Thanks to Christi Gordon for uncovering some new documents that have not seen the light of day before.
This one is a fascinating glimpse into the mindset of the Sea Org with respect to children.
The basic gist of this issue from 1982 is this.
Sea Org members are supposed to produce 5X what it costs to retain them
Babies produce no monetary exchange to the Sea Org
Babies cost the Sea Org at least $3000 a year
To be able to keep a child in the Sea Org you have to prove that you are providing more than adequate exchange for yourself AND for your child(ren) otherwise you are not “qualified” to have children
Without approval that you meet the qualifications, no services or money will be allocated.
This is the first page of this document:
You can find a copy of the complete document, with its attached form to be filled out by parents here: Parent Financial Eligibility Review FLAG Pilot
For a taste, here are the first 2 pages of the 8 page form:
Of course, Captain Miscavige later decreed that children in the Sea Org were a distraction and an unnecessary expense and Sea Org members were forbidden to have further children. That heralded in the era of coerced abortions for SO members, and those who refused when they fell pregnant were sent off in shame to “small and failing orgs” to fend for themselves until their children were old enough to return to the Sea Org.
The “champions of family values” exposed with their own documents once again.
Jere Lull says
Those POOR kids playing “cadets”.
“Momma, don’t LET your kids grow up to be scientologists…”
Mick Wenlock says
I am going to make a comment which may surprise some people. While in the SO our son was born (in Copenhagen, FOLO EU) he had congenital rubella syndrome , was born deaf/blind and with developmental issues. Sean was with us through the rest of our SO time. He came with us to Flag, he had a nanny/companion just for him. It was hell sometimes getting him fed (he was an incredibly fussy eater (he still is). Even when I was on the RPF no-one suggested us routing out. I can’t say why it happened this way you would think,given the CoS attitude to the disabled we would have been barraged by snide. But we never ever were.
Most of the people in the SO, in my experience were ordinary decent people.
Jere Lull says
True, in my experience. Individual crew were “decent”, as best they could be due to the strains of being crew AND the number of rules disallowing normal human relations.
Rosemarie says
I keep remembering how awful it is to try and get forms approved for staff. The form could sit in their inbox maybe for days. Next guy on the form says you filled it out wrong or incomplete data so now you have to start over. If you finally get to the end of the form it can still be disapproved anyhow. I remember it taking weeks sometimes so if you wanted to go home for a funeral forget it! By the time your senior even read it the funeral is over! Do they care? No! If sea Org members apply to have a baby that form could take years I bet! On purpose too. Anything to discourage personal desires or needs !
Xenos says
If a couple refuses to abort the child but they still want to be in the sea org im guessing that they will get kicked out and will have to pay the freeloaders bill even though they are not the ones deciding to leave ?
Jere Lull says
But they ARE the ones deciding to leave! They know the rules: NO kids; so deciding to get pregnant and deciding NOT to abort it, and deciding that your family is more important to you than scientology’s expansion, are ALL selfish decisions that degrade scientology’s business — err.. mission of making money, more MONEY, so Dwarfenführer® can conquer/”clear” the WORLD! All gone just because THEY were so self-centered so as not to see the greater goods for Davey.
Real says
Not surprising. Hubtard was never interested in making making anything but money. In the SO you could get away with murder, literally if you were bringing in cash to Hubbard’s coffers. ALL High Crimes were ignored because, as Hubtard wrote, “the ONLY real crime is to be poor.”
Ms. B. Haven says
Real, as in Réal Laplaine? Just curious.
Jere Lull says
Réal Laplaine wouldn’t have anything to do with any of Davey’s considerations, since his income doesn’t go directly to ASI, under Davey’s control.
Doug Sprinkle says
He actually said that?
Jere Lull says
I don’t recall seeing/hearing him say it, but it SEEMS like something Hubbard would have said at one time or another. He certainly LIVED the poor life before he dreamed up Dianetics, then scientology.
John Doe says
I came across an old CSW I had written many many years ago.
It was a CSW begging permission to get married. It’s both tragic and humorous now when I look at it. To think that these “approval terminals” had a say over something like somebody else getting married.
Scientology only has the power over you that you grant it and this is a good example of that.
There used to be a joke, “Is it a real marriage or a Sea Org marriage?” Except it wasn’t a joke. Because everything is so subordinated to scientology‘s interests, a major life event such as getting married is just Dev-T.
Ms. B. Haven says
One really has to love item B. 10. Apply this question to the Founder, L. Ron Hubbard and see where it leads…
B. ORIGINATOR answers the following questions and attaches tabbed evidence.
10. Has the applicant studied the parent hat? (If already a parent, get evidence of wearing that hat well and demonstrating responsibility as a parent.)
Q: How many wives to you have?
A: Two, no three, no just two. Yup, just two.
Q: What inspired you to dedicate your book Science of Survival to your daughter Alexis?
A: Alexis who?
Q: When is the last time you saw Quinten?
A: Look what that little fucker did to me…
Q: What did you think of Nibs’ Penthouse interview?
A: crickets…
Q: How is Mary Sue doing these days?
A: You’ll have to talk to her parole officer about that?
Q: Do you have any further evidence to present that shows your glowing 2D stats?
A: How about we just all join in song with a good ol’ round of “Thank you for Listening”?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpTUhN__FRk
Joe says
Our cadet chant went something like your:
We work all day,
We never get paid,
We drive a shitty bus.
We’re the cadets.
The Moose says
So even while the cult founder was still alive, the organization was not truly interested in expansion, which might be facilitated with new children being born into it. They were only interested in extracting as much short-term labor and cash as they could out of their existing followers.
otherles says
Short term thinking gets them nowhere. No tomorrow means no today.
PickAnotherID says
That makes it pretty clear that the purpose of the “Dedicated $cientologists of the Sea Org” is to make money, period. Anything that interferes with bringing in the money is not allowed, including children. Doesn’t sound like much of an organization deserving 501(c)3 tax exempt status to me.
Jere Lull says
There are MANY reasons Davey’s little organization shouldn’t have tax-exempt status. Dedication to squirreling away money is hardly the worst of them. It’s pretty common in other “religions”, anyway.
Alcoboy says
I can see those little kids in the picture singing
some little ditty like this:
I want to be in the Sea Org!
Yes, I want to be in the Sea Org!
I’ll be among the most theta elite!
Yes, I want to be in the Sea Org!
Pathetic, ain’t it?
safetyguy says
Pretty much. Yes it is. Shameful too.
safetyguy says
What I do not nor will I ever understand. This would be reason enough for me to leave.
The Sea Org is suppose to be the most dedicated members of the church of scientology. The best and brightest. Problem, what is the OT requirements for joining the Sea Org? None that I read of. Just a warm body, to begin with, who signs a “contract.” No requirements for progression on the almighty “bridge” either. So how is this the most dedicated members? They very well may have never achieved any “progress” at all in the “religion.” But, but, but they are the most dedicated members of the church. Really? I would think a truly dedicated member would be at least OT III. You know, the knowledge of the whole Xenu thing.
All I can do is shake my head. I will never understand that. The most dedicated are not dedicated at all but are driven by their task masters.
Jere Lull says
If you’re in the SO, this is just ANOTHER “little” irritant on top of all the others that you “agree” to (or else). EVERYTHING is regulated as much as possible. Communists could only HOPE to be as controlling as scn’s upper echelons.
Mat Pesch says
A basic belief of the Cherch of scientology is that for every bean (dollar) spent there must be many more beans in return. Unfortunately your baby only eats beans, thus we have no use for it.
Alcoboy says
Y’know, if what LRH says is true, then I have the perfect economic solution:
LET’S ALL STOP HAVING KIDS!
Of course this would drive mankind to extinction within a generation but at least we’ll be applying LRH tech.
Angry Gay Pope says
The one “BEANS” they don’t care about? Human Beans.
Mat Pesch says
Funny!
Jere Lull says
The baby only EATS beans, returning anything BUT beans for too long a time.
Fred G. Haseney says
What about the sheer joy of having children? Children are, after all, our future. What about the Second Dynamic? Survival through the family and children?
The hoops a Scientologist must jump through in order to become a Sea Org member marks that person’s importance to the group. The Sea Org safeguards Scientology. It should also safeguard the future of their group, which should include repopulating the planet.
To view children and child-rearing as some kind of demeaning second class thing is unthinkable. Thank you, Mike and Christi, for bringing the “Parent Financial Eligibility Review FLAG Pilot” to light.
The PFERF is grotesque.
I remember in 1980 the “trouble” caused when Sea Org members Scott and Patricia (Kettler) Foster learned that she was pregnant.
The PFERF is a waste of time and causes more trouble than it is worth.
Cindy says
I thought I’d seen it all regarding Scn. But this is a shock to me. I’m reading the article and the reference and it’s like I’m in Communist China and not America. The SO have to ask permission to have a child and prove that they earn enough to pay for it. This leaves such a bad taste in the mouth. This is the kind of crazy stuff that should be leaked to the press and talked about on social media to get the word out. It will prove how crazy the C of S is and maybe will get a few more people to leave staff and leave the church in general.
Jere Lull says
As we’ve already found out, scn doesn’t respond well to the truth getting out. At a minimum, they’ll DENY, DENY, DENY all evidence as manufactured (Yeah, by the “cherch”) and misinterpreted from it’s true meaning.
Geoff Levin says
This happened to one of the most productive class IX auditors in the SO in LA. Jill Burkhart Graham. She was married to dedicated public scientologist Mac Graham. She was my auditor at the AOLA and was the best auditor I had. Although that’s now oxymoronic. She was also my neighbor. When she insisted on keeping her first child she was demoted to the Riverside Org. She accepted that and commuted there every day from Glendale. The SO demeaned her on a regular basis. She finally contracted cancer and died young. What a waste.
Mary Kahn says
😪
Such a waste of a beautiful soul. I always wondered what happened to Jill.
Glenn says
No kids in the SO?
But wait. I thought the cult was all about all 8 dynamics? The 2nd dynamic is all about family ain’t it?
Know a couple who were high classed auditors at Flag who refused to abort a pregnancy and had to “route out” of the SO.
Foot bullet happy Miscabbage doing his “best”.
But what could we expect from someone who totally flunked out of auditor training?
Jere Lull says
There’s what the groups puts out in its public proclamations, but the staff don’t get to experience any of the “lighter” side of scn.
Public PR and internal behavior are often (usually) diametrically opposed. We all joined to support the public proclamations — thought we were working to achieve those “star high” goals, but were the last to ‘benefit’ from scn’s “benevolent” aspects.
Peridot says
One problem that I see with this “logic” is that, as a sea org member, you do not get to reap what you sow financially, except to a small degree in instances of selling an e-meter or a book. (I think you can receive a sales commission.)
Many people are inspired to improve their production and household finances when they become parents. They work hard, possibly take on a second job–such as corporate worker by day, and adjunct instructor at a local college or university in the evenings. Commercial carpenter by day, side jobs on the weekends doing home improvements.
For all that “5X” of their work production and skill in generating income, the household gets to KEEP a far, far greater percent of the financial rewards. (As any business, including if you are self-employed, does retain a good chunk of the pie for keeping lights on, office supplies, rent, marketing, etc.)
I see no way to win, no matter how much production a person generates as a staff member or a sea org member.
I do remember a sea org member confiding in me, as she was truly skilled with helping others with Condition Formulas, that one time she went into a rapid mental-emotional downward spiral noting she had just worked with a television celebrity in Los Angeles on “conditions” whereupon that person rapidly went off to generate an additional $10 million in income for the year. For the sea org member, she knew her pay would remain at no more than fifty dollars per week. She was a parent with a child that had some health challenges. Her financial and parenting scene was a steady nightmare.
I bet that last statement surprises no one in this blog community. #heartbreak #itsacult
Mary Kahn says
Cold. A heartless, POS of a cherch.
By now, I am not stunned. It’s all about the cold hard cash – always has been.
Jere Lull says
Oh GAWD! An 8-page checklist to ask permission to have a child — The basis of the second Dynamic, a prime consideration of what is “right” or “wrong”. They couldn’t quit putting roadblocks in the way of staff having semi-normal, rational lives, even in scientology’s terms.
otherles says
I have to keep groaning. We only get a fraction of how depraved LRH was and DM really is.
Jere Lull says
The more we learn of LRH & COB’s machinations, the worst it gets. It’s a wonder that ANYone was resilient enough to go through that somewhat sane and functional. Insanities heaped upon insanities. So much for a “science” of the mind.