous San Francisco mission holder’s conference is an EXTREMELY important one. I posted last week how the creation of the FSO violated tons of Scientology policy and many of the conditions formulas, helping to destroy org income. But LRH’s hand in the destruction of the top missions was possibly his MOST insane and vicious act in personally destroying the Scientology boom of the early 70s. I can tell you personally that about 80% of all San Francisco Day Org training was delivering through much of he 70s was to the Samuels and Wimbush missions. A number of SFO staff and MANY top SO members at this time also came from these missions. Was it Ron’s vindictive jealousy of Martin Samuels, Kingsley Wimbush and other top mission holders (who were sort of “godlike” in their own little fiefdoms) or was it his hunger for the cash they were pulling in to be sent to him instead at Flag? My guess is it was both. By the early 80s, SFO day was like a morgue. But of course, staff were not allowed to even question CoS management in any way. Not that that would have even occurred to staff, who were conditioned to believe that “Ron knows all is always right.” *I mention two famous California mission holders, but of course there were a number of these pioneers in the 60s and 70s throughout the USA who were the ones who actually GOT PEOPLE INTO SCIENTOLOGY (Kapular, Spickler, etc) But LRH just couldn’t stand it that these people were making lots of money and gathering tons of admiration in the Scientology world. And the toadie Miscavige knew how to how to exploit every part of Ron’s case.
Even the mission holders who got the Miscaviges into Scientology were declared.
Mike wrote: “Believe me, it [the San Francisco Mission Holders Conference] has EVERYTHING to do with Hubbard.”
Thanks for settling this, Mike. It is one of those things that has been very controversial for a long time.
Say – have you ever thought of writing a book, or maybe even starting a blog?
You have a lot of eyewitness experience and inside information that would be very helpful to people in sorting out what was done to them by Scientology.
Alanzo
Mike, you seem to be speaking about separate subjects to moonlighting. What you say about the Mission Holder’s Conference and the GO hiring staff may well be true, but I don’t see or know of any facts that Hubbard himself ordered an attack (which it became) on staff moonlighting.
I don’t think you want to see or know. I was there. So were plenty of other people. Apparently the information I have given just doesn’t fit your pigeonhole. But that is OK. To each his own.
Dear Mike, did LRH ever utter why he sent that mission out to break the Mission Network ? I mean, obviously it was money-motivated reasons, but I am just curious about what was his stated reason, his excuse , if you was privy to that information. Were there any written orders as such? Or was all of that simply handled kind of “backstage” w/out written records of it ? Thanks in advance.
Peter
The reason was that he was certain the missions were ripping off org public. This is what the “fines” were all about — for “stealing” public. Remember, a much smaller percentage of Mission income made it to “Int Reserves” and LRH than org income. He considered the Mission Holders to be “criminals” who were “getting rich” off his technology. Of course, there is some truth to this. Some of the Mission Holders WERE living high on the hog… Though they certainly didnt have income approaching his.
Thanks for your detailed reply, dear Mike ; I appreciate it. It was very helpful.
Peter
Mike,
I absolutely love when you set the record straight based on your extensive experience and knowledge of $cientology, LRH, Miscavige, mgmt, etc. It’s unfortunate that some people just don’t want to accept it.
When I joined a thriving org staff in 1970, we had 130 staff. My first week’s pay was a little over three bucks. At one point in 1971, we went seven weeks straight weeks with no pay (to handle a finance emergency brought about by overspending). I repeat … our org was thriving with lots of students and pcs, but apparently not enough. In those days, 31% of the CGI went to staff pay. Who knows where all the money went. We soon got an FBO and he ensured enough moolah DID go uplines. Then Flag opened, the org’s public was slowly taken away and it emptied out, not doing well to this day, forty years later. Augustine also made a good point in Ortega’s blog today that the IAS has also taken tons of money that one day would have gone to org services.
But the bottom line is, there was never ANY real intention, from Ron or anyone else in Scientology to see that org staff made any type of living wage. I repeat … NEVER. Otherwise it would have been done. The idea was ALWAYS to get free labor. In the 70s, one could rent a room for 30 or 40 bucks even in San Francisco or New York, but I still could not make it on staff pay. Once my father died in 1976, along with my twenty buck a week allowance (at age 25!!!!) I started moonlighting as a busboy on weekends, then as a typesetter, furniture salesman, etc etc Still had trouble making my monthly nut on food and rent as rents went up.
Nowadays, I don’t think there is anybody (after a couple of weeks) who has the illusion that they will be paid on org staff. I think what you get is second and third generation Scientologists on staff supported by their parents or MOST likely (I have seen) one partner in a couple makes the money in the wog world and the other person is on staff. No more forty buck rooms in glamorous big cities anymore.
As long as people agree to being slave labor … to save mankind of course … the plantation will still be open for business.
When I was on staff I was one of those moonlighters (40+ hrs regular job and 40+ hrs Scn). There were various times that the “Moonlighting” policies came out to remind everyone this was frowned upon (more to the point of Scn companies recruiting staff [to help them out]. And being a moonlighter your pay is automatically cut because you are not full time, not to mention the comments about how being a moonlighter you are not giving your all to the org or helping mankind.
As many have indicated those staff that survived on the pay had parents who had money taking care of them (not only helping them survive with food and clothing but paid for their courses and auditing), or the spouse working, and those without those helpers lived with several other people and most of them on couches or floors and could barely afford food.
After I left there was a small change in their pay which increased slightly but still times of no pay when stats are down or income was down and utilities not paid, etc. Then if those poor buggers get sick (“they were of course PTS so their fault”, NOT) no pay, no help (until it was too late and they ended up dropping their bodies), no way to live for sure.
And the new people who would come in and the shock on their faces when receiving their first paycheck. Some would get irate and a lot of them would not come back. The only ones who would try to stick it out a bit longer had taken courses or received some auditing that they felt helped them.
Would you like the bottom line truth on my “staff pay and enhancing my resume” experience? When I first got into Scientology I did not have a full time job. I was a student and then a staff member. Finally a staff member offered me a job under the table. I didn’t want it so the ED of the org (NY FDN) offered me a different job under the table, because his whole second job outside the church was off the books, I did not want that either. That ED then got into a fight with me about it. Now I just told you what his missed w/h was so for him to set an example like that to me when I still was not even sure what an engram was yet, is to this day unforgivable. My ENTIRE “journey up the Bridge” is corner stoned with these type of incidents.
Jerry indursky?
I wonder … does OSA have a stat, or is there any CofS stat, of successful falsehoods?
OSA used to call me weekly for deprogramming cycles. Back then they were concerned about CAN and blows.
They’ve been playing this game since the early 70’s. Promoting that staff will soon be paid well because of this or that bright idea being implemented and all we need is Big Beings like YOU to fill this or that post to make it happen.
Some of the old time staff have been wishing and hoping their way through life, refusing to give up on the dream or admit they had been duped.
My experience has been that a really knowledgeable auditor who only cares about the person he’s auditing can help a person with his concerns to the point where the auditor is well thought of and generates good word of mouth. I believe that out of every 100 staff members you get maybe five or six who can actually help. You have 50 or 60 stumbling around wondering what the hell they are doing there. You have rest sabotaging the efforts of the 5 or 6 by trying to “handle” the public. “Handle” meaning they are trying to control or manipulate them for a stat, most frequently for money.
It’s really a pathetic scene.
Good summation Les. Pity it’s true.
To paraphrase all New Yorkers: How about that Mets!
Them Mets. How ’bout them Mets.
It’s probably the most affront you can face concerning the scientology organisation – it’s treatment of its own dedicated staff member.
For an organisation to lie and steal from it’s public is bad enough but for those who were never in and feel they know about what this subject is about, you’ll always be missing the true essence of what the underlying betrayal inherent to that group presents and feels like, i.e. how it treats its own. It can never be excused by the effort and struggle to cease the decay of mankind or confront the truth of life and present a path to the salvation of the spirit, it’s about the way you treat and feel about the person next to you. What you think of them, how you get along with them. Do you consider them a friend, someone to protect etc. IMO when those emotions become bonded with unseen betrayal and the struggle against tyranny from within for which you cannot fight against, it leaves a deep scare which is very hard to come to terms with. It’s a hurt which follows you around and is an unwelcome visitor when two ex-staff exchange experiences reminiscing about the time they spent under the false auspices of church management. It’s a silent affliction for the most part.
In my experience after a decade on staff the highest emotion I was left with concerning the people I worked with was pity and sorrow. Even though they turned on me and treated me as a traitor because I walked out I was too stunned to acknowledge the true impact. I know today what a evil system it truly is – it makes good people do evil and ugly things. And you just know in your heart they are going to severely regret their actions one day and there’s nothing you can do to stop it – horrible!
I guess the greatest difficulty is acknowledging the fact no matter what you say or pretend, you just can’t stand to see someone else badly treated and betrayed. I have little time for the cold and heartless people of life but actually do like to see others doing well. You won’t find that in the church of scientology, no matter how hard you look or expect to find it. Every cent in the scientology coffers has been acquired under false pretences.
Look don’t listen, simple words, extremely tough to apply.
“Seriously, there are not enough people in NY? ”
On the floor! 2FF! Mike you are a triple threat! You can COUNT!
A copy of the staff contract (although now they try to call them service volunteers) is at http://tonyortega.org/2014/02/23/sunday-funnies-theres-a-new-contract-for-scientology-staff-workers-and-we-have-a-copy/
You are really on top of the math Mike. BOOM!
As I recall, my daughter, who’s been a long time staff member at Tampa was being paid nothing and that had been going on for a while. This was a few years ago.
Gail, if this was a few years ago, she’s probably making less than nothing…
Pretty sure it is Hannah Mets at the 9:57 mark of this video telling these Harlem residents and community activists to stop filming the Org. They did not appreciate it in the least. It’s from Jan of 2014.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8JIIcUTDsA
Love that video. NOI nutter gets in face of Scio nutter. I think my favorite is the young lady’s attempts at Scio-handling, with her pseudo agreements of I-get-that and I-understand, and how they bounce right off the glib exterior of that dude. But seriously, if he’s got a problem with the NOI/Scilon alliance (and he should), he really ought to be aiming his pointed questions at his bow-tied bosses back the NOI place of business. These Scientologists have no better understanding of their own situation than does newborn babe.
Well if that’s her she’s had a seriously expensive makeover for the recruitment shot; hair dyed and straightened, eyebrows plucked, toner, secretary-style specs, the lot. Mind you, one of my most enduring memories of Sea Org berthing was the stench. Working 14+ hours a day without good nutrition and hygiene routines makes mass-berthing a pretty unpleasant environment. Brook House where we lived near Saint Hill would have been condemned as uninhabitable. Indeed it was uninsurable – a point which was to bite them in the bum when it eventually burnt down due to clothes catching fire while being dried over an electric heater. But that’s another story. Point is, Sea Org living, unless you have Officer’s or married quarters is a sorry place to be. And could well make a fresh-faced Hannah look like a bedraggled nag. Maybe the recruitment shot is the “before” and the shot of on the streets in Harlem the “after” a few month/years in the SO.
Hi Martin Padfield, A terrific post! My first weeks in Sea Org I had room 404 at the Hollywood Inn with one other girl! Wonderful I thought then.Well before I went to The Excalibur for Product 0, The Sea Org Recruiter got a Dad,Mom and two daughters from the homeless shelter to join up.All of a sudden I was moved to 707 being seventh floor a great view of the Hollywood sign but five in one room four who were family was nuts! The Mom & Dad blew the second week and the two girls 17 & 16 I think, stayed about six months then left.They followed me around and told me they thought Scientology & Sea Org was going to pay them well and they had read and knew nothing of Ron or his books.Sad! After that I got moved to 406 and five ladies plus moi were in that room until I blew in 78. I got a little suitcase with a lock because my earrings etc always seemed to walk away.And I was always at the laundra-mats because I love clean linens and towels and that room got very fragrant very fast! Love, Ann
No, that’s another Sea Org girl.
If she is living in Harlem she is way better off than CLO EUS in Hell’s kitchen.
I read Hannah’s pitch and sadly she’s probably a lifer. Oddly, if I didn’t know better, a lot of the pitch would be appealing.
LRH approved “living on the Dole” or welfare checks and food stamps helped me thru several years of day/foundation 80 hour week years. Average pay was about $28 per week in the early 90’s.
Of course he would…HE didn’t have to pay it.
Years ago I was close friends with a staff member who was given a very hard time due to her having to moonlight. Long story, but she was KR’d and castigated and otherwise made wrong by the then E/D of our org because she needed to earn money to feed, clothe and shelter herself AND be on staff FULL TIME at our Class V org. She WANTED very much to be on staff and moonlighting was her means to that end. She was trying so hard to “make it go right” Well the E/D harrassed her and made her wrong and not long afterwards she blew. Now, that E/D was a Sea Org member sent to our org for a while who hated moonlighting and constantly not-ised the necessity for staff to have outside jobs.
Well, that was then, obviously.
Nowadays, LRH and his policies be damned, Sea Org members are POSTED in Class V orgs for the PURPOSE of HELPING staff moonlight and they even have Linked In pages advertising this.
Yes, Co$ is circling the drain, alright.
And yet there is still an attempt to camouflage the actual moonlighting scene.
This SO gives the reason for the necessity for moonlighting as “Harlem Org is forming”.
Seriously, who does this girl think she’s kidding?
For nearly 30 years, every staff member I’ve ever known has been moonlighting and IS moonlighting, unless he/she is a trust fund baby. or supported by wog-jobbing, non-staff spouse or family.
So true, Aquamarine. LRH was against abortions, yet the SO are pushed to get abortions and get them “on the dole” for free by going to state Medicaide places to get them. LRH hated “being on the dole” yet staff are forced to do so by getting food stamps because the orgs don’t pay them enough. If this was seen for what it is, “a business,” they would be shut down in a minute for having slave labor and being a sweat shop. My kids were on staff at LA Org and they told me that the pay was very low and sometimes so low, like a dollar or under, that they just donated their paycheck back to the org pot as another contribution besides their blood, sweat, and tears. Both my kids had to moonlight and live at home for free room and board to make it on staff.
What a way for 20-something young people to live. No salary, no social life, stuck at home with a parent for a roof over their head and a bed to sleep in, and any time left over spending at some going nowhere moonlite so they can at least eat. Well, they’ll wake up, maybe when they’re in their 30s or 40s, and realize how severely they were conned, and how they should have listened to you. I’ve read your story, Cindy. I’m so sorry.
As usual, following LRH policy is a damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don’t proposition. Either you don’t moonlight, according to that particular policy, and you can live in a van down by the river, or you do moonlight and you can therefore work 100 hours/week to just keep your head above water. Of course the real question isn’t whether or not you’re on policy. The real question is how fast and how far can you get away from Scientology and anything to do with LRH, so that you have a chance at a normal life.
So disturbing that they would lie like this to recruit people! I used to volunteer at a Ten Thousand Villages store (a program of the Mennonite Central Committee) a few hours a week, and they made it clear from the beginning that such positions were unpaid. Volunteers got a discount on the store’s products, so you could say we were encouraged to buy them, but there was no pressure to do so.
Orgs are parasites, literally sucking the life-force from its staff. And when that life-force runs dry, they are kicked to the curb. No living wage, no healthcare, no retirement funds, no nothing really. And if you’re not “tough” enough to make it on staff, well you’re pretty much a DB. But, they are kind enough to give you a program to make you more employable.
This is one of those cases where the problem is hiding in plain sight. The biggest problem faced by staff members is the Org itself! Eliminate that and staff can get real jobs and begin to live their lives, free from the oppression of Scientology.
From 1976-1978, I made $80/week as the senior supervisor for the SHSBC at ASHO Fdn. My ex-husband (Robbie Robinson) was a Power auditor in the HGC for ASHO/F and frequently made $0 because Power sessions were intended to be brief and he was often unable to audit the minimum hours needed for him to be eligible for pay. (Although, to be fair, he might have socialized when he could have been auditing, but that’s beside the point.) Even then, no one made enough money to live on. I took a day job to keep us going.
Robin, I know Robbie R and we used to work together. Is he OK? I Heard he had cancer and was still drinking the Kool Aid. What is he doing nowadays?
Hi Robin, What a small world! Robbie Robertson was my auditor at Asho F! I could not re-call the name. He was one of my good ones! We got along great. Then one day he was taken away from me and I went thru a bunch of people doing training etc until I finally got a C/S and auditor I loved until they were RPFed and Guardian’s Intel took over. So sorry if he has cancer Tough either in or out but especially for those who remain in until the Sea Org kicks you out! I love all your posts too.Love, Ann.
This was the straw that broke the camel’s back for me. I was very close to moving to another state to join staff but I couldn’t get a straight answer on how much money I would receive and was assured that I would be able to at least pay rent, which was my concern. I found out how much I would be making while in training and receiving staff “pay” and it was next to nothing. There was no way I could live on it and there would not have been much time left over to “moonlight” with the required course room study time and required helping for events. It was all about getting me there, no matter what it took. I am so glad I found out before making this huge move! This huge lie is actually what made me start looking into things online where I found you brave people here. I have heard it said quite a lot that this organization is digging its own grave and this is a prime example. I’m done!
Welcome out!
You may want to take a look at the list of ex-COS-members speaking out about what is going on in the organisation:
http://whyweprotest.wikia.com/wiki/Former_Church_of_Scientology_members_who_have_spoken_out
It is a list of well over 2,500 people. 🙂
One day, while she was working with L Ron Hubbard in the late 1970’s, Melanie Murray walked into L Ron Hubbard’s office and told him that her father, George Seidler (RIP) who ran the Peoria, IL Mission since the early 1950’s, said that public can not afford the price of auditing and training and it needs to be lower if we are ever going to clear the planet.
This was during the “monthly rising prices” period in Scientology, while Mary Sue and 10 other top Scientology officials were being indicted and tried for felonies and headed for prison.
The Gross Income graph was in steep affluence on Hubbard’s wall. It had graphs taped on top of other graphs it was in such a steep rise.
Melanie stood there with her TRs in waiting for an answer to this fundamental situation, if the purpose of Scientology really was “to Clear the planet”.
Hubbard, pointing at his Gross Income graphs, told her emphatically, “Do you see that graph? I’m not changing anything!”
Scientology was never about “clearing the planet”. That was only a totalist implant designed to make Scientologists feel that they had joined something larger than themselves, and to switch on their hive impulse which compelled them give their lives for The Cause.
Scientology was also never about paying staff a living wage. Had that actually been true, many policies would have been corrected and/or cancelled over the years to correct this “outpoint” when it was first evident that staffs were poverty stricken.
No, none of these were outpoints to L Ron Hubbard.
They were pluspoints.
These were pluspoints to L Ron Hubbard because the purpose of Scientology was ALWAYS to make L Ron Hubbard rich.
End of story.
Alanzo
Bravo !! Hurray!!! Kudos to you Alanzo. Apparently L. Ron said that the truth cannot be stopped even by 17 inch armour. Lol
Wait. T C stands for The Cause? I thought we were supposed to give our lives to Tom Cruise
Oops… busted!!
Caught on another lie, another deception of which, truly, I have lost count.
Thank you Mike, great report.
Staff Pay has always been low.
I made around $70. a week and drove a Taxi
at night to make ends meet. got 2 to 3 hours sleep a day
and routed out to get a real job .
You made a lot more than me. I’m jeolas of your Scientology wealth…
I learned a lot but not enough to see the light just yet.
DeSoto, Jose? SEVENTY BUCKS A WEEK!!! I could have lived like a freakin’ king in San Francisco making that amount back then!! In 1976 I was paying $65 a month rent and couldn’t pay that on org pay, thus my bussing tables all weekend. By 1978, I had to move and my rent went to $110 a month. I was making less than eighty bucks A MONTH those years and I was a freakin’ Case Supervisor, sometimes working in BOTH orgs. By 1978, I had to moonlight as a computer operator at Mt. Zion Hospital out on Divsadero doing a graveyard shift every Saturday night. Well, I was young then and my body could take the one night a week of not sleeping. And now we find out the CoS and LRH were LOADED with cash. Sons of bitches. Well … we did have cool parties every couple of weeks with a band and a lot of drinking and …. I think that’s out nowadays.
Golden years, indeed. Travel well, David Bowie. 1947-2016 I always loved the duet with you and Bing Crosby singing Little Drummer Boy. You’re already missed….
Thanks for the reminder. That was/is incredible.
It’s a sad day. It’s just not right, David gone.
I also noted today that we’ve lost Sally Field, a fine actress and first rate human being. RIP, Sally.
Sally Field is still alive, fortunately.
Sally Field is still alive. She won’t go on the cart, she is feeling much better.
Knowing Sally as I do I doubt a little think like death is going to keep her down. I expect a full recovery!
Noooo Say it isn’t so! RIP David
My fav of ALL time. 🙂 <3
Hi OSD, Always love David Bowie’s music. Heroes one of my favorites. He and I are in the same club of those that fight cancer.RIP David. I am sure you have quite the Band up there.I’ll be-able to hear it one day.I’ll be on my black opal rock with my conch shells waiting on y’all and Indie8onemillion to join me!Love you 2! Ann.
As a New Yorker, let me state that this is great news. Disappear, Scio-org. Disappear in a New York minute!
This is a very expensive city to live in. You can’t just drop in to take a sub-minimum wage job and expect to afford your rent. And forget about dinner out at Per Se.
Did the staff at “old saint hill” make a decent wage ?
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!! Now that’s some funny shit, Phil! Wait…you were serious? Bwahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!
I guess pay was nothing like the freeloader bill,,,,lol
Actually…they’re paid an indecent wage. A slave wage.
I could be wrong, but pre-Sea Org and pre-Proportionate Pay Plan, SH staff were paid salaries commensurate to the local area.
If you count ‘Proximity to Big Being No. 1’ as being of value, then the pay was awesomely exactly priceless.
Good question! – anyone know the real, non emotional answer in todays monetary terms?
There used to be an issue (perhaps dark blue ink on blue paper?) in the old blue packs of Executive Directives that said that St Hill had paid normal wages to its staff. Then when Hubbard left, the proportionate pay plan was instituted and pay plummeted.
The proportionate pay plan was never to pay the staff anyways, it was to protect Hubbard from the liability of having to meet payroll.
I was told they wanted me on staff at Cincinnati and watched their video in the glass cubicle. Later I asked about pay as they were trying to pressure me into buying my Purif. I was told it was pretty good.. Esp for auditors, which was my interest in training. Based on this post and other research I believe the truth was absent the room. He did say a percentage… Around 600. A week, I thought but maybe that was a month? These posters you post are so frightening to me.
Glad I got out of there and woke up… Before it was too late.
Disa, we’re all glad you got out too! Hope you stick around Mike’s Blog.
Thanks, Old Surfer Dude… Once I found out about Independents, it was time to split!
I think I’ve mentioned this before but I know a staff member who earned $13 per week during 2014, it will almost certainly be less for 2015 as the redo’s for the GAG 2 had already paid during 2014, Amazing that this was a “good year” and yet they still need to moonlight just to be able to afford to eat. Daily travel to the org from our neighbourhood costs $30 per week so they are paying for the priviledge of being there. As Mike correctly said, any business trying to operate in this way would have gone belly up years ago.
Gimpy, are you kidding? Seriously? They were getting $13 a week???? I am so rejoining staff ASAP…
$13.US Dollars per week !
This will start a stampede to sign up !
A Brain Surgeon in Asia makes $10. per week
and works more hours than Scientology Staff.
I think Org staff should form a union. Then go on strike to get better wages and benefits. Of course Miscavige would go ballistic and declare them all. Then what would he have? Totally empty idea orgs with really big utility bills that the IAS would have to pay.
It would never happen, but legally they could have a case for leaving and taking the org building with them.
There are precedents for Christian churches leaving their head organization and being awarded the church property. It usually hinges on if the local congregation has paid for it, and provided all the upkeep on it for a number of years. That probably fits most orgs, unless there’s an IAS “loan” that they’ll be paying back forever.
As scientology hunkers down to ‘Christian Science Reading Room’ mode (NEVER seen anyone at the ones in PAC Base’s back yard of Hollywood and Los Feliz), whether or not Dave is incarcerated/exiled, will hire SEIU union cleaning services to take care of the Ideal Props as a Perpetual Trust.
You keep catching them in their inconsistencies and utter lying. Go Mike!!!
She should add “If you can not provide work, maybe you have spare food, clothing or even cigarettes that haven’t been smoked too far down. Lets save this planet and then the Universe!!!! Remember we are the top 1% of the top 1% of the top 1%……… When you look into the eyes of our poor, confused and uneducated staff, how will you answer this question: “Did you help?”.
Priceless.
🙂
You forgot to mention toilette paper! And deodorant. And female sanitary products…
Poor bastards. Thirteen dollars a week is less than most kids get as an allowance.
Good to see that your wit and wisdom has remained intact after all these years.
My cat is treated better than a scio staff member but still feels it has to supplement it’s diet with rodents.
Then again to the cat I’m staff.
Ever get the feeling you just can’t win? You sure won’t with being a scientology staff member – guaranteed! I’m still hopeful with the cat…
For decades, nuns in the Catholic Church were the unpaid labor that served as teachers in schools or health care providers in Catholic hospitals. While they do not lead materialistic lives, they do have to meet their basic needs of food, clothing and shelter. For this reason, they no longer provide services without pay. The money they earn is a shared resource that goes to their community of nuns. They provide for each other and for those nuns that are unable to work due to age and health. No one expects nuns to be Walmart greeters on the side. They are not dedicating their lives to the accumulation of real estate for the Pope.
In comparison, what happens to the Scientologists who are no longer able to “serve”? Do other Scientologists make sure their basic needs are met? Are they able to live with dignity, or are they cast out without a prayer’s chance of survival other than the generosity of the family members they have disconnected from? I think I know the answers to these questions.
My aunt was a nun and her accomodations were very pleasant. In her later years she was unable to do much and lived comfortably without “contributing.” Then she had a stroke and was completely disabled for a couple of years. The Catholic Church provided for her and her fellow nuns took care of her with kindness, compassion and company until she passed away. They did not offload her.
” More evidence of the “big lie” — scientology is not expanding. Not even slightly. It is disappearing.”
Hip hip, ___________________!
And Coop, that’s why they’re known as the Amazing Disappearing Cult. And no one outside the cult is helping this to happen. They’re doing it all my themselves….
Tom,
Didn’t see you at the Golden Globes. Were you concerned that Ricky Gervais might bring up the subject of all of those skeletons that are used to fill your closets?
I have always wondered what happens when the first pay period rolls around and the new staff recruit receives his/her check….. Once they lift thier chin off the ground what happens?
Do a lot of the staff quit once they discover they have been lied to? I don’t understand how these people live….is there some sort of berthing for non-SO staff members? How can they afford NY rents?
What happens if they quit? Are they declared immediately?
Do they sign any kind of emoyment contract?
From my experience, 90% never return the following Monday. But, hey, that’s what’s amazing about Fast-Flow Recruitment. Only Kool-Aid junkies stick.
You’re being funny but what you’ve said is true, Statpush. Time and again I received glowing verbal testaments to the joys and rewards of being on staff, from NEW staff trying to recruit me, who, a month or so later, were nowhere to be seen. After a while I was pretty jaded about this and would listen and smile politely and say, “I’m so glad for you”, and either change the subject or high-tail it out of there on some pretext or another. Most of the new ones I saw come and go over a 30 year period lasted a month.
” How can they afford NY rents? ”
Rent a studio apartment and put 25 staff members in it! They can pay the rent provided one of them is from a whale family.
Isn’t this a Trade Secret?
Well, it was until you just brought it up. Way to go, TFB. Way to go!
Education : Church of Scientology
Oh dear.
Ms Mets is headed for a life filled with industrial-grade disappoint. What a waste.
I can tell you what happens, from my own experience. Something similar happened both times I was recruited for staff. CofS recruiters lie non-stop about the actual conditions. For instance, during my first time being recruited for staff, I told them as a young person (had just turned 22) I didn’t have too many responsibilities so didn’t need to make too much, a simple $200/wk should do. They said that shouldn’t be a problem.
I had no reason to doubt it. I was green as grass, and $200/wk was a very reasonable wage. My rent depended on it, but after I agreed to start working for the mission that initially recruited me, I stopped looking for other work because I was told I had a job where I could make $200.
What really happened was the first week pay came and there was nothing at all. I was alarmed but told that happens with proportionate pay sometimes but that next week will be better so I hung on.
The next week came, and we got paid! I was happy because rent was already past due. I eagerly opened the envelope but when I did, it was only $5.
The HES said something like “Hey, you could get a whole big mac with that!” with a big grin. I ended up losing my apartment because I had trusted them, worked for them, and they were lying. They knew that mission had never paid anything like $200/wk.
When I got pissed about them lying to me and hurting my life, they told me that the only reason people get upset is because they commit overts. See, it wasn’t that they were a bunch of liars who hurt me, it was ME who had the problem.
Sadly, I didn’t understand at the time that having me write up MY overts instead of them writing up their lies was totalitarian mind control, so unfortunately, I went along with it. I wrote up MY overts. You DO stop being mad because forcing YOU to confess allows them to maintain a dominant position, with you under their control. They ended up getting away with their lies and harm, so they do it again.
I have found CofS recruiters to often be dishonest, not telling how bad things really are. They know they can get away with it because once the person finds out the truth and gets pissed about it, they can easily be brought under back under CofS domination and control by making them confess. That it’s evil seems to escape them.
Wow. Hannah’s post actually surprised me. (When am I gonna learn.) “It is disappearing” for sure and going through all sorts of weird gyrations on its way to death. It reminds me of a worm that’s moved into the sun for too long and is dehydrating to death and there is nothing anyone can do to help it survive at this point.
I do like her fixed, dedicated glare, however. Still the same worm on its way out though.
Yeah, when hot female cult members gave me the 1,000 yard stare, I was putty in their hands.
Did you cling to them?
Like glue…
I think she is in stage three of the ‘TR zero’ process Mary.
Stage 1) Smiling and happy with sparkly eyes – happy to be joining a cult
Stage 2) Fixed dedicated glare – being there to get your stats in power
Stage 3) Starting to glaze over – realizing you can’t have an uptrend forever.
Stage 4) The Look of nowhere – another day with 1.5 hours sleep
Stage 5) Full Robot tard, dull eyes – I must do what Dave says to survive.
? I believe you’re right.
Scary, to say the least.
My experience in Scientology only goes back to 1977, but your article is true at least since then.
“Scientology is not expanding. Not even slightly . It is disappearing”. – to which I say: Bye bye.
I say, “So long; Farewell; auf Wiedersehen, Adieu and Good Night.”
Nah nah nah nah, nah nah nah nah, hey hey hey….GET THE FUCK OUT OF TOWN!
And nothing of value will be lost. 😛
The truth is that even if Tampa looks unable to pay normal wages to stffs, it’s because Hubbard and miscavige never want to pay anything or anyone the correct price. That’s called theft, fraud, and utter disgusting dishonesty from both “leaders” of the scxam.
Nothing to argue with here. COS has a COD relationship with creditors, except for the new and uninitiated.
They have not ever even been able to pay non-normal wages to staff. The cult has redefined what a ‘minimum wage’ is ……………….spelled Zee fucking Ro.
Yo Dave,
Let’s get those admin vols reprinted and corrected to fix the obvious errors in commas and semi colons. Some low life must have put a period in the wrong place …………. like Ogre Staff pay………….$.01/week.
Certainly even One who has nearly completed a high school education can get this math straightened out? Or you could ask Lou, maybe she completed her GED? Whaddayasay big boy?
BTW, what are you going to be selling at Big Being No. 1s birthday this year?
Coop, I’m very sorry, but, I knew Zee Fucking Ro. I worked with Zee Fucking Ro. Zee Fucking Ro was my friend. You sir, are no Zee Fucking Ro! Sorry Coop….had to be said.